WW XXXIII - Other Minds and Hands

[Rikae]

It's the year 2020, and the slightly more mature ghouls of the Downs have come together with a noble purpose; to remake The Lord of The Rings as it should have been. Tom Bombadil and the Barrowdowns will recieve a full hour of screen time; the Scouring of the Shire another. There will be no lemming hyenas or psychadelic Galadriels; Gimli will remain deadly serious at all times, and Orlando Bloom...well, he's playing an elderly man of Rohan who is simultaneously impaled, beheaded and incinerated in the battle of Helm's deep.
Needless to say, this 30 hour epic will not be cheap to film; but we're in luck; the resourceful Volo has discovered a studio which is offering a 98% discount in the wake of certain...interesting events...which occurred during the filming of "An American Werewolf in Hamburg" last year.
We, being (for the most part) not superstitious, and (for the other part) trusting in the benevolent spirit of Professor Tolkien to protect us, have booked said studio and are scheduled to commence filming on May 14th.

The day before filming was to begin, the Downers arrived, one by one or two by two, from their various corners of the globe, and deposited suitcases and duffel bags and walking-sticks and umbrellas in their respective trailers. These latter left something to be desired; most had leaky roofs, no hot water, and infestations of ants and tiny little spiders.
"Oh yeah, this isn't a fire hazard!" remarked Durelin, exploring her trailer with a roll of the eyes.
Volo, getting into character, grabbed one of the spiders with a lighting quick gesture and devoured it greedily... and then proceeded to make extremely realistic hacking and gagging noises.
Sauce whipped up a tasty, if simple, meal for the hungry cast and crew, and Rikae produced several bottles of "Old Winyards" to kick off the filming properly. Soon everyone was in a jovial mood indeed. The Downers laughed and debated and reminisced for hours, and the crowd broke into smaller groups, which roamed about the studio complex at random.
Two downers staggered into the darkened room where old costumes were stored. "Where's the light switch?" one wondered. "Maybe behind these clothes...hmm...they've got a lot of fur coats in here..."
Suddenly, there was a snarl and a shriek. The second downer doubled over in pain, foaming at the mouth.
The florescent lights suddenly blinked into flickering life, and the first Downer was met by the sight of a friend curled up on the floor and a slavering hyena-like creature standing over the victim. Adreneline pumping, the Downer grabbed a sword which hung on the wall and, with ...several, messy, bloody strokes...hewed off the beast's head.
But the friend was no longer recognisable, and the hero recieved a bite for the trouble.
Two others were walking down the hall at that moment and paused by the door at the sound of a scream inside. They turned to one another with knowing smiles...
and the door burst open. Soon, two more Downers were transformed, and the pack was complete.

Night One has begun. Wolves begin your fiendish plotting. Others, hold your horses.

The Cast and Crew

Rikae (mod) - CG Animator
Volo - Gollum
Legate of Amon Lanc - Sound Master/Saruman
Macalaure - The 7th orc in the 3rd row
Boromir88- Sir Boromir, playing Denethor
Mithalwen- Galadriel
Shastanis Althreduin - Legolas' stunt double
Durelin - Special Effects Pyrotechnician
The Saucepan Man- Set Catering Manager
Xyzzy - Young Fanboy
Brinniel- Wacky Foley Artist
Thinlómien- Non-Winged Balrog
The Sixth Wizard- Protester against Dwarven Comic Relief
Anguirel- Celeborn
Kath - Make-up Artist
Gil-Galad - Zombie-Gil-Galad
Aganzir - Smeagol
Rune -Tolkien geek who is estatic about being an Elf extra
Diamond18 - Lady in charge of Wigs and all other False Hairpieces

[Rikae]

It was well past midnight, and the Downers had all long since retired to their trailers after a hard day's work. Only the CG animator remained, hunched over her precious computer in the darked studio. When she heard footsteps behind her, she replied without even moving her eyes from the screen.

“Ah, yes, I'm coming to bed soon – just let me show you these ghosts, rendered and lit. There! How do you like that? So much for green termites!”

She whirled her office chair and burst into laughter.

“Hahahaha! Nice costume! Mac, is that you? Volo??....hey, what's that in your hand....?”
The beast replied: “This is called lye.”
“Heehee...”
“And this is called chemical burn....”
....

The sky turns from black to gray.
Birds begin to sing.
Yawning Downers stumble into the studio, clutching mugs of coffee or tea.

“What's that smell?” asked Aganzir, wrinkling her nose.
“It smells like something burned!” remarked Boromir, looking accusingly at SPM.
Sauce retorted: “I didn't burn anything!...Hey...it's coming from in here...”
The Downers filed into Rikae's office and stared in confusion.

The CG animator's work space had never been a paragon of tidiness...but this was truly bizarre.
The ubiquitous empty Pepsi bottle beside her computer was now filled with a thick, greasy substance, and ashes were heaped on the chair and scattered across the floor.

SPM picked up the bottle and examined it.
“It's fat!” He exclaimed, proud of his detective skills.
Lommy, already in her Balrog costume, was examining the ashes on the chair. Suddenly, she let out a strangled gasp. Everyone turned toward her.
The actress plucked something out of the cinders with her false claws and held it up in silence. Her face was white and her hands shaking. The object sparkled in the light from the monitor.
It was one of Rikae's leaf-shaped earrings.

SPM dropped the bottle in revulsion, and it exploded with a liquid *pop*, splashing its contents around the room.

Macalaure burst into tears.

Brinniel wished she'd recorded the sound of the exploding bottle.

The Balrog put her arm around the Orc to comfort him.

“At least she finally lost that pesky last ten pounds!”

Boromir mused “I wonder what it's really like to be burned alive.”

Durelin remarked crossly “You people better not blame ME!”

Legate climbed onto a chair and waved his hand to get everyone's attention.

“This is certainly a terrible tragedy. Our special effects are going to suffer horribly, for one thing! But Rikae died doing what she believed in...! And we're going to finish this movie...for Rikae...and send the proceeds to her wife...er, or whoever...and kids!”
“Hear, hear!” proclaimed the fanboy.
“And what's more, we'll find the people responsible for this...mess...and give them what they deserve!”
“Look!” shouted Gil-Galad, pointing to Rikae's prized 60th anniversary “giant book of death” edition of LOTR on the table.

The book lay open, and the pages were turning of their own accord. Back and forth they flipped, faster and faster...
and suddenly stopped – at the very first page.
Mithalwen walked over to the book, and, before her eyes, a luminous silver line appeared on the page, underlining two phrases. She read out loud, in her best Galadriel voice:

“glimpses that had arisen unbidden of things higher or deeper or darker than its surface.”

“In spite of the darkness of the next five years I found that the story could not now be wholly abandoned, and I plodded on, mostly by night...”

Then – signed in the margin - “J.R.R. Tolkien”

Day 1 has begun. Wolves, shut up (er...with the PM'ing! :p). Everybody else: SPEAK! NOW!!!!

The Cast and Crew

The dearly departed:

Rikae (mod) – CG Animator - Rendered and Lighted on Night 1.

Those still with us:

Volo - Gollum
Legate of Amon Lanc - Sound Master/Saruman
Macalaure - The 7th orc in the 3rd row
Boromir88- Sir Boromir, playing Denethor
Mithalwen- Galadriel
Shastanis Althreduin - Legolas' stunt double
Durelin - Special Effects Pyrotechnician
The Saucepan Man- Set Catering Manager
Xyzzy - Young Fanboy
Brinniel- Wacky Foley Artist
Thinlómien- Non-Winged Balrog
The Sixth Wizard- Protester against Dwarven Comic Relief
Anguirel- Celeborn
Kath - Make-up Artist
Gil-Galad - Zombie-Gil-Galad
Aganzir - Smeagol
Rune -Tolkien geek who is estatic about being an Elf extra
Diamond18 - Lady in charge of Wigs and all other False Hairpieces

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Woo, first post! Just in time for me to get out of the hospital (contracted mononucleosis on Friday, finally went to the ER yesterday). I don't know how active I'll be today, as I'm using the on-screen keyboard to type this... I'll definately be active tomorrow, though. :)

[Anguirel]

Nineteen there came from Rivendell, so went the word. Where is Rikae, for I do much desire...

Blast it. I've examined proceedings and have decided that you're all clearly guilty apart from my dear wife. Once we have some transport, we shall withdraw, in two separate marine stages, not that our marriage is on the rocks or anything...the rest of you can stew in your lupine juices.

I am going to spend my time whittling some stylish river-going vessels and white-water rafting. Wolves, do not attack me, for I am an Elf Lord of ancient lineage, even though no one seems to know who my parents were, and have many powers potent and strong.

I'm also not that Wise. Definitely not a Seer or anything. Neither's my wife. That mirror is purely employed for purposes of vanity.

Oh God! I had half-a-dozen lines in the canonical script, and now this!

[Volo]

My presiouss! What are we iss do heer?!

Not uss, niise hobbitss.

What? No hobbits? Precious is free!

[Aganzir]

What was that smell? Spoiling nice meat, scorching it, are they? They shouldn't have done that, sss, no! Nassty red tongues! It's dangerous, yes it is. It burns, it kills. It killed Rikae, nice Rikae. Sméagol doesn't like at all, precious, no.
And where are the nassty hobbitses, precious? Where have they taken the Precious? We wants to complain to the director for not employing hobbitses, nassty director. We can't bite off Frodo's finger, I can't.

Sméagol is sorry but Sméagol can't be very active toDay. We have to sleep, we have to go to school, we have to see friends, nassty friends. Sméagol will be back to vote some hours before the deadline, but if one balrog friend of Sméagol's must go home early, Sméagol will return again about the deadline.


Precious is free!
The Precious is Sméagol's!

[Mithalwen]

The Lord Celeborn maybe called wise, and long years of the world outside, have I dwellt with him in Caras Galadhon, yet while he speaks truly of my innocence, should he speak slightingly of the powers of the mirror of Galadriel, calling it perchance "The magic birdbath", or otherwise suggest that I need to spend longer in make-up than the other female cast members, he may find himself walking the strange paths of Elvish dreams on the spare flet. :p

Indeed already from my mirror (ie the Admin thread ), I have learnt that our quest is balanced on the edge of a knife for though we have four sworn enemies, further foes of number unspecified may haunt our steps though we are aided by the Three whose powers are not clearly revealed and my reading has not yet discerned any clues.

Though it be soon in the day, I would exhort the fellowship to be mindful of the commandments of the Lady Rikae as concerns voting (ie remember double lynching is possible and only one retractio) .... though perhaps she spoke in jest only when she instructed us to vote for Rune ....

[Anguirel]

Indeed, my lady, I should be most loth to vote for Master Rune, seeing as he is the only Elf apart from ourselves and your illustrious relative's revanant shape, and so might be said to constitute the entire People of Lorien...I have no desire to be a Lord without subjects to wisely shepherd...

In the absence of that parvenu stripling Master Elrond, I suppose we get to host the Council at last (unless the Balrog of Moria wishes to put in a counter-claim...)

To me the instruction of the late departed most deserving of attention is the advice about "slightly unique" helpers. I shall therefore proceed on the assumption that we have something amounting to a Seer, Ranger and Hunter on our side, until evidence arises against this.

Did the lady also hint that sundry ruffians, like unto Cobblers, will aid the wolves? This I shall check once more, yet I think it passing unlikely for the present.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Well? Why must you disturb my rest? Will you give me no peace at all by night or day?

Four enemies are hiding among you now. And as for the Lady here, she spoke of other possible dangers. That may be so, but the thought is late in coming to you. How long, I wonder, are you, "secret roles", going to conceal from me, the head of the Council, a matter of greatest import? What are you waiting for? What will bring you now from your lurking-places?

But come now! Yes, I am now speaking to you, Innocents, and especially you, good Gifted! Much have I desired to see you, especially in these dark times, for you could be of the greatest help to us, having a noble mind and eyes that look both deep and far. Alas, I cannot, and I know that: there's too much at stake. But even if you stay hidden, let your counsels help us. Much we could still accomplish together, to heal the disorders of this place. And this goes for you, all the Innocent minds. Let us understand one another, and dismiss from thought these meddling creatures! Shall we make our counsels together against evil days?

Silence kills. Especially now. Early time it might be, but we must grasp as much knowledge as we could, and this is not accomplished by just silence or idle monologues. Rather, let us talk.

Are we alone here? Or is there anyone else, waiting? Speak! What have you to say?

[Anguirel]

Ah, yes. The head of the Council. I had quite forgotten him.

Hmph. No comment. Far be it from me to take issue with the respected Curunir, but...hmph. Come on, Galadriel, let's see if we can plant some mallorns here about. The trees call out to us. Do they not call this the Wood of the Hollies?

At least I have a starring role now we seem to have lost contact with that troublesome Fellowship...

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Indeed, Lord Celeborn? To every man his part. Far away is your home and your part in the Council was not great, if any. And the wisdom of Saruman and the power of Orthanc cannot be lightly thrown aside. You may find the Shadow of the Studio at your own door next: it is wayward, and senseless, and has no love for Elves. Unless you are its servant. So let me and the Lady and the others consult the matters of utmost importance - and either join us, or meddle not in policies which you do not understand.

[Mithalwen]

Saruman the White should remember that while Celeborn the Wise, is not infallible that he is still my husband and that if anyone else other than me attempts to slight him, even be they Maia and Istar, they may find that a ring of power makes and effective knuckleduster... (and I've got one and you haven't nyah nyah nyah nyah nyaaaaaaaah) :p

I would add that the presence of malevolent aides to the foes are deemed probable in the auspices. And that the doppelganger of my lord's nephew/cousin/ whatever may be deemed of the eldar kindred. Land of Hollies? Ah my love, we have it seemed returned to Eregion after so long an absence! I shall fetch my gardening gloves ... I mean my Alan Titchmash songbook for lazy but musical gardeners:I sang of leaves, of leaves of gold, and leaves of gold there grew...

[Anguirel]

Curunir, discourtesy is no sign of wisdom - at any rate, not among the Children of Illuvatar. I shall take counsel with my heart's love and we shall share that counsel with you, should it be needful. Alas, my osanwe is not yet quite up to speed despite my recent passage through the Royal Academy of Dramatic Art, yet we shall do our best.

Let us leave matters of precedence and soberly consider each other's words - and deeds.

It seems to me unlikely that wolves will risk adhering to each other too closely so early on, and deliberate distancing may prove a helpful guide.

Remember that our cast and crew is scattered and diverse, and be not too swift to condemn the quiet (who in any case are punished in extreme cases by the Rules...)

[Mithalwen]

And the wisdom of Saruman and the power of Orthanc cannot be lightly thrown aside..


Time will tell if if should be hurled with great force, if necessary we might negotiate a group rate with Entish Equity... but let our hearts not be troubled overly by dispute between us .. the smallest folk may have more influence in this matter than the great ones here in discussion. I would hear more speak before I look into their hearts and attempt to divine their secrets. . Less than a third of our company have spoken. Soon I must depart for a while, a few hours of men, and repose my mind and body. I hope that I may learn from the wisdom of all on my return.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

"Remember that our cast and crew is scattered and diverse, and be not too swift to condemn the quiet," you say? But on that occasion you erred, I think - or are you misconstruing my intentions wilfully? I only wanted those who are around to speak, if they are. It must be obvious to everyone that those from lands far away cannot speak up already now, only if they wanted. My speech was against those who are around, and are not speaking. As I, with my wisdom, presume they are. There is not that few of us, after all.

EDIT: Hmm, seems the Lady has the same point as I. For myself, I have also other matters to attend to, and then I am going to depart for possibly a... longer time. So here you see it: This is what I meant.

[Anguirel]

I too must fall silent soonish. One mustn't forget professional obligations, and I've nabbed a plush role as King John in a docudrama on the Magna Carta fronted by Simon Schama...er, ahem, brings back the days when I did A-Level History as a callow youth, ahem ahem...

[Mithalwen]

I had thought a wafer of lembas, and a tot of miruvor to steady frayed elvish nerves, might be in order but the catering facilities are currently noticeable by their absence so I shall see if the kettle and toaster in my trailer work and failing that ... well the corkscrew always works;)...... for now ..Namarie

[xyzzy]

Oh, sweet, the guard didn't notice me coming in! Wow, cool!

What're you all talkinmg about, voting for someone, huh? I don't know anything about that, I guess.

When are you gonna tape one of those cool war scenes? Those are the really cool ones. They're so cool, I hope I can manage to get into one! I could, like, run past and scream at random people, then I could do, like, some sweet ninja action.

[Am I playing the part of the overeager nine-year-old fanboy well?]

[Gil-Galad]

urrgh? it aint fun being a zombie sometimes...


personally i hate day ones mainly because there is virtually nothing to get off at, the day 1 lynch is a big chance probably all the time... so i guess we'll just wait till the first bandwagon appears, though personally i also hate those (bad past experiances and all)

so in conclusion

brains

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Wooha me the intire population of Lothlorien! That is so awesome! ! !

and is this what I shall be wearing? It is sooo cool, wait to the guys from D&D and The Downs sees me in this.

I wonder if there is any other elves around, I think I spottet Celeborn earlier. . .

[Diamond18]

I'm here. With hair. Now's your chance to make requests. Red, brown, blonde, black, blue? Curly, straight? Braids? Ponytail mohawks? Speak now or forever hold the piece I choose for you.

Okay, so it's Day 1, there's already been lots of banter... mainly between Celebang and Mithaladriel. Entertaining, as Ang always is. I also forsee much entertainment value to be got from Vollum and Smeagnzir.

But as far as Wolves (er, weird hyenalike creatures, rather) go... not so much to go on. Which figures.

I'm going to have to vote early toDay. As in... a couple hours from now. Right now I have nothing to go on.... so.... hm. Sucks a bit.

[Brinniel]

Okay, okay, I'm here. *jumps up and down* I've got a lot of work to do....there's so much sound to record, where do I begin? Let's see...

Well, the elves have already arrived, so let's begin with them. *Picks up some fancy elven robes stolen from a costume designer that apparently does not exist and starts swing the material around next to a mike*

Whoosh Whoosh

Okay, perhaps that is a little too loud. Elves are light and graceful, right? Let's try it again...

Oh and btw, I have decided to used the sound of pouring lemonade for the mirror of Galadriel...because water is just too darn realistic...

it aint fun being a zombie sometimes...
Huh? Wait...did Tolkien write in zombies? *Pulls out copy of LotR and starts scanning through it* Nope, I don't see anything.

Oh well...I guess that just means more sound for me to record. :D

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Huh? Wait...did Tolkien write in zombies? *Pulls out copy of LotR and starts scanning through it* Nope, I don't see anything.

Oh well...I guess that just means more sound for me to record. :D
yes it is quite interesting that there is a zombie on the set even though it is nowhere mentioned in the books, it does look like Gil-Galad, but still slightly odd.

oh and Di, just make me a bunndle of different style hair, it looks like i will be needing a few. . .most of them should probably be long, blond and straight though.

[Diamond18]

oh and Di, just make me a bunndle of different style hair, it looks like i will be needing a few. . .most of them should probably be long, blond and straight though.

Elves are extra fun to make wigs for... there's "everyday straight" "special occasion braids" "battle worn mussed" and my personal favorite "very special occasion channeling Princess Leia"... :merisu:

Hm. I may not be able to bring myself to vote for any of the elves. Lose the elves and I could be stuck doing "stringy trio of oily strands" for the rest of the shoot! Though dwarven beards are fun, too.

My time to vote is nearing... as I expected I don't really have much to go on that would make for sound reasoning... I may just have to vote for Gil because his signature is begging for it. :rolleyes:

[Kath]

Oh I do wish you'd all just sit still for a few moments so I can get this make-up on you! Everytime I think I'm actually going to be able to work on someone they disappear! And with Gollum and Smeagol switching places every few seconds I'm never going to get them done. Perhaps it's an evil plot ... oh wait, that's not actually a thing to joke about here is it?

On that subject there is a point I would like to bring up but I may wait until tomorrow or even the next Day to do so, as it's one that can cause a first Day to descend into a flurry of arguments the likes of which we see every time.

Now, if you'll excuse me I'm going to see if I can find that blasted zombie. I want to copy those shadows under his eyes for later in the films.

[Diamond18]

Okay... work is calling... I've got lots of wigs to make.

+ + Gil-Galad

Really, a zombie in the LotR? I thought we were trying to do it the proper way this go-around!

[The Saucepan Man]

… but the catering facilities are currently noticeable by their absence …*The serving hatch on the Catering Van slides open with a creak and a jolly, bearded and bespectacled face pops out.*

Someone looking for something to eat? Well, I’ve whipped up a nice ghoulash here, if anyone would care for a bowl. An old family recipe. Put hairs on your chin, it will.

*Saucepan holds up a bottle marked “Saucepan‘s Special Ghoulash Sauce“ and does a double take as he notices that it remains full. Sheepishly, he glance back to the kitchenette and spies with horror an empty, though somewhat greasy, pepsi bottle.*

Ahem, salad anyone?

So, what’s been happening since the ghoulash … er ... ghoulish discovery? Hmm, a bunch of method actors spouting their lines. Crew members going about the business. Sheesh! I’ve heard of the expression “the show must go on”, but this is ridiculous. Surely you don’t expect this production to go ahead in the circumstances? What with the CG Animator brutally murdered and a bunch of Werewolves running amok among us? I mean, it’s not like there’s never been a film of Tolkien’s masterpiece made before. Like, you know, there was that trilogy that, um, won, like, UMPTEEN OSCARS including BEST DIRECTOR, or something like that.

Anyway, to business.

*Saucepan picks up a clipborad on which the word “Director” has been hastily scribbled out and replaced with the words “Day 1 Checklist”*

Now, let me see …

Discussion of roles. Check

Exhortation to all to speak. Check

Discussion about what might be done with the quiet ones. Check.

Statement of dislike of Day 1s. Check.

Any useful discussion directed towards finding the Wolves … Erm, nope.

So far, I am highly impressed by Xyzzy, who obviously has a masterful understanding of how fantasy films should be made. And I think that we should keep Gil-Galad around for a while, as Zombies are always good value. Especially later in the piece, when the hero stumbles across a chainsaw or hover-mower, or some such.

Oh, and Anguirel‘s clearly a Wolf. He‘s talking far too much to be a credible Celeborn. Obviously, he’s got something to hide.

That and it’s traditional for me to attempt to vote off the Elves first, starting with Celeborn. ;)

[The Saucepan Man]

Okay, so it's Day 1, there's already been lots of banter... mainly between Celebang and Mithaladriel. Indeed, and the Legate of Orthanc too. If a certain fellow by the name of Nogrod were here, he might have something to say about this little triangle of luvvies. :D Anguirel and Mithalwen are, of course, linked by their roles. But Legate's little opening skirmish with them struck me as slightly odd. Mainly banter, I know, but possibly worth bearing in mind for the future.

Remember that our cast and crew is scattered and diverse, and be not too swift to condemn the quiet (who in any case are punished in extreme cases by the Rules...)

But on that occasion you erred, I think - or are you misconstruing my intentions wilfully? I only wanted those who are around to speak, if they are. It must be obvious to everyone that those from lands far away cannot speak up already now, only if they wanted. My speech was against those who are around, and are not speaking.This comes across as rather defensive to me, given that Anguirel's point was admonishing, rather than accusatory, in tone.

Still, not a lot to go on really, given that few have said much substance so far. I too must take my leave for now. Tea, coffee and cookies on the counter, if anyone’s interested, but I would advise steering clear of the ghoulash. ;)

[Boromir88]

4 werewolves! 4 werewolves! I'm used to having 3 and thats bad enough! But now there's 4! All hope is lost. No point in resistings the wolves will devour us all. Flee for your lives, I say, if you can! Or die in what was seems best. Durelin, fetch me wood and oil:

++Boromir88

[Anguirel]

I am now lost in a multiplicity of voting candidates.

I could vote for that unsavoury cook due to his vulgar mention of the Jackson travesty.

I could vote for the Lord Denethor, for though he is reputed to be wise he seems to be planning to burn down some vegetation in a pyre, which I disapprove off.

I could vote for the discourteous so-called Legate Curunir.

I could join the campaign to remove the uncanonical zombie.

Charmed though I am by the wig-maker Diamond, I wonder if her liking for Elvish hair is an attempt to gain the support of the Elvish votes? I doubt it actually. Wolf-Diamond would probably work through chaos, not politics.

I am grateful to the Lord Denethor for reminding me about the fourth wolf. That means that one in four and a half of us are guilty...

[The Sixth Wizard]

Hello all you potential dwarf slanderers! I have my eye upon you with your 'toss me's' and your 'nervous system's. :mad:

I have not much time toDay to say anything, but, as Legate said we should speak up and I may as well voice my opinion.

Usually on Day 1 we jump to less than well-founded suspicions, so here we go! When reading over the thread I came to the conclusion that Anguirel looked the most suspicious thus far, posting a lot and being in character too much. He looks a bit like he has something to hide to me. I see that SpM has come to the same conclusion.

Speaking of whom, SpM also looks suspicious to me at this point. I don't know why, I got this feeling last game, but he makes me feel angry. :D

Ta-ta till I vote, peeps!

[Thinlómien]

A flame veiled in shadow approached the discussers. The wing-like shadows it casted were dark, avoiding the sunlight. "You shall not pass", a booming voice said. Then, after a moment: "Oops! It was not my line!"

I'll try to be useful toDay (useful on Day1 :rolleyes: ) as I'm not sure if I can get online at all during Day2 (see old post on admin thread). So, where to start...?

Like Mr Saucer noted, there has been less constructive posting than usually. That kind of worries me - after all, such intelligent people as Ang, Mith and Legate seem to have had plenty of time online. (Though, I admit, they've been very amusing. :D) On the other hand there's not much to say during the early hours, but...

This is a rather big game and I wouldn't be surprised to see a lot of weird roles - knowing the CG animator. ;)

It seems to me unlikely that wolves will risk adhering to each other too closely so early on, and deliberate distancing may prove a helpful guide.I wouldn't count on this, Mr Pointy-Eared Silverhead. I've seen wolves bantering with each other during the early hours, though I admit that's not too usual. However, this statement by Ang this early when he, Mith and Legate have been chatting quite intesively makes me a bit alarmed... (Even though I must say Legate and Ang don't look like partners in crime...)

Sixth then... I don't know what to make of him jumping against Anguirel. I took SPM's words about Ang as a joke, but Sixth seems to be serious about it and jumping to it quite quickly. Might be an over-eager wolf first-timer...?

[The Saucepan Man]

When reading over the thread I came to the conclusion that Anguirel looked the most suspicious thus far, posting a lot and being in character too much. He looks a bit like he has something to hide to me. I see that SpM has come to the same conclusion.Actually, as Lommy the Balrog has correctly noted, my accusation of Anguirel was mere flippantry. Anguirel is far from being the only one to have posted mostly in character and, indeed, is one of the few to have made some points of substance among the frippery. You seem to accept that your suspicion is less than well-founded, but why single out Anguirel from all the banterers?

I am ever suspicious of those who pick up on flippant accusations, so my eye is on you Sixth.

Porridge anyone?

[Macalaure]

Pure in-character content within one of the first 10 posts is okay...

But pure in-character content within any of the later posts begs for quick death!

xyzzy, Rune, Brinniel, Boro and excessively Mith and Legate.

Speak sense, you filthy maggots! Don't you know we're at waaar!?

Silence kills. Especially now. Early time it might be, but we must grasp as much knowledge as we could, and this is not accomplished by just silence or idle monologues. Rather, let us talk.Idle monologues? Look who's talking...
Legate really looks like the worst of all these.



On that subject there is a point I would like to bring up but I may wait until tomorrow or even the next Day to do so, as it's one that can cause a first Day to descend into a flurry of arguments the likes of which we see every time.So you would rather turn Day Two into a flurry of arguments? :D


PS: I agree with Lommy and SPM regarding Six.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Pure in-character content within one of the first 10 posts is okay...

But pure in-character content within any of the later posts begs for quick death!

xyzzy, Rune, Brinniel, Boro and excessively Mith and Legate.

Speak sense, you filthy maggots! Don't you know we're at waaar!?

Idle monologues? Look who's talking...
Legate really looks like the worst of all these.


What a load of rubbish! If one is not allowed to make in-charachter posts then what is the point of the charachters Mac?

Of course it is a problem if people keeps on doing it for a whole day and nothing else, but to set up rules saying that 10 posts in maximum is just way to rigid a system.

I really see no problem in my first two "intruduction" posts being in charachter just because that a sertain number of people have posted before me.

Let it be up to people them selves to judge and if it bothers you say so.

[Boromir88]

Well my incharacterness first post had a plan along with it, but umm that really didn't turn out exactly as planned. Since I have to vote in about 10 minutes, before I went to sleep I wanted to get some reaction and talk besides all this in-character stuff, so I at least had something to go off of for voting.

--Boromir88

Pah I was foolish to think anyone would fall for that one. Obviously you are all smart enough to know a noble Lord like myself would not stoop to the level of the heathen kings; killing themselves in their madness. No, you need a Lordly master, like myself (and not some chump from Elf Land) to lead us through these times. With that I shall officially vote for:

++Anguirel

No real reason, besides the fact that he is too jovial and chipper for my liking. That's all I have, now I must be gone. I do hope the rest of the day picks up a little bit. Where's Nogrod, to pick up the village chatter, when you need him.

[Macalaure]

Why this sudden fit of defensiveness, Rune?

There is nothing wrong with in-character-ness. You might have noticed that I left Ang and Diamond out of my list. That's because they mixed their in-character fun with actual points. And of course there's also nothing wrong with pure in-character stuff. All you have to do is deal with my suspicion then. :p

[Thinlómien]

As for being in-character, I don't have anything against every person's first post being something in-character regardless of the time it is posted - after all otherwise the late-comers would always miss the banter which could be sad - but I think excessive ic-posting hinders the village.

Anyway, I don't like Mac throwing all those people into the same category. While Mith and Legate clearly iced (like were in-character, nothing to do with ice :D) a lot, they had some constructive (or un-in-character) points in there. (Even such a goatee-having cobbler like you, Mac, should see it. :p) Thus I don't think they should be compared with Rune, Xyzzy, Brinn and Boro.

[The Saucepan Man]

Lord preserve us from any hard and fast rules about when banter is permitted and when it’s not. Surely it’s a matter for individuals to judge whether someone’s use of banter seems incriminating or not.

As far as I can see, the only banter here so far has either been a first post (fair enough, in my view) or else mixed in with some substantive points.

I take the 7th Morc in the 3rd row’s point about the Legate of Orth Ankh counselling everyone to speak, while saying little of substance himself (and Legate certainly bears watching). However, the most suspicious thing that I have seen so far is Sixth’s hastiness to jump on Ang, following of my own flippant accusation. So I shall vote:

++The Sixth Wizard

Macaroons anyone?

[Mithalwen]

[. Put hairs on your chin, it will.



At my age sweetie, that is no laughing matter :rolleyes: ..do anyoneyou make up types have tweezers? And Brinniel, darling ..lemonade in my fountain - I don't think the lady of the Golden wood would be getting the vision with tesco value pop, do you? Make it Gin & Tonic, there's a love, does wonders for the vocal cords...

Boromir, my dear, we need a lord you say ..why when we have a Queen, beautiful and terrible... all shall love me and despaaaaaaairrrrrr

...ok, fair point despair premature, lead on Palantir-boy. But that is my chump you vote for, and if he be innocent I shall be handing you the firelighters.. :p

Mac, chill, as SpM pointed out we covered all main Early day one topics while having our fun. At least we talked. Personally I am a little disappointed that there was still the one page when I came back *misses Roa and Nogrod*.

I am meeting my agent for lunch shortly but then I should be back up to the end. I really hope everyone will post as much as they can. At the moment I cannot decide whether people are jumping at genuine clues or straws. Day ones are not wastes of time. Given that there are more than a dozen fenris wolves, a wolf is caught Day 1 a good proportion of the time. This may not be one of those days but Day one interraction is usually significant in retrospect. Silence is not golden.


Fare thee well ...

[The Sixth Wizard]

So it was mere joking from SpM? I thought he was serious (!) and also thought I should just jump to the Day 1 suspicions that we had last game. Isn't it good to suspect people to get the wolves out of the darkness on Day 1? It seems I've drawn suspicion onto myself when we should be concentrating on finding the real wolves. I was not jumping onto SpM's bandwagon, I already suspected Anguirel before I read his post, but I suppose I can't prove that.

Anyways...

++Anguirel

And Legate looks a bit hostile to me.

[Macalaure]

Oh dear... and already I feel the need to explain myself... :rolleyes:

I felt that the Day was going a bit too smooothly til then, so I felt like mixing things up a little (reason why I cared little about who I put into the same category with others). Who is better suited for mixing things up than the next best orc? ;)
I certainly don't want to tell people how they should be playing, and if some have understood me that way I'd like to apologise. However, there are some ways of playing that make me more suspicious than other, and I think that is legitimate. :)

My main suspects right now are Legate and Six, followed by Mith, followed by, well, pretty much everybody...

[Anguirel]

I strongly suspect the Lord Denethor of having designs on my wife. And there seems to be a plot to kill me. How dreadful. I shall go off and commune with trees and return with some sensible, eucalyptus-induced thoughts.

I feel like voting for that Sixth Dwarf fellow but couldn't really do so with my integrity intact, as I happen to be his scapegoat.

[Thinlómien]

Mac, I don't get your tactics... (But fair enough, I've never been a fan of "I'm an innocent but I try to cause confusion" -tactics. And before you guys jump on it, I'm not declaring Mac innocent. :p)

I should go and vote soon-ish. No other things has caught my attention and rang my alarm bells than Sixth's behaviour, but to be honest he hasn't been that bad either.

I'm off to reread and to arrange my thoughts...

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Why this sudden fit of defensiveness, Rune?

There is nothing wrong with in-character-ness. You might have noticed that I left Ang and Diamond out of my list. That's because they mixed their in-character fun with actual points. And of course there's also nothing wrong with pure in-character stuff. All you have to do is deal with my suspicion then. :p
Defensiveness? I would rather call it anger . . . :p Actually it was a matter of me thinking you chritisism was unfair. It is alright to think there is too much in charachter stuff going on, but I thought your point about the rules was weird. . .

It kind of seemed like a way to stir things up and whether that is with good or bad intentions I cannot say.

The post seemed like a good way to
1. get some talking going
2. get my views said
3. meet your demands on less in charachter posting;)

[Thinlómien]

This far those who have spoken (I don't count the icers here):

Sauce has been very amusing and contributive and I'm inclined to think him innocent at this phase. Boro is weird but in an innocent way, I would say, knowing his playing style.

Rune, Di, Ang, Mith and Mac seem all pretty normal. Nothing particularly alarming there.

Like pointed out by Sauce and Mac, Legate is behaving oddly. I don't like the feel of his first post. (Maybe because I don't like pompoeus speeches... ;)) Legate slightly worries me, though I'm not sure if he would be this bantery as a baddie.

Sixth is acting weirdly and in a way I could imagine a relatively inexperienced wolf to act. But he's not overtly suspicious... Anyway he's most probably going to get my vote as he's the only one who stands out...

edit: xed with the Elf-wannabe

[Thinlómien]

Alright.

++The Sixth Wizard

Hopefully see you toMorrow, if not then on Day3 (if I'm alive that is).

[Aganzir]

When this game is over, we all have probably read the Lotr at least once...

We doesn't have much time now, precious, but unlike we thought, we'll be able to return & vote before the deadline.

Sixth jumped quite eagerly on Anguirel after Spm's joke, but we doesn't know if it was because he's a first-timer wolf or because the opinion, though a joke, of a more experienced player kind of confirmed his suspicions.

We didn't like the tone of Legate's posts either, but we thinks it might be thus because we know the person who originally uttered these words was evil, and have associated the words with sorcery and wickedness. Or then there's something more, we doesn't know.

Now we're leaving for some hours, but we'll be back, precious, we'll be back. To catch fishes we go!

[Volo]

Mith I'm inclined to trust, though again, she hasn't said anything that I see other that in-character stuff.

Lommy's vote speaks well for her, but we shall see, we shall see.

Legate and Aganzir I find innocentish.

I'm more afraid of Mac and Ang, maybe purely for their harsh tone (and because I'm paranoid after learning that I'm "the confused innocent"). I'll try not to prosecute without solid factss.


SPM, toss me a vegetarian soup, would you please!

[Anguirel]

I'm being accused of excessive joviality and chipperness by Denethor, and of a "harsh tone" by Volo...business as usual then. To be honest, I think Volo's description of me conforms more to my stereotype than anything I've actually done so far, which puts me a touch on edge.

I'm unlikely to vote for the Steward of Gondor because he's behaving the same way as always and I want to keep him alive so I can kill him in a duel...

Sauce and Thinlomien also strike me as not far off the beaten track, though Sauce is being quite pally I suppose.

I trust my wife without reservation...but I'm not sure anyone else should. I'm a little unnerved by the universal credence she's captured so far. Of course I won't vote for her. That's the trouble with being a dominated male.

Saruman genuinely strikes me as a pretty odd, combative cove and may receive my vote.

I am, as I have said above, suspicious of Volo because his thinking, re: me, seems a bit lazy.

I am suspicious of Sixth Wizard Dwarf Whatever but won't vote for him unless I have to save my life, as it seems slightly bad form.

I might also vote for Gil-Galad, just as a kind of despairing spoilt ballot.

Basically I'm keen on voting for Volo or Legate if I get some support. I'm about close to the deadline so may retract in an emergency, but my first vote will be soonish.

[Kath]

do anyoneyou make up types have tweezers?
Ah, I think, yes Mith! Here we are. Though I wonder, Galadriel as a bearded lady? Could be interesting.

So you would rather turn Day Two into a flurry of arguments?
No. By Day 2 we will have voting records, a Night's kill and all the information from toDay to study. Arguments on Day 2 generally focus on individuals rather than ideas. But I changed my mind anyway so never mind!

But enough of that, it's toDay we have to focus on right now. So:

Shasta - told us he (?) wouldn't be around much so haven't exactly got any ideas about him (?).

Ang - has been having fun with his character, but there's nothing sinister in that. I do wonder why he pointed out the possible existence of extra roles, as this was something we all knew might happen from the admin thread and then from the narration. Trying to be helpful or just trying to make his post longer perhaps. It is also odd that he would point out wolvish tactics, as that is something that often brings suspicion. If anything he is acting like he would expect a not-quite-so-experienced wolf to act. A ruse perhaps, but in which direction I don't yet know.

Volo - um, I don't actually entirely understand his first post but he has since returned to say that he thinks Mith, Lommy, Legate and Aganzir seem innocent though there aren't really reasons for any of that. Is 'afraid' of Mac and Ang because of their tones but doesn't want to say anything until he has some actual facts. Bit hedging your bets there. I hope we see something a bit more concrete before Day ends.

Aganzir - mentions Sixth jumping on Sauce's joking accusation of Ang and says she doesn't like the tone of Legate's posts either. There are some good bits of reasoning behind both ideas, and there is a promise of returning later, so I'm quite comfortable with Aganzir at the moment.

Mith - there are some words of wisdom scattered within the banter, especially those about the voting. Double-lynches. *shudders* With so many wolves those really could be bad for us at the beginning. Her 'silence is not golden' point was a good one too. Plus, what she is saying in silliness is making me laugh out loud! It may just be the endorphins from happiness but I'm putting Mith in the innocent pile toDay.

Legate - his first post was all about the roles that haven't been explicitly stated, and there seemed to be a call for all to reveal, a dangerous move so early in the game. We've also seen nothing but banter and some defense about his previous statements, so I'm not too keen on him right now.

xyzzy - we've had only the one post from him and it was entirely banter. Hopefully we'll see more of him before the end of the Day.

Gil - mentions his hatred of Day 1 which may be why we've seen nothing from him since that first post. I can only hope he doesn't just pop in with a vote with no reasoning and then disappear again. After the last game I have expectations!

Rune - a sudden burst of annoyance at Mac over the banter thing has made it appear that he is talking with susbstance, but in fact apart from a mention that Mac was trying to stir things up he really hasn't said anything at all. One to watch out for I think.

Di - votes for Gil, for no real reason I think, but she did have to go early. It's hardly an excuse but then with how few people had spoken at the time she didn't have much to go on. No condemnation for that.

Sauce - seemed unimpressed by events so far and made some joking comments about various people. Then thought Legate odd (which I agree with) and made a comment about the possibility of Lovers (which I really hope aren't around), both of which were good points and had some evidence to back them up. Mentions some suspicion of Sixth for jumping on his joking accusation of Ang and then votes for him. Everything seems quite above board here, and the food isn't half bad, I'm keeping Sauce as innocent.

Brinniel - we've only had one post from her toDay and it had nothing of any substance in it. Again we'll have to hope she turns up later with something to say.

Boro - voted for himself, apparently to try and get people talking, but when found that didn't work he retracted his vote and voted for Ang 'for no real reason'. Now, having exonerated Di for doing the same thing I can hardly jump on Boro for it either. However, it feels more forced than Di's vote did. I know that's terrible reasoning, but how can you explain a feeling?

Sixth - mentions that Ang looks suspicious, and then says this idea was backed up by Sauce. Though Sauce's accusation was just banter it seems that he took it seriously, but then Sixth also thinks Sauce looks suspicious. Mm, I can see why people are voting for him, but I think I want to give him the benefit of the doubt for toDay at least. There is definitely some miscommunication going on.

Lommy - worried that people such as Ang, Mith and Legate have been spending their time chatting about nothing rather than trying to come up with anything constructive which is a fair point, and finds a comment from Ang that makes her worried about him. Also mentions Sixth and his 'jumping' on Sauce's accusation of Ang. Then thinks Mac is being odd in lumping Ang, Mith and Legate together with Rune, Brinn and Gil, when the former three had actually managed to get something constructive into their posts when the latter three had not. This is a very good point, and it seems odd that Mac would do such a thing. Votes for Sixth in the end because he was the only one that had really caught her attention. Well, she has made about the most posts so far, has come up with some very good points and has spoken with substance rather than just banter, and she seems to be acting like 'normal', so I'm going to put her down as innocent.

Mac - thinks Legate looks odd, picks up on a point from me and agrees with Lommy and Sauce about Sixth. I agree with the first point and I've responded to the second at the top of this post. As for that third comment. Sixth has been accused because he 'jumped' on Sauce's accusation. Well what is everyone doing now but 'jumping' on this accusation of Sixth! I don't know, it feels like a bandwagon in the making without anything substantial behind it. Says Rune is being overly defensive, which indeed he did seem to be. Defends himself against Lommy but not very effectively as his argument seems to be 'oh did I do that? silly old me, but don't worry, there was a reason'. Still suspects Legate and Sixth but we've not had a vote yet. Something odd about this one.

Well I think that's everyone. I forgot how long those things take. :rolleyes: Where's spawn when you need her? Oh, wait, Durelin is missing! Hope she gets here before the deadline. Now, let's see.

Innocent:
Aganzir
Mith
Di
Sauce
Lommy
Kath

Guilty:
Ang
Legate
Rune
Boro
Mac

No idea:
Shasta
Gil
Brinniel
xyzzy
Durelin
Volo
Sixth

These are (obviously) very rough lists which aren't in order, but it's just to help me work out what I'm thinking. I'll have to vote relatively soon as I won't be here at the deadline. In fact, I'm going to vote now.

++ RUNE

I'd dearly love to vote Mac, but I want to see what else he has to say for himself first and I won't be able to before the end of the Day, so Rune it is.

[Brinniel]

And Brinniel, darling ..lemonade in my fountain - I don't think the lady of the Golden wood would be getting the vision with tesco value pop, do you? Make it Gin & Tonic, there's a love, does wonders for the vocal cords...
Very well then. I most certainly will do my best. :p

Okay, I have gotten up from my trailer a little earlier than I prefer, but indeed, some sleep has given me a chance to think things over...

I won't deny Sixth's behaviour is rather suspicious and the fact that he continues to pursue Ang (for little reason, I think) even after he realises he has mistakenly taken SPM's case seriously, certainly doesn't make things better for him. But so often, the one who makes the most outrageous statements turns out innocent, yet then again, I have been very wrong on this before (coughGlirdancough). These posts could quite possibly come from an in-experienced Sixth Wolf, but then it could be an in-experienced Sixth innocent as well. Hmm...I'm not sure what to think. Sixth is certainly not in the clear for me, but I won't place him on the very top of my suspicious list just yet.

Legate, however, I find more suspicious. He speaks loudly in his three posts without saying much of anything. And as I think it's been mentioned before, the fact that he encourages others to speak up in his first post, yet does not follow his own advise, is rather odd. I will definitely be watching him closely.

Anyways, I should be around for the next couple hours leading up to the deadline. I have this fear that the last fifteen minutes are going to be complete chaos (of course, isn't it always? :rolleyes: ) since retractions are allowed and all..

EDIT: X-ed with Ang and Kath

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Okay, seems the discussion has started, I want to contribute now, time for picking Saruman's lines will be later.

First: who looks suspicious to me now. You have "colored yourselves" nice over the time I wasn't here, especially some of you. And there is already a bandwaggon running: against Anguirel. Some people seem also concerned about Sixth, which is quite logical (or is it?) contrasting move. Now, what I feel about these two:

Anguirel the Strange. Anguirel the Wood-walker. Anguirel the Barbarian Elf. Don't know what Anguirel's style of playing is, but he seems strange to me. From the beginning, I didn't like his style, it seemed to me as too much in-role and too long for an in-role, nothing-saying post, being vocal enough to be noticed, maybe even get sympathies, but saying nothing in game - not even trying to. Of course everyone posted in-role at that time (and I thought it all right, if only we didn't overdo it), but you would say Ang could make it shorter: for example Agnazir&Volo made little Gollum-Sméagol entertainment and finito. Ang was the first to post something longer, but saying nothing. This is why I suspected him then, and now, seeing a bandwaggon rolls, despite all doubts there might be, I am inclined to vote for him. Though I will wait yet - plenty of time. Let's see if anyone has anything to add to this topic.

Six on the other hand seems ok to me, and if you read the above, you'll understand why: he independantly came to the same conclusion as I, he started to suspect Anguirel. I sympathise with him now and I think he didn't do anything that could be called suspicious besides starting a bandwaggon against Ang (if Ang is even innocent, see above), so I'm leaving him out of my suspicions now.

Now to the matters that are connected with this. Based on what I said of Six, I am somewhat uneasy about SpM, because, like Six, I thought his "suspicion" on Anguirel (which he then said was a joke) as serious.
Actually, as Lommy the Balrog has correctly noted, my accusation of Anguirel was mere flippantry. Anguirel is far from being the only one to have posted mostly in character and, indeed, is one of the few to have made some points of substance among the frippery. You seem to accept that your suspicion is less than well-founded, but why single out Anguirel from all the banterers?
If Six thinks like me, I'd understand why he picks Ang, so this matter would be solved for me. But now what alarmed me SpM did was, he rigtaway continued with:
I am ever suspicious of those who pick up on flippant accusations, so my eye is on you Sixth.
I understand the thought if SpM were innocent - when you mention someone suspicious, even in a joke, if a person jumps on it, it can as well be a Wolf seeking for opportunity to find a scrapegoat. But the way SpM rightaway jumps at Six does not seem all okay to me. Also, SpM's vote for Sixth might look like creating a secondary bandwaggon to save a friend. Of course it wouldn't make sense then, if SpM & Ang are wolves, to even joke about suspecting Ang, on which some people could jump (like Six did). If Ang were not a wolf, it would make perfect sense if SpM were - making a joke, rising a suspicion on someone, then retracting from it so that he doesn't end blammed for innocent Ang's lynch.

The other person who spoke up in an important point in this discussion was Lommy, who mentioned that "SpM probably joked" even before SpM himself said it. What this says of Lommy? Well, if he's wolfish, for Lommy then it wouldn't make sense to be in alliance with SpM because of aiding him (with saying that what he said was joke) would get them in connection in the eyes of public. Then the question is, if they would've thought of that, or if they wouldn't ignore it (Lommy, from that part). But here I am coming to the place of very big speculating, so let's leave it for now.

The other person who raised alarms in Orthanc when I was reading through the thread was Mac. Mac is strange. He seems to be "over-eager in speaking sense", and when I remember him as being innocent, when I was innocent and him as well, we were pretty much agreeing on many things. Now he seems over-eager and strange. He is at first harsh like Treebeard's bark and then in #42 he is smooth as the wall of Orthanc. If I didn't have my script at me, I'd think he stole my text from the chapter "Voice of Saruman".

Other people have said either too few, or just in-character, or it makes a neutral feeling for me, or not of interest at this point.

In conclusion: Ang looks suspicious, Six not unless something else happens, SpM might as well be a wolf, Mac is strange. Others - either questionable or no data.

Oh, and one more thing. I think it was Mac who said it first and in a rather offensive way, but also some others, I don't know who, but some people said that my posts were just banter. Here I would like to note that ALL my posts have content. In the posts at the beginning of the Day, I was using Saruman's lines, but modified them, so that I both enjoyed the in-character play and also said something. So whatever LotR language my posts may seem, I am saying real things, sometimes just in LotR language. After all, there even wasn't much to say at that time. And as Agnazir said, if it at any time seemed offensive, well, that's the nature of Saruman's words.

EDIT: x-ed with Ang, Kath, Brinniel

[Anguirel]

Righty-ho...how about this

++VOLO

Wishy-washy, non-commital, unconvincing and dodgy. That a harsh enough tone for you, fella-me-lad...?

[Anguirel]

I think Saruman's innocent, slightly annoyingly as if we don't hang him we'll have to endure his insufferable tongue and proto-industrialism for the next fortnight. Nevertheless, that last, magnificent Philippic of a post struck me as bearing all the marks of that deadliest of animals, The Innocent With A Beloved Theory!

Certainly that tirade helps to convince me I did rightly in avoiding voting for him, despite considerable provocation. Besides there's something of a consensus building against him, I now see, which I don't much like the look of.

[Mithalwen]

I have just lost my post gah ... no time but I am here and need to do one of my lists ...

[Volo]

We might have different meanings for the word "harsh", but I do completely agree with Legate, about your, Ang, half-in-half-out-character talk being annoying and easily changed by yourself. If you are a wolf, I suggest you quit it. If you are an innocent, I suggest you quit it. This will always put you into a guilty light, whatever the case.

I'm sure thing going to vote you now. Though you're probably innocent. Your accusation came so out of nowhere. My first post was PURE in-character stuff, without ANY useful content. My second post was pretty much my thoughts as they are. Why no more than that? For the simple reason that I didn't have anything else to say. Are you expecting me to have great analysis for the talk here? You yourself don't have much stuff to say...

++Anguirel

[The Saucepan Man]

SPM, toss me a vegetarian soup, would you please!Vege-what? I can do you a vegemite sandwich, if you want.

Well, a bit more to get my teeth into now. So, here goes ...

Rikae – Would undoubtedly have been either a Wolf or the Seer, were she not dead. ;)

Volo – First post mere banter. Has recently returned to note a few suspicions. But nothing solid.

Legate of Amon Lanc – Much interaction with Ang and Mith at the beginning, but little substance (despite his protestations to the contrary). Exhorted everyone to talk (or everyone then present, as he later claimed) and then got rather defensive in response to a mild rebuke from Ang. More substance in his latest post, although I find it strange that he should suspect Ang for being ‘in-character’ for too long, given his own behaviour in this regard. His comments about me are, of course, pure nonsense and look to be somewhat retaliatory in nature.

Macalaure – Laid into the continuing banterers with vigour, subsequently claiming that he was attempting to stir things up (difficult to see what this was designed to achieve, if so). Accused Rune of being defensive, then got rather defensive himself when challenged on his stance against bantering.

Boromir88 – Voted for himself (effectively wasting his first vote, seemingly in the cause of character development), then retracted to vote for Ang, for no other reason than the latter was being too chirpy. Rather erratic behaviour but, as others have noted, that can be his way.

Mithalwen – Has appeared to glide serenely through the proceedings thus far, and has done little to raise suspicion. This could be because she is innocent or it could be because she wants to give that impression. Did raise a few substantive points ‘in character’, as it were. Linked with Ang, albeit through their choice of roles.

Shastanis Althreduin – Nought but banter.

Durelin – Nought, full stop.

Xyzzy – Again, nought but banter.

Brinniel – First post banter. Her recent post focussed on Sixth and Legate (ie those currently topping the ‘most discussed’ chart) .

Thinlómien – One of the more substantive contributors. Can’t really fault her vote for Sixth, given my own suspicion of him. Nothing to raise any alarms with me so far.

The Sixth Wizard – Jumped on my flippant accusation of Ang, although he claims to have suspected him independently. Hasn’t really explained his vote, save by reference to Ang being one of the more talkative of those present. But one or two others have been equally talkative, so why Ang in particular?

Anguirel – Some substance amidst the opening flim-flammery. Mild skirmish with Legate, both in-character and in relation to Legate’s request for discussion. The only thing that I thought slightly odd was his early suggestion that the Wolves might look to distance themselves from each other. Well, not if that’s what people are looking for, they won’t. Could be a comment designed to conceal his allegiances, should he later prove malign. His recent comments on his likely vote look genuine enough.

Kath – Not sure what to make of her mysterious ‘issue’ that she decided not to raise and now claims to have changed her mind about. Why mention it at all in the first place? Her recent analysis looks pretty solid, though, with some good points raised, although I'm not sure where she got the idea that I raised the possibility of Lovers.

Gil-Galad – He came. He posted. He said he didn’t like Day 1s. And that’s about it. Where the expansive Gil of recent times?

Aganzir – Like Volo, first post was mere banter, followed up recently with a few thoughts. Nothing to raise my concerns.

Rune – Bit of banter. Other than that, his main contribution has been to challenge Mac’s criticism of the banterers.

Diamond18 – Early vote for Gil could have been an attempt to start a bandwagon. But she appears to have been obliged to vote early, and there was little to go on at that stage.

Voting thus far:

Diamond: ++Gil-Galad (Gil-1)
Boromir: ++Boromir (Gil-1, Boro-1)
Boromir: --Boromir, ++Anguirel (Gil-1, Anguirel-1)
SpM: ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-1, Sixth-1)
Sixth: ++Anguirel (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-1)
Lommy: ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-2)
Kath: ++Rune (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-2, Rune-1)
Ang: ++Volo (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-2, Rune-1, Volo-1)

I must conclude that, purely on the basis of my own analysis, Legate is looking rather suspicious. That said, I can certainly appreciate the possibility that he is an over-thinking innocent (having fallen into that trap myself on more than one occasion). His recent post looks to draw much firmer conclusions that I would expect from a Wolf on Day 1. And I too am wary of the suspicion gathering around him, albeit witout a vote thus far.

So I'll leave my vote for Sixer to stand for now. I'm not sure where this idea that he is inexperienced is coming from? Isn't he a veteran of something like three games now?

Edit: Crossed with Volo, as is often the way with villager-by-villager analyses.

[Mithalwen]

Must you kill my husband so soon? I mean I don't know if he is innocent but he is is charming and fun .... could make an elf queen die of grief...

Kath darling I asked for tweezers not shears !...situation far from being so drastic .. I am not a dwarf..though if Galadriel had a beard it would explain Gimli's crush :p

*continues reading*

[Volo]

The in-out-character confusion has also a second contributer. Please, Legate, either in-character or out-character.

Kath's is interesting. It might go for trying too hard, as it has a lot of nothing saying observations. Then again, it can be her sincere thoughts.

EDIT: Xd with SPM and Mith

[The Saucepan Man]

At the risk of further accusations of 'palliness', I fail to see the basis for these accusations of harshness against Ang. Perhaps I am just used to his style. However, like Mith, I would rather not see him fall at the first fence as I rather appreciate his wit.

Volo's seeming over-reaction to Ang's vote for him has pinged my radar somewhat.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

On to the voting. . .

So far the person that has jumped the most to my attention has been Mac, but you probably noticed that. The problem is that it does not take very much to do that on day one. His sugestion attitude did seem weird, but I also have to be aware of the fact that he actually could just be an innocent wanting to get us all talking.

For this time I shall leave him be and I will just have to see what tomorrow brings.

Mith I'm inclined to trust, though again, she hasn't said anything that I see other that in-character stuff.

Lommy's vote speaks well for her, but we shall see, we shall see.

Legate and Aganzir I find innocentish.

I'm more afraid of Mac and Ang, maybe purely for their harsh tone (and because I'm paranoid after learning that I'm "the confused innocent"). I'll try not to prosecute without solid factss.


SPM, toss me a vegetarian soup, would you please! Now this post is interesting. . .

He trusts a person even though he does not think she has said anything of substance. . . that is odd.

I have expirienced that people had an innocent feel to them, but to trust them is a very radical thing to do.

I my self do not find Mith suspiciouse, but I do not trust her.

And how does Lommy's vote speak well for her? that one I do not understand. The rest seems unbased as well, but more resonable as Volo only seem to be talking about feelings.

anyways Volo seems like the best option at this point.

++Volo

EDIT: Cross posted with SPM

[Volo]

I have expirienced that people had an innocent feel to them, but to trust them is a very radical thing to do.
Please, don't twist my words. Yes, it's not a fact as that of a Seer, and even then the Seer can be wrong. So of course I can't fully know that she is innocent, though I think she is.

And don't waste your votes on me, you won't be able to kill me anyway... I'm one of the special roles... That is, I can't be lynched or killed.

EDIT: And instead of dying, my role will be revealed if I'm "lynched" or "killed".

(Sorry, I'm not in a mood now and not too optimistic for keeping the role a secret.)

[Macalaure]

Something about the Legate of Nan Curunír:

I don't agree with his interpretation of Ang at all. Is his main point that his in-character stuff could have been shorter? Well, surely it could have, but Ang had more actual arguments inside it than others did. He's accusing Ang for things he himself has been doing.

In fact, Anguirel is the only one whom I would dare to declare innocentish at this early time.

I wonder: Why does Legate emphasise that he came to the same conclusion as Six independantly?
But I guess it's premature to go and construct any links between people (which Legate passionately does). Maybe I'm paranoid because these two are my main suspects for now.

Legate's case of the Saucepan Man looks almost constructed to me. Lommy and I jumped on Six equally fast. Legate is founding far too much of his analysis upon Six's innocence, and if his ways are innocent, then they're misguided. In fact, as others have pointed out already, this is not so unlikely.

...when I was innocent and him as well, we were pretty much agreeing on many things.Didn't I end up lynching you in that game? There must've been some things we didn't agree on. ;)

Then in the end, he apologises to people who might think he's offensive, because he is just playing Saruman. In the same paragraph, he accuses me, the anonymous orc, of being offensive. I can't see the sense in this.


I will probably vote for Legate or Six today, or maybe Volo for good reasons that others have already stated. I really wouldn't like to lose Ang today.

[Mithalwen]

Actually if there is a love fest going on (other than Ang and my IC one) it is Legate and Sixth it seems to me. That is a bit creepy but would 2 wolves be so bold? Maybe... wolf and cobbler-type-person might maybe..

Really don't like Mac's attitude to the IC posts - I was IC but I was also making the stating the bleeding obvious reminders that I am prone to if I am able to post early in teh day when there isn't a lot else to talk about. I see nothing suspicious in suggesting peopel bear in mind what we are up against as they read posts, to think of the various possible dynamics.

Also there were only 3 of us posting ... all with book characters and great lines to play with - did you really not expect us to fill the vacuum with a bit of fun.

More suspicious surely are those who flip in make a brief IC post and that is it.

Nominations in this category: Gil, Shasta, Xyzzy ( a few others narrowly missed nomination)

Boro and Di havn't been around much. Boro is prone to stir things up and though normally I wouldn't approve of selfvotes / frivolous votes the IC context made it funny enough to forgive him.

Di - well I wonder about Gil's sig too .... Gil is impossible to read .... he can be very right or very wrong ...

SpM seems ok so far .... and without anything concrete I prefer to hang on to "talkers".

[Anguirel]

Okay. I believe Volo's probably telling the truth about his role, though what purpose an unkillable bodger serves I have very little idea.

I'd like to stress, my dear friends, that I am not at all unkillable, have very nicely combed silver hair, am quite wise, still have a vote to chuck around, and don't especially want to bite it just yet. Though it would be good for my acting schedule, what with my, ah, upcoming roles as King John, Sophocles, Chaucer and Aeneas (it's just amazing how much like my A Levels my acting career seems at the moment...real deja vu...)

That apart, erm, my brilliant original suspect choice seems to have gone awry, and I'll reserve my decision until the nailbiting last minute.

[Volo]

I'm pretty sure that either Mac or Ang (or both) are wolves.

Unless Rikae had thought of something even more sinister for Mac.

Ang has been the loud suspicious wolf. And pretty much Mac too. I really don't know what to think of this... :( The itchy feeling that Mac is trying to get closer to Ang assailed me. Oh, botheration.

Is Ang always like that? Even as a wolf?

EDIT: Xd with Mith and Ang.

Mith, I wouldn't go too hard on analysing the quiet ones.
1. There is nothing to analyse.
2. They'll be lynched from paranoia at the latest.

Ang. Everybody has a retractable vote, except Boro. So, we can still do much here. I don't really want to lynch you, but you are far from innocentish to me... :(

[Brinniel]

Volo's vote for Ang is now making me very uneasy. Not only was this a spite vote, but he jumped the bandwagon perhaps to make this vote seem a bit safer. Even worse, is what he says here:
I'm sure thing going to vote you now. Though you're probably innocent.
Why would you vote for someone when you think they're probably innocent? Well, I guess you explain it here:
Your accusation came so out of nowhere.
Okay...but not good enough to convince me.

Suddenly, Volo has been moved to the top of my suspect list.

Legate's last post is an improvement from before. Still, I feel a bit uneasy about him. Again, another suspector of Ang:
From the beginning, I didn't like his style, it seemed to me as too much in-role and too long for an in-role, nothing-saying post, being vocal enough to be noticed, maybe even get sympathies, but saying nothing in game - not even trying to.
Okay, a good reason....but haven't you been doing a very similar playing style yourself?

Legate is still very suspicious to me, but as the voting already is rather spread out, I would rather not vote for him if it means a throw-away vote. Well, we still have almost an hour left, so we will see...

A lot are voting for Ang. I'm honestly not sure what to think of him at this point. Could be a wolf or could be innocent. But I see no good enough reason to vote for him, so I won't for toDay.

But anyways, my vote probably will be for Volo or Legate if nothing dramatically changes...

EDIT: X-ed with everyone since Rune. Oh my, what has happened here?! :eek:

[The Saucepan Man]

Apologies if I am misunderstanding you, Volo, but you appear to be making no sense. Since when can a Seer's dreams be wrong?

As for your claimed role, I thought that you were joking, but then your edit would suggest that you are serious. But, if you are unkillable and unlynchable, what possible downside might there be to you revealing your role anyway? Unless, you are either on the side of the Wolves or on neither the side of the Wolves nor the villagers, and merely out for yourself. :confused:

[Anguirel]

My jokes are marginally better when I'm a wolf.

My strategy is marginally better when I'm a Ranger.

(Not that I am. Just fiddling with a correlation there)

Oh, and by the way, I quite agree, all this complaining about mixing IC and OOC talk is nonsense. For me the whole point of this game is having fun with a role while extracting some cursory tactical thinking...

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

I don't agree with his interpretation of Ang at all. Is his main point that his in-character stuff could have been shorter? Well, surely it could have, but Ang had more actual arguments inside it than others did. He's accusing Ang for things he himself has been doing.
For the seventieth and the last time, almost every sentence I said had real in-game meaning. This is what Ang didn't do, he was speaking in character, but not just it, it was all... well, strange.

Didn't I end up lynching you in that game? There must've been some things we didn't agree on.
At least from my part, I saw you doing all that I agreed with or you came to the same conclusions independantly of me, and the only thing you did which I didn't agree with was my lynching.
Which, in mirroring that game, I would really NOT like to see...

Then in the end, he apologises to people who might think he's offensive, because he is just playing Saruman. In the same paragraph, he accuses me, the anonymous orc, of being offensive. I can't see the sense in this.
Oh, sorry if it was that - my fault, I didn't look what your role is. Or, I knew you are "7th orc in 3rd row", but it didn't came to me that it's "Orc". The image in my head was "some warrior in 3rd row", which in role would mean a person who does not say anything in the whole film. Then only the accusation of me posting only banter remains, and for that, cf. above.

[Mithalwen]

Ang is like that .... - less so I would say when wolvish.. but I am biased. He is very like that when gifted too and his protestation that he isn't might be worth considering BEFORE he gets lynched.
I don't KNOW his status, I suspect he would be more cautious if he were wolvish. He is one of life's cavaliers .. that may not win him friends among the roundheads but it doesn' t make him a wolf. I really don't know why he is found os much more suspicious than Legate say - and indeed Mac.... both have been a bit scratchy? Of course some things get lost in translation even when the ESL players have such a good standard as they have ...

[Macalaure]

Really don't like Mac's attitude to the IC posts - I was IC but I was also making the stating the bleeding obvious reminders that I am prone to if I am able to post early in teh day when there isn't a lot else to talk about. I see nothing suspicious in suggesting peopel bear in mind what we are up against as they read posts, to think of the various possible dynamics.

Also there were only 3 of us posting ... all with book characters and great lines to play with - did you really not expect us to fill the vacuum with a bit of fun.
If it had only been you three, I wouldn't have lost a word about it, but it was half a dozen of people. Well, I already said I shouldn't have put everybody into one box.

Unless Rikae had thought of something even more sinister for Mac.Oh, please.... :rolleyes:

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Actually if there is a love fest going on (other than Ang and my IC one) it is Legate and Sixth it seems to me.
Not from my part. If Six is a cobbler and thinks me a wolf or vice versa, that might be, but for myself, nope.

Other people:

Concerning Ang, now I am in the typical situation of contradiction when a person you suspect proclaims you innocent.

Brinniel is the typical example of "more-or-less-neutral" person. Even if she were a Wolf, after what we did to her last time (well... and not just last...), I'm probably not voting for her at least the next two days.

Kath then... she makes sense, but somehow the way she says it in a way that it seems... fishy. I don't have anything specific now, I have to look to it more.

SpM hasn't convinced me at all of his innocence.

Volo: And what are you, then? Some sort of a role that just mixes other people's roles or something like that? What's your goal? What side are you on? When you started of it, it must mean you don't care - or what?

[Mithalwen]

Apologies if I am misunderstanding you, Volo, but you appear to be making no sense. Since when can a Seer's dreams be wrong?



I am afraid I haven't followed all the games I haven't played - but isn't htere a false seer? but I don't really understand what Volo says....

[Mithalwen]

I mean a possible role of False seer not necessarily here and now...

[Volo]

Apologies if I am misunderstanding you, Volo, but you appear to be making no sense. Since when can a Seer's dreams be wrong? WW XXXII

As for your claimed role, I thought that you were joking, but then your edit would suggest that you are serious. But, if you are unkillable and unlynchable, what possible downside might there be to you revealing your role anyway? Unless, you are either on the side of the Wolves or on neither the side of the Wolves nor the villagers, and merely out for yourself. :confused:
If I'm "lynched" then my role is revealed anyway, so no point wasting a lynch on me. So I am on the Innocent side. Though if you really don't trust me, you might as well see for yourself by voting me.

I'm just feeling like being a known Innocent wouldn't be too bad. Not too optimistic after being lynched on Day1 for so many times, only once guilty. (But I'm not emphasising this.)

EDIT: Xd with everything since Legate.

I'll explain:

My role is called the Reincarnation of Tolkien. And because Tolkien is immortal, I can't be killed. I am on the side of the Innocents. My goal is to lynch the Wolves. If I am to be lynched or killed at Night, my role will be revealed, but I won't die.


Still half an hour. I'm going to find myself a new vote target. I was very very frustrated with Ang, but logic tells me that he's innocent, as I stated before.

[Macalaure]

I will vote now, since it makes no sense to delay one's vote until short before the deadline when we're playing with retractable votes.

I'm getting a slightly better feeling about Legate from his last few posts, so my vote will be received by:


++The Sixth Wizard

[Mithalwen]

Oh volo - I am definietely not in the market of lynching a flitter today - just pointing out that there are levels of IC ... and as time goes on it may be that we have to weigh RL and habit against the possibility / statistical probablility that if we have 4 or 5 people who post just enough to stay in the game, that a wolf may be in their number - the devil will be in deciding which.... and of course it will be necessary in this game for a low posting wolf to make the effort to at least register their presence since the mod not the players will dispose of them.

[Brinniel]

Volo, I'm really confused about this role of yours. :confused:

If you can't be lynched or killed and you are on the side of us Innocents, then why won't you reveal it to us?

It doesn't make sense to me. What harm could possibly be done if you do indeed reveal your role?

[The Saucepan Man]

SpM hasn't convinced me at all of his innocence.I wasn't aware of having tried to convince you. :p In any event, I would rather that you vote for me than condemn a (probably innocent) Ang to an early grave - provided, of course, it doesn't result in me being lynched in his place. ;)

Diamond: ++Gil-Galad (Gil-1)
Boromir: ++Boromir (Gil-1, Boro-1)
Boromir: --Boromir, ++Anguirel (Gil-1, Anguirel-1)
SpM: ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-1, Sixth-1)
Sixth: ++Anguirel (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-1)
Lommy: ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-2)
Kath: ++Rune (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-2, Rune-1)
Anguirel: ++Volo (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-2, Rune-1, Volo-1)
Volo: ++Anguirel (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-2, Rune-1, Volo-1)
Rune: ++Volo (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-2, Rune-1, Volo-2)
Mac: ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-3, Rune-1, Volo-2)

With half an hour to go, I can see this ending in utter chaos. With the threat of a possible double-lynching looming over us, it might be a good idea for those who have not yet placed their first vote to do so reasonably in advance of the deadline.

[Volo]

Volo, I'm really confused about this role of yours. :confused:

If you can't be lynched or killed and you are on the side of us Innocents, then why won't you reveal it to us?

It doesn't make sense to me. What harm could possibly be done if you do indeed reveal your role?
I revealed it already! We wouldn't be discussing it if I hadn't...

[Brinniel]

I revealed it already! We wouldn't be discussing it if I hadn't...
Oh sorry...I didn't see your edit... :o

[Volo]

Do you feel Sixth is worth lynching? I sure see why he is suspicious, and it might indeed be a possibility that he's a Wolf. Otherwise we need to agree, quick.

[Aganzir]

I'm a little confused. I thought I would be going to vote for Legate, but now everything he has said has made him look more innocentish than some others. But I don't consider Sixth that suspicious that I would vote for him.

I don't really see the point of Volo's role, and neither in revealing it. Of course I understand why he revealed his role, but... It all seems quite weird. Why would there be a role that cannot be killed? Claiming that he has this role would of course be a good strategy for a wolf or a gifted - at least for, say, a couple of Days. Why would wolves take the risk of losing a kill by attempting to kill someone who doesn't die, and why would the villagers consider wasting a lynch in someone who might or might not die...

Mith looks pretty innocent this far. So do Kath, Brinniel and Rune. Of others I can't say anything.

[Macalaure]

But Volo, does anything change for you once somebody tries to kill you? Will you still be allowed to vote, for example?

[Mithalwen]

Legate I might well vote for..... btu I worry that suspecting him is a not entirely unjustified habit.... but as Brinniel say it might be throw away ... and indeed wrong....

So little time, so much confusion, such a great fear that it is an innocents tear each other apart day..... shall we try to avoid a double lynch at least? I can only see that that would help the wolves ...

And volo - if you do have som knowledge can you be less oblique?

Or is this some wolftrick?

My mirror is very cloudy :(

[Volo]

But Volo, does anything change for you once somebody tries to kill you? Will you still be allowed to vote, for example?
Nothing changes.

Gut says that Kath be a Wolf. Or the thought that she analysed too little content with too much text.

[Mithalwen]

OK I will change if necessary but first vote of instinct even if second for necessity:

++Legate of Amon Lanc

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Well although Volo's role could have been a trick, I don't think he'd think of it himself. Also remember the narration (the book and the lines in it). The shame is, that it was revealed - surely more fun could've been brought with it. Any downside of revealing, Volo? But let's keep this off - with deadline about 2 hours earlier than I am used to, I now realized in shock after SpM's and Mith's post that it's upon us! :eek: Hey, we HAVE TO AVOID DOUBLE-LYNCH AT ALL COSTS!!! While I know with the remaining votes my vote might lead to it, I'm still keeping one vote for retraction. Let's hope no one else does it!

PLEASE CHECK YOU DON'T CROSS-VOTE WITH ANYONE, BECAUSE THEN WE CAN HAVE DOUBLE-LYNCH VERY NICELY.

++Anguirel

for what I said earlier.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

I did not see your edit either before just now. . . .Interesting.

My problem is that you were my only lynch candidate other than Mac, I could change my vote but it would change nothing.

[The Saucepan Man]

OK Volo, I'll buy your explanation, for now at least. Although, with a greater likelihood of an innocent being lynched than a Wolf on Day 1, it might have been better for you not to have revealed your role and run the risk of being non-lynched. After all, the main advantage of your role would appear to be that the Wolves might have wasted a kill on you.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Ad Six: I believe him innocent, because he didn't do anything that could be wolfish apart of that he started bandwaggon for Ang.

[Brinniel]

Okay, I said I would vote Volo or Legate, unless things dramatically changed, and well....things have dramatically changed, so...

That is indeed a special role, Volo, and I don't think you would lie about it, so I will not vote for you.

I would really like to vote for Legate now, actually, but at this point it looks like it would just be another throw-away vote. And as SPM has reminded us, there can be double lynches, and I would really rather not have that happen...

Deadline is getting close...

Next on my suspicious list is Sixth, and while I'd rather not vote him toDay, he definitely seems more suspicious to me than Ang or any other who has been voted for already for that matter.

Vote coming shortly...

EDIT: X-ed with a whole lot of people

[Aganzir]

I would rather go for Legate than for Sixth or Ang, though voting for Legate at this point would indeed be throw away. Sixth is more suspicious than Ang, of whom I can't say anything.

++Legate

I'll change to Sixth if necessary.

edit: xed since Legate

[Volo]

--Anguirel
++The Sixth Wizard

I suspect those two more than Legate, but seeing that Sixth will be lynched more surely than Ang I'll vote him.

[Macalaure]

I'll change to Sixth if necessary.
And I would change to Legate if necessary. We all just have to decide on one.

[The Saucepan Man]

I declare myself willing to vote for Legate, if necessary, given that he looks far more suspicious to me than Ang.

[Anguirel]

Evidently this is going to be a pretty close run thing, especially with Saruman helpfully chipping in over there...I don't think there's much point in doing anything other than this:

--VOLO, ++SIXTH WIZARD

Very undignified to have to stoop to scrabbling for my skin, but...

[The Saucepan Man]

Crossed with Volo's retraction and vote - I'll leave my vote with Sixer for now.

[Brinniel]

Okay, now people are starting to vote Legate...

What to do...

Well, since this won't be a throw-away vote anymore, I will after all vote:

++Legate

Hopefully, this won't turn into a double lynch toDay...

EDIT: X-ed with Volo on...

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

I guess it's obvious that Six is toast now, but I daresay that you made a mistake, and if not, I'm going to eat my own Orc-food...

[Mithalwen]

So What are the votes ..I am too befuddled...... I need ot know if widowhood is imminent... :Merisu:

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

I think Sixth is leading by two votes, but I am not sure.

[Aganzir]

So What are the votes ..I am too befuddled...... I need ot know if widowhood is imminent... :Merisu:
Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-5, Rune-1, Volo-1, Legate 3, if I'm right.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Six five, four three one. Umm... I wanted to say: Six 5, Ang 3, Little My 3. (unless I miscounted)

EDIT: X-ed since Mith

[Macalaure]

Ang 3
Six 5
Legate 3

...I hope...

edit: cross-posted, obviously :rolleyes:

[Brinniel]

I think it's:

Sixth: 5
Ang: 4
Legate:3

EDIT: Haha....all of us answered at once... :rolleyes:

[The Saucepan Man]

Hard to keep up, but I think that it looks like this:

Diamond: ++Gil-Galad (Gil-1)
Boromir: ++Boromir (Gil-1, Boro-1)
Boromir: --Boromir, ++Anguirel (Gil-1, Anguirel-1)
SpM: ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-1, Sixth-1)
Sixth: ++Anguirel (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-1)
Lommy: ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-2)
Kath: ++Rune (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-2, Rune-1)
Anguirel: ++Volo (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-2, Rune-1, Volo-1)
Volo: ++Anguirel (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-2, Rune-1, Volo-1)
Rune: ++Volo (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-2, Rune-1, Volo-2)
Mac: ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-3, Rune-1, Volo-2)
Mithalwen: ++Legate (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-3, Rune-1, Volo-2, Legate-1)
Legate: ++Anguirel (Gil-1, Anguirel-4, Sixth-3, Rune-1, Volo-2, Legate-1)
Aganzir: ++Legate (Gil-1, Anguirel-4, Sixth-3, Rune-1, Volo-2, Legate-2)
Volo: --Anguirel, ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-4, Rune-1, Volo-2, Legate-2)
Anguirel: --Volo, ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-5, Rune-1, Volo-1, Legate-2)
Brinniel: ++Legate (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-5, Rune-1, Volo-1, Legate-3)

Yet to vote: Shasta, Durelin, Xyzzy, Gil

[Volo]

Diamond: ++Gil-Galad (Gil-1)
Boromir: ++Boromir (Gil-1, Boro-1)
Boromir: --Boromir, ++Anguirel (Gil-1, Anguirel-1)
SpM: ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-1, Sixth-1)
Sixth: ++Anguirel (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-1)
Lommy: ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-2)
Kath: ++Rune (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-2, Rune-1)
Anguirel: ++Volo (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-2, Rune-1, Volo-1)
Volo: ++Anguirel (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-2, Rune-1, Volo-1)
Rune: ++Volo (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-2, Rune-1, Volo-2)
Mac: ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-3, Rune-1, Volo-2)
Mith: ++Legate (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-3, Rune-1, Volo-2, Legate-1)
Legate: ++Ang (Gil-1, Anguirel-4, Sixth-3, Rune-1, Volo-2, Legate-1)
Aganzir: ++Legate (Gil-1, Anguirel-4, Sixth-3, Rune-1, Volo-2, Legate-2)
Volo: --Ang, ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-4, Rune-1, Volo-2, Legate-2)
Ang: --Volo, ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-5, Rune-1, Volo-1, Legate-2)
Brinniel: ++Legate (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-5, Rune-1, Volo-1, Legate-3)

EDIT: Huh, xd with everything since Brinniel's vote.

[Mithalwen]

15 vote out of a possible 19 is not great .. but better than most general elections....

[Macalaure]

That's six vote counts in a row! :D

[Brinniel]

Ah, thanks for that, both Volo and SPM. I'm less confused now... :rolleyes:

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

And speaking of you, Brin, though I don't want to by even a little hint cause your premature death again, I don't like how you voted and said "let's hope it's not a double-lynch"... it's like apologizing for your wolfy comrades who will make it later.

EDIT: Not that they could any longer... just writing it down so that I don't forget it till toMorrow ;)

[Mithalwen]

Thanks everyone ..I could get used to being a queen and getting my requests met instantly... and excessively ;)

[Rikae]

Everybody quiet!

Sixth has been lynched.

The narration will be up within a couple minutes.

[Rikae]

Though faced with the daunting task of hunting down a quartet of murderous hyenas, the Downers were reluctant to get down to business. Half the day was spent in shooting ad-lib Lothlorien and Orthanc scenes; until the caterer and the bereaved orc gently redirected the group's attention to the grim business at hand (despite the protests of the elf extra). Saruman, however, insisted that he had not left the path of wisdom.

When Volo, who had received some earlier suspicion, proclaimed that he could not be killed, Anguirel and The Sixth Wizard emerged as the top suspects.

In the end, the protester against dwarven comic relief was chosen to die.
“Now how shall we do away with him?” asked Durelin.
“How about this?” Kath suggested, holding up a gallon bottle of vodka from the CG animator's secret stash.
Sauce and Aganzir grabbed the bewildered young man by either arm, and Boromir88 advanced toward him with a funnel and the bottle. “I bet he can't hold his liquor!”

Suddenly, Sixth wrestled himself free and sprinted off down the hall. The Downers pursued him up a stairway and into a darkened crawlspace just under the roof. They could hear his footsteps, which seemed to make a strange crunching sound.

Xyzzy turned on a flashlight to reveal a horrifying sight...

Sixth was running across a floor covered with hundreds of thousands of human skulls.

He cried out in disgust and nearly fell – putting out his hand to catch himself, he dislodged a plank which secured a hatch in the wall. It fell; and with a fiendish clicking and clattering, countless more skulls poured down, crushing the hapless Sixth to death.

The rest of the cast and crew stood staring.

Finally plucking up their courage, Mithalwen and Brinniel made their way across the skulls (which they now realised were merely props), to the body. Sixth looked like he always had...only less alive.

The Cast and Crew


Not Lost, but Gone Before:

Rikae - (Mod) CG Animator, Rendered and Lighted on Night 1
The Sixth Wizard - (Ordo) PDCR, buried in skulls on Day 1

Alive and Well:

Volo - Gollum
Legate of Amon Lanc - Sound Master/Saruman
Macalaure - The 7th orc in the 3rd row
Boromir88- Sir Boromir, playing Denethor
Mithalwen- Galadriel
Shastanis Althreduin - Legolas' stunt double
Durelin - Special Effects Pyrotechnician
The Saucepan Man- Set Catering Manager
Xyzzy - Young Fanboy
Brinniel- Wacky Foley Artist
Thinlómien- Non-Winged Balrog
Anguirel- Celeborn
Kath - Make-up Artist
Gil-Galad - Zombie-Gil-Galad
Aganzir - Smeagol
Rune -Tolkien geek who is estatic about being an Elf extra
Diamond18 - Lady in charge of Wigs and all other False Hairpieces

Day one is over. Night two has begun. Silence.
Wolves, send me your kill; others send me what you will.

[Rikae]

The unjust and untimely death of The Sixth Wizard demoralized the Downers terribly.

“Alas! I fear we cannot stay here longer,” said Gil-Galad. He looked toward the mountain of skulls and held up his prop sword. “Farewell, Sixth Wizard!” he cried. “What hope have we without you?”

Xyzzy answered “We must do without hope. Let us gird ourselves and weep no more! Come! We have a long road, and much to do.”

And so the Downers returned to their filming...

The sun was sinking behind the Sierra Nevada mountains, and the shadows were deepening in the studio when the Downers went back to their trailers. Night came beneath the fake plastic trees in the backlot as they walked, and the “Elves” uncovered their silver lamps.

In one trailer, a Downer flipped randomly through a copy of LOTR, then, finding something, sat back and frowned, deep in thought.

Two trailers were watched by unseen eyes that night; but for what purpose I cannot say.

Another Downer was unable to sleep. Mithalwen! Haven't you seen enough horror movies in your long life to know better than to leave the group when there are werewolves about? Alas; dedication to her craft was to be the actress' downfall. She returned to her glorified birdbath to rehearse the Mirror scene one last time...
She did not see the four misshapen figures lurking in the shadows; nor did she see the frayed electrical cord left with its end in the basin of liquid...

With lemonade from the stream Galadriel filled the basin to the brim...

but as she bent over to breathe on it, a grating voice spoke from directly behind her:

“Do not touch the water!”

Mithalwen started and her hand slipped into the electrified liquid.

She began to glow from within; her hair lifted as if by a breeze; her eyes lit up...

..she turned several lovely psychedelic colors by turns...turquoise, green, electric blue...

...the lights in the studio suddlenly went out...

...and the elf queen collapsed in a heap on the floor. Four grinning creatures circled around, eager to enjoy their freshly cooked and sizzling dinner.


When the Downers awoke, they had gained a prop for Shelob's lair; but this did not quite compensate for the loss of Mithalwen...

Day 2 has begun! Wolves, stop PM'ing. Everybody – take it away!!!

The Cast and Crew

Resting in Peace:

Rikae(Mod)–CG Animator, Rendered and Lighted on Night1
The Sixth Wizard(Ordo)–Protester against Dwarven Comic Relief, Buried in Skulls on Day1
Mithalwen(Ordo)–Galadriel, Illuminated...(Electrocuted) on Night2

Hanging in there:

Volo - Gollum
Legate of Amon Lanc - Sound Master/Saruman
Macalaure - The 7th orc in the 3rd row
Boromir88- Sir Boromir, playing Denethor
Shastanis Althreduin - Legolas' stunt double
Durelin - Special Effects Pyrotechnician
The Saucepan Man- Set Catering Manager
Xyzzy - Young Fanboy
Brinniel- Wacky Foley Artist
Thinlómien- Non-Winged Balrog
Anguirel- Celeborn
Kath - Make-up Artist
Gil-Galad - Zombie-Gil-Galad
Aganzir - Smeagol
Rune -Tolkien geek who is estatic about being an Elf extra
Diamond18 - Lady in charge of Wigs and all other False Hairpieces

[Volo]

Diamond: ++Gil-Galad (Gil-1)
Boromir: ++Boromir (Gil-1, Boro-1)
Boromir: --Boromir, ++Anguirel (Gil-1, Anguirel-1)
SpM: ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-1, Sixth-1)
Sixth: ++Anguirel (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-1)
Lommy: ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-2)
Kath: ++Rune (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-2, Rune-1)
Anguirel: ++Volo (Gil-1, Anguirel-2, Sixth-2, Rune-1, Volo-1)
Volo: ++Anguirel (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-2, Rune-1, Volo-1)
Rune: ++Volo (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-2, Rune-1, Volo-2)
Mac: ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-3, Rune-1, Volo-2)
Mith: ++Legate (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-3, Rune-1, Volo-2, Legate-1)
Legate: ++Ang (Gil-1, Anguirel-4, Sixth-3, Rune-1, Volo-2, Legate-1)
Aganzir: ++Legate (Gil-1, Anguirel-4, Sixth-3, Rune-1, Volo-2, Legate-2)
Volo: --Ang, ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-4, Rune-1, Volo-2, Legate-2)
Ang: --Volo, ++Sixth (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-5, Rune-1, Volo-1, Legate-2)
Brinniel: ++Legate (Gil-1, Anguirel-3, Sixth-5, Rune-1, Volo-1, Legate-3)

The Sixth Wizard voters: SPM, Lommy, Mac, Volo, Ang
Legate voters: Mith, Aganzir, Brinniel

Of those SPM and Lommy are in the worst place if you ask me.
Me too as I basicly changed the lynch from Ang to Sixth.


I'll see if I can find anything interesting.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Woo, I'm feeling a little better. :) I feel bad for Mithalwen.... it's never any fun dying the first day. I know, cause I just did on PPT. :( I usually end up dying the first day or so. Based on yesterday's votes, and because I don't know if I'll be able to get on again later (mom thinks "sick" means "invalid" <_<) I'm going to go ahead and vote now, because I don't want to be modkilled. :D

++Legate

Edit: X'ed with Volo. Hi Volo!

[Aganzir]

And she was so concerned about her possible widowhood.

Quite an easy target for the wolves, as she was considered innocent by most. I doubt I can think of anything but that she was killed because of her innocentishness, as she did not say anything particularly special or accuse anyone with too determined way. Of course, she was the first to vote for Legate etc., but I can make of that out just as much as I can of too many other things, which is nothing.

Rikae, Sixth should be removed from the list of the living? ;)

edit: xed with Volo and Shasta, whose explanation of voting for Legate I'd like to hear.

[Volo]

Hello Shasta!


First of all, I'd like to send attention to Boromir, who, from my perspective, acted rather un-Boromirish... (And I'm not refering to Denetorish either.)

First post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521613&postcount=29)

Second post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521626&postcount=36)

He might have disguised his vote for Ang as a joke, but it sticks out pretty badly. And voting for Ang without reason is a bit too risky to be wise.

I'm actually thinking of a Boro-Ang figure here. Don't worry, I'll probably vote Boro of the two.


EDIT: Xd with Aganzir. Whose explanations to life, the universe and everything I'd like to hear. But start out with Boromir.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

So here it goes - another death. Mithalwen! And that's the second innocent. Can you now see the wisdom of Orthanc? Didn't I tell you Six was innocent? If you even heeded my advice, of the Wisest of the Order, we might yet have Six among us, and possibly one wolf down.

Let us not think that a yesterday's Survivor husband might not participate on a plot to kill his wife. It's a wife just in role, anyway. I am no fool, and I do not trust you, Anguirel. They do not stand openly on my stairs, but I know where the wild wolf-demons are lurking, at your command.

But come now. I think that we must seek first, who might have had interests in killing Mithalwen. I'm going to gaze to my Palantír and then I'll hopefully come back with some info on that.

EDIT: x-ed with everyone. Woo-hoo, Shasta, what was that supposed to be? I just saw it in the corner of my eye, have to read your post...

[Macalaure]

Mithalwen:

suspected by: Mac

thought innocent by: Lommy, Volo, Kath, Aganzir

not sure: SPM, Rune

no declaration (I'm leaving out people who rarely posted): Legate, Brinniel, Ang, Diamond

Standing out are, to me: Kath for praising Mith a little too much, and Rune for saying he doesn't find her suspicious, but doesn't trust her either. Am I really the only one who found her to be a little suspicious?


suspects: Mac, Legate

thought innocent: SPM, Ang

not sure: Gil

no declaration (as above): Brinniel, Lommy, Kath, Aganzir, Rune, Diamond

This part doesn't really make me smarter...


I guess Aganzir is right and Mith has been killed because she left few trails and was regarded as innocent by most.

[Aganzir]

Umm I don't know about Boromir.

I (am probably the only one to) fail to see why an innocent would vote for himself, even with retractable votes. It's quite unlikely that anyone else would vote for him after his little show. Thus, it might be a good way for a wolf to mislead innocents' thoughts.
Boro's second post is just explanatory, but to be honest the way he explained his vote for himself is not the most innocent I've seen.
But I'm not sure about you either, Volo, and Boro is not on the top of my suspect list.


EDIT: Xd with Aganzir. Whose explanations to life, the universe and everything I'd like to hear. But start out with Boromir.
The answer is simple: A Dwarf. But I think you already guessed it.

edit: xed with Mac

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

On current posts:

Interesting point on Boromir, Volo. I don't know if he ever plays like that, but I would like to add that it was him who, in our last game, still spoke about need to be accusatory in order to get things running. He made impression on me of one of the active, "pioneering" types. He isn't now. His first post calls "meeegajoke" or "cobbler", but the second one, for no reason, votes Anguirel at first. Be it a wolfy start of bandwaggon (or just trying to do it) or a wolf-on-wolf "safe" vote (without knowing the consequences, we had similar things here many times before), it doesn't look much good.

Seeing Shasta has no real support for his vote, this was quite an unlucky move from you, Shasta: such a thing really raises alarm. When I thought about it however, it comes to me that you might be in press to not be modkilled and that you might have somehow gained the impression that I am guilty so you just voted to save your life without possibility to dig into it deeper. However, as I said before, it's an unfortunate move and I hope you'll be around tomorrow with more "sensible" playing. Of course I'm not happy at all that you picked me of all the possibilities.

About Mith: Mith wasn't much active yesterday, but I'll still have to look at it, haven't gone through properly. However, I wouldn't be so fast to condemn it to "leaving no track". Of course the wolves likely do it that way, but if we can get at least something, it'd be good. Interesting thing is that from my experience, the Wolves are quite often the first to come and say "oh, it was made to leave no track" - and this might be even in the case that it indeed was made to leave no track.

[Rikae]

voice from beyond the grave:

As I said on the admin thread, players who do not post for two days will be modkilled.
I didn't mention players who post but don't vote. Those are left to the village to deal with as it sees fit.

[Anguirel]

I don't have much enthusiasm for this racket anymore, to be honest. I was almost hoping Mithaladriel would be guilty - it would have been better to have been betrayed by her than to stand impotently by when she was slain. It will be a sadder and less amusing game without her, but I suppose I'd better make a lacklustre attempt at vengeance.

A grim affair. I shall return in the morn, but meanwhile I have a little choice advice to the White Wizard. You dislike my style, it is clear, thinking it strange...but that does not necessarily mean either that it is strange in my terms (it really isn't, not that I'd care if it was), nor that I am necessarily guilty or innocent.

I urge you to keep an open mind and follow evidence, not taste. For myself I think both you and Volo are pompous rather than guilty...which means my whole performance yesterday was pretty off the rails.

I think Sauce is innocent due to the way he acted last night, showing intelligence and adaptability, at least from my point of view. I'd like to hear more from Diamond, largely as it would brighten things up...

I am rather concerned about Aganzir. His widowhood quip looks like a potential wolf-gloat. You'd say, no wolf would be foolish enough to wolf-gloat, but in the past when guilty I've often done it, enjoyed it and sometimes got away with it...part of the thrill of the chase.

My poor dear Lady. Namarie.

[Volo]

Having reread Mac, I see an innocent or a careful wolf. I'm inclined to believe him innocent for now as the carefulness is a bit too careful for a wolf... (Can't see bluffs.)

About Brinniel I can't say anything except that she's eccentric. A good reason not to vote her then, or then I just don't want her to die young, again. Although her vote is a bit wierd, I'll let it pass, for now.

Lommy. Nah, I don't have anything to say... But I do hope you'll be online toDay *cough*there're plenty of places with a net*cough*.

So far so empty... Continuing investigation.


EDIT: Xd with Ang. Good point about Aganzir, though maybe too early pointed out!

[The Saucepan Man]

Very sorry to see Mithalwen go. Anyone else need a stiff drink? I have a fine Scottish Malt here, if anyone’s interested.

I would agree with the conclusions of most that she was killed because she leaves a relatively cold trail and was regarded largely without much suspicion. She is also a dangerous adversary for the Wolves, as she has a flair for deduction. My first thought was that Anguirel, of all those present, would be the least likely to have chosen her to die as they were playing off each other well. But he can be a devious fellow, has a good grasp of tactics and bluffery and knows Mith’s werewolfing ways and skills very well.

Of course, the abiding aim of the Wolves in their Nightly kills is to find the Seer while he or she yet lives. Yet I can see nothing in her posts that might have made the Wolves think her the Seer.

Her main suspects appear to have been Legate (who she voted for) and Mac (for his comments about bantering) both of whom she described as ‘scratchy’. She was also suspicious of Gil, Shasta and Xyzzy, for contributing little more than brief ‘in-character’ posts. She appears to have been relatively comfortable with Ang (as she was keen not to see him lynched) and me (“seems OK so far”). But she did not outline any really firm conclusions.

And so to the voting. My traditional modus operandi is to look for ‘safe’ votes, although this is of slightly less use when the votes are retractable. Still, it’s worth a look. The safest vote looks to me to have been that cast by Kath, since Rune was not under particularly heavy suspicion at that time. Di’s vote for Gil might be considered safe, but has been explained. Rune’s vote for Volo was perhaps less safe as, prior to his revelation, it looked like Volo might attract a few votes.

The non-voters are of course suspicious by virtue of their lack of vote, but none contributed much, if anything, yesterDay, so I would like to hear more from them.

Other than that, all the votes were, I think, cast for Sixth, Anguirel and Legate.

Sixth voters: Me, Lommy, Mac, Volo and Anguirel

I wouldn’t regard Lommy’s vote as particularly safe, as early suspicion was already gathering around Sixth. It might be regarded as an attempt to grease a bandwaggon against an innocent, although I can understand why she thought him the most suspicious at that stage, as I did too. Of course, I realise that the same points apply broadly to my own vote, but I know that it was cast innocently. Since I am accepting Volo’s claim for now, and Anguirel was voting to save himself, I do not regard either of those votes as particularly suspicious. Which leaves Mac’s vote. This was effectively the one which pushed Sixth into pole position as the “not Anguirel” candidate, rather than Legate. As such, I regard it as the most suspicious of the Sixth votes.

Legate voters: Mith, Aganzir, Brinniel

Difficult to draw any conclusions from these. Mith, obviously, was innocent. All were cast in the last minute flurry, when cross-posting is a danger. Brin’s late vote, however, is curious as it was cast at a time, I think, when Sixth was leading in the votes, and so risked creating a last minute tie.

Anguirel voters: Boro, Sixth, Legate

I don’t regard Boro’s vote as particularly safe, as Ang was already attracting suspicion, and it is in itself suspicious by virtue of being wholly unexplained. Legate, I guess, was voting to save himself, even though he had only one vote at the time, and was in line with his stated suspicions.

So, on the basis of this, I would regard the votes of Kath, Mac and Brinniel as the most suspicious, although it does not follow necessarily from a suspicious vote that the voter is a Wolf. Also, I am wary that there may well be a Wolf among the non-voters.

I do, however, remain suspicious of Legate, for the reasons stated yesterDay. I would have been quite willing to vote for him yesterDay, had he gained more votes earlier as, if anything, I regarded him as the more likely Wolf than Sixth by the end of the Day. And I found this comment curious:

I guess it's obvious that Six is toast now, but I daresay that you made a mistake, and if not, I'm going to eat my own Orc-food...He could not be sure that Sixth was not a Wolf, unless a Wolf himself. The comment looks rather self-serving to me, and sure enough he has returned toDay with an “I told you so”. :rolleyes:

Legate remains high in my suspicions.

Must dash, but I'll be back later. I'll leave the Malt on the counter.

[Volo]

Of course, the abiding aim of the Wolves in their Nightly kills is to find the Seer while he or she yet lives. Yet I can see nothing in her posts that might have made the Wolves think her the Seer.
Even though not wolf, I did think of her as a Gifted myself, that's why the trust. Can't find the phrases now, and they might have been intentional, though most probably I'm just paranoid.

[Aganzir]

I am rather concerned about Aganzir. His widowhood quip looks like a potential wolf-gloat. You'd say, no wolf would be foolish enough to wolf-gloat, but in the past when guilty I've often done it, enjoyed it and sometimes got away with it...part of the thrill of the chase.
This will probably seem explaining, and rather increase your suspicion than lessen it, but I would never have said that and taken the risk of being suspected, were I a wolf. When I read through Mith's posts at the beginning of the Day, I thought the one where she said she needs to know if widowhood is imminent was funny on a tragic way, and couldn't resist mentioning it. Please note that this is only my second game.
And oh, you can call me she.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Hmph, though I was skeptical somewhat, it really seems there was nothing - or at least nothing recognizable for me - behind the death of Mith. The points about her possible behavior as Seer might have some logic in it, though it didn't strike me like that - Galadriel has a mirror, that's a fact, no? Nevertheless, the motive might be there, even just like a support. This, however, does not help us.

Concerning the momentary debate:
Agnazir: I don't think Aganzir's "widowhood" notes are of interest, though I'd certainly find some things that could be. First I wanted to wait, but now when it was mentioned, I have only to say Aganzir just creates too many ambivalent fellings in me - I can't probably work with it now.

Ad SpM:
He could not be sure that Sixth was not a Wolf, unless a Wolf himself.
As you were among the Six-voters as well, I wouldn't be as loud, being you. But concerning this, I thought, and I stand behind it, from the start (and you can even read it in my posts waay back there) that Six does not seem suspicious in anything, and the bandwaggon that formed against him was really very nasty. And as you were the one who started it, you are not in good light for me, as I said earlier. Lommy had to vote early, so the evidence cannot be based on her vote since it might have been just a momentary need to vote (and perhaps Ang is her lover or something like that, so that she didn't vote for him and picked Six instead). Ang, whatever suspicious he was/is to me, was voting to save himself, so even if he were a wolf, this vote would be logical even for innocent. Volo's was the first one that seemed strange to me, but now when I trust Volo, I can only say - even innocents do strange things sometimes. And then there is Mac, who seemed somewhat fishy to me yesterday and now is still. I think it's quite possible for two wolves to be in one voting - if they are SpM and Mac. From this point, Ang wouldn't fit that well in that scheme but, why not - three wolves out of four, one voting to save his skin. Hypothesis, of course, and very very imaginative, I know. But the main thought is in there.

We, of course (!) cannot forget that there might be more than one, even more than two wolves among the quiet people. But, however unfortunate it is, no evidence is bad evidence, so I suggest focusing on those who speak, and thus there is info about them. Hmm... now something struck me... Mith was the one who mentioned at one (or more) occassion that she would like to focus on the quiet ones (the opposite of what I'm saying here, this is how the idea came to me). What if the wolves are quiet and they killed Mith because...? (Another speculation. But worth mentioning, I'm sure.)

Other things. Just to recall one more thing on SpM which I said earlier - there were these possible links between SpM and Ang, if there were, and if Ang is a wolf - and even if he was not, SpM would have a good chance being a wolf (cf. the nice "I was just joking about Ang being suspicious and Six jumped on it, lookiee lookiee, ++Six" move of you). I remember you as wolf, SpM, and I know what you are capable of. I wanted to bring this back just so it's not forgotten. The way SpM seems to me lately, it's worth mentioning.

[Volo]

SPM in interesting, even from the mere fact that he has written a huge amount of posts. He noted Legate as suspicious right from the beginning.

The only thing that raises my hair (not wolf-like hair. Just the usual hair (that is, in fact, longer than of a wolf's) is his early vote for Sixth. He voted for Sixth was very like Sixth's vote for Ang.

I'll leave it on this for now.


BTW, Legate, you've been saying that you have sense in every post of yours. Could you please clarify.

First post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521565&postcount=9): You're saying "silence kills" and "Gifteds, reveal yourself"?

Second post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521569&postcount=11): Umm, what?

Third post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521574&postcount=15): Explaining Ang that you don't want the ones not able to speak to speak.

Fourth post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521659&postcount=53): Gah, here you got me to sympathise with you... :rolleyes: I actually find this post with the most sense so far. Oh, I hope I'm not totally wrong. Though you could have said it all much shorter and bolded out the names to save us from more confusion.

Fifth post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521691&postcount=71): This is probably the post where suspicion rose. I really don't understand the first part, because, as I see it, you are accusing Ang for what you yourself are doing. You might have sense in every post, and so might Ang, the problem is that you can add the meaning to the post much later, when you are questioned. That's why I don't like in-out-character posts, in which you can later decide what's in and what's out.

Sixth post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521695&postcount=74): Reasonable. Can't (or shouldn't) say much when not much has been said. But I don't get the SPM part, is it just "I'm not 100% that you're innocent"?

Seventh post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521715&postcount=90): Agreed.

Eighth post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521719&postcount=93): You were right, and suspicious at that. ?

Ninth post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521730&postcount=102): Howcome so certain?

Jumping vote-tally tenth post.

Eleventh post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521746&postcount=114): Nah, accusing for what you yourself have done, again...

Twelfth post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521836&postcount=123): I won't say anything about Mith and Ang killing/not killing her.

Thirteenth post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521841&postcount=126): Hmm... Good that you agree with me. Though I'm not so scared of the change in Boro's style as what his style is now. Might be that you are pressing too hard on the idea and trying to get my sympathy as I have clearly shown it.
I don't feel alarmed in the least about Shasta's vote. Ok, it's really really wierd. But understandable.
Weren't you the first to say that it was to leave no tracs?

On the whole: I don't know! :D Legate goes both ways. Many things have raised my alert, as his trying for sympathy and in-out-character posts. But then again, he has made a lot of sense and on the whole looks innocentish. I'm not inlined to vote for him now.


Huh, it's getting late here. I think I'll quit for now.


(Probably) Xd with everything after my preveous post.

[Volo]

This will probably seem explaining, and rather increase your suspicion than lessen it, but I would never have said that and taken the risk of being suspected, were I a wolf. When I read through Mith's posts at the beginning of the Day, I thought the one where she said she needs to know if widowhood is imminent was funny on a tragic way, and couldn't resist mentioning it. Please note that this is only my second game.
And oh, you can call me she.
What iss she doing, what is she doing! This is actually a very funny post.

1. "Were I a wolf..."

2. "I'm just a newbie..."

Two bad signss. Oh Preciouss...

[Volo]

Other things. Just to recall one more thing on SpM which I said earlier - there were these possible links between SpM and Ang, if there were, and if Ang is a wolf - and even if he was not, SpM would have a good chance being a wolf (cf. the nice "I was just joking about Ang being suspicious and Six jumped on it, lookiee lookiee, ++Six" move of you). I remember you as wolf, SpM, and I know what you are capable of. I wanted to bring this back just so it's not forgotten. The way SpM seems to me lately, it's worth mentioning.
Hmm... Possible. But maybe a bit far-fetched. I'd rather go with Boro-Ang.

Anguirel, what do you think of Boromir?

Boromir, what do you think of anything?

[Aganzir]

What iss she doing, what is she doing! This is actually a very funny post.

1. "Were I a wolf..."

2. "I'm just a newbie..."

Two bad signss. Oh Preciouss...
We assumed it would look bad, precious, we did, but we didn't care. Poor Sméagol knows it, but good Sméagol bears it.
We understand we were being suspicious, but we couldn't think of a better way to express what we were thinking.
But referring to my newbieness was because it didn't even occur to me that a wolf might find it amusing to say something like what I'd said. (Apparently I should have realised it myself.)

First we thought we would not bother to comment Anguirel's petty accusation, but then we thought it would be good to correct his mistake concerning our gender, precious. And when we had already started writing a reply, no matter if we would say something more. And now we're probably making us look more and more suspicious. That's the way it goes, precious.

edit: I forgot to mention I'll be off to sleep now. I doubt I'll be back too soon, I'm dead tired.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

...and then I'm going to bed. What I wanted to say to current situation, I said.

BTW, Legate, you've been saying that you have sense in every post of yours. Could you please clarify.

Now, if you permit me, I was in temptation to get rid of you by one of the answers of, well, not Saruman, but Gandalf the White, but White is White, so we can say it could belong to me, more or less: "What? Speaking in riddles? No! A habit of the old: they choose the wisest person present to speak to; the long explanations needed by the young are wearying." I.e. if there is a "wise" person, he/she'll find the meaning in it. But a few short answers I'll give to you.

I don't want to go through all my posts :D so I'm answering just to where you had the question mark, I suppose you take those where you understand or agree with me as "okay". Only if somewhere clarification will be needed, I'll add it.

First post: In translation to normal, game language: Introduction on the first line. Then rightaway in-game: "Notice, we have four wolves, not three. And Mith mentioned another possible baddies aiding. (this was quite scary to me at that moment, because I thought there are just some other roles on the good side, but checking at the admin it indeed seemed that there might be some other baddies)" Etc, etc - please note only that it certainly was NOT point of it to say "Gifteds, come here and reveal yourselves". It was quite the contrary: "Much have I desired to see you... for you could be of the greatest help to us... Alas, I cannot, and I know that: there's too much at stake." This means "Gifteds, be quiet." Why would, anyway, anyone want the Gifteds to reveal? (apart from the Wolves, of course) All was ended with, as I said after in clarification to Ang, "Let's speak more, and if anyone else is here just watching and didn't speak, then please, speak up."

Second post: Quite short, in-character Sarumanic arrogance, but then naturally switching to the words meaning "Anguirel, either speak sense and not just unnecesarrily long in-role speeches, or be quiet, because Mith already said something (take care of double-lynching...) and you are still just in-role." Also, to that aided the fact that while I thought "first post is banter, with second the real speech might start" and Ang's short post between these first two of mine was about absolutely nothing, while even my first had some content, I expected Ang to say at least "Ah, Saruman... etc... And to what you said, I would like to mention that I agree/disagree/think you should speak more or something like that. After X roleplayers there are few of us who finally say something, so let's talk." He didn't do anything, he continued in banter. That was what I was replying to at that time.

Fifth post: This is probably the post where suspicion rose. I really don't understand the first part, because, as I see it, you are accusing Ang for what you yourself are doing. You might have sense in every post, and so might Ang, the problem is that you can add the meaning to the post much later, when you are questioned. That's why I don't like in-out-character posts, in which you can later decide what's in and what's out.
If you understand me from what I said, I am NOT and once again for the last time NOT accusing Ang for doing what I was doing, because he was NOT saying anything where I WAS. I am not going to return to this, I said it more than enough times, I believe.

Sixth post: SpM I mentioned just to "mark my progress", for myself (this post was even a sort of monologue for me) as well for others, it's another way of saying that I haven't forgotten about him, also for that HE knows it.

Eighth/Nineth post, and generally all concerning Six: Since I was fairly sure of Ang being a Wolf, or Spm being a Wolf, or whoever but at least someone, and I really didn't see anything suspicious on Six, as I said earlier many times, I was fairly sure Six is innocent. This is also everything I am saying on that matter, as well as the prolonged issue mentioned above, I already explained it, so that's it. Of course I had a little 1% of being wrong and for that chance I prepared a funny line about eating Orc food, which, as it turns out, I didn't need to use.

The last two posts I am not exactly sure of if you have any problem with them or not? If yes, please explain more exactly. Or my brain is just already shutting down. Only:
Weren't you the first to say that it was to leave no tracs?
No, I think you must've confused me with someone else. Aganzir and Anguirel, I believe, spoke of it before me, or something like that. At least one of them surely - Aganzir, I think.

So that's about it. I probably crossed with someone, but I am not going to read anything till tomorrow. Good night.

EDIT: Oh really, didn't cross with almost anyone! Nice. Good night.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

The Most Noble Lord Horatio Nelson at your service!

Oh damn wrong set. . .

Anyways I am really sad to see Mith go as I love that gall, a lot of interesting things went on yesterday. Of the more notable ones I would like to mention:

1. Volo's revelation
2. Boromirs vote for him self
3. Brinniels slightly odd vote
4. Gil-galad's return to normal self


EDIT: Cross posted with Legate

[Gil-Galad]

okay... now Durelins vote for me is probably one of the weakest i seen, so i don't have to throw really any defense on that accusation...




1. Volo's revelation
2. Boromirs vote for him self
3. Brinniels slightly odd vote
4. Gil-galad's return to normal self





now i must cross-examine this...

1. brings a good view and definately starts off todays discussions
2. could be cobbler, or could be so bored with WW that he decided to play around with it, like that one time with my many-links post... good times...
3. will get back to you on that one
4. well my dear rune, i have already explained day one and now i am currently trying to get back into it, but if you want me to return to my old self by stating that here, then sure i will join boromir and just be a waste to the whole village! but i am not! i will try as hard as i did last game to play, so don't go throwing those assumptions out unless you beleive them to be true!


now that that rant is over... lets get back to the game...

[Diamond18]

I'd like to hear more from Diamond, largely as it would brighten things up...

I'm quite flattered, to be sure... :Merisu:

Well, I'm around and have a couple hours to spare tonight... I have some sticky real life issues this week which will be keeping me away from the game but I'll whine about that on the Admin Thread instead.

It takes me a few reads of the thread to work up any solid suspicions (oh who am I kidding: weak suspicions!) so at the moment I'm just blathering on a bit. The good news is that I think I'll be able to vote closer to the deadline toDay so I don't have to rush to figure something out in the next few minutes!

I'll be around but re-reading if anyone needs their wigs tweaked. ;)

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

First of Gil, I was stating what had caught my eye the previouse day. I was not making a post saying "KILL GIL-GALAD", as you clearly must have thought in order for you to produce such a reaction.

Whether there was RL reasons behind your actions or not it does not undo them, no matter what they will be a subject for analysing and judgement. If you returned today with a load of insightful posts nobody would care about you being quiet the first day, but if it kept up it would be a different matter.

Now if you notice I did not even state whether it was good or bad that you had been quiet yesterday, it was meerly something I noticed and that I thought was interesting.

It might as well speak for you innocense as your guilt.

I am not planing on spending more time on this matter as it was just a small thing that already has gotten blown out of proportions!

[Brinniel]

okay... now Durelins vote for me is probably one of the weakest i seen, so i don't have to throw really any defense on that accusation...
Durelin? You mean Diamond, don't you?

Speaking of Durelin, where is she? She didn't post at all Day 1, and she has yet to show up toDay...

Okay, okay, I probably should go about and explain my vote (once again) since some thought it was odd (yeesh...I really need to start getting out of the habit of making weird votes...I don't mean to!). I voted for Legate because he was my top suspect, for good reasons, in my opinion. I admit the timing of the vote was a bit foolish, but I was hoping that there would be a chance that others would retract and vote for him as well. I stated I didn't want a double-lynch, because I honestly didn't want one...and I'm sure everyone (except for the wolves, I suppose) was thinking this as well, I guess I just had to be the stupid one to state it aloud. :o Also, I was there until the deadline with one retraction at hand...I was ready to change my vote to Sixth if it looked like a double lynch might occur. But that didn't happen, therefore I didn't change my vote.

There...I hope I explained that well enough.

About Boromir: I thought his first vote for himself was a bit odd, but I figured it was an in-character move and assumed he would change it later, so I didn't say anything. I think it was an attempt to get a discussion moving of some sort...but I don't know. Hopefully, we will hear from him soon.

Okay, time for me to go and examine yesterDay's posts more closely...

[The Saucepan Man]

Well, I’m back! But not for long, I’m afraid and, after that, I fear not making it back before the deadline, so I’m going to have to vote shortly.

Meanwhile, to pick up on a few earlier comments.

First of all, I'd like to send attention to Boromir, who, from my perspective, acted rather un-Boromirish... (And I'm refering to Denetorish either.)I don’t regard Boro’s actions as yesterDay particularly un-Boromirish. But his quietness certainly is.

But I'm not sure about you either, Volo ...I agree that we shouldn’t lose sight of the fact that Volo's claim would be excellent cover for a Wolf, for a few Days at least, but I see nothing to cause me to distrust it for now. And, assuming that he is true, he looks from his enquiring contributions toDay to be a useful ally.

As you were among the Six-voters as well, I wouldn't be as loud, being you.Why not? My own vote should not prevent me considering all the evidence, such as it is. We all have to (or should) vote every Day, and on Day 1 there is little to go on. Sixth looked the most suspicious to me at the time that I voted. As it happens, I would have preferred to have changed my vote to you at the end of the Day, but was wary of the possibility of creating a tie or of Ang (who I thought more likely innocent than not at the time) being lynched. You, on the other hand, showed far more conviction than I would think possible for an innocent that Sixth was innocent.

Leggie, I find your explanation of the “substance” in your opening votes distinctly unconvincing. What little substance there is there is hardly earth-shattering. That, in itself, I would not find suspicious, as it was early on Day 1. What concerns me is that you keep criticising Ang for doing what you yourself were doing.

If you understand me from what I said, I am NOT and once again for the last time NOT accusing Ang for doing what I was doing, because he was NOT saying anything where I WAS.You can deny this as much as you like, but the evidence of the posts is there and undeniable. Ang was talking “in-character“, but making some points at the same time, just as you claim to have been doing. It doesn’t follow that Ang is innocent (and I am still wary of his suggestion that the Wolves might look to distance themselves from each other), but your continuing attempts to re-write the opening skirmishes makes you look far worse in my eyes.

i will try as hard as i did last game to play ...What, you mean the one where you were a Vampire … ? :p ;)

[Diamond18]

Originally Posted by Gil
okay... now Durelins vote for me is probably one of the weakest i seen, so i don't have to throw really any defense on that accusation...
Durelin? You mean Diamond, don't you?

Eh?

You mean because of the signature? I wouldn't call that weak reasoning so much as no reasoning at all, which is pretty much what happens when you have to vote hours and hours early on Day 1. So no, I wasn't expecting you to have to come up with a defense....

I do find it a little funny though that you had to mention that... I mean, I thought it seemed pretty clear that I did not seriously suspect you. A little paranoia leaking through, maybe? Hm.

[Kath]

(Don't have much to say right now as I just got back from the LotR musical (*squeals*) and I'm exhausted and would like to get the nights events up on LJ before I forget them.)

Mith killed during the Night. Why? There has been mention of possible Seer hints but that was role play. It would have been a good cover but Gifted-Mith is far more subtle until she's focused on. Plus, there were a couple of people who questioned the way she was acting and she barely responded, which again is an anti Gifted-Mith thing.

That latter thing, Mac, is what made me think Mith was innocent so no, I didn't have any suspicions in her direction yesterDay.

So perhaps we have newbie wolves? People who haven't played with Mith often enough to know her style? Unfortunately it could just be that they thought she was an easy kill. Hopefully the next kill will help us decide which it is.

I've only flicked through the posts so far, I'll read up properly tomorrow.

[The Saucepan Man]

Well, Legate remains my prime suspect.

Of the others, I have some concerns about Kath, Mac, Brinniel, Aganzir and Rune.

Kath, Mac and Brinniel for their votes yesterDay, as I explained earlier. But it’s not sufficient evidence to persuade me to vote for them, and I have seen little else in their contributions to cause me undue alarm.

Aganzir looks to me to be committing the traditionally suspicious werewolfing sin of posting relatively frequently without saying much concerning her own thoughts, particularly toDay. She is distinctly non-committal. But it’s still early in the game and that may just be her way.

Rune is an interesting case. As I think Kath noted yesterDay, he too has been around a fair bit without saying a lot. And his contributions seem to follow a distinct pattern. He comments on someone, provokes a slight overeaction (in Mac yesterDay and Gil toDay), and then overreacts rather defensively himself. I’m not sure that it’s enough just yet to condemn him as a Wolf, but he is probably my second suspect after Legate.

But now I must vote and, since he remains the most suspicious to my eyes at the moment, I shall vote for:

++Legate of Amon Lanc

I shall try to make it back before the deadline, but I am not hopeful.

[Boromir88]

Do what you must Volo et all who hath accuseth me. This time I can't be my normal self. This is the first time I've had the chance to get on today. And just like Day 1, I'm going to get some more rest (as I have to get ready for work again in 5 hours, and when I come back I'm going to vote. This is how it is going to be for me most of the time. So, I'm going to read through all this stuff today, post my thoughts...get a few hours of sleep, come back and vote.

As for why I voted for myself...it was in-character stuff, but also to try and get reactions (which didn't happen at all). At that time there was about 20 posts, something around that number? Nothing at all stuck out to me, I wanted to try and get some discussion going as I had to vote within a few hours and had absolutely no clue. I didn't get what I wanted (as there were only a few posts after I voted for myself), so changed my vote for a mostly random reason, but Ang was the most suspicious one to me. Again, he seemed far to chirpy and jolly. His posts reminded me of Fea. And Fea scares the crap out of me when she plays.

Now to get caught up...

[Boromir88]

Well, Kath and Brinniel have given off this innocent vibe to me. Their tone comes off as innocent and sweet. If one of them is a wolf, congrats to you for completely fooling me.

I'm willing to trust Volo's reveal, for the time being.

Now, Legate, Sauce, and Ang are an interesting and talky bunch. I think one is a wolf. And of those 3 Ang looks the most wolvish and Sauce looks the most innocent.

Sauce is very adamant in going after Legate. That's how he always is as an ordinary innocent. He has his suspects and he goes after them with everything he has...very lawyerish of him :p .

Legate made a strange comment at the end of voting yesterday that didn't sit right with me:
Hey, we HAVE TO AVOID DOUBLE-LYNCH AT ALL COSTS!!!
And in the same post:
PLEASE CHECK YOU DON'T CROSS-VOTE WITH ANYONE, BECAUSE THEN WE CAN HAVE DOUBLE-LYNCH VERY NICELY.
I mean we all know that a double-lynch only helps the wolves, and it's good to be reminded 'hey lets avoid a double-lynch, this might happen if we mess up.' But this just seems too forced and and quite frankly fake. It's like Legate is trying to look innocent by reminding us all we don't want a double-lynch (duh :rolleyes: ), but the manner he does it (the all caps and twice in the same post) looks fake and like he's trying too hard to look innocent.

Ang, I really can't get a hold on, and I know as long as we are both around that isn't going to change. I have a funny feeling about him...as I really always do actually. Ang is one of the toughest players, that I know I will never figure out because he is the exact same as an innocent or a wolf. Which means I get the same 'bad feelings' about him all the time.

[Anguirel]

Boro is now on his usual form, which is good, though I don't think he was ever that much off it (despite Gil-Galad's damning verdict...)

There seems to be a lot of viciousness in this game. I know that sounds deeply feeble, but really, rarely have I encountered a village where the vibes are so dark.

Much of the tension permeates from Saruman. Sauce observed he seemed to know too much about Sixth, but this need not necessarily point to guilt. I have a tendency myself to be pessimistic whenever most lynchs, but especially compromise-lynchs like that one, are enacted. So far as that goes, I don't suspect Saruman particularly. But his forceful voice and obsessive opinions is creating almost as much division as an extra werewolf. It is also true that I could readily see him doing in my wife, who he had various spats with but also fought shy of confronting directly (unlike his approach vis-a-vis me).

So, yes...could still go either way on that one.

Lommy is keeping her nose very clean, but that could be a time issue.

A few candidates are attracting most of the attention today...we should really try casting the net wider. Say, Durelin, for instance. I haven't thought about her once yet, and that's not a good sign...

A lot of you have been sniffing around Mac, but no votes materialised. Is he suspicious, or the victim of a tentative and indecisive wolf intrigue, I wonder? I'll look at his posting when I next have the time.

[Brinniel]

Alright, I'm not going to stay up terribly late trying to analyze everyone right now. I think I'd rather go to bed early (ha, like 3am is early) and get up early when this thread is more active. Curse these time zones, they can be such a nuisance at times...

Back to the subject, I will take a closer look at others in the morning, but for now, I would like to take a look at yesterDay's prime suspects (other than Sixth, of course): Anguirel and Legate

So far toDay, my suspicions of Legate have not changed:

One thing I've noticed is that he's been a bit jumpy and overly-defensive towards those who have accused him. Partly I get this feeling from words, but mostly from tone. Of course, tone can be read quite differently when it's in writing, so perhaps I'm just reading the signals wrong and he is not actually as upset as he seems to be, but nevertheless, it's the feeling I have.

Though, Boromir has brought one thing to attention that does raise some alarms for me:

Legate made a strange comment at the end of voting yesterday that didn't sit right with me:
Hey, we HAVE TO AVOID DOUBLE-LYNCH AT ALL COSTS!!!
And in the same post:
PLEASE CHECK YOU DON'T CROSS-VOTE WITH ANYONE, BECAUSE THEN WE CAN HAVE DOUBLE-LYNCH VERY NICELY.
I mean we all know that a double-lynch only helps the wolves, and it's good to be reminded 'hey lets avoid a double-lynch, this might happen if we mess up.' But this just seems too forced and and quite frankly fake. It's like Legate is trying to look innocent by reminding us all we don't want a double-lynch (duh ), but the manner he does it (the all caps and twice in the same post) looks fake and like he's trying too hard to look innocent.
Now, the mentioning of the double-lynch itself doesn't alarm me, I mean it is something I admit I said myself, although it was in a bit of a different manner. But then Legate goes about accusing me of being wolfish for saying something he said himself first. I'm not sure what exactly to think on this, but it certainly makes me uneasy...

On Anguirel:

I honestly have to say I'm confused on what to think of him. I don't see anything strange about his vote for Sixth. He did it to save himself from a lynch, as he explains in post #99, which is something anyone would do, wolf or innocent. The main thing that catches my attention is that he gained so much suspicion yesterDay, and perhaps in the morning I will better examine this. I've never played with Ang until now, so I'm not terribly aware of his style, but I've heard that he can be quite dangerous as a wolf, so while he doesn't raise any huge alarms for me yet, indeed I will be careful not to disregard him.

If there is a wolf among these two players, I do think it would be only one. Ang and Legate have been at each other since Day 1, which is too risky to be wolf-on-wolf, in my opinion.

Okay, it's getting late. I'm off to bed now. I'll try to be back around three hours before the deadline.

[Boromir88]

Well, I'm afraid like yesterday, all the action today will take place after I have to vote. Hmm...two posts, and none of my opinions have changed. Brinniel is still innocent and Ang I have no clue...could be anything.

It's difficult to pull the platform on Legate. He has said a lot of strange and odd things, but it doesn't seem very wolfish-Legate like. If you know what I mean. Legate was more careful and friendly the one time I knew he was a wolf. Maybe since that didn't work too well for him he wanted to try a different strategy? I don't know, but it just seems like Legate is too careless (in not monitoring what he says) to be a wolf.

Bah, I really have no clue, it must be done:

++Legate

[Boromir88]

Oh and a note about Durelin, Ang, if Durelin doesn't show up to post or vote today...my understanding is she mysteriously disappears for good. Quite a shame really, as if I ever suddenly get some strong urge to burn myself (ya like that will ever happen :rolleyes: ) I can't. You think I'm going to trust some untrained orc to handle the burning of my noble arse? Pah, ya right. Hey orc, fetch me some cherries. :D

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

I stated I didn't want a double-lynch, because I honestly didn't want one...and I'm sure everyone (except for the wolves, I suppose) was thinking this as well, I guess I just had to be the stupid one to state it aloud.
Well, the point was, that you said you didn't want a double-lynch and at the same time performed an action that could cause a double-lynch. I understand if you wanted to vote for me, but voting for Six (even though it wasn't right) would have been much better, safer in the meaning of safer for the community. On that I now feel okay because of your explanation in the rest of your post:
Also, I was there until the deadline with one retraction at hand...I was ready to change my vote to Sixth if it looked like a double lynch might occur. But that didn't happen, therefore I didn't change my vote.

but your continuing attempts to re-write the opening skirmishes makes you look far worse in my eyes.
(sarcastic tone) No, SpM, it's not me bringing it back. It's you, because everyone asks me about it five million times and I five million times answer the same thing.

Also, when you mention it, the "nothing-saying" of Ang's posts is not the main point of my suspicions of him, there's quite much more of it. I'm going to re-investigate Ang's case, because he seems more "normal" at the later time, though I am still very aware of that might be a retreating move from a wolf, which I would really not like to experience and thus letting a wolf slip out of the spotlight.

Now something on Boro. That he appeared here and spoke in a more active way, as I thought his behavior is, is nice. But. There is something fishy and now I am actually thinking of a connection between SpM and Boro. When someone says "these three are most vocal, and Ang seems most suspicious, where Legate does this and this and SpM does this and this but I think he's actually innocent" (or that is, from my point, the message of it), then such a statement has several impacts: a) someone who reads it might get the feeling that Ang is suspicious, b) someone who reads it might get the feeling that I am suspicious, but what if Boro does not pay enough attention to me, putting me on the second place? Result: the person focuses either on Ang or me. Of course not on SpM. Boro also mentions him, but says that it's not an important matter, and when the person looks at it, he might say "Well, Boromir speaks reasonable, of course he does, so let's leave SpM for now."

A few candidates are attracting most of the attention today...we should really try casting the net wider. Say, Durelin, for instance. I haven't thought about her once yet, and that's not a good sign...
Seriously, while there is the possibility that the wolves might be hiding among the quiet ones (cf. what I said about it earlier), waiting for us vocal ones to kill each other, I don't think there wouldn't be at least one among the vocal ones. Even if it were not, these are just shots in the dark until we know for sure that all of us "vocal" are innocent. Evidence from the quiet ones' posts (if any) is quite feeble evidence. Realizing this, I think it's best to drop this until something happens that brings some more light on the innocents, or shows the "vocal" into being innocent.

EDIT: x-ed with these after Anguirel (Brinn, Boro...)

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Brinniel about my "do not double-lynch": well, now you hopefully can understand it (my post above). Also, as you can guess from the capital letters, it was pretty much a post written in affect - I just learned then that deadline is upon us and I saw the ghost of double-lynch upon us, so I was "shouting" the (in my opinion, important, as I know these "last-time votes") warning of checking if you are not x-voting with someone. Which is another important thing to bear in mind even for the next days, I think.

Boromir: Now this is really rising alarms. Again, cf. above: He thinks Ang the most suspicious of all three of us, and now he votes for me. Also, the end of his post where he said this, he says Ang looks the most wolvish, but then at the end says he doesn't know.
And of those 3 Ang looks the most wolvish and Sauce looks the most innocent.
The same post:
Ang, I really can't get a hold on, and I know as long as we are both around that isn't going to change. I have a funny feeling about him...as I really always do actually. Ang is one of the toughest players, that I know I will never figure out because he is the exact same as an innocent or a wolf.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

I have done a little Anguirelysis and I am announcing hereby that I am dropping all my earlier accuses. Should I checked him yesterday (or over the Night), this might have saved some confusion, but what happened, happened. There were not his toDay's posts at that time yet, anyway, and they add their own, quite a large bit, to cause me drop my suspicions.

Now when I already was in it, for peace of mind I started checking other people:

Mac. His two first posts are quite harsh, but we got past it before. In his third post, he even explains it, and I feel it quite innocentish. The post itself looks very good.

Then he does say some things on me, which could be from an innocent's point of view, because he doesn't seem to be attempting to raise things against me, rather he's (if I exaggerate it, of course he is not actually) defending me, or calming it down. Of course, there was pretty much suspicion on me at that time already, so if I ended lynched innocent, then this would serve Mac as good cover "this innocent's blood is not on my hands". But again, that's probably overcombinating it.

Then he voted for Six, which I sort of didn't like, as I said earlier. Beside SpM's, as I mentioned somewhere before (and Volo's, but he is innocent, or so I believe), this was another not much nice vote for Six. He also tied him with Ang in the lead (which was not a problem at that time yet, and also he later said he could change his vote to me if necessary). Today, he just posted that analysis about Mithalwen. Hey, I didn't catch the moment where he said he suspected her? The only moment he mentioned her was in the first post where he mentioned her at the same point as me, and then he was responding to her. Or did I forget anything?
If any of Mac's post, this would be giving bad feeling to me, but that's just because, as some people who played with me already know, I don't like and a priori am suspicious on people who post summaries of any kind, because it's an easy job a wolf has to do anyway, and then he can just post it, adding some imagined stuff concerning him and his comrades... But that's in no way point for accusing, and you can't actually get much from it unless it contradicts anything.

So in general: Mac seems more or less okay. Others coming shortly. Maybe.

[Macalaure]

Which leaves Mac’s vote. This was effectively the one which pushed Sixth into pole position as the “not Anguirel” candidate, rather than Legate. As such, I regard it as the most suspicious of the Sixth votes.Sauce, you are aware that Legate had a total of zero votes when I voted Six? I was suspicious of Six, I wanted Ang to live. It was a no-brain vote for me, especially with retractions available.

I like Volo's point on Aganzir and I agree with Saucepan's points on Legate and Rune. I don't want to repeat what has already been said.

I think I will have a closer look at Kath once she has posted more. That vibe that Boro calls innocent doesn't leave me with an innocent feeling, but there is very little for me to go on yet.

I find it a tiny bit strange that Boro is suspicious because of Legate's double lynch comments, while he finds Brinniel, who made similar comments, innocent. I mean, I share his overall judgement of the two, but still it's a little bit weird. Where do you see the difference, Boro? You have not told.

Legate, do you intend to manufacture a new wolvish connection between villagers every second post now until a couple of innocents bite on one? Because that is what your behaviour is looking like to me.

edit: hit 'post' on accident. The above is only a draft... :rolleyes:

[Volo]

It might be evil to say, but a lot of the stuff happening is (or can be thought of) happening around Aganzir.

I'll continue going through toDay's Aganzir talk:

#121 Aganzir, first post to the subject (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521832&postcount=121). Even three things that raise alarms. (Either Aganzir's style is after mine, or then she's a wolf.) We'll come back to them later.

#128 Anguirel (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521846&postcount=128). Mentions Aganzir's post's first alarm raising part. Gloating is something very easily done, and often noticed. Says "he" of Aganzir, which could be a trick.

#132 Aganzir (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521854&postcount=132) The most alarming post so far.

#133 Legate (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521857&postcount=133) Pretty much just mentions Aganzir and leaves it at that. Though the way he put it is a bit suspicious: A slight defence and some undescribably suspicion.

#135 Volo (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521859&postcount=135) Return to post #132. I point out the two things that are a usual newbie-wolf mistake (As I very well know. Fenris Wolf, grrau.) in a joking manner.

#137 Aganzir (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521863&postcount=137) What's so bad here is that she takes the on the in-character manner I set for her.

#147 SPM (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521881&postcount=147) Says, like I did before, that Aganzir makes the usual mistakes, but wants to wait. This too makes a wolf-wolf connection between the two.

So: Aganzir has made close to none sense in her posts, except for self-defence of which there is plenty. Many posts: only self-defence and joking. The only part of her that doesn't make me want to lynch her is that she's who she is.

In her preveous game she was very calm, very very suprisingly calm. Where's the calmness now? Ok, she's still calm in her words, but not in the meaning.

At first I found her more like a Gifted, then like a Cobbler, now like a Wolf, what next?

I'll vote for her if nothing suprising happens.


EDIT: Xd with Legate and Mac.

[Macalaure]

My last post was crossed with a few of Legate. I was about to change my joking tone in the last line. I'm sorry. :(

[Macalaure]

What I really was about to say about Legate (now that I read his post about me):


Though I certainly like him not being suspicious of me, there is some kind of "appeasing" tone within his post about me. I'm not sure what to think of it.

Of course, there was pretty much suspicion on me at that time already, so if I ended lynched innocent, then this would serve Mac as good cover "this innocent's blood is not on my hands". But again, that's probably overcombinating it."This innocent's blood is not on my hands"?
But I said that I was willing to vote for you in a later post. I definitely was suspicious of you when I wrote my short analysis. It was your reaction to it that made it cease the significant small bit.

Why do you suddenly feel like you're overcombinating. ;)


I understand that you were sure about Six's innocence and I don't think, unlike others, that it is a suspicious thing. What I don't understand is that you don't understand how others were able to think he's not innocent.


Hey, I didn't catch the moment where he said he suspected her?My main suspects right now are Legate and Six, followed by Mith, followed by, well, pretty much everybody...Besides, my last post about Mith was not mere summary...

[Volo]

Disturbing: Gil, Diamond, Shasta and Xyzzy haven't contributed yet, or so little that I couldn't notice it, in this order. Durelin is completely away... Bad. Everybody else seems to be around though.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

After looking through Boro's posts, and more or less ignoring the yesterDay's because he really seemed to be in bad timing and the posts create a self-contained "equating effect" (he explains himself, so the general feeling is neutral), the final result is more or less like that I said earlier. If he were an innocent, I am convinced, since last time I experienced my share of it, he'd act differently. I have one very strong image of Boromir the Innocent in my mind, and it is the image of a person who goes around throwing suspicions, then picks a person and goes after her until he/she ends lynched. Now he is acting differently. About what he said on Ang, me and SpM I spoke before. His suspicion against my voting-post, while on a "good" basis (meaning I think an innocent might eventually come to that suspicion), is in my point a little bit exaggerated, making too much of it. Which implies wolvery. Also, his earlier mentioning of Kath and Di seeming perfectly innocent does not look good to me. How he even came to it? Speaking of Kath, to me she looks also sort of suspicious, and I think to more people around here, but since Boro operates quite a lot with hunches (which I totally don't agree with), it might be that he "feels" Kath innocent in this way. But the statement "if you are wolves, congrats" is a little too strong. The question is, if Kath is innocent and Boro were a wolf, why would he say this. Unless he plans to, let's say, kill her toNight, and thus get the suspicion off him.
EDIT: I can't make anything of it, but if anyone's interested, or for later thinking of it. This is what Kath says about Boro:
Boro - voted for himself, apparently to try and get people talking, but when found that didn't work he retracted his vote and voted for Ang 'for no real reason'. Now, having exonerated Di for doing the same thing I can hardly jump on Boro for it either. However, it feels more forced than Di's vote did. I know that's terrible reasoning, but how can you explain a feeling?

SpM is quite a long story to read, but I might very well end voting for him toDay. His speeches, whatever they are, are many times too much "general", not taking it into finalizing, leaving some "vacuum" behind them, which I believe an innocent would fill - either to find that filling it solves the matter to good, or to bad. On the contrary, there are things looking more innocent, like his enduring case against me. If he were a wolf and I ended lynched, this could seem bad to him. Or would it? He might play an innocent who focused too much on one subject who turned out innocent (he even earlier mentioned this here, like that it sometimes happens to him - it was in connection with me). In this case, this could be an excuse for his action, and so the Wolf goes unnoticed.

EDIT: x-ed since my last post

[Thinlómien]

My time toDay is very limited.

Why is everyone speculating about lovers? I mean, of course we can't rule out the possibility, but why is half of the village assuming there is a lover couple. Makes me wonder if some furry people or cobblers are trying to cause confusion...

All in all, we shouldn't speculate too much about the roles - actually I can hardly believe how well we've avoided it. (Until this post of mine... :rolleyes: ) As long as we have no role-clues from the narrations, there is little sense in speculating them.

But Volo, does anything change for you once somebody tries to kill you? Will you still be allowed to vote, for example.While this is a good question and it's important to know these things, this question of Mac's just doesn't sit right with me... I mean, he sounds all too much like a wolfie trying to fish out (=get) information.

I agree Mith was probably killed because of most people considering her innocent and for leaving no tracks and I think she might have been a nice kill for the wolvsies also because she is (well, like quite many of us here...) a good player and thus a threat to the baddies if she's innocent.

I'd love to see Durelin around. Where is she? Other than this ww-game, she has an RPG soon to start here in BD so I think she must have had some RL issues if she's not been online...

Volo, I don't think Aganzir is any different from her last game - though that does not prove her innocent, certainly not.

I can see why you're all after Legate, but I have to disagree and consider him innocent-ish. While he certainly has done suspicious-ish things, his almost furious defense of himself and his manner speak for his innocence. I mean, this wizard-creature doesn't resemble the wolf-Legates I've seen. Wolf-Legate is - according to my experiences - far more careful and avoids argument with other villagers. That image doesn't quite fit the current Legate. :) I think he tends to be more rash when innocent, which would speak for his innocence in this game. I doubt I will vote him toDay at least.

I will vote very soon and to be honest I have no clue who I will vote. Everybody (except the non-contributors) has made the impression of being more on the innocent side (see, I'm probably easily fooled... :rolleyes: ). My only yesterday's suspect is dead and innocent. (Well, except Legate who I suspected a little and who I suspect less and less when I see more posts of his.) I will probably vote either some non-contributor who looks active enough to stay alive or then Mac (for his comment and the tone of his recent posts has been a little worrying)...

[Thinlómien]

++xyzzy

It seems like he will make a few, non-contributing posts per day and stay alive and just be dead weight. And if he's a wolf, it's a disaster since we'll never be able to catch him by normal means.

I think we should eliminate him but I have the bad feeling my campaign won't get much support. *sigh* Nevertheless, voting xyzzy seems the best option for me toDay.

I don't want to Mac because my reasons to suspect him are quite flimsy. If I had more time to go through his posts, I could vote him if I found him suspicious. But it would be stupid to vote a helpful and intelligent player on such feeble grounds.

But now I have to go. Bye.

[Volo]

I'll go off to mend my bike (or try mending my bike, like I have been "trying" for the last six... hmm... more, months) soon.


Before that a very quick word about Kath, Brinniel and Rune.

Kath seems genuine. A bit exaggerated opinions in her second post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521657&postcount=51), but otherwise looks innocent.

Brinniel gives me the feel of a confused innocent, maybe even so confused that she could be a wolf. I mean acting confusion. Still, doesn't strike too alarming, though if I had to give four names of possible wolves, she'd probably be in the list.

Rune feels like himself. Though he hasn't said much relevant stuff yet. He might be a Rune-wolf, but I think that we should wait a few days before voting him.


Aargh. I've been thinking and rethinking.

++Boromir

, like I said before, something looks very wrong here. I decided that Aganzir should live, the way she plays is wolfish, but at the same very innocentish, actually looks very much like my own style when I'm innocent.

I'll go now, and not give any certain time of returning, but I'm going to think over this again.


EDIT: Xd with Lommy. Great to see you even as for such a little hop. Your vote isn't a good one, grudges? But I'll agree about what you said there in the first post.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

I can see why you're all after Legate, but I have to disagree and consider him innocent-ish. While he certainly has done suspicious-ish things, his almost furious defense of himself and his manner speak for his innocence. I mean, this wizard-creature doesn't resemble the wolf-Legates I've seen. Wolf-Legate is - according to my experiences - far more careful and avoids argument with other villagers. That image doesn't quite fit the current Legate. :)
You know what? I love you! :)

Now to the grave issues at hand. About Aganzir, I think that "widowhood" thing is not signifying anything, but this could:
Of course, she was the first to vote for Legate etc., but I can make of that out just as much as I can of too many other things, which is nothing.
It's the type of ambivalent, half-ended sentence the Wolves do. "You know, maybe she was killed by Legate because he wanted to get rid of her... but I didn't say this!"
I originally wanted to wait until Aganzir herself makes some other things that could classify her as wolf, but since it was already brought up, I think her a very likely candidate.
Concerning the "he-she" thing, while I knew from somewhere before in my unconscious mind Aganzir is she, I didn't think about it now and considering Ang not knowing her before, the "he" mistake does not seem as an attempt of a trick, and if it were, not a good base for suspicion, because it really can be a mistake. (it's probably the name and the avatar, both. Oh! And I know what else - there is Shasta, who is actually he, which is the counter to Aganzir.) But in general: nothing basing on this, I think that's quite feeble as an evidence.
Personally I don't see anything wrong on posting the widowhood joke and would never have thought of it being a sign of wolvery. The more alarming now seems to me Aganzir's statement "were I a wolf, I'd never post it". Why? And she's saying it after she was suspected on basis of it. This seems fishy. However, seeing that Volo drops his suspicion, I don't know if digging in that matter has any perspective of being important any more now.

I'll be here yet surely, but I'm going to take a little "break" (going to purchase a new bike, seeing what Volo said here, it's not about just me)... so, see ya later. Later? Later?!? Yes, when you also have the Keys of Barad-dûr itself, I suppose?! And the crowns of seven kings, and the rods of the Five Wizards... *walks off, muttering*

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

My talking about irrelevant stuff is mostly because I am trying to hide the fact that I do not have any good suspicions, I am constantly hoping that the next time I read through some post that something will jump into mind.

Now onto more irrelevant stuff: Dubble Lynchings

Dubble lyncings are not only for the benifit of wolves! That is how it has been previously because villagers have not had a clue about what they where doing at the time of the dubble lynchings. Technicaly it must mean there is a greater chance getting a wolf, of course it also could be devistating if one lynches purely innocents.

I am just saying that dubble lynching is a tool, a very dangerous tool and it should not be used lightly. There is of course no sense in having a random dubble lynch based on confusion, but I can imagine situations where it might be a risk worth taking.

btw the reason for this post is that I find it wrong when things are branded as pure evil, unless it is the wolves of course.

I just found out that works start earlier today which means I will have to vote very soon. . .

[Anguirel]

Gather round, my friends. I have a New Theory.

Vote analyses can be helpful resourses, but on this occasion I think more helpful still is who people thought about voting for before Volo's revelation, which completely changed the landscape.

As well as myself, Sixth, and Saruman, (in the event the main candidates), before Tollers revealed himself Volo and Macalaure were seriously considered.

Of these two, evidently the more intriguing case is Volo, because if we believe his claim (and I do, you couldn't make up a role like that...) he's a proven innocent.

Prominent in laying into Volo were myself, Kath, Brinniel and Rune.

I was probably the most vehement, and cast the first stone. However, at least that means I can't be accused of piggy-backing...

Kath followed with a fairly condemnatory description of Volo as a bit vague and contentless. However, she did not vote for him (instead opting for Rune) and we cross-posted, so this opinion was not influenced by my diatribe. Nothing that suspicious here.

Sauce (I've just noticed) felt Volo's revenge vote against me had "pinged his radar somewhat". This is a bit more suspect, especially as Sauce was proceeding with a good deal of caution, avoiding "accusations of palliness" in a disclaimer. But the motive was sensible.

Rune now leapt in, stuck in his own dagger and voted for Volo. This is getting pretty suspicious by now; he knew this vote might well have heavyweight backing with Sauce's vote apparently pending.

And then Brinniel says, fairly out of the blue,

"Suddenly, Volo has been moved to the top of my suspect list."

Suddenly is generally a bad sign as words go. I think either Rune or Brinniel is guilty, and personally I favour Brinniel because she is escaping suspicion so effectively - Legate and Boro for instance have both said they think she's convincingly innocent.

So my first vote, at least, goes to ++BRINNIEL, and if you see where it's coming from, I beg you to join this slightly left-of-field case...

If further evidence is desired, look at Brinn's slightly panicky inquisitiveness about the effects of Volo's role.

[Aganzir]

This is probably waste of time, as we should have no reason to expect Volo is lying, but I still feel somehow uncomfortable about him. I started analysing him a couple of hours ago but couldn't post this earlier as Lommy decided to pop over.

Day 1
#5: Pure ic.
#49: Trusts Mith. Lommy's vote speaks well for her. Legate and Aganzir innocentish. More afraid of Mac and Ang.
#57: Agrees with Legate that Ang's half-in-half-out-character talking is annoying, and suggests Ang to quit it. Votes for Anguirel, but says he's probably innocent.
#60: Asks also Legate to play either in-character or out-character. Finds Kath interesting.
#63: Asks Rune not to twist his words. Reveals his role, because he's "not in a mood now and not too optimistic for keeping the role a secret".
#67: Pretty sure that Mac or Ang are wolves. Feels that Mac is going to get closer to Ang. Says it's no use to go analysing the silent ones. Says doesn't really want to lynch Ang, but he's far from innocentish.
#77: Tells more about his role. Says he was frustrated with Ang, but now logic tells he's innocent.
#82: Tells Brinniel he has already revealed his role.
#84: Asks if Sixth is worth lynching. Can see why he's suspicious, though.
#88: Thinks Kath is a wolf. "She analysed too little content with too much text."
#96: Retracts his vote for Anguirel and votes for Sixth instead. Suspects both of them more than Legate, but votes for Sixth as he'll be more probably lynched.
#110: Voting records that far.

Day 2
#119: Voting records from the previous Day. Thinks Spm and Lommy are in the worst place.
#122: Says Boromir has been acting quite un-Boromirish. Sees a connection between Boro and Ang, and says he will rather vote Boromir than Ang.
#129: Mac is innocent or a careful wolf, but his carefulness is a bit too careful for a wolf. Brinniel's vote is weird and she's being eccentric, but doesn't want to vote for her.
#131: Says he thought Mith was the Seer.
#134: Finds Spm interesting. Asks Legate to clarify some of his earlier statements. Doesn't know what to think about Legate.
#135: Finds my post (#132) newbie-wolvish.
#136: Asks Ang's opinion of Boro and Boro's opinion of everything.
#158: Analyses toDay's talk about me. I'm speaking nonsense and defending myself. Wonders where has the calmness of the previous game gone, and says he'll vote for me if nothing unexpected happens. Tells his post #135 was "in a joking manner". (Well, I can tell you I didn't see that you were joking, except for the in-characterness, the point of which I thought I understood as I had been complaining to you some minutes earlier that it's a shame we don't use our characters more.)
#161: Thinks it's bad that Gil, Diamond, Shasta and Xyzzy haven't been contributing.
#165: Kath looks innocent. Brinniel is confused innocent, or maybe a wolf acting confused. Rune might be a wolf, but we shouldn't vote him off for a few Days. Votes for Boromir. I'm both wolvish and innocentish but I'm playing a little like himself, when innocent.

When reading through the Day 1, Volo seemed quite wolvish sometimes. In my opinion the most suspicious thing he did was revealing his role, especially as I can't see the point of his role. He revealed it after receiving only two votes, and he wouldn't probably have been killed anyway, seeing how much more Sixth and Ang were gaining suspicion.
After a while of general confusion he told more about his role. A nice way for a wolf to avoid suspicion, to create a new role for himself.
He was also a little flip-floppy with his opinion of Ang. I mean, Ang didn't say that much between Volo's posts #67 & #77, and eventhough some who had played earlier with him said he's always like that, the sudden change of Volo's opinion is worth noticing.

The Day 2 makes me feel more like that he's innocent. He's contributing, he has some good points. The most important thing is that I find his tone somewhat different from the previous Day. He keeps suspecting different people, but with better grounds, I think (though it's not surprise as by now we have much more material than yesterDay we can use).
But the thing I don't understand is why he kept throwing suspicion against me, as I think he really should have known better than expecting me to fall for those newbie-wolf mistakes. I understand why others found them suspicious, but it was Volo who pointed them out, and he was also the one who continued accusing me of them.
Either I have overestimated him, he has underestimated me or then there's somehow good chances of him being a wolf.

I thought it would be possible that someone started accusing me of that post of mine, but I would never had expected this much suspicion. I probably should have kept silent after you, Volo, seized on my words, since I thought answering to you might seem overreactive self-defence (as it indeed seems to have done).

As for the calmness, I don't remember I was suspected even this much in my previous game, which you happened to mod. I suppose mod's perspective must be quite different from player's. In the last game you knew with 100 % certainty that I was innocent, and could look at my behaviour from a different angle than now, when all you do is looking for suspicious signs on other players.


The more alarming now seems to me Aganzir's statement "were I a wolf, I'd never post it". Why?
I wouldn't have wanted to gain suspicion by saying it. I could have left it unsaid and that wouldn't have changed anything in my post. If I had been deliberately avoiding suspicion, it would have been better not to say it, ie not to say something that is usually considered a newbie-wolf mistake, and I know it as well as you do.

edit: xed with Rune & Ang

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

I find it a tiny bit strange that Boro is suspicious because of Legate's double lynch comments, while he finds Brinniel, who made similar comments, innocent. I mean, I share his overall judgement of the two, but still it's a little bit weird. Where do you see the difference, Boro? You have not told.
This makes me think. . .I know it is shocking!

It was interesting how Legate found Brinniel's comments suspiciouse when he made something very similar, of course it was connected with her vote and he did retract the suspicion when she had explained her self. OK maybe this was not so interesting after all.

Now we are talking about Brinniel and we were!

There is something about her that does not sit right, she seems somewhat uneasy, kind of nervouse. Maybe she always plays like this, but gets killed to fast for me to notice, but I think she seems like she might be afraid to get killed. This could be due to her being killed so early in previouse games or maybe she is not and ordo.

Moving on to Gil-Galad

He might be busy at the moment, but there has been indications that he is not going to play like last game. This could mean that he is an ordo once again or that he is a cunning wolf. I still need to make my mind up.

Please someone say something that convinces me to vote for you as I really have to leave soon.

[Aganzir]

Anguirel, I understand your way of thinking, but I'm afraid I can't totally agree with you. To me it's not clear that Volo is innocent. It's unlikely he would have made up the role, but it's not certain that he hasn't done just that. He would probably find it funny.
It's a role that could be very easily created because it just is, without any significant purpose or meaning, and he doesn't have to answer questions like "who did you dream of?" or "who did you protect?".

I also understand why Brinniel suspected Volo, and I don't think that's a reason to vote for her. Of course she might be a wolf who startled when Volo told about his role, but in my opinion she looks more like a confused innocent. Or then a wolf acting confused innocent - I don't think a wolf would be the first one to ask about the role (if I remember correctly at least Spm and Legate had asked about it before Brinniel), but even if she had waited for someone other to ask more about it, she eventually had to do it herself (as Volo didn't seem to answer because she hadn't managed to see his edit on the post where he told about the role).

I'll go and eat something. Will be back in an hour, as I probably should also do my homework and I rather do it before the deadline starts drawing near.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

I have to vote now and in my search for a candidate I went back and looked at my suspects from yesterday: Volo and Mac.

Volo I belive although I still think he acted very weird yesterday and that leaves Mac to compete with Brinniel and Gil.

Of these Mac is the one I am most comfortable voting for today, Gil I will give a chance to prove him self and Brinniel I need to watch for a bit.

My case against him might not be the best you have ever seen, but here goes.

1. He has his whole in-charachter rant, which have been the subject of much debate.

2. He pretty much focuses his suspicions and his post contents on Legate, leaving almost no trace if he is a wolf and is lynched.

3. At first his main thing case again Legat was that he did not agree with his suspicion of Ang, but I suppose this is quite normal for day 1.

4. In post 78 he all of the sudden feels beter about Legate, but tells not why.

yeah that is basicly what makes me uneasy about him, some of the points have more merit than others, but I thought I would put it all there. (nr3 is very shaky, but it made me wonder in the situation)

++Macalaure

(We have 10 min breakes every hour at work and there is computers, but they are slow. Anyways I will try to get on and check up on what is happening , so if anything drastic happens I might be able to change my vote)

Edit: Cross posted with Aganzir

[Anguirel]

If Volo did invent his "Spirit of Tolkien" role then I'm seriously impressed.

But a look at the first narration should convince you that it was planned as part of the game from the start. We are "trusting in the spirit of Professor Tolkien to protect us", apparently.

It is of course possible that, taking his lead from that hint, Volo made up a fitting role to save his lupine skin. But that's the kind of trick I've only known myself, the phantom and conceivably Fea to stoop to!

I think it's far more likely that he is a proven innocent and far more helpful to regard him as such - we do need all the information we can get. So Volo's role is essentially the only thing I'm clinging onto solidly at present...

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Rune's two last posts have really scared me. The first one about "dubble lynchings" is quite scary in itself: of course the double-lynch can be used even for good, to get two wolves, but the chance is so small - and even then, how would you arrange the villagers to vote all (even the wolves) the way that two wolves get lynched? In other words, what sort of a nonsense is that?
If we skip total luck where two wolves are tied for voting and no one of their comrades retracts a vote (probably explained by saying "oh, double-kill is too dangerous, what if one is innocent?") to save them; the only possible situation where I can imagine this working, would be if for example the Seer revealed two Wolves and said it to the whole village, and the village somehow (and I would like to see, how) divided the votes between themselves so that the votes are tied in the end. But even in that case, one of the Wolves could just vote for himself to save his comrade, to prolongate the period for one more day. So this, in my opinion, cannot work.
I wouldn't believe such an experienced player could say such a nonsense, so I'm not sure what to make of your statement, Rune. Even a wolf would not be so stupid to say this, I believe. So unless you are a Cobbler..?

However, that's not all that raises alarm. Rune's words about Brinniel:
There is something about her that does not sit right, she seems somewhat uneasy, kind of nervouse. Maybe she always plays like this, but gets killed to fast for me to notice, but I think she seems like she might be afraid to get killed. This could be due to her being killed so early in previouse games or maybe she is not and ordo.
This looks almost like checking if Brinniel is a Gifted, and maybe even a subtle way of an attempt to throw Brinniel (if she were a Gifted indeed) into a state of panic and in case situation started to move just a little bit in a bad way for her, causing her coming in front of us saying "No, I am this and this, please leave me alone". However, maybe if Rune indeed were a wolf and wanted to bring Brinn forth, he'd also vote for her to enlarge the pressure.

Concerning Brinniel, while I'm keeping an eye on her, I don't want to make a case against her, at least not now. First reason is, there is more than enough other people against whom to make a case. Second, I don't want to trigger anything that could cause her to be for the third time killed pre-maturely with my assistence, at least not until I am more sure that she is a Wolf. And as I said, there are more people of whom I am more sure.

And Ang's last post I completely agree with. It's shown in the narrations, and I really don't believe Volo would make up that role.

Now something to the business at hand. I have checked toDay's vote list, and apart from Shasta, who suddenly&unfortunately chose to vote for me, there are yet two other to vote for me. And these are Boro&SpM. I am fairly convinced at least one of them is a Wolf, and I am probably going to vote one of them. Anyone has any ideas about these two? Since Volo already voted for Boromir, I'll probably vote for him as well, also for the reason that the matter does not look much good for me, so I'd prefer him over SpM for whom there is no vote thus far.

The votes thus far:

Shasta: ++Legate (Legate-1)
SpM: ++Legate (Legate-2)
Boro: ++Legate (Legate-3)
Lommy: ++xyzzy (Legate-3; xyzzy-1)
Volo: ++Boro (Legate-3; xyzzy-1; Boro-1)
Anguirel: ++Brinniel (Legate-3; xyzzy-1; Boro-1; Brinniel-1)
Rune son of Bjarne: ++Macalaure (Legate-3; xyzzy-1; Boro-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1)

[Brinniel]

And then Brinniel says, fairly out of the blue,

"Suddenly, Volo has been moved to the top of my suspect list."

Suddenly is generally a bad sign as words go. I think either Rune or Brinniel is guilty, and personally I favour Brinniel because she is escaping suspicion so effectively - Legate and Boro for instance have both said they think she's convincingly innocent.

Ang, I don't understand why you see my earlier suspicions of Volo strange. I stated my reasons quite clearly, and he gave a good reason to be suspected after his odd vote for you.

On the the subject of Volo's role:

It would be one thing if he claimed to be some traditional role, but seeing as the Reincarnation of Tolkien is rather unique, I feel I have little reason to doubt him. If you are indeed a wolf, Volo, props to you because you will have fooled just about everyone...

[Aganzir]

But a look at the first narration should convince you that it was planned as part of the game from the start. We are "trusting in the spirit of Professor Tolkien to protect us", apparently.
That's true. I had completely forgot the first narration when Volo revealed his role. But though it probably should, it doesn't make me feel much more comfortable about him.
I hope suspecting probably known innocents is not becoming typical for me, since in the last game I was pretty sure Nogrod was a wolf even though he had revealed himself to be the Hunter... :rolleyes:


As long as we have no role-clues from the narrations, there is little sense in speculating them.
Actually, besides the Spirit of Tolkien thing there's one (might be more, though, but I found only this):


Two trailers were watched by unseen eyes that night; but for what purpose I cannot say.
I don't know if this "two" means the Ranger (or something alike) and the Wolves, or if there's some extra role who might want to watch a trailer.

[Kath]

My, my! I'd completely missed Volo's little declaration yesterDay! Well there's an eye-opener and no mistake. But what is the point of the role? Simply to aid the numbers of the innocents? Though now he's revealed that isn't going to help us much. While he was hidden the role was of some use, as had the wolves gone after him we would have been saved a death for one night. Now it's as useless as a revealed Hunter, except for the benefit of having a known innocent. In fact I don't get why he revealed at all. So what if you were about to be lynched? It didn't matter if you can't die! And it screwed up the voting record too because now nothing after that revelation was 'real' because it was all planned, and there's nothing to say that a wolf wasn't helping to lead the planning.

There was a comment Legate made yesterDay about Sixth that seemed odd to me as well while I think about it.

I believe him innocent, because he didn't do anything that could be wolfish apart of that he started bandwaggon for Ang.
You can't really start a bandwagon. I mean, there was some ill-feeling toward Ang yesterDay but unless you have, say, 3 other people all saying that they will vote Ang in their next post and then you vote making the first vote can't really be considered starting the train.

Now on to toDay:

Shasta strikes me as particularly innocent. He's so ... bouncy! It may just be because we've seen so little of him of course, but I'm keeping him in the innocent pile toDay.

Legate is giving me pause for thought. 'I told you Sixth was innocent' seems to be a common refrain of his, and what better a cover? Had Sixth been a wolf Legate's constant defending of him would have made us think that no wolf would fight that strongly to save a fellow baddie, and had he been innocent (which of course he was) he can claim to be pure as the snow since he didn't vote for him. (Sorry if that's confusing, I know there are far too many he's and him's.)

There seems to be some focus on Aganzir, though I'm not entirely sure why. The widowhood quip was actually pretty funny, and didn't seem particularly suspicious to me. He has also been coming up with some very good points, theories and ideas, so I'd like to keep him around. He's looking innocent to me so far. The 'were I a wolf' bit doesn't always mean the poster is a wolf either. I think Volo might be clutching at straws a bit there.

Gil I'm happy with at the moment. His response to, I think Rune (?) saying that he had gone back to his usual self was snappy and offended, exactly the way Gil usually reacts.

Rune still has my back up. His posts toDay have been just as empty of any susbtance and yesterDays. The one about the double-lynching was particularly useless, as it was something everyone knows, just as what he said about Gil was obvious.

btw the reason for this post is that I find it wrong when things are branded as pure evil, unless it is the wolves of course.
He says. Ok, so why not focus on, say, who the wolves could be? No point in worrying about double lynchings until we're sure enough of the guilt of two people that we would want to double lynch them. Oh, and yesterDay he wouldn't change his vote from Volo even after he revealed. 'It wouldn't change anything' he said, when this was blatantly not true since everyone else around was happily switching votes and causing major changes in the lynch. And he was hanging around right up til the end so he would have realised this before the lynch was finalised.

He also seems to be jumping on what other people say. A couple of people start talking about Brinniel and suddenly he thinks she's the most suspicious thing ever? Plus, having previously said that he isn't going to focus on Gil anymore he brings up that point about Gil posting differently again. Finally, when he votes his suspicions of Gil and Brinniel take a backseat to Mac, who hadn't yet been mentioned toDay.

I actually wonder whether Rune and Legate could be in league. Both argue against the other but neither finds the other suspicious enough to vote for. I certainly think one is a wolf, and right now I think Rune the most suspicious.

I have to go to a meeting in a bit and won't be here for the deadline so I'm going to cut this short. I know I haven't looked at most of the people here, just the ones that caught my attention as I read through, I will try to get everyone looked at tomorrow. But for now:

++RUNE

I will be around for another 10 minutes or so though so if anyone has questions in my direction ask 'em fast!

[Kath]

Oops, sorry Aganzir. I meant she!

[Anguirel]

Incidentally, I've just thought of a devious exploitative strategy.

In an emergency - such as lack of information and inspiration or a threatened gifted - we can deliberately lynch Tolkien to effectively keep the game in stasis. Of course, only to be used in a real crisis of confidence and when the nightly kill afterwards wouldn't destroy us.

I'm not sure about Aganzir (whom I of course now see is a beauteous lady, my deepest apologies). As a bumbler she rings completely true, but she has spent the day attempting to indict a clear innocent!

Kath, you're dead right about Tolkien's revelation but it's a case of spilt milk, alas. Your case against Rune is interesting and he is among my top suspects - I might retract to him in a pinch (though as so often, and so erroneously, in these situations I can't help wonder how he's become a wolf again!)

I notice I seem to be finding it hard to attack what you might call the Old Guard, Kath, Sauce and Boro particularly - they do seem innocent to me (Sauce a bit less so), but I shall try to extirpate the prejudice that familiarity breeds nonetheless.

I'm not sure about my brilliant Brinniel idea but as someone who distrusts brilliant ideas and adheres to Sod's Law, I fear that's only to be expected.

I don't think Legate is a wolf but mischievously, can't help admitting I wouldn't mind finding out. I won't strain myself too hard to prevent his lynching.

[Brinniel]

Okay, here comes my analysis on everyone:

Volo: While there may a small chance he could be lying, I am inclined to believe him, as I have stated in my last post.

Legate: Today he seems a bit calmer than before, and some of his recent posts have eased me a bit. And while I do find him to still be suspicious (for the reasons I've stated before), he does not look as bad as he did earlier.

Mac: He's one of those I have a very hard time reading. I think he could very easily go either way. I'm going to list him as unsure for now.

Boromir: He's another difficult one. His posts toDay give me more of an Innocentish vibe, but I could be very wrong here. I would like to leave him be for now.

Shasta: Hard to say since he hasn't been around much. His vote for Legate with no reasoning behind it is a bit odd, but that's very little to go on.

Durelin: Nothing to say here since she remains a no show. Looking at the time, I have my doubts she will show up, so it looks like this could end up as a mod-kill.

Anguirel: I think he might be one of the most difficult to figure out. It appears he was voted for yesterDay due mostly to his in-and-out-of-character style, which he doesn't seem to be doing toDay. I do, however, find his sudden jump on Rune and me rather odd.

Lommy: She has such a sweet nature about her, which always makes me want to mark her innocent, even when she is guilty, which I made the mistake of doing once before. Therefore, I have no idea about her.

Kath: She hasn't posted very much at all, and indeed I would like to hear more from her before the Day is over. The one thing I do find suspicious is her vote for Rune yesterDay. Was she trying to start a bandwagon against him? There wasn't much suspicion surrounding him at the time, so it's got me wondering..

Aganzir: Some thought here comment "were I a wolf" was suspicious, but it could also be the mistake of an innocent. There's nothing about her that raises alarms for me, though.

Rune: He can be a little overly-defensive for my taste, but maybe that's just his nature. His post about double-lynching does set me off. Double lynching is a risky business and I feel doubtful about ever doing it, and I especially think it would be a bad idea at this point of time.

Diamond: Another tough one to judge since we've hardly seen her around. I do hope she reappears before the deadline.

Gil-Galad: I don't like how he gets all defensive about his posting in post #140, and on that subject, I do miss the presence he gave in the most recent games. But since he's not posting much this time around, does that mean he's Innocent? I don't know...

xyzzy: He's only made one post, I think, throughout the entire game, so I can't really say much here...

Saucepan Man: I admit I haven't given much thought about him, mostly because I never know what to think about him. There's nothing I see highly strange here, but perhaps I should take a closer look. I would rather not vote for him toDay, though.

So, in conclusion:

Suspicious:
Legate
Anguirel
Rune
Kath

Unsure:
Mac
Boromir
Shasta
Durelin
Lommy
Diamond
Gil-Galad
xyzzy
SPM

Possibly Innocent:
Volo
Aganzir

Yeesh...that's a lot of unsures... :rolleyes:

EDIT: X-ed with Kath and Ang

[Volo]

A lot of text in a short time. Though the deadline is closing. I feel like Legate shouldn't be lynched.

Kath and Lommy have jumped into my list of scary, but I haven't had the time to analyse them yet, so I won't state anything against them.

I think I'll stick with my vote for Sir Boromir the Denethor.

[Brinniel]

Okay Kath, I've read your post, and I agree with Ang - you're case against Rune is indeed an interesting one. Not to mention, I find it much more convincing than when you voted for him yesterDay. This last post does help decrease any suspicions I had for you.

I think I need to go back and take a closer look at Rune's posts...

[Volo]

Oh, and for any sake: Don't vote Xyzzy or Durelin as they'll die from modfire if the situation continues.

[Anguirel]

I thought I would mention that while I currently suspect Rune, I agree with him completely about double-lynching. In fact, a lot of players think that by rights a village with double-lynching cannot lose without a severe lack of skill, so powerful an advantage does it form. I wouldn't quite go that far, but its sheer devastating randomness can hurt wolves a lot; they're much more badly burnt by the sudden loss of a comrade than we are.

The chance of lynching two wolves is tiny and insignificant. But the chance of bagging one wolf by sheer fluke is doubled. I'm a bit of a gambler so I actually quite like to see a few double-lynchs - speeds up the action for a start...

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

I'm a bit of a gambler so I actually quite like to see a few double-lynchs - speeds up the action for a start...
But from what it looks like now (six possible voting candidates), I have a bad feeling that if such a "gamble" occured, I'd be one of the objects. Which is a situation I'd certainly not like to experience.
I feel like Legate shouldn't be lynched.
You are not alone :rolleyes: Or, at least I hope you won't be alone...

Okay, I'm going to cast my vote. Is anyone else willing to vote for Boromir?

++Boro

[Macalaure]

suspicious: Rune

wary of: Legate, Aganzir

stumped: Shasta, Durelin, xyzzy, Lommy, Gil, Di

innocentish: Boro, SPM, Brinniel, Ang, Kath

innocent: Volo


Three of these need explanations, I guess.

Rune: What makes me wonder about him, additionally to the things others have already said, is that he takes up a point of mine to found his suspicion of Brinniel upon, but then he decides that I am more suspicious than she. You don't take up the points of your supposed baddies to detect other baddies unless you're making something up. Makes no sense.

Lommy: Her openly displayed lack of suspicions and her quasi-intended throwaway vote for xyzzy have me slightly wary.

Kath: I used to be wary of her, but her last long post gave me a very innocentish feel.

[Volo]

Shasta: ++Legate (Legate 1)
SPM: ++Legate (Legate 2)
Boro: ++Legate (Legate 3)
Lommy: ++Xyzzy (Legate 3, Xyzzy 1)
Volo: ++Boro (Legate 3, Xyzzy 1, Boro 1)
Anguirel: ++Brinniel (Legate 3, Xyzzy 1, Boro 1, Brinniel 1)
Rune: ++Mac (Legate 3, Xyzzy 1, Boro 1, Brinniel 1, Mac 1)
Kath: ++Rune (Legate 3, Xyzzy 1, Boro 1, Brinniel 1, Mac 1, Rune 1)
Legate: ++Boro (Legate 3, Xyzzy 1, Boro 2, Brinniel 1, Mac 1, Rune 1)

Please, no more votes to the sides.

[Aganzir]

I could vote for Boromir.

I'm afraid I have no idea who I really want to see dead, but even toDay nobody has caught my attention (except Volo, but even though I'm not too ready to consider him innocent, I wouldn't waste a vote on him). YesterDay I voted for Legate, but now he seems far too innocentish that I would do it. Of Rune I can't say anything, and I would rather vote for someone of who I at least have some kind of opinion.

edit: xed with Volo

[Macalaure]

++Rune Son of Bjarne

This vote is subject to be retracted if necessary.

[Aganzir]

++ Boro

I can retract this if something unexpected happens.

[Volo]

Rune: Just like in Monty Python: "And now, Gil-Galad". (If you don't know the joke, don't ask.)

Like he himself said, he hasn't had many suspicions. I actually see him pretty genuine. Though neither I believe that Mac is too wolfish.

Rune's vote looks rather bad. It's basicly a throw-out as Mac is pretty safe at the moment.

I'll look at the situation more carefully after toDay.


EDIT: Xd with Mac and Aganzir.

(Legate 3, Xyzzy 1, Boro 3, Brinniel 1, Mac 1, Rune 2)

[Brinniel]

Analysis of Rune:

Post #20: in character

Post #23: Mentions a zombie occupation is weird, but nothing really significant here.

Post #35: Gets defensive against Mac about in character posts.

Post #45: Defends his previous defensive post.

Post #62: Mentions he suspects Mac because of his attitude. Doesn't understand why Volo trusts Mith based on little substance, suspects and votes for Volo.

Post #91: Sees Volo's edit, mentions only other candidates is Mac, decides to not change his vote.

Post #104: Vote count.

Post #139: Notes Volo's role, Boromir's self-vote, Brinn's vote for Legate, and Gil going back to his old style.

Post #142: Defends himself against an upset Gil about Gil's posting style.

Post #167: Suggests that double-lynching could benefit the Innocents.

Post #170: Discusses suspicions about Brinn, says she's nervous. Unsure about Gil.

Post #172: Still unsure about Brinn and Gil. Goes after Mac because of his in-character rant and his focusing on Legate, votes for Mac

Sorry, that's a bit rushed, but the deadline is coming soon.

Anyways, I'm planning to either vote Legate, for old reasons I've stated before, or for Rune.

[Brinniel]

Hmm...I'm really stuck here...

I'm starting to feel more suspicious of Rune than Legate, but that would tie it.

But now, if it turns out as a three-way tie, only one would die, so we wouldn't have to worry about double-lynchings...

I'm not sure.

[Macalaure]

Uhm, in case you haven't noticed, we're about to double-lynch Legate and Boro. I don't think this is our best interest... :rolleyes:

edit: x-ed with Brinniel's last two

[Volo]

I'll change my vote to Rune if I have to, though I'd rather not have to.

[Diamond18]

I'm here... sorry I'm so late, I ended up running pretty late this morning and only just got online half an hour ago. I've done a rather quick read-through but obviously my thoughts will have to wait till tomorrow. Right now it looks like a double lynch is in the works... I'd like to avoid that. And between Boro and Legate, I think Legate's been more active and helpful (not that I blame Boro as he seems to be in essentially the same boat as me) but I think the 'village' shouldn't be damned to a whole lot of us super busy people barely playing and the active people dying off.

So....

+ + Boro

[Aganzir]

There are still 5 to vote, if I'm correct.

I will rather change my vote than see a double-lynch, too.

edit: xed with Di, which means that 4 haven't voted yet.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Shasta: ++Legate (Legate-1)
SpM: ++Legate (Legate-2)
Boro: ++Legate (Legate-3)
Lommy: ++xyzzy (Legate-3; xyzzy-1)
Volo: ++Boro (Legate-3; xyzzy-1; Boro-1)
Anguirel: ++Brinniel (Legate-3; xyzzy-1; Boro-1; Brinniel-1)
Rune son of Bjarne: ++Macalaure (Legate-3; xyzzy-1; Boro-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1)
Kath: ++Rune (Legate-3; xyzzy-1; Boro-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1; Rune-1)
Legate of Amon Lanc: ++Boro (Legate-3; Boro-2; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1; Rune-1)
Macalaure: ++Rune (Legate-3; Boro-2; Rune-2; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1)
Aganzir: ++Boro (Legate-3; Boro-3; Rune-2; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1)
Di: ++Boro (Boro-4; Legate-3; Rune-2; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1)

I'd like to note, if I'm correct, if we have three people to lynch, it's flip a coin.

EDIT: x-ed with Di. Oh, bless you, bless you! I'm going to give you a... Palantír, I have nothing better.

[Diamond18]

Uhm, in case you haven't noticed, we're about to double-lynch Legate and Boro. I don't think this is our best interest... :rolleyes:

I've fixed that, I think?

[Macalaure]

I don't want Boro to be killed, but I really don't want to cause a double-lynch.

Anybody else willing to retract to Legate?

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

yeiks! !! Good thing I got my brake moved. . .otherwise I would not have been here before the deadline.

this is a weird keyboard so there might be som odd mistakes in this post.

--Mac

++Boro

[Brinniel]

Okay, though I do suspect Legate still, I really do feel better about him today than I did before. I would like him to stick around for one day, and I'd hate to be the one to seal his fate just when I'm starting to have second-thoughts about him.

Boromir I still don't think is guilty, so I won't vote him.

And looking at his posts, Rune has most recently been the one to alarm me.

And I certainly won't pick up any new candidates.

++Rune

It may end up being a random lynch, but at least it won't be a double...

[Macalaure]

I don't see what you're finding suspicious about Boromir.

Fools. :rolleyes:

[Volo]

Should we try a Dubble Lynch?

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Shasta: ++Legate (Legate-1)
SpM: ++Legate (Legate-2)
Boro: ++Legate (Legate-3)
Lommy: ++xyzzy (Legate-3; xyzzy-1)
Volo: ++Boro (Legate-3; xyzzy-1; Boro-1)
Anguirel: ++Brinniel (Legate-3; xyzzy-1; Boro-1; Brinniel-1)
Rune son of Bjarne: ++Macalaure (Legate-3; xyzzy-1; Boro-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1)
Kath: ++Rune (Legate-3; xyzzy-1; Boro-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1; Rune-1)
Legate of Amon Lanc: ++Boro (Legate-3; Boro-2; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1; Rune-1)
Macalaure: ++Rune (Legate-3; Boro-2; Rune-2; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1)
Aganzir: ++Boro (Legate-3; Boro-3; Rune-2; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1)
Di: ++Boro (Boro-4; Legate-3; Rune-2; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1)
Rune: --Mac; ++Boro (Boro-5; Legate-3; Rune-2; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1)
Brinniel: ++Rune (Boro-5; Legate-3; Rune-3; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1)

[Brinniel]

Oh...well I just crossed over a bunch of posts...

I guess it won't make a difference now. :rolleyes:

I could retract and vote Legate, but I think he's up by two now.

EDIT: and by "he" I meant Boromir, sorry if that confused anyone...

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

the deadline is now right_

[Rikae]

On Day 2 of filming, the mood among the cast and crew was grim. Suspicion was cast on almost everyone; but in the end, Saruman was the least trusted; and the Downers gathered round him where he stood on the studio roof, hatred and fear in their eyes.

“Will you have peace with me, and all the aid that my knowledge, founded in long years, can bring? Shall we make our councils together against evil days?” asked Legate, in a last desperate attempt to save himself.

“So would the trapped wolf speak to the hounds, if he could! What aid can he give you, forsooth? All he desires is to escape from his plight!” retorted Boromir.

But Saruman's voice worked its magic on the others. The mob suddenly turned on Boromir. Durelin doused him in gasoline and set him alight...

...Boromir turned and ran 1000 yards down the length of the studio roof, then turned and raced back again, by now completely clothed in flame. He turned a third time and sprinted back again, showing no signs of slowing. Some of the Downers could not refrain from cheering as he completed a final lap, and set the record for the first mile run in under three minutes while in flames. Finally, he plummeted off the end of the roof.

The Downers shuffled reluctantly to the edge and peered over...

....to find that Boromir88's charred and smoldering corpse was still quite human.

Day 2 is over. Everyone mourn in silence. Wolves may PM. Send your picks by an hour before deadline tomorrow, please.

The Cast and Crew

Pushing up daisies:

Rikae(Mod)–CG Animator, Rendered and Lighted on Night1
The Sixth Wizard(Ordo)–Protester against Dwarven Comic Relief, Buried in Skulls on Day1
Mithalwen(Ordo)–Galadriel, Illuminated...(Electrocuted) on Night2
Boromir88 (Ordo)-Denethor, Burnt alive on Day2

Not pushing up daises:

Volo - Gollum
Legate of Amon Lanc - Sound Master/Saruman
Macalaure - The 7th orc in the 3rd row
Shastanis Althreduin - Legolas' stunt double
Durelin - Special Effects Pyrotechnician
The Saucepan Man- Set Catering Manager
Xyzzy - Young Fanboy
Brinniel- Wacky Foley Artist
Thinlómien- Non-Winged Balrog
Anguirel- Celeborn
Kath - Make-up Artist
Gil-Galad - Zombie-Gil-Galad
Aganzir - Smeagol
Rune -Tolkien geek who is estatic about being an Elf extra
Diamond18 - Lady in charge of Wigs and all other False Hairpieces

[Rikae]

Durelin was out of fireworks for the party scene. In desperation, she broke into the local Pyrotechnics-R-Us after closing time and "borrowed" the requisite supplies. Sadly, she hadn't kept informed about the latest recalls...
...an hour later, the Downers were greeted by a spectacular sight.
"It's a bird!"
"It's a dragon!"
....Durelin circled over the heads of the prostrate cast and crew three times, then turned a somersault and burst over "Bywater" with a deafening explosion.
"That's the signal for supper!" quipped SPM.

Later that night, Lommy prepared to leaver for her night job. She put on her attractive ill-fitting polyester uniform, but left her knife in the trailer. Some other night perhaps she would use it, but tonight she would protect, not kill, one of her fellow downers. The security guard punched in and took up her post in front of one of the trailers...but ere long, she heard a rustling in the bushes behind her.
One balrog may be a match for four Peter Jackson style wargs, but one security guard isn't. While two held her down, the others stitched a pair of tattered batlike wings to her back. Ignoring her shrieks and curses, they dragged the newly winged Lommy to the cliff behind the studio and cast her over the edge.
The wings, though quite lovely, were not terribly effective.
When the 13 remaining members of the cast and crew discovered the wolves' handiwork in the morning, all of them wept openly...but five were gloating in their hearts.


Night 3 is over. Day 3 has begun! Wolves, stop PMing. Everybody talk.

Good luck!

The Cast and Crew

Bought a pine condo:

Rikae(Mod)–CG Animator, Rendered and Lighted on Night1
The Sixth Wizard(Ordo)–Protester against Dwarven Comic Relief, Buried in Skulls on Day1
Mithalwen(Ordo)–Galadriel, Illuminated...(Electrocuted) on Night2
Boromir88 (Ordo)-Denethor, Burnt alive on Day2
Durelin(Ordo)-Special Effects Pyrotechnician - Burst over Bywater on Night3
Thinlómien(Ranger/Assassin)- Non-Winged Balrog - Took a tumble off the cliff on Night3

Didn't:

Volo - Gollum
Legate of Amon Lanc - Sound Master/Saruman
Macalaure - The 7th orc in the 3rd row
Shastanis Althreduin - Legolas' stunt double
The Saucepan Man- Set Catering Manager
Xyzzy - Young Fanboy
Brinniel- Wacky Foley Artist
Anguirel- Celeborn
Kath - Make-up Artist
Gil-Galad - Zombie-Gil-Galad
Aganzir - Smeagol
Rune -Tolkien geek who is estatic about being an Elf extra
Diamond18 - Lady in charge of Wigs and all other False Hairpieces

[Volo]

Damn and double damn! :(

Sure looks bad. I hope we have a Seer or something, because we really need one!

Though I have some thoughts that are clear at this moment:

Shasta: ++Legate (Legate-1)
SpM: ++Legate (Legate-2)
Boro: ++Legate (Legate-3)
Lommy: ++xyzzy (Legate-3; xyzzy-1)
Volo: ++Boro (Legate-3; xyzzy-1; Boro-1)
Anguirel: ++Brinniel (Legate-3; xyzzy-1; Boro-1; Brinniel-1)
Rune: ++Mac (Legate-3; xyzzy-1; Boro-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1)
Kath: ++Rune (Legate-3; xyzzy-1; Boro-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1; Rune-1)
Legate: ++Boro (Legate-3; Boro-2; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1; Rune-1)
Mac: ++Rune (Legate-3; Boro-2; Rune-2; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1)
Aganzir: ++Boro (Legate-3; Boro-3; Rune-2; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1)
Di: ++Boro (Boro-4; Legate-3; Rune-2; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1; Mac-1)
Rune: --Mac; ++Boro (Boro-5; Legate-3; Rune-2; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1)
Brinniel: ++Rune (Boro-5; Legate-3; Rune-3; xyzzy-1; Brinniel-1)

I now regret that I didn't have the guts to change my vote from Boro to Rune as I now pretty strongly suspect him.

If I'd have to toss a few names to call wolves, I'd toss Rune, Brinniel, Diamond and Shasta.

If I'd have to toss a few names to call innocent, I'd toss Legate, Aganzir, Anguirel and Gil-Galad.

Explaining: I found it strange that nobody used the chance to cause a double lynch, especially after I suggested it and the suspicions were so balanced. The wolves would have had much use of doing so, but they didn't. A reason could be a fellow wolf.

Of the two I'd go for Rune. And that brings a whole new figure into the field.

Brinniel's vote was a moderately safe vote for a friend. Looking at her earlier thoughts about Rune you'll probably see what I mean. I'm not 100% about this figure, but it looks the most probable.

The third one is harder, but I think it's Diamond. I've found her the suspiciously innocentish person here and her vote looks wierd. Though not wierd enough to say for sure. If she had suspected Rune she would have been far more suspicious with this figure. Because she just couldn't have voted Rune and caused a double lynch. And now that she didn't vote for Legate but even saved him, does speak for her. But I'm not lowering my guard!

The fourth one is pretty much a guess, but Shasta fits well into the overall figure with his vote for Legate.


I'm still thinking over and over.

Now to the innocent list:

Gil-Galad looks so much like the good ol' good Galad boy that I'm very sure that he's innocent.

I think I have misjudged Anguirel for now I see him innocent.

Just as Aganzir. I've gone through and decided I was much too rash there.

Legate's answer to my analysis of him pretty much convinced me of his innocense. I don't want to have him lynched!


:/

[Volo]

As we see from the narration, we have a cobbler or something nasty here. I'd put poor Mac into that part, again.

EDIT: Explaining:

Mac looks too confused for a wolf, but too confusing for the innocent Mac I know.

[The Saucepan Man]

Alas, it would appear that our Ranger/Assassin's apparent innocence was her downfall. I can’t see (and wouldn’t expect to see) any suggestion in her posts that she might be the Ranger, so I guess the Wolves just got lucky. She was unsuspected by most and her votes (for Sixth and Xyzzy) leave little trail. Other than these two, she outlined no firm suspicions, although she was slightly suspicious of Legate and Day 1 and Mac on Day 2.

It’s easy for me to say now, I suppose, but I cannot believe that you lot lynched Boro on such meagre evidence. He was, admittedly, acting slightly strange on Day 1, but he explained that and seemed far more engaged on Day 2.

Indeed, I cannot believe that you lot let that slippery fellow, Legate, escape from the noose. He is, in my view, clearly a Wolf. He looks to me to have spent a lot of time on Day 2 maneuvring Boro into the 'hot seat, in place of himself. :rolleyes:

One more point worthy of note, from the narration:

When the 13 remaining members of the cast and crew discovered the wolves' handiwork in the morning, all of them wept openly...but five were gloating in their hearts.Clearly, we do have a Cobbler or some such thing. The bad news (apart from the loss of our Ranger) is that the current ratio of innocents to baddies is less that 3:1. The good news is that we are more likely to lynch a baddie toDay.

I'm off to look at the Day 2 votes.

[The Saucepan Man]

I now regret that I didn't have the guts to change my vote from Boro to Rune as I now pretty strongly suspect him.In my view, the Wolves were voting to save their comrade, Legate, yesterDay. However, I am prepared to consider that they might have been voting to save both Legate and Rune, as I have conisdered Rune to be suspicious. Looking at the votes in this way might well make for an interesting analysis.

Legate answer to my analysis of him pretty much convinced me of his innocense. I don't want to have him lynched!You, Volo, were I think the first to put forward Boro as a possible candidate yesterDay, but it was Legate who did much of the running. Can you be sure that your analysis was not being used by a Wolf here to malign ends?

[Volo]

Well, having read his posts I am pretty sure he is innocent. Compare this Legate with the wolf Legate in the prevous games... :rolleyes:

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Hey guys! I'm feeling a lot better now. :) My high school graduation is tonight (thank goodness I'm feeling better just in time!), so hopefully this will be my last night of minimal activity, unless I relapse. Which would suck. Majorly. :)

Now, to go and reread the whole entire thread. ._.

[The Saucepan Man]

Well, having read his posts I am pretty sure he is innocent. Compare this Legate with the wolf Legate in the prevous games...I have, since I am very familiar with a Wolfish Legate. ;)

I agree that he is far more aggressive now than when he has previously been a Wolf. However, I am pretty sure that this is down to two things. First off, he has been under a fair amount of scrutiny in this game, almost from the off. Secondly, I would not expect him to act the same way now as a Wolf as he has in the past. Indeed, given that there are a number here who have experience of a Wolfish Legate, I would expect him to act quite differently.

However, if I was not convinced by his behaviour before, I am now from the way in which he took such a dominant role in condemning an innocent Boro. He even, at one point, said something like "Either Boro is a Wolf or SpM is". A classic Wolfish ploy directed towards getting two innocents killed in succession. I have used it mysef on a number of occasions.

[Volo]

I'd say that this is the usual two big innocents killing each other, SPM. He's not going to be online toDay, BTW if you forgot.

[The Saucepan Man]

He's not going to be online toDay, BTW if you forgot.Well, you seemed to have no qualms about turning against a Boro who was clearly unlikely to be able to return to defend himself. I am well aware that Legate will be absent toDay. However, it most certainly does not preclude his Wolfishness. And there is more than enough evidence to condemn him already, in my view.

Now, the Day 2 votes.

Shasta: ++Legate (Legate-1)
SpM: ++Legate (Legate-2)
Boromir: ++Legate (Legate-3)
Lommy: ++Xyzzy (Legate-3, Xyzzy-1)
Volo: ++Boromir (Legate-3, Xyzzy-1, Boromir-1)
Anguirel: ++Brinniel (Legate-3, Xyzzy-1, Boromir-1, Brinniel-1)
Rune: ++Mac (Legate-3, Xyzzy-1, Boromir-1, Brinniel-1, Mac-1)
Kath: ++Rune (Legate-3, Xyzzy-1, Boromir-1, Brinniel-1, Mac-1, Rune-1)
Legate: ++Boromir (Legate-3, Xyzzy-1, Boromir-2, Brinniel-1, Mac-1, Rune-1)
Mac: ++Rune (Legate-3, Xyzzy-1, Boromir-2, Brinniel-1, Mac-1, Rune-2)
Aganzir: ++Boromir (Legate-3, Xyzzy-1, Boromir-3, Brinniel-1, Mac-1, Rune-2)
Diamond: ++Boromir (Legate-3, Xyzzy-1, Boromir-4, Brinniel-1, Mac-1, Rune-2)
Rune: --Mac, ++Boromir (Legate-3, Xyzzy-1, Boromir-5, Brinniel-1, Rune-2)
Brinniel: ++Rune (Legate-3, Xyzzy-1, Boromir-5, Brinniel-1, Rune-3)

Did not vote: Durelin, Xyzzy, Gil

Legate voters: Shasta, SpM, Boro

Legate’s votes were received early in the Day. I am surprised that he did not receive more, but I consider that this was largely down to his own devious machinations (and those of his fellows) throughout the Day. Because I am convinced that Legate is a Wolf, and know two of the Legate voters to be innocent, I consider Shasta also likely to be innocent. It would have been a dangerous wolf-on-wolf vote.

Boro voters: Volo, Legate, Aganzir, Diamond, Rune (retracted from Mac)

I have no reason to reconsider the veracity of Volo’s claim (although his insistance on Legate's innocence is beginning to unnerve me), so his vote was innocent in my view. I also doubt that more than two Wolves, at most, voted for Boro. One of them was Legate. If there was another (and I think it likely that there was), I suspect that it may well have been Rune, with a view to ensuring his own, and Legate's, safety. However, I do not discount the possibility that Aganzir and Diamond may have been voting here to save a fellow Wolf. Particularly Aganzir, as it was her vote that put Boro level with Legate.

Rune voters: Kath, Mac, Brinniel

The votes against Rune came rather late in the Day, and it was Kath that started them. Mac and Brinniel fanned the flames. Difficult to draw any conclusions without knowing whether or not Rune is a Wolf. If he is, then Kath and Mac are looking very innocent as these are unlikely Wolf-on-Wolf votes, given that Rune was under a fair amount of suspicion. Brinniel’s less so, as it came at a time when Rune was probably safe. If Rune is not a Wolf, then the analysis, to my mind, depends on Legate’s guilt, since neither were really directed towards saving him. Since, however, I consider Legate to be as guilty as hell, these votes (those of Mac and Kath) look innocent to me.

Others

The only other votes were Lommy's for Xyzzy, Anguirel’s for Brinniel and Rune’s for Mac (later retracted). Lommy's vote was besed primarily on Xyzzy's lack of participation, and so little can be concluded from that. Anguirel’s vote looks to be a safe one, since there seems to have been little appetite to vote for Brin, although he did plead for support in his case. Rune’s vote for Mac was a very safe one, but was subsequently retracted for a much less safe one, but one which might have been directed towards saving both himself and a fellow Wolf.

So, assuming that there were two Wolves among the Legate voters, then I consider one of Rune, Aganzir and Diamond to be a Wolf. Rune is currently the one that I am most suspicious of. I also consider that there may well be a Wolf among the non-voters, Xyzzy and Gil (given that Durelin has been proven innocent). Which leaves one more. My inclination is to look to Brinniel, for her ‘safe vote’ for Rune. I am not discounting the possibility of a Wolfish Anguirel but, given my view on Legate, I consider it unlikely.

Unless things change dramatically, I will be voting for the Legate of Tol Gaurhoth toDay.

[Diamond18]

Disclaimer: I've been awake for the past 28 hours so this will probably be incoherent and rambling, with a dash of delusional thinking....

It's unfortunate that Boro was innocent, but actually I stand by my reason for voting him as I do not find Legate suspicious enough to lynch, and at the time he had been participating far more than Boro, so would be the worse loss. Well, now Legate is gone all day and will be silent, but I was going by the past posting patterns.

The third one is harder, but I think it's Diamond. I've found her the suspiciously innocentish person here and her vote looks wierd. Though not wierd enough to say for sure. If she had suspected Rune she would have been far more suspicious with this figure. Because she just couldn't have voted Rune and caused a double lynch. And now that she didn't vote for Legate but even saved him, does speak for her. But I'm not lowering my guard!

Wait, I don't understand. First you said my vote was weird and then you say it "does speak for me"? By that I assume you meant it speaks well for me? I'm a little confused as to what you actually are saying about me here.

As far as Rune, I wasn't paying that much attention to him, I think at the time I finished my read through Boro and Legate were tied which made them the only two players who, I suppose, really seemed to matter at the moment.

Eugh. I don't have much time so I won't really waste it on self defense, especially as I'm not sure what you're getting at.

I haven't had time to analyse everyone this game and so I'm playing a somewhat Valier-esque "gut feeling" sort of thing with whom I find suspicious.

Right now my spidey-sense is tingling most in Mac's direction... something about his sureness that Boro would be innocent seems too sure.

SPM seems very innocent to me, which maybe ought to be worrisome in itself as I usually suspect him, but I felt this way last game and he was innocent after all... so I'm not going to worry over him too much for the time being.

There are others players who have been way too quiet to get a read on (I know I'm one of them) and I'm tempted to vote for them just to clear up the view, so to speak. Perhaps I ought to start with myself. :rolleyes: But I'm not Nilpish quite yet.

Sigh. I really have to go now. I'm about to be physically ill with sleep deprevation and I have to show up at work again in 6 hours, so it's high time I passed out. It would take a miracle for me to make it online again before Day end, so I'm going to go with my spidey-sense on this one:

+ + Mac

[The Saucepan Man]

Clearly, we do have a Cobbler or some such thing. The bad news (apart from the loss of our Ranger) is that the current ratio of innocents to baddies is less that 3:1. The good news is that we are more likely to lynch a baddie toDay.Actually, on reflection, the good news is not that great. Potentially, five of the votes cast toDay (out of a maximum of thirteen) will be cast with malign intent. That's quite worrying, particularly if any non-voters are innocent, although it should make the voting analysis toMorrow interesting.

[Volo]

Well, you seemed to have no qualms about turning against a Boro who was clearly unlikely to be able to return to defend himself.
Indeed. Sorry, Esspiem... :o

I'm more and more sure of your innocence. We are probably the two fighting loud guys.

Though I am beginning to be a little paranoid on Anguirel (and why SPM was always so sure of his innocence. (Haha! :D)). Every time I reread Ang's posts I become scared of him, but every time somebody says that they trust him, I begin to feel stupid.
His posts just make so little sense to me... :rolleyes: Really! Especially this: Vote analyses can be helpful resourses, but on this occasion I think more helpful still is who people thought about voting for before Volo's revelation, which completely changed the landscape. Could you please explain more about Why?

I predict that we lose if Legate is lynched toDay as SPM will be under constant firing toMorrow (or however you werewolfarise the word).


EDIT: Xd with Di and SPM

[Volo]

The third one is harder, but I think it's Diamond. I've found her the suspiciously innocentish person here and her vote looks wierd. Though not wierd enough to say for sure. If she had suspected Rune she would have been far more suspicious with this figure. Because she just couldn't have voted Rune and caused a double lynch. And now that she didn't vote for Legate but even saved him, does speak for her. But I'm not lowering my guard!

Wait, I don't understand. First you said my vote was weird and then you say it "does speak for me"? By that I assume you meant it speaks well for me? I'm a little confused as to what you actually are saying about me here.
Yeah, I was writing that as the thought went past.

You feel so innocent that the paranoid part of me wants to lynch you just to be on the safe side...

If you'd voted Legate (and you had the potentiality to doing that even when Wolf, because of your preveous suspicions.) I'd be very sure that you are a Wolf, but since you didn't I'm not sure, I'm not sure...

[Volo]

Continuing on Diamond:

While reading this (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=522124&postcount=218) I somehow thought that I made a mistake about you, Di, but your post crossed that feeling.

Sorry, I don't really know what it is, but it made my hair stand up. Maybe because Valier was a very successful wolf once...


I think I'll go out to have a breath for a while.

[Aganzir]

There are 13 alive.
4 are wolves.
1 is a cobbler or something alike.
1 is Volo.
If we assume there's a Seer and a Hunter and that no one is lying (and that there are no more special things), this would leave 5 ordos. But we can't be sure, and everybody didn't even vote.
If we have a Seer, s/he would have had only two dreams by now. That's not for much help, I'm afraid.

I think Spm's point about Legate is good, but I'm a little taken aback by his certainty. Thoug if he's a wolf and having such a strong case against an innocent, I would think it astonishing.

We had better catch a wolf toDay, and if anyone had any idea who might be wolves, it'd be great, because I just don't suspect anyone enough myself to vote for him/her with certainty or even a strong feeling that I'm killing a wolf. That was to say I can vote for Legate if anyone won't pop up as a more likely wolf.


So, assuming that there were two Wolves among the Legate voters, then I consider one of Rune, Aganzir and Diamond to be a Wolf.Was that a confession? ;)

[Volo]

++Rune Son of Bjarne!

I bet with my life (:p) that Legate is innocent.

[Volo]

I think Spm's point about Legate is good, but I'm a little taken aback by his certainty. Thoug if he's a wolf and having such a strong case against an innocent, I would think it astonishing.
What point?

He looks to me to have spent a lot of time on Day 2 maneuvring Boro into the 'hot seat, in place of himself.

(to SPM about Legate)

I might trust him because his reactions have been very similar to my own. If I were Wolf, I might have suspected him of being Wolf (if that was possible).

You might not see at what I'm leaning because
1. You didn't agree with my (and his) opinions about Boro being extremely suspicious.

2. This answer (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521865&postcount=138) to this (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=521858&postcount=134). It does solve many of the suspicions cast at him. No, it really does!


EDIT: NO cross-posts! :eek:

Am I the only one alive here? This immortality isn't so nice after all... Gollum, gollum. :(

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Okay, scanned the thread.

The current vote struggle seems to be between Rune and Legate.

My quick Day 2 vote for Legate was just a placeholder; I thought that voting was what kept you from being modkilled, not simply posting. Apologies, Saruman! Don't blast me, okay?

Volo has basically solidified a connection between himself and Legate, so it's pretty safe to say that their alignments are the same. If Volo is telling the truth about his role (which I have no reason not to believe at this point in time), then it would follow that Legate is also on the side of the innocents.

One or two of Rune's posts put my hackles up, but I'm not sure where they were.... I'll have to go back and check.

++Rune, and I'll retract later if it's needed for any reason.

I was also going to mention the evidence of a second watcher in the Night 2 plot, but I see Aganzir already has... Might there be a tracker of some sort? For those who don't know, a tracker-type role watches one person during the night to see whether or not they target someone, and if they do target someone, who they targeted.

Example: I'm the tracker. Aganzir is... say... the Seer. I decide to track Aganzir during the night. Aganzir decides to dream of Volo. I would then receive a list back stating that Aganzir targeted Volo during the night, but I wouldn't be able to see what the results of that targeting were.

Okay, enough rambling, I need a throat lozenge. I also need to practice my backflips, as I'm behind on them, and Orlando "Pretty-Boy" Bloom told his agent not to schedule any gymnastic stunts, so of course I'm stuck doing them.

Edit: X'ed with Volo's last post. Hi again, Volo! :D

Edit: Okay, I found one of them; Rune's 'safe' vote for Mac yesterday. Moving on.

[Aganzir]

What point?
I meant that I found his ways of thinking good in the post where he brought up arguments against Legate. I should have said it clearlier, sorry.


Might there be a tracker of some sort? For those who don't know, a tracker-type role watches one person during the night to see whether or not they target someone, and if they do target someone, who they targeted.
There might, but I think it's more probable that it was about the Ranger and the Wolves or about the Ranger and the Hunter (if there's one) or something...

edit: I meant this (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=522124&postcount=218) post.

[Kath]

Don't think I'll have time to post much tonight but should be able to get on for a bit longer tomorrow (RL). But just a couple of points from reading through so far.

Firstly, how in the heck did Boro get lynched? I'm not usually one for looking at voting records but if there wasn't a wolf egging that little bandwagon on I would be extremely surprised. I'll definitely take a look at that when I get back.

Second is this by, erm, Shasta:
Volo has basically solidified a connection between himself and Legate, so it's pretty safe to say that their alignments are the same. If Volo is telling the truth about his role (which I have no reason not to believe at this point in time), then it would follow that Legate is also on the side of the innocents.
Eh? Just because Volo is a known innocent doesn't mean that those he believes to be innocent are. Even if Legate is Gifted it would seem unlikely that Volo would know that unless the two could communicate, which I doubt. Legate cannot be exonerated just because Volo says so.

I've nothing much else to say right now, except that I still believe Rune is extremely suspicious. I'm not convinced of the innocence of Legate either but Rune is higher on my radar than he is. I'm having trouble finding other suspects though. With that comment about Legate being innocent because Volo says so Shasta has moved into the guilty list because it feels like an attempt to clear a fellow wolf. I also have a sinking feeling that Sauce is playing us all for fools again, as he's pretty much escaping suspicion at the moment, or at least he's not in any real danger. But that's just my 'uh oh Sauce is still alive after two Days, he must be evil!' alarm going off so I'll ignore that for now.

Anyway I shall stop rambling now. I'll be around for a little longer but I have to get to bed early tonight (horrible early morning exercising, bah).

[Shastanis Althreduin]

I bet with my life (:P) that Legate is innocent.

The above is what I meant by the connection, Kath.

Eh? Just because Volo is a known innocent doesn't mean that those he believes to be innocent are. Even if Legate is Gifted it would seem unlikely that Volo would know that unless the two could communicate, which I doubt. Legate cannot be exonerated just because Volo says so.

That wasn't my point. The point I was trying to make is that if we decide to lynch Legate, and he turns out to be a wolf, we should be at least somewhat suspicious of Volo, on the grounds that he "bet with his life" that Legate was innocent.

With that comment about Legate being innocent because Volo says so Shasta has moved into the guilty list because it feels like an attempt to clear a fellow wolf.

Volo has basically solidified a connection between himself and Legate, so it's pretty safe to say that their alignments are the same. If Volo is telling the truth about his role (which I have no reason not to believe at this point in time), then it would follow that Legate is also on the side of the innocents.

I did not say that we should trust Legate because Volo says so. I said that if Volo is not lying about his role, Legate is likely to be innocent because no sane wolf would post something as clear-cut as Volo's championing of Legate.

[Gil-Galad]

first off i apolagize, thsi week has became rather busy, mroe busy then i expected, but hopefully this long weekend can give me time to get back up onto speed but the gifted kill and the lack of wolf kills dis-hearten me...

[The Saucepan Man]

Though I am beginning to be a little paranoid on Anguirel (and why SPM was always so sure of his innocence.I am not at all sure of his innocence. However, given what happened on Day 1, I consider it highly unlikely that both Legate and Ang are Wolves. Since I believe Legate to be a Wolf, I think it unlikely that Ang is one.

Was that a confession?Oops! :D I meant “Boro voters”, of course. :rolleyes:

I bet with my life that Legate is innocent.And I would stake my life in him being a Wolf. In fact, I pretty much have already.

1. You didn't agree with my (and his) opinions about Boro being extremely suspicious.But that’s the point, isn’t it? Boro, in my view, did not look particularly suspicious. You made a tentative accusation, and Legate seized upon it (no doubt because you are effectively a known innocent) and started sweet-talking everyone into believing it. Can’t you see it? Legate is playing his role to perfection.

Volo has basically solidified a connection between himself and Legate, so it's pretty safe to say that their alignments are the same. If Volo is telling the truth about his role (which I have no reason not to believe at this point in time), then it would follow that Legate is also on the side of the innocents.Kath picked up on this, but it is worth reiterating. I believe Volo innocent, but he has no special knowledge. Just because Volo thinks Legate is innocent, it does not follow that he is.

I did not say that we should trust Legate because Volo says so. I said that if Volo is not lying about his role, Legate is likely to be innocent because no sane wolf would post something as clear-cut as Volo's championing of Legate.This doesn't explain your point at all, since I think we are all pretty much agreed now that Volo is not a Wolf. But, just because he has been convinced of Saruman's innocence, it doesn't follow that the White Wizard is not a Wolf of many colours.

With that comment about Legate being innocent because Volo says so Shasta has moved into the guilty list because it feels like an attempt to clear a fellow wolf.I would have thought the same, but for Shasta’s vote yesterDay for Legate, which would have been a very risky Wolf-on-Wolf vote.

But that's just my 'uh oh Sauce is still alive after two Days, he must be evil!' alarm going off so I'll ignore that for now.Uh uh! Here we go … :rolleyes:

I’m off to look over what happened yesterDay again, as I was not here at the time.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

2 votes before I have a chance to get online, you guys are really testing my pations!

The next time I have to leave a long time before deadline I just wont vote and give the wolves more influence. . .

OK I won't, but right now I sure feel like it! You guys jump on my back for not voting for one of the two that you decided was most likely to be wolves, well in the end you made me vote for one of them and suprise suprise he was innocent!

Until proven otherwise I will claim that my vote for Mac was wiser than those that vote Boromir at first. Anyways if i cannot vote for the people I find suspicouse then what I am to do?

The reason I get irritated by this is that now everybody thinks that I am a wolf because of one vote, very little of you had other cases against me. SPM and Volo had made some points about my style which is a 1000 times more valid than my vote, if you are going to keep ranting about my guilt do it based on that please.

[Brinniel]

Brinniel's vote was a moderately safe vote for a friend. Looking at her earlier thoughts about Rune you'll probably see what I mean. I'm not 100% about this figure, but it looks the most probable.
My earlier thoughts on Rune? Which earlier thoughts are you talking about? I don't recall mentioning anything about him on Day 1, mostly because I didn't know what to think of him at the time. On Day 2, I started to feel suspicious of him (as shown in #180) and it only increased as I took a look back at all of his posts.

And I really wouldn't consider my vote for Rune safe. When I made my vote, I cross-posted with everything since post #194. This means if I hadn't cross-voted, I would've pulled it into a triple-tie, which means a random lynch among the three, and would've given a 1 in 3 chance for the person I voted for and most suspected to be lynched. It was better odds than to seal the fate of Legate, someone I was starting to feel increasingly uncertain of at the time. I hadn't seen the two votes for Boromir until after I made my vote, and by then it was too late to make any sort of difference.

I'm still feeling very uncertain about Legate, I keep going back and forth on him...and it doesn't help that he's not going to be around toDay. Right now, things don't look too good for him simply based on his vote for Boromir yesterDay.

Rune I am still suspicious of, and I will keep an eye on him toDay.

Through most of the game, I've been feeling that Aganzir is innocentish, but just based on her vote for Boromir, which tied him with Legate, I think perhaps I should take a closer look at her. And I can't seem to find a good reason on why she votes for him. I'm not sure what to think here...

Okay, I have to go get ready for work now. I'm pretty sure I'm closing tonight, so I'm afraid I won't be back for another eight hours.

EDIT: X-ed with SPM and Rune

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

I am sorry if I was a bit too agressive or used a harsh tone in my earlier post. I was just annoyed with the votes and Lommys death, but I have cooled down now.

[The Saucepan Man]

A few things from yesterDay.

I think that there may be something in Volo’s case against Aganzir, though he seemed to withdraw from it. She was picked up (by Ang) on the comment about Mithalwen’s concern over becoming a widow, which did not look Wolfish to me at all, merely flippant and humorous. But her attempt to explain it by saying that she would not have posted it were she a Wolf does look Wolfish. Why would she say this if it didn’t look Wolfish in the first place? It just seems the kind of overly defensive explanation which a Wolf might give when under scrutiny. Aganzir also looks bad for her determined attempt to discredit Volo, which could well have been a Wolfish attempt to neutralise a known innocent, subsequently abandoned when it gained no support.

If you want more proof that Legate is a Wolf, look no further than his posts #154, #155 and #162. Volo, in post #122, had raised a doubt about Boro and a few people had expressed some possible suspicions, but nothing firm. Then, in these posts, Legate delivers a withering assessment of Boro, seemingly in a honey-tongued attempt to turn the doubts of others into suspicion and, thus, votes. An endeavour in which he was, alas, successful. I think that we are better of without the Voice of Saruman toDay.

Anguirel’s case against Rune and Brinniel (#168) is an interesting one, since it is predicated entirely on the basis of hindsight. He is saying that, because we now know Volo to be innocent, anyone who was suspicious of Volo prior to his revelation looks suspicious, which does not follow at all. Volo did look pretty suspicious immediately before his revelation. I find Rune and Brinniel suspicious, for other reasons, but Ang’s reasoning here looks Wolfish to me. I wonder, is there any possibility that both Legate and Ang are Wolves, and were playing a very risky game on Day 1? Doubtful, but not beyond the bounds of credibility.

It was interesting how Legate found Brinniel's comments suspiciouse when he made something very similar, of course it was connected with her vote and he did retract the suspicion when she had explained her self. OK maybe this was not so interesting after all.Actually, it is quite interesting. Legate seems to have a habit of finding things suspicious when he himself has done them. He did the same with Ang, on the basis of the early Day 1 banter, yet later withdrew his supicion of Ang too.

I have checked toDay's vote list, and apart from Shasta, who suddenly&unfortunately chose to vote for me, there are yet two other to vote for me. And these are Boro&SpM. I am fairly convinced at least one of them is a Wolf, and I am probably going to vote one of them.This is the comment that I mentioned earlier. A classic Wolfish ploy.

Kath's post #177 makes a good case against Rune, and echoes my own thoughts on him. I can see why he attracted so much suspicion yesterDay, and can certainly see him as one of Saruman’s Wolfish cohorts. His Day 2 voting looks bad too. A ‘safe’ vote for Mac (who was under little suspicion at the time), subsequently retracted to condemn an innocent Boro, rather than himself or Legate.

[The Saucepan Man]

So, a quick round-up of my thoughts before I retire for the night.

Volo - The Spirit of Tolkien, Lor’ bless ‘im, but unfortunately beguiled by the silver tongue of his own creation.
Legate of Amon Lanc - A sweet-talking rogue who deserves nothing less than a rapid descent from Orthanc onto a nice bed of spikey wheels.
Macalaure - His vote for Sixth raised a slight question in my mind, but I haven’t seen anything else suspicious about him.
Shastanis Althreduin - Probably innocent for his Day 2 vote for Legate.
The Saucepan Man - A lone voice of reason. ;)
Xyzzy - Who knows?
Brinniel - Some suspicious voting and seems a bit reluctant to commit herself. A possible Wolf.
Anguirel - Surely can’t be a Wolf with Legate. But I have some concerns, based upon the points raised just now.
Kath - Useful, constructive contributions. Day 1 vote was slightly suspicious, but Day 2 vote less so. Thinking her innocent-ish for now.
Gil-Galad - No idea. As usual, could be anything.
Aganzir - Non-committal approach earlier on and the suspicious points that I noted just now. A possible Wolf.
Rune - Looks distinctly Wolfish to me, for his frequent but insubstantive posts and his voting.
Diamond18 - Haven’t a clue, but she’s put in a few seemingly ‘safe’ votes.

Back tomorrow, almost certainly to vote for the Wolf Wizard.

[Gil-Galad]

I am sorry if I was a bit too agressive or used a harsh tone in my earlier post. I was just annoyed with the votes and Lommys death, but I have cooled down now.


looks like a good cover to me...

I don't see what you're finding suspicious about Boromir.

Fools.

now that i don't like... trying a bluff? perhaps boro and mac are both wolfs and Mac tried to bluff by stating that...

but my vote will probably go to Rune though...

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

In case you did not notice: Boromir is dead and he was an Ordo

[Gil-Galad]

In case you did not notice: Boromir is dead and he was an Ordo

alright then... then perhaps Mac was piggy-backing on Boro's death and tried to play either a wolf or gifted...

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

That is a possibility. . . one that I think is worth considering.

[Gil-Galad]

That is a possibility. . . one that I think is worth considering.


but still, my votes will have to be between Mac and you my dear Rune...

so


++Macalaure

[Kath]

I'm not even supposed to be on here right now so ssh!

But I had an idea. What if we double lynch Volo and someone? What's this, Kath advocating a double lynch? Madness! But, there is reasoning.

There is still some doubt over Volo's role, and this would clear it up as if he is telling the truth he cannot die and it won't affect his standing in the village. If however he is a wolf playing an incredible bluff then, well, then we've bagged ourselves a wolf.

Now we could actually do this just on it's own, except that it's rather a waste either way. I personally would like to see Rune go down with him as he has so far toDay said not one constructive thing. His posts have either been a defense of himself or jumping on the theories of others. I won't vote until later so my mind has time to change, but at the moment I don't think it will.

Anyway, it's just an idea, doesn't have to be done. I'm actually a little wary of suggesting it as it may leave another less helpful voting analysis to be done by those that do them, but I thought it was worth putting out there.

[Macalaure]

Ah! I see I'm being suspected upon the basis of some serious and well-thought arguments. :)

My defending Boro and thinking him innocent is suspicious? May I remind you folks what the reasons for the votes for Boromir were?

Volo said "something looks very wrong there"
Legate said "a lot of wacky theories"
Aganzir said "I'm afraid I have no idea who I really want to see dead"
Diamond did a quick read-through, felt she had do decide between Legate and Boro and found Legate more helpful. No word on why Boro is more suspicious
Rune retracted to Boro from me for whatever reason

This was plain madness, and I'm sorry if you don't see it this way.

I know Diamond has little time on your hands, but her votes look increasingly wolvish.
Gil-Galad is right at the top of my to-lynch list right now.

*polishes his scimitar* :D

[Macalaure]

Rune Whelp of Bjarne


Day Two

#139
He jokes and states the obvious.

#142
He responds to Gil-Galad with the same sudden defensiveness that we have already witnessed before, but then he says "It might as well speak for you innocense as your guilt."
In the end: much ado about nothing.

#167
My talking about irrelevant stuff is mostly because I am trying to hide the fact that I do not have any good suspicions, I am constantly hoping that the next time I read through some post that something will jump into mind.
This is very interesting: He admits his own fault of having no good suspicions in order to get away with another post of irrelevant stuff. This confession of minor faults in order to increase one's credibility is something I did some times in the one game that I was evil.
He then continues with some obviousnesses about double lynchings

#170
This post looks to me like he has now realised that he cannot make it through completely without making any points. The comment of mine which he picked up looks almost as if picked up at random. To found his suspicion of Brinniel upon it is a very, very weak point. He also says that Gil "is an ordo once again or that he is a cunning wolf", which has absolutely no content. Actually, Rune and Gil look more and more like wolvish comrades to me.

#172
He goes back to his suspects of yesterDay (ouch!), but realises he obviously can't vote Volo any more. He relativises his suspicions of Brinniel and Gil and does a quick analysis of me (exclusively about Day One). He votes me on the basis of this.
This whole post looks extremely contrived, I'm sorry.

#201
He retracts from me to Boro without giving any reason.


Day Three

#233
He complains about the votes for him and defends his own vote vigorously.
Actually, I don't even think his vote itself is that suspicious. It's the badness of its reasoning. Though it is also possible that he wanted to save Wolf-Legate (I'm not as convinced of Legate's wolfdom as SPM is) but didn't want people to turn towards himself if it fails. But this is a very vague theory.

#235
He apologises for his harshness, which of course is a good thing, but then it also echoes #167 again.

#239
He tells Gil the Confused that Boro was an ordo.

#241
After Gil has bent his own argument by 180 degrees, Rune thinks it's worth considering.
Honestly, I can only shake my head at this.


I am now very convinced that Rune is a wolf and quite convinced that Gil is one, too. There are some others which I would maybe put into the same bag at the moment, but I don't want to complicate matters unnecessarily. One wolf after the other.

[Brinniel]

Yeesh...I was gone for what...10 hours, and expecting there to be a flood of posts. Yet, there was really not much at all for me to catch up on. Well, I'm sure there will be plenty of more posts when I come back in the morning.

Anyways, to keep track of the voting so far:

Diamond: ++Mac (Mac- 1)
Volo: ++Rune (Mac-1, Rune- 1)
Shasta: ++Rune (Mac- 1, Rune- 2)
Gil-Galad: ++Mac (Mac- 2, Rune- 2)

But I had an idea. What if we double lynch Volo and someone? What's this, Kath advocating a double lynch? Madness! But, there is reasoning.

There is still some doubt over Volo's role, and this would clear it up as if he is telling the truth he cannot die and it won't affect his standing in the village. If however he is a wolf playing an incredible bluff then, well, then we've bagged ourselves a wolf.
An interesting idea. This indeed could help guarantee us whether he is Innocent or not. And if Volo really is being honest and he cannot die, then he should have no objections to a double-lynch involving him. But then, I have my doubts that this would work as it would take a lot of cooperation from everyone. And considering the chaotic ends to our Days so far, I don't know if that could happen.

Alright, I need to put up some thoughts on everyone as of now:

xyzzy: He said on the admin thread he would be around toDay, but still no sign of him. Nothing I can really say here.

SPM: He seems so certain that Legate is guilty, he is willing to put his life on it, which is strange, not to mention risky. Yet, I doubt a wolf would be so bold, especially since Legate has been highly suspected since Day 1.

Rune: I am still very suspicious of him for the same reasons I was yesterDay. No change here.

Legate: I'm still feeling a bit uncertain of him and I really wish we could hear from him toDay, but I realise that won't be happening. Still, he is swaying more on the suspicious side for me partly because of old reasons, and also because of the timing of his vote for Boromir. It seemed to me he was trying to help get a bandwagon going, which was, in fact, successful.

Shasta: A rather seemingly cheerful fellow, I would say. I don't really like how he's voted so quickly these past two Days with little explanation, though maybe this is due to time reasons. But right now, there is nothing I can find particularly suspicious about him.

Diamond: I don't see anything suspicious when looking at her vote for Boromir alone. However, I feel like she has put little substance into her her posts until toDay when she voted for Mac. I'm not sure exactly what that means...

Kath: Since Day 1, she has suspected Rune with almost as much certainty that SPM has against Legate. Her case against Rune is actually quite reasonable, and I don't really see any reasons to suspect her. If she does turn out to be a wolf, props to her for completely fooling me.

Aganzir: She seemed so innocent to me before, but I find her vote yesterDay for Boromir rather alarming, especially since she didn't really give a reason for it. She's certainly not at the top of my suspects, but I certainly want to keep an eye on her from now on.

Anguirel: Oh geez...I'm still so confused on what to think of him. Such a tough player to figure out. He still hasn't shown up toDay, and I would like to hear from him. But right now, I have no idea.

Mac: His last comment yesterDay about Boromir's innocence indeed could be coming from a wolf trying to draw away suspicion. Yet, while I would like to keep a close eye on him, I do not think it is a good idea to lynch someone based on one comment alone, as it could've also come from an Innocent blurting out his thoughts without thinking of the consequences.

Gil-Galad: Due to his scarce posting compared to his flood posting when he was a wolf, I really haven't considered him. But toDay, when he says he is probably going to vote for Rune, after going back and forth in conversation with him, he suddenly jumps on Mac, which I find to be alarming. If Rune is a wolf, I think it may be possible Gil is one as well.

Volo: I still feel the same about him. While there may be a chance he is lying about his role, I really doubt that.

Suspicious:
Rune
Legate
Gil-Galad

Slightly Suspicious:
Aganzir
Mac

No Idea:
Anguirel
xyzzy
Shasta
Diamond

Possibly Innocent:
Kath
SPM

Innocent:
Volo

Time for me to go to bed now. I'll try to be back in around four hours if I can get myself up that early...

EDIT: X-ed with Mac's last post (whoa, did I really take over an hour to write this up?! :eek: I'm so slow... )

[Volo]

SPM: He seems so certain that Legate is guilty, he is willing to put his life on it, which is strange, not to mention risky. Yet, I doubt a wolf would be so bold, especially since Legate has been highly suspected since Day 1.
Yet I did so when I was a wolf in Oddwen's game... :rolleyes:

But I had an idea. What if we double lynch Volo and someone?We could try if you really feel that I'm lying, though doing the double lynch might be hard... Better we consentrate on lynching the wolf as that itself is problematic with so many evil creatures hopping around.

Gah. The only action I feel like taking that won't boil my head is looking at Kath and Brinniel, again.

EDIT: ...in Oddwen's game and it would have worked too if not for you meddling Seer! Well, we won anyway. Thanks Holby and Nilp.

[Volo]

Kath:

#25 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?p=521598#post521598): Pure in-character. Ah, wait, no:
On that subject there is a point I would like to bring up but I may wait until tomorrow or even the next Day to do so, as it's one that can cause a first Day to descend into a flurry of arguments the likes of which we see every time.
What's this? Something to do with me and Aganzir?

#51 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?p=521657#post521657): Changes mind about the quote above, if I understand her right.
Much ado about nothing. Or at least too much ado about barely anything. I'm really mystified how Kath turned such a post out of nowhere. No, I'm not saying that it doesn't say anything truthful. On the contrary, I'm saying that the post holds too much of the obvious. And especially how she congatulates people on how great "points" they have made looks suspicious. The "Nice Cuddly Wolf"? The only thing that really turns everything around is her vote for Rune, though Rune wasn't in real danger there and I'm pretty sure Rune doesn't mind being the "Martyr Wolf". :p

A hard post that one. One thing is certain: Kath used a lot of time on it. What do you, fellow innocents, think? (Wolves stay quiet.)

#146 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?p=521879#post521879) : Hmm... I started off this analysis thinking of Kath as, well, anything, probably innocent, but now she's falling into the Wolf category pretty neatly. Anyway: Am I the only one who finds this post a bit plastic? As if Kath knew that Mith was going to be killed? Ok, the post doesn't come 2 seconds after the Daybreak, but still... Or am I just paranoid and unfamiliar with Kath's style?

Anyway, the part about "Newbie Wolves" raises my alarms the most. Gloating? The Wolves in truth all old times?

#177 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?p=521964#post521964) : (On side note: So Legate saw Sixth innocent even because Sixth didn't start a bandwagon! :D).

(Sorry if that's confusing, I know there are far too many he's and him's.)No, that's not confusing, but what is confusing is that your thought s about Legate defending Sixth make zero sense. The ideas of what Legate would do is just too far fetched, I think that nobody in his right mind would claim somebody innocent because of those reasons...

I think Volo might be clutching at straws a bit there.And I think that my analysis of Aganzir was damn good too. But alas, I regret it now... Actually this part is pretty much like what Kath is describing what Legate did about Sixth, seeing that Aganzir would probably die, Kath said that Aganzir is innocent (Not an accusation, just pointing out that the logic doesn't work.).

Rune still has my back up. His posts toDay have been just as empty of any susbtance and yesterDays. The one about the double-lynching was particularly useless, as it was something everyone knows, just as what he said about Gil was obvious. And Mith or somebody pointing out the same obvious stuff isn't guilty? The way Kath targets Rune does make me wonder...

I think the most innocent thing Rune has done is not to change his vote from me. I really think that it was pretty irrelevant.

He also seems to be jumping on what other people say. A couple of people start talking about Brinniel and suddenly he thinks she's the most suspicious thing ever? Plus, having previously said that he isn't going to focus on Gil anymore he brings up that point about Gil posting differently again. Finally, when he votes his suspicions of Gil and Brinniel take a backseat to Mac, who hadn't yet been mentioned toDay. But here's a point I agree with. Not so much the Brinniel part as the Gil-Galad part.

#229 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?p=522143#post522143) : This post doesn't feel too evil, but I must disagree about Shasta. I'm not saying that he can't be a Wolf, but his thought that I'm what Legate is looks more like a simple mistake...

#243 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?p=522175#post522175) : The obvious thought, can't really say that this looks suspicious.


On the whole:

I'm pretty lost here too. Kath seems to be the "Friendly Wolf" type if she's a Wolf, which is pretty probable. A lot of text and praise for barely anything.

The very strange obsession with voting Rune. Here it's obvious to think "Seer!" and do think that indeed. But if I'm right, there was no dream on Night 1. Night One has begun. Wolves begin your fiendish plotting. Others, hold your horses.

A few contradictions I've marked in the analysis.

On the whole the tone isn't that suspicious as Kath seems to put a lot of effort into the game and her posts are readable and without too many unnecessary stylistic tricks that make you feel like the writer is a genious but in fact doesn't say anything. :p (But that's a minor detail conserning Wolves.)

I even went as far as reading through a few of Kath's posts from Oddwen's game in which Kath was the wrongly lynched Hunter.
In the current the style is completely different from this post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=504913&postcount=53), but comes close to the style here (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=505148&postcount=110) . Is Kath always praising people to the level of suspicious?


Xd with everybody since my last post. Goin out now.

EDIT: :O Didn't X-post with anybody! Speak up!

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Yet I did so when I was a wolf in Oddwen's game... :rolleyes:

Yeah and no matter which other thing Brinniel would have chosen as something she did not think a wolf would do, we could find an example that shows that a wolf actually did do that.


It's the badness of its reasoning.
Do I really have to listen to stuff like this?

Non has pointed out what about my reasoning for Mac was so awful that it has to tricker my death!

Other people voted for random people with far less reasoning than I, but I guess that matters not.

I am also suprised that you talk about bad reasoning when you, yourself cannot recognise my retracted vote as self-preservation and presents it as something suspiciouse.

Now we could actually do this just on it's own, except that it's rather a waste either way. I personally would like to see Rune go down with him as he has so far toDay said not one constructive thing. His posts have either been a defense of himself or jumping on the theories of others
Me defensive? That sure is strange and wolfish!

Maybe if half of the crew had not jumped on my bag with drawn knifes I would be less defensive and maybe then I would also have the extra energy to actually direct some of my focus on others.

You guys are giving the wolves so much space to hide with this joint case and normally I am alright at picking out wolfish attacs on me, but you are all saying the same things.

[Macalaure]

Non has pointed out what about my reasoning for Mac was so awful that it has to tricker my death!It comes out of nowhere. You haven't even mentioned me so far the whole day, except when you founded your suspicion of Brinniel on my, apparently wolvish, comments. Your explanations for the vote consist exclusively of Day One stuff, you seem to have intentionally ignored what I've said on Day Two.
Altogether this is, I'm afraid to say it, very wolvish.

Other people voted for random people with far less reasoning than I, but I guess that matters not.It does. I am suspicious of Gil, Aganzir and Diamond, for example, but I just happen to be more suspicious of you. You have surely noticed that my suspicion is based on more than just the vote.

I am also suprised that you talk about bad reasoning when you, yourself cannot recognise my retracted vote as self-preservation and presents it as something suspiciouse.Granted, you're right in that point.