View Full Version : Game Thread: Werewolf- this time it's real!
satansaloser2005
04-17-2009, 03:53 PM
But I'm not a duck! Or a witch! And this isn't my nose, it's a false one!
(Sorry, I couldn't resist popping in with that. Won't see me for a few hours now.)
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 03:53 PM
Gwath, if you're around plese explain why you didn't vote yesterDay. I'd love to know.
Well, I'm VERY busy reading the thread, but I'll oblige anyway. It was indecision, basically. I couldn't make up my mind, almost voted a couple of times, and then it was too late.
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 03:56 PM
I said we should all disarm - as a show of confidence that is - and then lynch those who do not wish to join. And I expressed many reservations to that. And I already kind of deserted the plan in my posts as an impossible one to execute - before I realised it could be accomplished if we could pressure the wolves toDay.
Yeah...ain't no way I'm disarming (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O0B_UZNtEk4).
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 04:01 PM
Because I think Nogrod's essential point is that currently over half the village (7 of 13) has all of their bonus votes and 9 of 13 has over 7. That is quite a disparity. And he's not saying if you have 10 bonus votes you are a wolf, but he's saying there are wolves clutching onto their bonus as Smaug does with treasure.
This is likely the case, but I ought to point out that an important element of our defense against wolves-with-lots-of-bonus-votes will be innocents-with-lots-of-bonus-votes.
A Little Green
04-17-2009, 04:01 PM
Well, I'm VERY busy reading the thread, but I'll oblige anyway. It was indecision, basically. I couldn't make up my mind, almost voted a couple of times, and then it was too late.Ok. Thanks for responding.
As for Nog - I confess I got lost about halfway through your post. :D
I should vote very soon, but I'd like to hear a bit about who others are planning to vote. Since, as Nog has been emphasising, toDay's voting is quite important, I wouldn't want to cast a vote that turns out to be a throwaway. So, a question to those that happen to be around: who do you plan to vote?
EDIT: x-ed with 2xGwathie
Nogrod
04-17-2009, 04:03 PM
Well, I'm VERY busy reading the thread, but I'll oblige anyway. It was indecision, basically. I couldn't make up my mind, almost voted a couple of times, and then it was too late.I could bet Gwath is not a wolf (or a vampire).
It would be quite bold from a wolf to pull that! And to be as suspicious as he once again is ("I'm VERY busy reading the thread but I will answer this as someone now makes a tiniest move to suspect me") would be just suicidal for a wolf. :)
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 04:04 PM
I should vote very soon, but I'd like to hear a bit about who others are planning to vote. Since, as Nog has been emphasising, toDay's voting is quite important, I wouldn't want to cast a vote that turns out to be a throwaway. So, a question to those that happen to be around: who do you plan to vote?
Right now I am casually considering Fea, Sally, and Nogrod as possibilities. I haven't finished reading the thread though, so these are all based on incomplete knowledge.
EDIT: Crossed with Nogrod...was that sarcasm, Nogrod? I can't tell...
Isabellkya
04-17-2009, 04:11 PM
I read it as "I'm very busy conversing with my fellow mates right now, but I will respond anyhow."
What exactly are you referring to Sally?
Nogrod
04-17-2009, 04:11 PM
So, a question to those that happen to be around: who do you plan to vote?I still have some time to spend (not much though) but going for it right now I might say that Brinn is my first choice at the moment, then there would be you Greenie and probably Form (but you two I'd need to think and read again a bit before making a vote). After that I'd say... hmm... Sally... it gets more difficult there. Nilp, Izzy, Kent, Fea... (add any name)
A lot depends on how extensive a read-about I will manage. The lengthier the greater the possibility these hunches will change, I presume.
But I'm also open to suggestions and good cases for or against.
Basically I do not trust but Kuru toDay. And as people have said; yeah he can err, but his intentions are sincere.
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 04:12 PM
That person whether wolf or innocent will most likely use their bonus to save themselves, which is I think the bigger point, to start levelling out the field.
Heck no! Save your votes for when you're confident that you've got a wolf! Don't disarm!
A Little Green
04-17-2009, 04:13 PM
Right now I am casually considering Fea, Sally, and Nogrod as possibilities.I was considering both Sally and Nogrod possible choices as well. Not Fea, though - I have no idea whatsoever about her and thus voting for her might do more harm than good. Something in Sally's last few posts has been rubbing me the wrong way. Dunno, it has to do with the sort of indefinitive manner of expressing things. Can't formulate that any better. Whereas Nog I still don't feel easy about, and it's not just because I disagree with him about nearly everything.
Another I was thinking about earlier was, in fact, Gwath, but his last few posts have seemed innocentish to me so I probably won't.
EDIT: x-ed with Izzy, Nog and Gwath
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 04:15 PM
Well, here's my thing with Fea: her votes for Nogrod look to me like either an innocent who's pretty convinced she's got a wolf or a cobbler trying to draw out more bonus votes from the village.
Nogrod
04-17-2009, 04:15 PM
Crossed with Nogrod...was that sarcasm, Nogrod? I can't tell...Partly yes - or just having fun - but to be honest I basically don't believe you to be a wolf in this game. Well at least for now.
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 04:15 PM
I read it as "I'm very busy conversing with my fellow mates right now, but I will respond anyhow."
I suggest taking it at face value.
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 04:16 PM
Partly yes - or just having fun - but to be honest I basically don't believe you to be a wolf in this game. Well at least for now.
Aw, well, it's swell of you to say so.
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 04:18 PM
Lynch those with ten votes - or create a general feeling that those having ten votes are the ones in the line for the gallows. Then the wolves need to discharge their votes and - especially if we get one toDay - then we may be able to breathe once more a little.
Those with ten votes are not an asset to the village, they are a threat. They may think in their individual potholes that they are the fighters for freedom but they are the harbringers of doom in many senses.
I agree with the first paragraph. I disagree with the second.
Shastanis Althreduin
04-17-2009, 04:20 PM
Here and reading.
Notes on first skim-through:
Greenie - I'll have to go back to my posts that day and look at who I suspected. I believe it was you, Form, and Nogrod, but I could be mistaken.
I'm leaning towards Brinn being innocent right now, and would rather not see her go. She definitely has the air of an ordo who's irritated at being constantly suspected by the same person. Sidenote - has anyone else noticed that every time someone gets irritated with having to defend themselves, Nogrod brings up Rikae as an excuse to attack them anyway? I think it's happened, like... every game I've ever played with him in it. :rolleyes:
As for Kuru's idea about suspicion lists, I'll go back and formulate mine.
Edit: X'ed from Izzy on.
Isabellkya
04-17-2009, 04:21 PM
Hahaha. Unfortunately, there is very very little that you can take at face value in this game we play called Werewolf. xD
I'm a bit concerned with Gwath's multitude of posts. Why not organize into one epic one?
X'd with Shasta.
Nogrod
04-17-2009, 04:26 PM
Aw, well, it's swell of you to say so.Sorry about my broken English but I do not understand what you mean by that. The dictionary gives quite conflicting descriptions of what "swell" means.
Anyway, most of them don't suggest you were making a positive comment... :rolleyes:
Shastanis Althreduin
04-17-2009, 04:27 PM
Sorry about my broken English but I do not understand what you mean by that. The dictionary gives quite conflicting descriptions of what "swell" means.
Anyway, most of them don't suggest you were making a positive comment... :rolleyes:
"Swell" in this context means "good", Nogrod. Whether or not he was being sarcastic is a question you'll have to ask him. :p
Isabellkya
04-17-2009, 04:29 PM
I think I may get what is not being said by that Shasta. Just because someone may get irritated or frustrated with defending themselves; doesn't mean it makes you innocent. Perhaps he is using Rikae as an example of putting on a good show in defense of herself to get off the lynch block?
That your acting skills should not be the ultimate decider in clearing yourself, when you are suspected.
X'd with Shasta and Nog.
Shastanis Althreduin
04-17-2009, 04:31 PM
I think I may get what is not being said by that Shasta. Just because someone may get irritated or frustrated with defending themselves; doesn't mean it makes you innocent. Perhaps he is using Rikae as an example of putting on a good show in defense of herself to get off the lynch block?
That your acting skills should not be the ultimate decider in clearing yourself, when you are suspected.
X'd with Shasta and Nog.
I know what he was saying, Izzy. I was just commenting on the fact that he makes the exact same comment every time. :rolleyes:
Nogrod
04-17-2009, 04:33 PM
I agree with the first paragraph. I disagree with the second.Naturally. But don't let your ideas about the second amendment to blur your view about what's taking place here. :D
Thanks for the clarification Shasta. I'll chew the possibilities...
I'm leaning towards Brinn being innocent right now, and would rather not see her go. She definitely has the air of an ordo who's irritated at being constantly suspected by the same person.Now who might that be? I have voiced suspicion of her toDay but is there someome else with whom she's irritated with as being "constantly suspected" by? Or what might you mean?
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 04:33 PM
I'm a bit concerned with Gwath's multitude of posts. Why not organize into one epic one?
Because I don't have one epic, monolithic thought, I have a multitude of little ones which come and go as they please and dance around and sing little songs...but now I'm rambling.
Shastanis Althreduin
04-17-2009, 04:37 PM
Now who might that be? I have voiced suspicion of her toDay but is there someome else with whom she's irritated with as being "constantly suspected" by? Or what might you mean?
Well, today it's been you, but I was mainly referring to past experience. :p
Isabellkya
04-17-2009, 04:40 PM
IT seemed like you were responding to things as you read the thread. Just curious as to why you wouldn't just organize it all into one post. XD.
Shasta. You weren't really commenting. You were asking if anyone else had noticed such things. Questions and comments are not the same.
Nogrod
04-17-2009, 04:42 PM
Well, today it's been you, but I was mainly referring to past experience. :pHmm... interesting. As it can't be me. The last games we've had she has been the one to kill me at Night or secure my lynch so early on that I've had no chance to even start to actually suspect her...
Now does this look like you two have had conversations lately, like within a few hours, last Night, or something? :rolleyes:
Shastanis Althreduin
04-17-2009, 04:53 PM
Hmm... interesting. As it can't be me. The last games we've had she has been the one to kill me at Night or secure my lynch so early on that I've had no chance to even start to actually suspect her...
Now does this look like you two have had conversations lately, like within a few hours, last Night, or something? :rolleyes:
"Past experience" in my previous post refers to any innocent being unjustly suspected and getting irritated about it. I'm willing to blame the language barrier, Nog, but it does seem you're starting to twist my words a bit, hm?
Shastanis Althreduin
04-17-2009, 04:57 PM
My internet has started acting up every time I go to today's first page, so I'm going to come back to my suspicion list. Meanwhile, here's what I picked up reading that page on a few people:
Gwath (10) - Seemed put out at the beginning of the day that Kuru was still alive.
Kuruharan (6) - obviously innocent.
Nilp (7) - I like that he went to the trouble of an analysis on Firefoot, but... I just don't see that it accomplished a great deal. It made him look quite helpful, though, which doesn't sit right with me.
Nogrod (5) - The fact that all he's been saying today is "Let's focus on people who haven't used bonus votes yet" irks me a bit. Even though he says he's not, it's like he's discounting the possibility that there might be wolves that have used bonus votes already, which I don't think is a good idea at this point. That and I don't tend to like continuous harbingers of doom. :p I'm actually beginning to think, after rereading post #445 where he condemns Brinn, that he's just mad that she hasn't posted as much as he would like.
Sally (10) - In post 430, she states, "The thing was that I was pretty sure you weren't innocent". Freudian slip? Maybe she's Grima. Also, the way she adds Gwath's explanation of his non-vote to her own just seems weird to me.
A Little Green
04-17-2009, 05:01 PM
Now does this look like you two have had conversations lately, like within a few hours, last Night, or something? :rolleyes:You just reminded me of one thing that was bothering me about you but I always forgot to mention. The quote above is a classic example, but there have been a few other similar ones as well. That sort of seemingly-careless, half-serious little accusations seasoned with a rolleyes smiley. I can't see the purpose that would serve for an ordo, but I do see the benefit of retorts like that for a wolf. This sort of things are easy to toss around and can be interpreted as a joke or a serious suspicion both. Having given lots of statements like that, you can then refer to them either as "I suspected him already here!" or "hey, but that was just a joke, why didn't you guys get it", whichever way the situation develops.
Yeah, I think that did it.
++ Nogrod
EDIT: x-ed with Shasta
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 05:15 PM
I've got yet another family commitment tonight that is going to keep me away from the comp for awhile.
I will be back later. I'm not sure if I can vote...I'd just assumed that I could because it doesn't say anything about it in the rules.
I do have another suggestion...I agree with Nogrod that the village will be in desperate trouble if we don't get a wolf toDay...basically that we will probably have lost.
I wonder if the Seer and Finrod should announce themselves and tell what they know. That would (hopefully) cut down on the number of people that we'd have to worry about voting for. We have more inncent votes now than we are going to have later...:(
I don't know if this is a good idea, though. I thought I'd throw it out there for discusion.
Be back in a bit.
Isabellkya
04-17-2009, 05:19 PM
Haha. Are you voting for Nog over smiley usage?
*runs before Kent arrives*
I'm glad I didn't mention that the two looked chummy. They've both defended each other, yet neither has posted a whole lot. Stands to reason that one could think they'd communicated in other ways..
X'd with Kuru.
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 05:27 PM
Oh yes...
And please don't forget to look at people beyond your favorite suspects...
Kent2010
04-17-2009, 05:33 PM
I don't know if this is a good idea, though. I thought I'd throw it out there for discusion.
-Kuru
It still might be pre-mature, and especially for Finrod. If Finrod reveals all they have to do is send that bat. Where if Finrod stays hidden there's and he does make a successful protection, there's a greater possibility (2 out of 3) he could take out one with him. Our only offensive weapon now besides the lynching is a successful protection by Finrod. He can't protect himself so the only real advantage would be to give Luthien an extra day, but we'd lose the chance of a Finrod successful protection/kill.
Luthien, it depends. There's been 3 dreams so far? If she knows 2-3 innocents (currently living) or a baddie plus an alive innocent...maybe. Also, if Luthien would reveal, theoretically she'd get another day (Finrod's protection). Oh well that should be left up to Luthien.
Nogrod
04-17-2009, 05:37 PM
Those with ten votes and whom I'd say are deliberately keeping their reserves full to possibly win the game in the end, possibly for the baddies (eg. includes a possible Grima as well) as they are wise enough to see the edge their votes might have.
Brinniel (10) - Still my top suspect. I think her (in)action in the end of Day2 betrays a baddie. I have written about it extensively enough thus far.
Formendacil (10) - My #3 or 4 of suspicions. He has been so cool and composed all the time and he has been a bit too nice to me. But I admit some of this getting him this high might be due to our differences in the philosophical approach of the game we have. Very much undecided right now with him but his full arsenal makes me afraid of him.
Greenie (10) - She has been much better toDay as she has been actually posting some thoughts on people and not only avoiding mentioning others but those she would vote for. On Day1 and 2 her demeanor just screamed wolf to me. She probably is my #2 still but I'm much less confident about her being a baddie I was like a few hours ago. Still wouldn't clear her as a goodie. Quite the contrary.
Other "tenners" - with whom I'm more at loss whether they have the bonus-votes full because it's a tactical decision or whether it's just that hey haven't found a place to use their votes yet as they haven't been around too much or have lost votings.
Gwath (10) - A questionmark. I'm not too sure he would have missed the vote yesterDay as a wolf and confessed being indecisive and losing it for that. He tends to garner a lot of suspicion and like oftentimes I'm tending to think undeservedly.
Lari (10) - Well, if she's a wolf/vampire and wins then I will just have to take it as "she didn't earn the victory". What could one say? Nothing. She has kept her votes...
Sally (10) - The problematic one... I would not be surprised she was a baddie but I wouldn't suggest her as the first lynch either. Her having the ten votes might as well be due to inattentivness than on plain decision with the mates.
Shasta (10) - I had nothing to say about him untill lately when he has defended Brinn. He might be one of the baddies but with the RL I'd say he's not my top choice anyway. But one to look after to be sure.
One thing to add. The baddies will talk together via PM's, all the time. So anything I say about someone "not possibly thinking to save her/his votes" in purpose might be jeopardised with the fact that her/his mates tell her/him to do so. So even the most inattentive player might have clear demands to not use her/his extra votes thus leading my possible redeeming judgements null and void.
The others...
Fea (6) - Not a likely baddie-candidate. Her weird extra-vote for me might be due to frustration. Her inattendance after that vote speaks for her not having a role and thus no interest in the game.
Izzy (8) - I actually suspected her a lot in the early stages but now she feels a lot better. Still if one of the wolves (or Grima) would have spent some of their bonus-votes I'd be worried about her the most. She seems to roll with the tide a bit too much (including when to suspect me or to trust me) and her giving up of votes might be interpreted as a tactical manouver. But not my top candidate in any way right now.
Kent (5) - Even if his early chivalry in regards to Greenie looked dubious I haven't very much bad to say of him. I see what people are saying with him being too defensive etc. But it's mainly his +5 vote for Kuru that bothers me a bit to be honest.
Nilp(7) - Mr. Oddball then. It's always hard to get anything reasonable out from him and this game is no different. His last vote was odd as well as it was well overdone. One or two votes might have done it but he gave Kuru four votes (and did not highlight them!). Keeps on repeating how he enjoys the game. I'd say more of an ordo than not but I'd not trust him either, at least yet.
That was not as much and as good I wished for but I hope it helps as one tally among others.
EDIT: X'd with a host... and Greenie...
Kent2010
04-17-2009, 05:58 PM
I don't like Sally's generic feelings of uneasiness about me. There's nothing to say to I 'feel like a rat.' I have to be doing something to make you uneasy, so how? There is always a describable reason to feel 'uneasy' so out with it already. And this is I don't get...
and while I don't want to kill him just to find out what he is I'm not going to complain if he ends up dead at the end of the Day, because I keep smelling a Kent....erm, rat.
If you suspect me than suspect me already. Don't beat around the bush 'well I don't want to kill him but it wouldn't bother me if he did die today.' You know the compliment sandwhich? One good thing, one bad, and back to a good? Well this is a roast sandwhich designed to put me on a spit and cook me over an open flame. You suspect me with broad vague feelings of uneasiness, all but say in a couple words you think I'm innocent, but then back to some generic suspicion.
If you have an issue with my approach to this game so far, than say it and I would think you are more innocent. But it's not that you say you wouldn't complain about my death at the end because I 'smell a rat.' To which I respond, we are after wolves and a bat, not a rat ;) and if you are trying to imply I'm Grima go search somewhere else.
I am working on a Formendacil analysis now. Am I the only one really searching for people, or are we just going to continue to go back and fourth about the bonus vote stuff? Because if that's the case I might as well stop trying now.
I would like people to tell me what they think regarding my comments about something Brinn said...here (Edit: my post 479, for some reason the hyperlink thingy isn't working for me). Do you see it? Is it a mountain out of a mole hill?
Shastanis Althreduin
04-17-2009, 06:01 PM
Second stage of my list. I added some to Gwath and Sally and added more people.
Brinniel (10) - I think her attitude says she's innocent (but then I always think she's innocent). Her vote for Sally does look to me a bit like a throwaway vote, but I just don't think a wolf-Brinn would be so easily irritable.
Fea (6) - I'm suspicious of her and will be until I get an explanation of yesterday's vote.
Gwath (10) - Seemed put out at the beginning of the day that Kuru was still alive. Also, #465 strikes me as a wolf trying to get instructions to a cobbler... does anyone else get that impression?
Regarding the bonus votes issue: the more innocents who save their bonus votes, the better - whoever has the most bonus votes towards the end of the game will win. Do NOT waste them now.
Now that I'm thinking along these lines, I wonder if Grima might be likely to try to force innocents to use their bonus votes early on by using some of his/her own.
Izzy (8) - I see some of the same things she does; notably the interesting interactions between Sally and Gwath. However, I'm not sure what to think about Izzy specifically.
Kuruharan (6) - obviously innocent.
Lari (10) - seems like she's playing very safe this time around. She's a possible baddie for me.
Nilp (7) - I like that he went to the trouble of an analysis on Firefoot, but... I just don't see that it accomplished a great deal. It made him look quite helpful, though, which doesn't sit right with me.
Nogrod (5) - The fact that all he's been saying today is "Let's focus on people who haven't used bonus votes yet" irks me a bit. Even though he says he's not, it's like he's discounting the possibility that there might be wolves that have used bonus votes already, which I don't think is a good idea at this point. That and I don't tend to like continuous harbingers of doom. :p I'm actually beginning to think, after rereading post #445 where he condemns Brinn, that he's just mad that she hasn't posted as much as he would like.
Sally (10) - In post 430, she states, "The thing was that I was pretty sure you weren't innocent". Freudian slip? Maybe she's Grima. Also, the way she adds Gwath's explanation of his non-vote to her own just seems weird to me. Also, her comment about Nienna being a "brilliant wolf". Seems odd to me; Nienna's only been in... one other game so far, I think, and Sally was the moderator. It just seems odd to me; I know I'd be more inclined to call someone a "brilliant wolf" if I'd actually played a game with them (especially since the baddies lost Sally's game). Also, I'm noticing that in #497, after Izzy calls her out on the list she made (immediately after, actually), Sally backs off of her suspicion of Izzy. Interesting...
Edit: X'ed with Kent and fixed a bold tag.
Nogrod
04-17-2009, 06:08 PM
Now does this look like you two have had conversations lately, like within a few hours, last Night, or something? You just reminded me of one thing that was bothering me about you but I always forgot to mention. The quote above is a classic example, but there have been a few other similar ones as well. That sort of seemingly-careless, half-serious little accusations seasoned with a rolleyes smiley. I can't see the purpose that would serve for an ordo, but I do see the benefit of retorts like that for a wolf. This sort of things are easy to toss around and can be interpreted as a joke or a serious suspicion both. Having given lots of statements like that, you can then refer to them either as "I suspected him already here!" or "hey, but that was just a joke, why didn't you guys get it", whichever way the situation develops.A classic example? Aren't you now stretching things to your favour? And you really can't see the purpose for an innocent to do that?
You should know better. And this makes me eat some of my words of not suspecting you so much anymore I said in my last post before seeing this.
Of course ordos gain from making things like that. You fish reactions, you look and see how people react to those. I thought Shasta's answer to that was a bit dubious and I already thought I might have a scent of a trace there but with you then...
Well if you are a baddie and wish to play as safe as possible then you probably won't see it. But we ordos need to get people into talking and reacting - and if they do not do it themselves and free-willing we need to force them to do it. Making that kind of statements is one way of doing it.
How have you tried to fish the wolves out from the lot yourself?
Isabellkya
04-17-2009, 06:35 PM
Sally:
I've not felt good about her since the first Day, when she suspected nienna only after Nog did. Which it really was a suspicion. It was like a definitive decision, "Okay, I see what you say, she is definitely evil!" Then followed it up with a vote for her. Nothing she has said since change the furry or fangy feelings. Quite the opposite, they make her look more baddie.
Gwath
As with Sally, I've not gelt good about him since his Nienna jumping and vote after nog's posted suspicions. His part/interaction with the Kuru/Kent deal yesterDay did nothing. Since it seemed he would've voted for Kuru more for him(Gwath) agreeing with Kent - rather than his saying he would've done it to save Nog. Though, I don't know if I would be ready to commit it to vote. because I feel he is connected to Sally in some way - yet I'm not certain they are both mates. AS it would be either super sloppy on both their parts if it were so. Or incredibly daring for some purpose, I can't yet imagine.
Nog
He seems his usual self. Though toDay he seems to be much more aggressive and jugular than in previous days As with yesterDay, I'd not vote for him toDay.
Nilp
He is helpful, or appears to be so. I don't find him overtly suspicious which would warrant a vote. He is playing a semi-private game. In that he seems to be conduction reactionary(?) experiments on some. I did not expect him to vote for Kuru yesterDay, mainly if I remember correctly - he said he didn't find him very suspicious. My only conclusion is that he was trying to save a Nogmate? I would like to know one thing, though I will wait until the game is over as to the validity and truth of it.
Fea
I am very curious as to her reasons of her vote for Nog yesterDay. I can only think that she did it because she is an Ordo and is bored, or she is the Cobbler and wanted to get people to use/waste their bonus votes - which some of us did.
Kent
I am for the most part comfortable with him, and have no reason to vote for him. My only qualm with him is the distraction his newbie discussion brought yesterDay. If you clear it out, it leavs almost something to be desired.
Brin, Lari & Green
All in the same boat for me. I can understand holding back the bonus votes for future use. Yet it almost seems like it is being used as an excuse, a shield to not delve into the game futher and commit to anything.
Shasta
He seems jumpy and I'm not liking his interactions with Brin. They have both defended each other when there really wasn't a need for it. Now, would mates do such a thing? I could see it, because the nature of the defending was not entirely related to suspicions voiced against them.
Form
I don't have a reason to vote or suspect him.
Nogrod
04-17-2009, 06:37 PM
I am working on a Formendacil analysis now. Good. I thought of doing it a few times but always found the time wanting... as it will take some time.
I do appreciate it as I'm very much at loss with Form anyway and would love to see someone else making an analysis of him & seeing some hard evidence gathered for viewing & comments made on that.
Am I the only one really searching for people, or are we just going to continue to go back and fourth about the bonus vote stuff?I don't know but it is like 3.20 AM here and I'm off to bed - and will hope to wake up in the morning to see the DL and vote. (and then go back to sleep to be sure as it's Saturday...)
I would like people to tell me what they think regarding my comments about something Brinn said...here (Edit: my post 479It probably is that Brinn refers to a game where tp and Boro basically sacrificed Aganzir to advert the wolves from picking the real seer at Night - or something like that; I don't remember it too well and I have no time to go back to search for the details of the incidence.
But the similarities between the two scenarios are scarce and thin indeed - and if Brinn actually suggested the similar thing would have happened here, it looks quite frivolous indeed. That was far from it!
I mean that was werewolf-history in the making when it happened. A perfect ploy to distract the wolves with a high risk two innocents trusting each other, and they managed to marshall it through. And surely Firefoot probably even doesn't know that kind of trick has been performed.
So Brinn was overstating that one.
But what does it mean? That's another question and one which I just can't stay awake trying to answer. :confused:
Feanor of the Peredhil
04-17-2009, 06:38 PM
Fea (6) - I'm suspicious of her and will be until I get an explanation of yesterday's vote.
I was bored and wanted to see what you all would do.
Tragically, you didn't lynch me, and instead you gave me like eight pages to have to read. Fail.
I'm being Nilp. Lynch me.
Also,
++Nog
He's been posting lots.
:Merisu:
Nogrod
04-17-2009, 06:51 PM
He's been posting lots. :Merisu:
Leading the scoreboard once again with a nice gap.
Oh, big time.
But we will lose if this continues like this.
See you before the DL (I hope I manage to wake up before that).
Kent2010
04-17-2009, 06:57 PM
Formendacil
Fair enough... I am mollified, I guess, insofar as I don't know you, so I can't distinguish between newbie covering (especially since, were that so, you could assisted by PMing with the other Wolves) and honesty--but at for know, I'm mollified. Though, I suppose, if you are a wolf, and you die, we should be looking for people who posted on this thread between those two posts to find someone who potentially might have been a PM partner.
Hmm... that might actually be an interesting gambit: lynching Kent to see if he's a wolf. It's tenuous grounds, to be sure, but that's sort of the prevailing atmosphere.
-post 239
What stands out about this is that I almost am painted into a no win situation. Were you jumping the gun Formendacil? Lynch me, and if I turn up a wolf check for any of my PM partners? You say you're mollified but conclude with the curious statement of test lynching me to see if I'm a wolf?
Hey, Nilp!
I haven't got any good voting plans? Want me to throw away my vote on you, since you can't autovote?
-post 254
Would you like to be test-lynched to figure out what we do with Nilp? :p
Speaking of Nilp, I feel like I should keep more of an eye on him this game. He has a tendency to slip under my radar because of his long-standing auto-vote, self-destruct, and-guess-what?-he's-an-ordo role, and long-standing prejudices are hard to shake... and Nilp has a long standing "good guy" prejudice in my mind. Not saying he's guilty (no evidence in the slightest to do so yet), but reminding myself to do so.
-post 305
Keeping the oppurtunity open to turn on a partner if needed?
To put it in other words, perhaps the wolves decided that, if Aganzir was converted to their side, and we woke up today with no one missing from our midst, she'd be the last one we'd look for as a converted new wolf, simply because she had been so conspicuous yesterday, and thus the sort of noisy person that wolves leave around to keep the heat off themselves.
I'm hardly wedded to this, but it's the best theory that offers something rather than just random confusion as the answer--at least to my mind.
-post 315
With the threat of Luthien still around are the wolves really looking to cause random confusion for their kills?
I am deeply amused that this little interjection of mine is getting so much attention. If it reads like "by the way, I don't see why everyone was suspicious of Nienna yesterday," that's because that is very much what I was saying... but in a slightly different tense. More along the lines of "by the way, I didn't see THEN why everyone was suspicious of Nienna." Granted, I may not be helping myself with this clarification... but you ARE more or less interpreting me right--not going to complain about that.
-post 330
This is Form's response to his statement regarding Nienna, and taking the moral highground as Nogrod mentioned...I wonder if I should analyze why you all capped 'ARE' pretty much saying my interpretation of it was correct?
And that's all I've looked at today... I sort of defended Kuru as not being a cobbler, but that doesn't mean he's not a wolf.
-post 333
This looks like a sneaky attempt to offer Kuru up as a possible lynching. I think Form's had that consistant tone regarding Kuru throughout the game, in some ways poking suspicion (albeit using a 40 and a half foot poll so he can keep his distance from a messy situation), but at the same time explaining why he wouldn't vote for Kuru.
Yes. What's up with those votes, Fea dear? I was going to say something when I cross-posted, but I had to be moving quickly... and I'd hoped you'd explicate with a string of one-liner posts. Or something. But this is right out of the blue! The Kuru-suspicion not so much... but the bonus votes? Typically impulsive, maybe... or cobblery-deviant? I don't know...
-post 342
Trying to get suspicion rolling against Fea?
Albeit, I have a few misgivings because it's a tenuous feeling at best, but she's as far up my suspicion list as anyone is, and if it spurs Nog's one-man-bandwaggon in that direction rather than Fea's or Kuru's--well, that sits closest to my intuitions this evening.
-post 377
I think this is my biggest issue with Formendacil, how uncommitting he's been throughout (in this post he votes for Greenie), but it's been more than uncommitting. In Day 1, he sneakily shifted suspicion towards Nienna:
And, in other news, I'm still no closer to a vote. Well, maybe an inch or two. I'm concerned that Nienna's vote for Nogrod was made with the encouragement that I might vote in that direction.
-back tracking to post 248
And he did the same to the day 2 lynch - Kuru the next day, shifting suspicion towards him, but spending most of his time defending Kuru because of his defense of Kuru for Day 1. The problem is when push comes to shove, Formendacil goes in an opposite direction and makes a safe play. On Day 1 he casts a random vote for Nilp and Day 2, he votes for probably the person he thought was most suspicious (or said he was most suspicious of) however it's a safe play.
What's more striking about his vote for Greenie is there are no bonus votes with it. Well maybe he just wasn't confident? The thing is before he told Nogrod that he would go 'contra-Kentian' (great word by the way :D) and prefer that Nogrod vote for Greenie. However, he really forces Nogrod into a tough choice, by choosing not to give Greenie any bonus votes. Nogrod new I wasn't going to vote for Greenie (and Formendacil knew I wouldn't either) so if Nogrod did want Greenie as an option (either to save himself or for another candidate) Nogrod would have to dump a lot of his bonus votes, while Formendacil would not.
The last thing is after his vote for Greenie, Formendacil does stick around and play a distant role at the same time chiming in about Kuru and me (post 380).
Isabellkya
04-17-2009, 07:00 PM
Are you perhaps being a bit over dramatic here Nog?
Vote Tally (unless I missed one somewhere?):
Kent -> Brin(1). 2
Sally -> Kent. 1
Green -> Nog. 1
Fea -> Nog. 2
Nog, Brin 2. Kent 1.
Nogrod
04-17-2009, 07:10 PM
What's more striking about his vote for Greenie is there are no bonus votes with it. Well maybe he just wasn't confident? The thing is before he told Nogrod that he would go 'contra-Kentian' (great word by the way :D) and prefer that Nogrod vote for Greenie. However, he really forces Nogrod into a tough choice, by choosing not to give Greenie any bonus votes. Nogrod new I wasn't going to vote for Greenie (and Formendacil knew I wouldn't either) so if Nogrod did want Greenie as an option (either to save himself or for another candidate) Nogrod would have to dump a lot of his bonus votes, while Formendacil would not.A good and an accurate description Kent! Appreciated! Even if it sounded familiar I hadn't quite grasped Form's role in it until now as you show it.
Now a good night for a few hours!
Isabellkya
04-17-2009, 07:12 PM
Why wouldn't the three want to cause confusion with their kills Kent? It distracts the village if the kills don't point in a clear direction.
Which begs the thought.
Perhaps part of the three's decision making process. They are going after people who are A) most Ordo looking, B) either going to be dreamed really early or not at all and C) aren't super suspects.
Because what more perfect set-up for the three, than to turn someone who has already been dreamed of by the Seer?
X'd with Nog.
Nogrod
04-17-2009, 07:16 PM
Are you perhaps being a bit over dramatic here Nog?Oh, I had forgotten that first vote by Kent...
But still I think you have the tally wrong.
Isn't it like this?
Kent -> Brin(1). 2
Sally -> Kent. 1
Green -> Nog. 1
Fea -> Nog. 2
Nog2, Brinn2. Kent1.
Shastanis Althreduin
04-17-2009, 07:30 PM
Nog, Brinn 2. Kent 1.
That's what the comma after "Nog" is for, Nog. "Nog and Brinn, two votes. Kent, one vote."
Edit: Fixed quote tag.
Isabellkya
04-17-2009, 07:36 PM
Ah haha.
I suppose the comma does make it confusing.
Though I thought I'd put an & in there.
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 07:51 PM
It still might be pre-mature, and especially for Finrod. If Finrod reveals all they have to do is send that bat. Where if Finrod stays hidden there's and he does make a successful protection, there's a greater possibility (2 out of 3) he could take out one with him. Our only offensive weapon now besides the lynching is a successful protection by Finrod. He can't protect himself so the only real advantage would be to give Luthien an extra day, but we'd lose the chance of a Finrod successful protection/kill.
Luthien, it depends. There's been 3 dreams so far? If she knows 2-3 innocents (currently living) or a baddie plus an alive innocent...maybe. Also, if Luthien would reveal, theoretically she'd get another day (Finrod's protection). Oh well that should be left up to Luthien.
I'm back and will get started with some serious reading now.
I did want to say that I agree with Kent's analysis at least as far as Finrod goes.
I'm still not sure about the Seer. I think if the Seer does know the identity of a wolf we kinda need that at this juncture...however, I have a feeling the Seer doesn't.
Shastanis Althreduin
04-17-2009, 07:57 PM
The last two people on my list:
Greenie: I'm prejudiced about her today due to the fact that I see where she's coming from re: Nog. I don't feel comfortable saying anything about her due to that, other than that I suspected her yesterday. (Which reminds me, I need to answer her question).
Kent: Smart cookie. Other than that, no real read. The only interesting thing I'd noted was all the talk about his newbie status and see where that got Kuru?
Brinniel
04-17-2009, 08:17 PM
Pfft...two pages while I'm gone? Well, I'm just gonna comment on quotes as I go instead of reading everything first so I don't forget anything.
Well, if you really suspected Sally and Firefoot - and you were an ordo seeing nothing particularly good/bad in me and Kuru - wouldn't you have wished to persuade some others to see your point?
I didn't think I would need to do any serious persuading. Around the time I intended to make my vote I saw there were others concerned about Sally and Firefoot too. I thought they might vote in the same direction.
Also, if you were a goodie you would have wanted to negotiate the lynch with the others. Why do you try to imply to us (in your earlier post toDay) you were having really a tough time deciding between Firefoot and Sally like it was something important (which it wasn't because you left your vote to the last possible instant so that no one could react to your vote) as meanwhile you don't give a damn to who gets lynched by not trying to influence the vote / negotiate it with others still to vote?
There was twenty minutes left. I'm a slow poster. There was no time for negotiations. It was a big rush at the end and everyone just did their own thing rather than work together.
I'm not sure why you're making such a big deal out of it that I mentioned I had trouble deciding between Sally and Firefoot. The reason I mentioned it was because I was complaining about all the last minute voting, which is hypocritical since I did it too. And I admit that was an error on my part and I wish I had voted earlier. I'll do my best to avoid letting it happen again.
Your idea of calling me the safe-voter or someone shying away from decisive voting is ridiculous even if you didn't notice that error of Nilp not highlighting his vote. Why would I waste four bonus votes for nothing when I'm about to be lynched? Really. At .59 I was still leading the tally. You think someone would love to be indecisive at that kind of minute?
Okay, I do accept that explanation. Nilp's vote was highlighted by the time you and I posted so I thought you already knew it counted when you made your vote.
I just tried to awaken people to the problem we have in our hands. If you think my theory is bad you should argue for a better one and not blame me for trying. The moment you come up with a better working plan I will abandon mine and change to yours.
I already do have my own plan: We shouldn't use our bonus votes frivolously but only when we feel confident that our suspect is evil. Because you are right; the baddies are dangerous with all those extra votes...but they'll be even more dangerous with all those extra votes if most of the innocents have few.
So we need to create an athmosphere where anyone having ten bonus-votes left feels s/he is going to be lynched because of it - or which would be better: we should force the baddies to defend their mate(s) with their bonus-votes, if we just got a good enough threat to them.
I already mentioned this but if you pressure everyone including innocents to use their bonus votes when they don't want to, it'll only increase the chances of a mislynch because they'll vote for someone they may not strongly suspect and later in the game when they are confident of their suspects, there will be little to no bonus votes left to use. And anyway, do you really think the baddies will definitely use their bonus votes to save their mates? Take a look at past games...there are plenty of players here who would be happy to sacrifice their mate to make themselves look good. I wouldn't be surprised if a wolf used some of their bonus votes against a mate...because who would suspect that?
The 2nd scenario is just odd, because how would Firefoot know Agan was not the seer, believe Agan was an ordo, and decide to set her up as the seer for the wolves to go after that night - if Firefoot was not the seer herself?
I know the second scenario does seem a bit absurd and I didn't think it was likely, but the exact thing has occurred in past games where an ordo sets up another ordo to be killed...so I didn't want to eliminate the possibility.
That person whether wolf or innocent will most likely use their bonus to save themselves, which is I think the bigger point, to start levelling out the field.
Yes, if that person is there to save/defend themselves. But not everyone sticks around until deadline and may not expect to be lynched.
Cool down Brinn, this is only a game. And you know I love you: this is pretty straightforwards, no sarcasm or smilies included.
Yes, I know that. I'm only angry with you for in-game reasons, not RL. So no worries. :)
Now this is interesting. If you would manage to bag a wolf - what good would that be?
*Ponders about it: what good would there be of lynching a wolf toDay? Hard to see... what good would there be?
I didn't say there wasn't good in bagging a wolf, but that it's no good to use all my votes on one person, even if they are a wolf. Why? Because:
a) Even if I put a wolf strongly in the lead with 11 votes, it doesn't mean they'll get lynched. There may be several others that will do everything they can to save that person thinking they are innocent (or perhaps if they are a wolf saving their mate).
b) Even if that wolf gets lynched, will it necessarily be just because of me? Because maybe that person can get lynched without all those bonus votes if others suspect them enough. And yes, I may have used all my bonus votes on a wolf...but there are three baddies here, and four if you count the cobbler. So what if I need some of those bonus votes to help bag another wolf later? Well that's just too bad because there won't be any left.
The baddies will probably kill those innocents with the most votes left by Nights (see Firefoot with ten votes). Also they would like to keep their votes to themselves if they need not use them - and they, unlike us - know when they need to use them. And remember that Thuringwethil may suck ten votes from an innocent the Night before the baddies decide to make their final attack if there is one. Then they will have 40-50 votes to spend on one Day which we innocents can never stand up against.
Now if the baddies killed all the innocents with 10 bonus votes then kept all their votes to themselves, then they'd be making themselves pretty obvious targets, don't you think? :rolleyes:
Just think there are three romantic heroes around with ten votes. One gets killed by Thurnigwethil and her/his ten extra votes are in the possession of the baddies the next Day. Then the two remaining ten-voters disagree with each other who's the wolf and vote different people.
Why do you keep going under the assumption that all the baddies will save their votes until the end? That's a really bad assumption to make..
But you should actually convince us - well me at least - why what I said about your actions in the end of Day2 are not true to begin with. Getting angry or hurt is one way of trying to do it but I have seen such shows that this is not quite enough (remember Rikae back then really bringing all of us others to tears with her show - but many enough of us stood firm and lynched her, as the baddie she turned out to be).
Do you really think I'm trying to use my emotions as a way to convince you of somthing? I certainly hope not, because I don't do that. I'm a naturally sensitive person and when I get upset by something my emotions do tend to flood out and I honestly can't help it. But I'm doing my best to explain my actions with words; I'm not sure what else to say since you don't seem to believe any of my explanations. I voted for someone I found suspicious, but apparently that's not good enough.
I'm leaning towards Brinn being innocent right now, and would rather not see her go. She definitely has the air of an ordo who's irritated at being constantly suspected by the same person. Sidenote - has anyone else noticed that every time someone gets irritated with having to defend themselves, Nogrod brings up Rikae as an excuse to attack them anyway? I think it's happened, like... every game I've ever played with him in it.
Yeah, it is irritating to feel personally attacked. I'm not saying Nogrod isn't allowed to suspect or attack me at all, but I think sometimes players will cling onto something against someone and not bat an eyelash at anything they say in defense. Rune has done this with me and I think that's what Kent did to Kuru yesterDay. It doesn't necessarily mean that these people are guilty, but I feel it's a bit close minded.
And I also agree with you on the second part. Rikae's her own person and has her own tactics. Just because she has used emotions as an act before doesn't mean everyone else will do the same. And anyway, was she just acting in that game? I think Rikae has been genuinely irritated before, regardless of her role.
I'm a bit concerned with Gwath's multitude of posts. Why not organize into one epic one?
That's just Gwath's typical style of posting. He does this every game. I'm surprised you haven't noticed it before.
I think I may get what is not being said by that Shasta. Just because someone may get irritated or frustrated with defending themselves; doesn't mean it makes you innocent. Perhaps he is using Rikae as an example of putting on a good show in defense of herself to get off the lynch block?
That your acting skills should not be the ultimate decider in clearing yourself, when you are suspected.
No, open frustration does not necessarily make one innocent. But it also doesn't mean someone is just acting. I really think emotions have nothing to do with roles because both innocents and baddies can get equally frustrated so I don't think we should judge whether someone is innocent or guilty based off their emotions.
He seems jumpy and I'm not liking his interactions with Brin. They have both defended each other when there really wasn't a need for it.
When have I defended Shasta?
But the similarities between the two scenarios are scarce and thin indeed - and if Brinn actually suggested the similar thing would have happened here, it looks quite frivolous indeed. That was far from it!
I mean that was werewolf-history in the making when it happened. A perfect ploy to distract the wolves with a high risk two innocents trusting each other, and they managed to marshall it through. And surely Firefoot probably even doesn't know that kind of trick has been performed.
So Brinn was overstating that one.
I wasn't overstating anything. I opened it up as a possibility, but I never said it was a likely scenario.
---
Okay, I'm all caught up. Now onto my suspects.
Nogrod: For his aggression, pessimism, and tactics. I really don't like how he's going about voting and while it is important to get a baddie toDay, I feel like he's acting a bit melodramatic about our situation. I don't suspect Nogrod for attacking me, but more like how he's going about it. He's been twisting my words which gives me another reason to feel uncomfortable.
Kent: There's something about him that irks me. Is it just me or has he been following around Nogrod a lot? He just seems rather quick to trust him. I easily suspect someone who makes an effort to keep on an influential player's good side. Though I rather doubt both of them would be wolves...that'd be a bit too obvious.
Sally I'm still a bit uneasy about, though I do need to look at her again.
I'm becoming quite uncomfortable of Fea who keeps voting out of nowhere without explanation. This isn't Sally's game, so surely she can't have a posting requirement.
Other players I'd like to keep an eye on are Formy, Izzy, and Nilp.
Isabellkya
04-17-2009, 08:49 PM
You defended Shasta in post #370 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=593240&postcount=370). In response to Kuru's troubled thoughts over Shasta's vote and explanation.
Isabellkya
04-17-2009, 08:56 PM
Whups, hit the wrong button.
I was talking about Gwath's near close to more than triple posting.
Why would you be keeping an eye on Form, Nilp and myself?
Shastanis Althreduin
04-17-2009, 09:02 PM
Alright, I'm going to bed. Both my two top suspects seem to be suspected equally by others, so I'm going to
++Gwathagor
because that one post I found just looks too much like a wolf trying to get a message to the cobbler.
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 09:19 PM
I'm very perplexed about Fea's behavior.
At this point just acting randomly and trying to be lynched isn't really doing the village a whole lot of good. I mean, honestly what is the point of laying out bait like that now? Mainly because at this point who is going to be left to interpret it?
Is she the cobbler, perhaps?
Feanor of the Peredhil
04-17-2009, 09:29 PM
I'm very perplexed about Fea's behavior.
It's not that hard, sweetheart: I'm taking advantage of an opportunity to be scandalous. I've been deprived...
Consequently, my scandal of choice is flippant and unhelpful, as opposed to flirtatious and unhelpful, with unhelpful being a given due to the ordinariness of my role. I don't know anything, and I'm not ambitious enough to pretend that I do. Consequently, I am enjoying, as I said, scandalous behavior.
I'll do it in fishnets and stilettos if you prefer...
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 09:33 PM
Sally (10) - In post 430, she states, "The thing was that I was pretty sure you weren't innocent". Freudian slip? Maybe she's Grima. Also, the way she adds Gwath's explanation of his non-vote to her own just seems weird to me. Also, her comment about Nienna being a "brilliant wolf". Seems odd to me; Nienna's only been in... one other game so far, I think, and Sally was the moderator. It just seems odd to me; I know I'd be more inclined to call someone a "brilliant wolf" if I'd actually played a game with them (especially since the baddies lost Sally's game).
'Brilliant' does seem like a bit of an exaggeration.
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 09:37 PM
I'm suddenly remembering now a part of the reason why I quit playing this game. :rolleyes:
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 09:38 PM
because that one post I found just looks too much like a wolf trying to get a message to the cobbler.
The resemblance is coincidental and unfortunate.
Nilpaurion Felagund
04-17-2009, 09:43 PM
A light perusal of the thread yields:
Oh, and a little addition: I still don't think the post count a relevant source of information concerning the amount of participation. There are people who like to post the thing they want to say in shorter sections and those who put it all in one post. Also, I don't think the amount of posts (unless outrageously small) necessarily correlates with the amount of actual substance the player provides.Which is why Gwath and Izzy are in my list. Gwath's playstyle is primarily replying to posts (which provides me with nothing to analyse about him), and Izzy, who, well, I just can't read.
Must mean she is an Oracle of something.
Shush. You're not playing.
(In any case, I, above all else, understand how RL interferes with WWing--just look at my bloody developing-country location, for instance--I can tell you a story of how morm worried about Lhuna and I somehow being caught in the middle of a freaking coup d'etat! But, as I've pointed out, even though one didn't start playing with that strategy in mind, it is quite easy to use to one's advantage. Do you see my point?)
I have a problem with this, if the wolves believed Firefoot was the seer, and that's why she was killed, I would not just look at who she attacked (mostly Nogrod yesterday) but who she defended might be just as important. If she defended someone pretty strongly, that could also be a tip off to the wolves, making them believe Firefoot was the seer.Excellent point, although the probability of an ordo defending an innocent is higher than the probability of an ordo suspecting/accusing a baddie.
And as I'm inclined to think Nogrod innocent, I don't really subscribe to that comment of mine--however, considering that I'm analysing Firefoot's post from a seer-hunter's Anschauung, I had to point it out.
[Nilp] is playing a semi-private game. In that he seems to be conduction reactionary(?) experiments on some.I love you, Isabellkya. :D
Yes, I'm playing that sort--still enjoying newfound ability to post more and all; but only a few seems to be reacting. :(
Fea's 541 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=593577&postcount=541) reads Cobbler to me, at the very least.
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 09:53 PM
I'm very reluctant to vote for Fea even though she now positively reeks with suspicion...because I'm afraid that her death won't tell us much of anything unless she's a wolf. She has, in the main, had so little interaction with the other players that if she is innocent, killing her would probably be a dead end leading nowhere.
At least with lynching Brinn, or Gwath, or Izzy (to name a few) there is a trail to follow regardless of the result of the lynching.
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 10:04 PM
The problem I'm having is that there really is no way to know without trying the ideas out. The problem is that we are so backed up against the wall right now that we have really run out of time to test anything. I think if we could find a wolf a lot of pieces would fall together very quickly. But right now it is just a crap shoot about whether you guess right on which theory to act on.
I feel pretty confident at this point that some wolves have been examined...its just picking out which ones I must admit myself to be at a bit of a loss to decide.
Overabundance of targets.
Isabellkya
04-17-2009, 10:04 PM
Shasta - So then what is your take on Gwath's later post about Fea being a Cobbler, or an innocent who thinks she found a wolf? in regards to her voting of Nog yesterDay.
Would that not suggest that if Gwath is a wolf/Vampire, then Fea is the Cobbler?
Yes well, it became semi when you revealed about the Kent experiment.
X'd with Kuru x2.
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 10:15 PM
Fea - intrigues me. She looked like a cobbler to me yesterDay and earlier toDay, but her recent explanation for her behavior/style seems like it could be legitimate. Unfortunately, I don't like her style; or, at least, I don't like playing against it because it seems intended to bewilder everyone equally and so I never know what to make of her. She could be anything. However, I am leaning towards cobbler. I think her 4 or 5 votes for Nogrod yesterDay could very plausibly have been an attempt (and if so, a successful attempt) to draw other players into expending their bonus votes, which helps nobody but the wolves, especially if the wolves are saving their votes, as some have argued.
Nogrod - I don't like his big long case against Brinn at all. I felt like he was too convinced, too attached to the idea that Brinn is a wolf to view the situation with clarity and detachment. I don't mean to denigrate certainty, but one person's extreme certainty will only occasionally convince me when it is supported primarily by speculation. All that to say: I am wary of his certainty, but uncertain about his role.
Also, if Fea was the cobbler, as I have suggested, then it doesn't seem likely that Nogrod could be a wolf. One or the other.
Sally - 'Shifty' is the word I would use to describe Sally as she has appeared in this game. She has said very little, and when she does talk, it's almost always evasive, vacillating, and non-comittal. Sally looks pretty bad to me.
EDIT: Crossed with Kuru, Kuru, and Izzy.
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 10:17 PM
Sally - 'Shifty' is the word I would use to describe Sally as she has appeared in this game. She has said very little, and when she does talk, it's almost always evasive, vacillating, and non-comittal. Sally looks pretty bad to me.
One point I'd like to reiterate from yesterDay's voting (if for no other reason than it may be important later...I don't think it likely that both Sally and Brinn are wolves since Brinn just sort of up and voted for Sally.
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 10:20 PM
Nogrod [...] All that to say: I am wary of his certainty, but uncertain about his role.
Unless....:confused:
It occurs to me that there ARE circumstances in which an innocent player could be thoroughly certain of another player's role...dang, now I'm having to rethink this.
Isabellkya
04-17-2009, 10:22 PM
As Brin stated before , she had seen a few others voice their concerns over Sally (as well as Firefoot). So if they were mates, and she was worried Sally would be lynched. Would she not add in a vote there, to try and make herself look good?
X'd with Gwath.
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 10:25 PM
As Brin stated before , she had seen a few others voice their concerns over Sally (as well as Firefoot). So if they were mates, and she was worried Sally would be lynched. Would she not add in a vote there, to try and make herself look good?
X'd with Gwath.
Possibly...although I'm not sure at that moment it would have been prudent to potentially put Sally out on a limb again.
Unless of course Brinn didn't think at the time she would have been.
D'oh...just when I was about to vote Gwath I'm back to wanting to test the Brinn theory more.
Going to have to make up my mind soon, though.
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 10:25 PM
Seems plausible.
EDIT: Ah, crossed with Kuru. Meant this in response to Izzy.
satansaloser2005
04-17-2009, 10:27 PM
Okay I'm here and trying to catch up. Just happened to notice this and went :eek:
Sally (10) - In post 430, she states, "The thing was that I was pretty sure you weren't innocent". Freudian slip? Maybe she's Grima. Also, the way she adds Gwath's explanation of his non-vote to her own just seems weird to me.
Did I really say that? I could have sworn I typed were innocent. Of course, I was also saying (at least I think it was the same post) that I was talking about him being gifted so it's possible that's what was going through my head and, as usual, I'm just horrible at expressing myself.
Back to business then. I noticed the comments regarding Fea's potential cobblerism and they interest me. The problem is that, again, we're talking about the cobbler and not the wolves. Not that we shouldn't get Grima but if we don't get wolves before too long we could be in big trouble, especially with the bonus votes complicating things. I'm just sayin'.
In regards to the considerations of me and Brinn being packmates, I'd just like to point out that I know for a fact (from previous games) that Brinn will throw her packmates under the bus. She may be planning to do it this game too, but it's not with me, I can promise you that.
Nilpaurion Felagund
04-17-2009, 10:31 PM
Blast. Less than an hour to go. Must do this in segments of four or so:
Feanor of the Peredhil (6)
All senses scream 'Wormtongue!', what with voting and certain posts and all. Will not vote for her, however, unless no better opportunity is presented.
Formendacil (10)
Should be added to my quiet list. Posts a lot, but it's some banter, some more banter, a little analysis, and not much else. Does present certain useful ideas, however--like that NIGHT kill theory. I remain wary of the motivations of said ideas, though.
Kuruharan (6)
Beren. Suspect at your own risk.
Nilpaurion Felagund (7)
Playing a private game. Loves this game. Will not declare himself a proven innocent even in his own list. Analyse me, indulge my narcissistic fancy!
Nogrod (5)
His earnestness to save this village shows. Hence, inclined to think him innocent. (I've been scrutinising his plan, and the only possibility of evil comes from him being the Cobbler and enticing the village to waste bonus votes for the next DAY's slaughter. But other indicators of innocence or guilt, like voting and other posts, say otherwise.)
Formendacil
04-17-2009, 10:32 PM
Oh dear...
Did you all HAVE to post that much? First time I say I'm going away is when all the posting starts. I guess I should go away more often, then.:p
Fea, Nogrod, and Kent are all not wolves. Might be a passel of cobblers, for all I know, but they are not wolves.
Personally, I inclined to think the Brinn and Gwath dyad mentioned earlier has merit to it. Brinn is always a hard read...
Nilpaurion Felagund
04-17-2009, 10:33 PM
Did I really say that? I could have sworn I typed were innocent. Of course, I was also saying (at least I think it was the same post) that I was talking about him being gifted so it's possible that's what was going through my head and, as usual, I'm just horrible at expressing myself.I already pointed that out, Sally dear. I included links in my analyses for a reason, see. It's for people to go see what's been actually said. ;) :p
satansaloser2005
04-17-2009, 10:34 PM
I already pointed that out, Sally dear. I included links in my analyses for a reason, see. It's for people to go see what's been actually said. ;) :p
Ah. Thanks, I lost my spot when I replied and must have missed your post. Appreciate it, dear.
Back in a few minutes! :D
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 10:36 PM
That's just Gwath's typical style of posting. He does this every game. I'm surprised you haven't noticed it before.
As you know all too well, after last game.
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 10:39 PM
Brinn
Gwath
Shasta
Izzy
At least one of those four has got to be a wolf...
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 10:39 PM
Ok, I've made up my mind. I came very close to giving Nogrod the benefit of the doubt, but after reading Brinn's big long post #552, I'm leaning innocent for the present. So:
++Sally
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 10:40 PM
Brinn
Gwath
Shasta
Izzy
At least one of those four has got to be a wolf...
Whaaat? Why am I on that list?
Formendacil
04-17-2009, 10:40 PM
++ Brinniel (+3)
Very sorry, Brinn, but lacking prescience, and stealing too much time from my family (back home and I've yet to do anything other than get onto the Downs and talk half-heartedly to my brother about his Lego men.
Lariren Shadow
04-17-2009, 10:41 PM
Known definite innocent:
Kuru
Leaning towards innocent:
Form: He seems to be making sense and has been making good points. His posts don’t seem like he’s hiding anything or trying to hard.
Greenie: Contrary to what others think she seems innocent to me. She just seems to be having little time and only wants to post when she has something to say. Nothing she says is giving off warning vibes to me.
Izzy: She seems more innocent every time I look at her.
Sally: I think she’s innocent. Not sure, but she seems like it in her posts.
Betwixt between:
Fea: I haven’t heard a lot from her, again with the problems, but she seems to not be saying anything that makes her seem guilty to me. I usually can’t get a good read on her and always suspect her, but here she is seeming more innocent than not.
Nilp: I read half of his post and he seems to have really good ideas and I go “yay!” and the other half I read and say “BUT HE’S A WOLF”. It’s just a feeling I get. And I just don’t like the idea of a lot of the vocal people saying a wolf/vamp is one of the quiet ones, seems like a good way to throw off suspicion.
Brinn: I’m thinking she’s more innocent but she could be hiding something through all of her defense. She seems to be innocent to me one minute and then guilty the next. I just don’t know how to feel about her.
Gwath: I have really no read on him at all.
Probably guilty:
Kent: I don’t like the vibes I’m getting from his posts. They seem like they are defensive and its just rubbing me the wrong way.
Nog: His posts seem the same way to me like Kent’s. They are also telling the village what to do about a lot of things, and to me this seems like a wolf playing boldly. Maybe he really does want the village to use all our bonus votes before the vampire can suck them but, well, it just seems wrong at time.
Shasta: His posts are giving me bad vibes all around.
With all this being said and I need to vote I feel like I should be using some of my bonus votes toDay:
++Nog(3)
Now, I've had far too much to drink and I'm glad I made that list earlier then rushed around all day.
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 10:41 PM
Whaaat? Why am I on that list?
Consider yourself special. :)
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 10:42 PM
Consider yourself special. :)
My mother always said so.
Formendacil
04-17-2009, 10:43 PM
++Nog(3)
Now, I've had far too much to drink and I'm glad I made that list earlier then rushed around all day.
Hey! So I'm not the only one imbibing this week.:D
But really, Kuru, the drink is addling your brains. Please don't vote for my non-wolf, hopeful innocent there. *beseeching smiley*
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 10:45 PM
My mother always said so.
And your mother doesn't lie.
I believe that I have made up my mind for the Day.
++ Brinniel (6)
Hope I'm right about this but if I'm not at least we have had lots of talking toDay to work on for later in what will probably be the last stand Day for the Village. All in the interests of science and theory testing!!!
At least we (well, I guess "you" now, alas) will know more.
Remember, this is for Science!
Brinniel
04-17-2009, 10:45 PM
You defended Shasta in post #370. In response to Kuru's troubled thoughts over Shasta's vote and explanation.
Ah, okay. I had forgotten about that.
As you know all too well, after last game.
Hehe, indeed. But it was fun. :D
Gah, so I was planning to vote earlier then I quickly realised I'd probably have to vote to save myself. So much for that. :rolleyes:
Isabellkya
04-17-2009, 10:46 PM
Kent -> Brin(1). 2
Sally -> Kent
Green -> Nog
Fea -> Nog. 2
Shasta -> Gwath
Gwath -> Sally
Form -> Brin(3). 6
Lari -> Nog(3). 6
Kuru -> Brin(6). 13
Brin 13. Nog 6. Kent, Gwath & Sally 1.
X'd since Kuru's #585. Added his vote.
Formendacil
04-17-2009, 10:47 PM
Hey! So I'm not the only one imbibing this week.:D
But really, Kuru, the drink is addling your brains. Please don't vote for my non-wolf, hopeful innocent there. *beseeching smiley*
*shakes head*
I haven't had anything to drink since yesterday, and I'm still fuzzy.
Somehow I conflated Lari and Kuru--the latter of whom, btw, I thank for agreeing with me.
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 10:48 PM
*shakes head*
I haven't had anything to drink since yesterday, and I'm still fuzzy.
Somehow I conflated Lari and Kuru--the latter of whom, btw, I thank for agreeing with me.
Think nothing of it.
By the way, if this all does turn out to be a huge fiasco at least we will all have something to look back on and laugh. ;)
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 10:49 PM
Hehe, indeed. But it was fun. :D
That's what she sa - wait, that was last game too.
Formendacil
04-17-2009, 10:49 PM
Think nothing of it.
By the way, if this all does turn out to be a huge fiasco at least we will all have something to look back on and laugh. ;)
Hopefully to the tune of victory, you and me.:smokin:
I want a smoke.:p
Kent2010
04-17-2009, 10:50 PM
Brinn
Gwath
Shasta
Izzy
At least one of those four has got to be a wolf...
-Kuru
When I came back I was considering retracting Brinn and voting Formendacil, but with his recent posts that will not happen.
I will stick with my Brinn vote, and if she turns up wolf, don't let Lariren slip unnoticed:
Brinn: I’m thinking she’s more innocent but she could be hiding something through all of her defense. She seems to be innocent to me one minute and then guilty the next. I just don’t know how to feel about her.
Brinn's defense leaves Lari going back and forth between innocent and guilty...hmm. But my defensive mode makes her feel very uneasy?
Kent: I don’t like the vibes I’m getting from his posts. They seem like they are defensive and its just rubbing me the wrong way.
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 10:50 PM
Hopefully to the tune of victory, you and me.:smokin:
I want a smoke.:p
We may be smoked. ;)
Formendacil
04-17-2009, 10:51 PM
We may be smoked. ;)
Happens a lot, to we the smoking hot.:cool:
Nilpaurion Felagund
04-17-2009, 10:51 PM
Sally the Mad (10)
Now I know how people feel about playing with me--except I don't banter as much as she does. (Or so I would like to think.) Her general slippery feel and somehow being noncommittal to the DAY's proceedings makes me think he evil. Her aforementioned 'slips' doesn't help.
Isabellkya :) (8)
Yes, she does post, but seems to be fated to go under the radar. (Sorry. :( )
Prolly cos she's not an attention-hog unlike some people I know.
Go away, Adam. Anyway, she has posted helpful analyses and contributes well to the DAY's discussion. Therefore inclined to think her innocent.
(And yes, that smile shall now be standard after her name.)
Kent2010 (5)
Am still suspicious of him. Defensive behaviour combined with certain interactions I found suspicious. (I must admit, though, that with Kuru and Firefoot exonerated half of my material against him has been rendered useless . . . ) He's being rather silent toDAY--perhaps his fellows told him to tone down after yesterDAY's close call. ;)
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 10:53 PM
Well, this will have to be my final serious word of the Day as the powers that sent me here are now demanding my return from the task for which I was sent back into the pub.
The powers that be are apparently bored and need to be entertained. ;)
If Brinn isn’t a wolf, please everyone look carefully at Gwath, Sally, Izzy and Shasta. We do now have lots of stuff to go by. Do also have an eye for Lari.
If we didn’t get a wolf the Seer and Finrod also probably need to come out Tomorrow to assemble as many innocent votes in one place as possible.
Good Luck Village!
(btw, I’ve slipped up to .92 posts a day…whodathunkit)
Kent2010
04-17-2009, 10:54 PM
He's being rather silent toDAY--perhaps his fellows told him to tone down after yesterDAY's close call.
-Nilp
Really? I've been silent today? Really? (now Nogrod might have to ban me from using really :rolleyes:)
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 10:55 PM
If Brinn isn’t a wolf, please everyone look carefully at Gwath, Sally, Izzy and Shasta.
And Nogrod, Brinn's chief attacker.
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 10:55 PM
Actually...if Brinn is a wolf...still have a serious look at those guys...
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 10:56 PM
And Nogrod, Brinn's chief attacker.
Yeah, that is a good point.
Nilpaurion Felagund
04-17-2009, 10:57 PM
I don't have time to analyse the rest. >.<
But I'm glad I have someone I suspect on the chopping block.
++Brinniel (+4)
Just to make sure she won't be using her bonus votes to kill Nogrod.
Borrowing from Izzy. :)
Kent -> Brin(1). 2
Sally -> Kent
Green -> Nog
Fea -> Nog. 2
Shasta -> Gwath
Gwath -> Sally
Form -> Brin(3). 6
Lari -> Nog(3). 6
Kuru -> Brin(6). 13
Nilp -> Brin(4). 18
Brin 18. Nog 6. Kent, Gwath & Sally 1.
satansaloser2005
04-17-2009, 10:58 PM
Wow. Blink and Brinn's dead. Somehow I get the feeling of deja vu. ;)
In other news I'd like to take a look at Lari and Nilp, not that I have time now, but I think it would be beneficial to....well, look into a couple things.
(Give me a break, I've got three minutes.)
Kuru, you will be missed. Thanks for your help toDay. :)
EDIT: x'd with Nilp. Your vote's not highlighted, sweetheart.
Kuruharan
04-17-2009, 10:59 PM
Kuru, you will be missed. Thanks for your help toDay. :)
Hmmm...depends on who I actually end up helping. ;)
But I know you all will miss me. :D
Brinniel
04-17-2009, 10:59 PM
Wow this was a stupid move from you guys... :rolleyes:
Kent2010
04-17-2009, 11:00 PM
Sorry Kuru...for kind of being a big reason why you're dead and all :rolleyes:
Gwathagor
04-17-2009, 11:00 PM
...I'm still confused as to where all this suspicion of Brinn came from.
satansaloser2005
04-17-2009, 11:00 PM
Wow this was a stupid move from you guys... :rolleyes:
Erm....I don't like this situation. I went from greater of two evils to lesser of two evils, and even at that....Blah.
Isabellkya
04-17-2009, 11:00 PM
++Sally
For previous reasons stated.
Brinniel
04-17-2009, 11:00 PM
say bye, bye to Finrod. :(
++Nogrod (+10)
Nilpaurion Felagund
04-17-2009, 11:01 PM
A classic line:
'Celuien, I am your Hunter. Vote for tar-ancalime.'
Haha! :D
Nilpaurion Felagund
04-17-2009, 11:03 PM
If what you say is true, Brinn, I won't highlight my vote . . .
Brinniel
04-17-2009, 11:03 PM
And look who made a throwaway vote now... *points to Izzy*
the phantom
04-17-2009, 11:03 PM
Time is up. Nilp's vote is not highlighted as of 12:01, so it doesn't count.
Narrative up as soon as I can manage. No more posting.
the phantom
04-17-2009, 11:33 PM
When Kuru rejoined them at the start of the day, it was clear that he was aided by Beren. Everyone trusted the motives behind his words, but knew that he had not more information than themselves.
Nogrod dominated much of the discussion, pointing out the dangers of the "10ers", and suggesting that the Downers disarm so as to increase the odds of being on more even footing, but the idea was not widely accepted.
The votes rolled in, and Nog and Brin both came under threat. Then Kuru stepped forward, and in his final act he unleashed all of his votes upon Brin. But Brin still possessed every one of her bonus votes, and she struck back hard, blasting Nog with eleven votes. Everyone expected Nog to respond, but he seemed to freeze- reluctant perhaps to step forward and directly kill Brin with his votes. But finally he steeled himself, and prepared to vote. But it was too late.
The walls and ceiling of the room became as storm clouds, and from all sides bright streaks of lightning converged upon Nog. There was a dazzling flash, and then the great light was gone. The Downers were too blinded to see Nogrod's body hit the floor. Next to the bar, there was yet another thud. Kuruharan had left them for good.
The familiar icy voice spoke from all around. "Wrong again, I'm afraid." And darkness enveloped them.
THE LIVING
Brinniel
Fea
Formendacil
Green
Gwath
Izzy
Kent
Lari
Nilp
Sally
Shasta
THE DEAD
Nienna (10) (Ordo, Day 1 lynch)
Aganzir (9) (Ordo, Night 2 kill)
Alonariel (10) (Ordo, modfire)
Firefoot (10) (Ordo, Night 3 kill)
Nogrod (5) (Ordo, Day 3 lynch)
Kuruharan (0) (Beren, Day 2 lynch)
Score: 8-3
the phantom
04-18-2009, 09:58 PM
There was no question who would be slain during the night. A Downer inhabited by one of the evil spirits awakened from sleep and crept to where Brinniel lay sprawled upon the floor. The fiend snapped the leg from a chair and grabbed Brin by the hair and pulled her to her feet. Just as the killer raised the chair leg to strike, Brin's eyes snapped open.
"No!" she screamed. "Don't! You don't know-"
But the servant of evil laughed and brought the heavy piece of wood whistling down upon Brin's head. Again and again blows smote her, and at last her attacker released her and she crashed to the floor, dead. But even as the villain stood over her smiling in triumph, a red glowing orb rose from Brinniel's breast and hovered in front of the evil one's eyes, and a voice spoke out of it.
"I came to give you aid- to help you achieve victory. Now you are on your own." The orb vanished with a burst of fire, and a large spark fell upon Brinniel's forehead. When it went out, the name "Grima" was left burned across her brow. Before the killer could express disappointment or rage, unconsciousness fell.
Not long after, the dawn came, and the Downers rose and looked upon Brinniel. Seven were filled with hope, and three with frustration.
THE LIVING
Fea (6)
Formendacil (7)
Green (10)
Gwath (10)
Izzy (8)
Kent (4)
Lari (7)
Nilp (7)
Sally (10)
Shasta (10)
THE DEAD
Nienna (10) (Ordo, Day 1 lynch)
Aganzir (9) (Ordo, Night 2 kill)
Alonariel (10) (Ordo, modfire)
Firefoot (10) (Ordo, Night 3 kill)
Nogrod (5) (Ordo, Day 3 lynch)
Kuruharan (0) (Beren, Day 2 lynch)
Brinniel (0) (Grima, Night 4 kill)
Score: 7-3
satansaloser2005
04-18-2009, 10:10 PM
Well that's....special.
(On the plus side, I didn't waste any votes to save her, and our actual Finrod didn't have a chance to come out, so we've come out of the Night fairly well.)
I'll see what I can do in the way of a vote tally, then I'll try to have a look at what Brinn said while she was among the living. I'll post again soon I hope.
Isabellkya
04-18-2009, 10:23 PM
Nice to see the Three took care of our Cobbler problem.
Clears some other things up as well.
Though, I was secretly hoping Brin was false claiming and would be alive toDay. Signifying she was one of the Three. So we could vote her toDay and eliminate.
Though, that would've entailed one more innocent gone during the Night.
Yet, why reveal as Finrod? Did she think the Three would be less inclined to go straight for her? o.O
Formendacil
04-18-2009, 11:55 PM
Well...
I was totally not expecting Brinn to be dead toDay.
This will merit thought, once I get some "real" sleep.
Back in 12 hours or more.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 12:21 AM
Finally some good news. What's weird is I thought Nogrod was Finrod since Day 2 and we were going to be pretty much dead coming into today. But this is a bit brighter.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 12:33 AM
Before I go to bed I would like to point out the tri-fecta who have subtetly through vague suspicions have been offering me up as a lynch candidate.
Lari
Sally
Nilp
I would add Brinn but well she's dead now. I know it's entirely possible Gwath and Greenie could be baddie and defending me. But, out of the 3 (and 4 if you were to include Brinn) Lari and Sally have voted for me, but have not made me a serious candidate as they have not spent any bonus on me. Despite the persistent feeling of uneasiness I give them, and being Nilp's 'secret' suspect? I don't know it just feels like either one or two of them will lynch me with the snap of a finger if they have the oppurtunity.
Ok, that's all. Good night.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 01:05 AM
I'm going to cover Lari for the moment, because her use of bonus votes yesterDay and the casualness of it, struck me as a bit odd compared to her statements on the matter previously. It quite looked to me like a wolf succumbing to the pressure which Nog was trying to elicit.
Lari...
In her post #348 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=593200&postcount=348) she covers a few people, these being whom she finds suspicious.
Who I don't like at the moment:
Kent: I'm not sure if it's his style but it seems suspicious to me. I can see where his points can be coming from, but to me he seems way too defensive right now. Whether that is being a newbie wolf or what but I don't like it.
Fea's vote worries me as well. I don't know what to make of it and someone earlier brought up that the odds of Fea being innocent in this game are, well, low. I also wish she could post more and maybe that's where a lot of my worry suspicion is coming from but I understand the not posting. I just don't like it.
And Brinn, who I've been wavering about all Day reading through the posts. She seemed guilty when explaining her vote, but the innocent later and then, I reread, and didn't like anything that I saw.
Nor does she like people seeing Greenie as a wolf. She reads Nog as rather innocent, and has no idea on everyone else.
In #378 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=593250&postcount=378) she votes for Kent, because she finds him the most guilty. Also states, that she better vote before she forgets.
In #384 she does a vote count.
Thanks Brin over the correction of a technicality in #389.
Her Day two posts are quite sparse. Her attitude in terms of voting "before I forget", give off an air of not caring, of casualness. As if she couldn't care less how the voting turned out, as long as she remembers to vote. Which is a valid point, since she didn't on Day 1 and would've been modfired.
In her #437 (
http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=593402&postcount=437) she shows surprised over the lynch of Kuru, yet is glad over having him back for the Day. Finds the Night kill of Firefoot a much bigger surprised than Kuru's lynching.
#470 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=593468&postcount=470)
She echoes what has been said regarding bonus votes.
As well as her stance on the use of them.
I for one am saving mine till I feel really sure of someone's guilt.
Known definite innocent:
Kuru
Leaning towards innocent:
Form: He seems to be making sense and has been making good points. His posts don’t seem like he’s hiding anything or trying to hard.
Greenie: Contrary to what others think she seems innocent to me. She just seems to be having little time and only wants to post when she has something to say. Nothing she says is giving off warning vibes to me.
Izzy: She seems more innocent every time I look at her.
Sally: I think she’s innocent. Not sure, but she seems like it in her posts.
Betwixt between:
Fea: I haven’t heard a lot from her, again with the problems, but she seems to not be saying anything that makes her seem guilty to me. I usually can’t get a good read on her and always suspect her, but here she is seeming more innocent than not.
Nilp: I read half of his post and he seems to have really good ideas and I go “yay!” and the other half I read and say “BUT HE’S A WOLF”. It’s just a feeling I get. And I just don’t like the idea of a lot of the vocal people saying a wolf/vamp is one of the quiet ones, seems like a good way to throw off suspicion.
Brinn: I’m thinking she’s more innocent but she could be hiding something through all of her defense. She seems to be innocent to me one minute and then guilty the next. I just don’t know how to feel about her.
Gwath: I have really no read on him at all.
Probably guilty:
Kent: I don’t like the vibes I’m getting from his posts. They seem like they are defensive and its just rubbing me the wrong way.
Nog: His posts seem the same way to me like Kent’s. They are also telling the village what to do about a lot of things, and to me this seems like a wolf playing boldly. Maybe he really does want the village to use all our bonus votes before the vampire can suck them but, well, it just seems wrong at time.
Shasta: His posts are giving me bad vibes all around.
With all this being said and I need to vote I feel like I should be using some of my bonus votes toDay:
++Nog(3)
Now, I've had far too much to drink and I'm glad I made that list earlier then rushed around all day.
In her #470 she said she was saving her bonus votes until she was really sure of someone's guilt. Yet in her #581, it seems her top suspicions are Kent, Nog, and Shasta - which she puts under the label "Probably Guilty". She then votes for Nog and adds bonus votes under the reason "I feel like I should be using some of my bonus votes toDay". Afterwards she says "I'm glad I made that list earlier then rushed around all day."
Unless I am mistaken, "probably guilty" and "really sure of someone's guilt" are not the same thing, nor are they entirely close to the same thing. Her statement of making the list earlier, gives an air of "meh, I'm not concerned".
Now, is she a confuzzled Ordo or one of the Three who succumbed to Nog's intentions of pressure to get them to use their bonus votes?
X'd with Kent x2.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 01:19 AM
I'm quite curious as to your voting... experiment(?) you seem to be conducting Mr. Nilp.
I dare say you are on much rockier ground now, if you miss one more vote.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 01:21 AM
Pugh, wrong button.
Will we perhaps be seeing a vote sucking soon? Since they killed the Cobbler, I'd say they wouldn't be worried about sucking the Cobbler's votes away.
Nilpaurion Felagund
04-19-2009, 04:24 AM
Well, certainly, my quote from WWXVIII was apt: I, like Celuien, have been duped by a baddie. :(
(Unfortunately today I have little time to post, I better make all analyses snappy,)
Nilpaurion Felagund
04-19-2009, 04:30 AM
Well, at the very least we have delayed what Nogrod feared the baddies intend to do.
Brinniel's 'reveal' gave the village another DAY. Oft evil shall evil mar!
And finally, Kent, after two DAYs you answer my suspicions! Care to answer why you think us suspicious, though? Be you special? ;)
Nilpaurion Felagund
04-19-2009, 04:59 AM
The DAY 3 vote list (times in GMT +8; known innocents underlined, known baddies emphasised):
04:54 Kent - Brinn (+1)
Brinn - 2
05:23 Sally - Kent
Brinn - 2, Kent - 1
07:01 Green - Nog
Brinn - 2, Kent - 1, Nog - 1
08:38 Fea - Nog
Brinn - 2, Kent - 1, Nog - 2
11:02 Shasta - Gwath
Brinn - 2, Kent - 1, Nog - 2, Gwath - 1
12:39 Gwath - Sally
Brinn - 2, Kent - 1, Nog - 2, Gwath - 1, Sally - 1
12:40 Form - Brinn (+3)
Brinn - 6, Kent - 1, Nog - 2, Gwath - 1, Sally - 1
12:41 Lari - Nog (+3)
Brinn - 6, Kent - 1, Nog - 6, Gwath - 1, Sally - 1
12:45 Kuru - Brinn (+6)
Brinn - 13, Kent - 1, Nog - 6, Gwath - 1, Sally - 1
12:57 Nilp - Brinn (+4) (no highlight)
Brinn - 13, Kent - 1, Nog - 6, Gwath - 1, Sally - 1
01:00 Izzy - Sally
Brinn - 13, Kent - 1, Nog - 6, Gwath - 1, Sally - 2
01:00 Brinn - Nog (+10)
Brinn - 13, Kent - 1, Nog - 17, Gwath - 1, Sally - 2
Did not vote: Nilpaurion Felagund. (invalid vote)
Nilpaurion Felagund
04-19-2009, 06:05 AM
Even though we already have a known baddie, the fact the she was merely the Cobbler, instead of being one of the Three, makes it less useful to analysis. However, someone with more time can perhaps scrutinise her posts to find some clues into what she thought. Cobblers looking for their masters can be rather astute.
YesterDAY's voting has been interesting in some aspects, one of which was Izzy's vote: Voting for Sally at the last minute even without the chance of lynching her. Of course, it could be a principles thing, and ordos have been known to do that; nevertheless it certainly is interesting.
Which brings me to another point: bonus votes. There are still four who have all 10, one of whom I suspect, and two of which are quiet. I am inclined to think Green and Shasta innocent, Gwath somewhat suspicious, and I believe Sally is t3h evil.
Back to the yesterDAY's vote: Fea's vote post. I thought it cobblery, but since it has been subsequently revealed that she is not the Cobbler, could she be one of the Three, then?
Will vote in my next post.
Nilpaurion Felagund
04-19-2009, 06:12 AM
We still have Lúthien. She is still dreaming. The Cobbler has bought us a DAY to get a Wolf. We still can win this, village.
With this (likely) last post for toDAY, I shall vote:
++satansaloser2005 (+4)
Feanor of the Peredhil
04-19-2009, 07:04 AM
No, Nilp. Not one of the three. I decided to experiment with the phantom's trick of using the best trick ordos have: make yourself into a target to keep eyes off of more important players. I figured if the wolves were settled on me being a cobbler, they'd kill somebody else off in the night: hopefully the cobbler. I didn't expect it to actually work, but it's worth a shot when you've got no clue what you're doing otherwise.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 07:15 AM
And finally, Kent, after two DAYs you answer my suspicions! Care to answer why you think us suspicious, though? Be you special?
-Nilp
I consider any one of you 3 capable of lynching me at the first oppurtunity you get.
Why didn't I respond earlier, what was I to respond to? Being your 'secret suspect,' it's like trying to respond to Sally saying she thinks I'm a rat. It's a pointless statement and would have been more pointless to respond. If you were trying to look like Luthien, if you are innocent you should give up, the baddies didn't buy it because I'm not one of them.
What does get me suspicious of you is your chivalry regarding Brinn yesterday. Saying you would not highlight your vote since Brinn said she was Finrod. It looks like a nice gesture, but it would be more beneficial to take care of Finrod at night, because Finrod can't protect himself and you can have an assured kill. You kill two for one...Nogrod gets lynched, because of your chivalry in saving Brinn, but if you believed she was Finrod it would be better to deal with Finrod at night. However, baddies got fooled by their own cobbler, hehe. :D
A Little Green
04-19-2009, 08:38 AM
Fea (6) - I don't know what to think about her. I find her toDay's post both innocentish and fishy. The explanation she gives makes sense, but it just crossed my mind that Fea is smart enough to pull that sort of thing off as a wolf and that it would be quite a clever move for a wolf - after all, behaving as weirdly as she has done doesn't quite look like what is generally considered wolvish behaviour.
Formendacil (7) - Still nothing to make my alarm bells ringing.
Gwath (10) - Under the reindeer.
Izzy (8) - Same thing. I'm interested in her yesterDay's vote that seems much like a throwaway to me.
Kent (4) - Innocentish still.
Lari (7) - Under the reindeer.
Nilp (7) - Kent brings up a good point about his voting yesterDay. I won't, however, shut out the possibility that he is just an ordo who believed what Brinn said about being Finrod. Other than that, I don't know. I need to look at him as well as those under-the-reindeer people.
Sally (10) - I'm beginning to feel uneasy about Sally. She seems slippery, probably because the little she says is very unspecific. Like these: Brinn makes me giggle, but in a 'I know how you feel, you poor girl' sort of way. I really don't want to see her go toDay because while it's possible she's guilty (which is a possibility for all of you, so that really means nothing, dang it) I'd like to hear more from her so I can get a better read on the girl.
Kent still makes me uneasy, just in general. I don't know what exactly it is, but a lot of the things he's said have made me uneasy and while I don't want to kill him just to find out what he is I'm not going to complain if he ends up dead at the end of the Day, because I keep smelling a Kent....erm, rat.
Nog seems genuine and yet at the same time I know I can't read him, so when I trust Nog completely he's generally got something up his sleeve.
I actually just looked through Izzy's posts (was looking for a quote which in the end I don't think she even said, alas) and think she may be sliding down to my innocent list. We don't exactly see eye to eye, but that doesn't mean she's evil, and after seeing a couple things she's said I'll have to give her some more thought.This sort of "s/he is kind of suspicious and kind of not" -comments are ideal for a baddie since they can be used either way in the future.
Shasta (10) - Nothing rings my alarm bells about him at the moment.
ToDay, if I have the time, I'll have a look at at least one of those people who are lurking under my reindeer. Probably Izzy, since she's the one of them who I feel most uneasy about - that partly because she escapes everyone's attention even though she's participating quite actively.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 09:09 AM
Ah yes, my vote yesterDay.
You could see it as a throw away, if you like.
I was waiting to see if Nilp highlighted his vote, then I would not have to vote for Brin in case she put all of her bonus votes into Nog. Since, I had no other reason to vote for Brin, as she hadn't been at the top of my suspect list at all. I didn't want to invest my bonus votes into Brin, then have Nilp highlight his vote - and Brin would've been overkilled, with one of us wasting our votes.
I was also waiting to see when/if Brin voted as I think most suspected her to - all her bonus votes onto Nog. Yet the clock reached :00 and there was no sign of her, so I thought she didn't make it in time. So I waited a little more, then submit my vote for my top suspect Sally. Then refreshed and saw her vote for Nog
Lariren Shadow
04-19-2009, 10:56 AM
So the wolves killed off the cobbler for us? Epic win for the village!
Before I go to bed I would like to point out the tri-fecta who have subtetly through vague suspicions have been offering me up as a lynch candidate.
Lari
Sally
Nilp
I would add Brinn but well she's dead now. I know it's entirely possible Gwath and Greenie could be baddie and defending me. But, out of the 3 (and 4 if you were to include Brinn) Lari and Sally have voted for me, but have not made me a serious candidate as they have not spent any bonus on me. Despite the persistent feeling of uneasiness I give them, and being Nilp's 'secret' suspect? I don't know it just feels like either one or two of them will lynch me with the snap of a finger if they have the oppurtunity.
Ok, that's all. Good night.
Just because I haven't spent any bonus votes on you doesn't mean I don't think you are a serious candidate. At the time I didn't want to use my bonus votes till later. And I still consider you a suspect. In fact this post is kind of suspicious in the whole "well obviously the people who suspect me are evil" thing. I don't like the way it sounds.
In her #470 she said she was saving her bonus votes until she was really sure of someone's guilt. Yet in her #581, it seems her top suspicions are Kent, Nog, and Shasta - which she puts under the label "Probably Guilty". She then votes for Nog and adds bonus votes under the reason "I feel like I should be using some of my bonus votes toDay". Afterwards she says "I'm glad I made that list earlier then rushed around all day."
Unless I am mistaken, "probably guilty" and "really sure of someone's guilt" are not the same thing, nor are they entirely close to the same thing. Her statement of making the list earlier, gives an air of "meh, I'm not concerned".
Now, is she a confuzzled Ordo or one of the Three who succumbed to Nog's intentions of pressure to get them to use their bonus votes?
I don't know who is guilty, so therefore I called them "probably guilty". As for the whole "yay I had my list done" thing: I did it earlier, I ended up being away from my computer for most of the Day, came back with less than a half an hour to vote and such and was glad that I had the list done and my suspicions were still the same. And yes I did feel like I should use some bonus votes, it was just a feeling and I didn't like at all how I was feeling about Nog.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 11:21 AM
Just because I haven't spent any bonus votes on you doesn't mean I don't think you are a serious candidate. At the time I didn't want to use my bonus votes till later. And I still consider you a suspect. In fact this post is kind of suspicious in the whole "well obviously the people who suspect me are evil" thing. I don't like the way it sounds.
-Lariren
I'm a 'rat,' a 'secret suspect,' and I give general feelings of 'uneasiness' hardly inspire innocence, especially when it comes from four different people. It looks like an attempt to offer me up as a lynch possibility as soon as the chance arises. Basically I consider any three of you votes against me waiting to happen.
What you did not note is that I have not excluded Greenie and Gwath as possible wolves who support me. But at this stage in the game, I'm trying to narrow down the field as much as possible.
I will not vote for Formendacil, Fea, or Gwath, because them being evil just doesn't make sense. Maybe they are sneaks, that's possible, but the evidence does not line up for them being wolves.
I am going to take a close look at Greenie today, as I have not reached any kind of decision on her - same for Isabellyka. I just found it interesting how four different people say I make them feel uneasy, yet do not make any specifications how. One of those persons turned up a baddie, so why not suspect the other three? Also, you have taken what I said too far, because I did not say all three of you are automatically wolves, I said one or two of you are slyly offering me up as a possibility waiting for a chance to lynch me, and so yes, one or two of you I think is a baddie. As lets be honest I am probably one of the easiest targets left, I have the least bonus votes remaining and I make a significant number of the remaining villagers, for some unclarified reason 'uneasy.'
Shastanis Althreduin
04-19-2009, 01:47 PM
For reasons I'm not going to post on the thread right now, I can't post anything of substance at the moment. Just know that I've read the thread, yay CobblerBrinn's dead, and have a few views on Greenie and Sally I'd like to share as well as reiterating my suspicion of Gwath. I will post at the soonest opportunity.
A Little Green
04-19-2009, 02:14 PM
I just found it interesting how four different people say I make them feel uneasy, yet do not make any specifications how. One of those persons turned up a baddie, so why not suspect the other three?Actually, if that was to point to some direction I'd say it points to the exact opposite. It can be highly risky for wolves to have the exact same suspicions.
I need to vote very soon, I'm not sure who to vote, and the silence makes me wary. Where is everyone?
A Little Green
04-19-2009, 02:41 PM
I - don't - like - this - silence.
I would have liked to take a look at Nilp and/or Izzy. I couldn't because of reasons I believe I'm not allowed to state on this thread. The way things stand I think I'll vote
++ Sally
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 03:24 PM
++Nilp (+2)
Actually, if that was to point to some direction I'd say it points to the exact opposite. It can be highly risky for wolves to have the exact same suspicions.
-Greenie
But you can't expect me to think all three off them have innocent intentions :rolleyes:
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 04:24 PM
Oh dear.
I really expected there to be much to read through after giving the entire bar a thorough cleaning. Good news, I find some mice and humanely tossed them out the bathroom window.
That explanation Lari, I've got to be honest sounds hogwashy.
Not liking how you feel about someone, doesn't seem to be on the same level as "really sure of someone's guilt".
I'm not buying it.
The only slice of pie which equals to you not being a wolf or Vampire is your seeming lack of activity. I think if you were a wolf or Vamp, you'd be much more active.
Then again, I don't know. But I think that is about all that speaks in your favor of being innocent.
Care to give a reason towards your voting of Nilp, Kent?
I didn't have any uneasy feelings towards you before Kent, save what I said yesterday in regards to the distraction which the newbie discussion proved.
Yet, lately all that I've seen from you - is continual defense of yourself. Suspecting others because they suspect you.
As you said, you'd be an easy lynch. So why would "numerous" people need to be sneaky in their ways of trying to get you lynched? Why would the Three need to stage some kind of sneaky, back door coup to get you lynched?
Perhaps, they are keeping you around until closer to the end? Maybe whispers here and there? Who knows, really.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 05:02 PM
Your conclusions about me changed relatively fast...at least after my Nilp vote.
*takes note of Isabellyka's curious reaction*
This will be a continued defense of myself but looks like I might of struck a nerve...
Yet, lately all that I've seen from you - is continual defense of yourself. Suspecting others because they suspect you.
That is not 100% accurate, just yesterday I went after Formendacil and he has remained relatively supportive of me through out. In fact, I went after him pretty good, but his posts at the end of the day relieved my doubts.
As you said, you'd be an easy lynch. So why would "numerous" people need to be sneaky in their ways of trying to get you lynched? Why would the Three need to stage some kind of sneaky, back door coup to get you lynched?
Out of conservation of bonus votes. I have received 1 maybe 2 votes the last couple days, to get me lynched would mean the wolves would have to spend a lot of bonus and I would not be worth the cost, especially since none of the three I mentioned have come under any significant scrutiny.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 05:17 PM
Lately, as in toDay.
What are you talking about Kent?
How did they change relatively fast?
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 05:19 PM
I think you are being just a tad overly paranoid here Kent.
Shastanis Althreduin
04-19-2009, 06:22 PM
I'm going to have to agree, Kent. You seem to keep bringing yourself up, and bringing up how necessary it is for you to have to defend yourself. To tell the truth, now I'm starting to wonder about you. :rolleyes:
Nilpaurion Felagund
04-19-2009, 06:35 PM
Whee, got one last chance to post.
But bloody hell, this village has been rather silent. I guess this is what comes after the death of Nogrod . . .
I dunno why I got this sudden feeling of some blokes smirking after being repeatedly put into people's innocent list. For example, in my game (WW XIX), an evil Form, until realising he was doomed by the double-lynch, was on everyone's innocent list. He can make himself look innocent if he wants.
Nobody's suspecting Shasta much, too, but I guess it's because of lack of material.
I know, it's unreasonable to suspect everyone, but, as demonstrated by the previous two NIGHT kills before last NIGHT, the Three seem to have been relatively unconcerned by the DAY's discussion, killing people who could have easily been lynched the next DAY instead! We need to push everyone, start pointing out little things and hope, somehow, that those with guilty consciences would slip something. It has happened a lot before, after all.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 07:02 PM
I'm going to have to agree, Kent. You seem to keep bringing yourself up, and bringing up how necessary it is for you to have to defend yourself. To tell the truth, now I'm starting to wonder about you.
-Shasta
With all due respect it's easy to say someone is being overtly defensive when the person saying that has had an easy skate most of the game.
And the fact is before today four people announced vague suspicions about me, with Brinn being the cobbler, I believe I have sufficient enough reason to think not all of the other three are innocently misguided
How did they change relatively fast?
-Isabellyka
You referenced yesterday how you had no reason to suspect with one exception, and then an hour after I vote for Nilp that changed - I call that relatively fast.
I am not quite sure why you and Shasta seem so surprised either. I have been very defensive since the start (slightly paranoid too as you can see from Day 2). Several people since Day 1 said I was defensive, I might have become more intense, but that's because we are winding down and on the verge of slaughter. It smells weird to start suspecting me because I've been defensive now.
I know, it's unreasonable to suspect everyone, but, as demonstrated by the previous two NIGHT kills before last NIGHT, the Three seem to have been relatively unconcerned by the DAY's discussion, killing people who could have easily been lynched the next DAY instead! We need to push everyone, start pointing out little things and hope, somehow, that those with guilty consciences would slip something. It has happened a lot before, after all.
-Nilp
Now if this isn't an evil attempt to white wash the Brinn kill than I don't know what is. She was obviously killed because she falsely claimed to be Finrod, and the baddies bought it. Now maybe you could say, well if Brinn wasn't killed the real Finrod would have stepped out and Brinn would have been lynched. But come on, she claims to be Finrod the baddies have to attack because Finrod can kill one of them with a successful protection, and add on top of that Finrod can't defend himself. Brinn was killed because they fell for her fake Finrod reveal. To try and sweep it under the rug as if they were going for easy lynch targets is fishy...especially since I have said earlier today that I believe I am an easy lynch target.
Lariren Shadow
04-19-2009, 07:19 PM
ToDay has been really really silent. I don't know what to think of it.
Anyway:
Fea (6): Has been oddly silent recently. Pretty much almost all the time. I’m not sure what to think of this silence, but it’s worrying me. I wish there was more that I could say about her. I’m really not liking her silence though.
Form (7): Has almost the same silence as Fea with a slightly more talking during previous Days. His silence is getting to be suspicious too.
Greenie (10): She still seems innocent to me.
Gwath (10): Honestly no idea about him at all.
Izzy (8): Same as Gwath no idea.
Kent (4): His constant need to defend himself is sending off alarm bells in my head. I don’t like it at all. He’s also attacking really only those who suspect him. He is sounding like a really paranoid wolf.
Nilp (7): I honestly thought he might have been the cobbler earlier but he apparently isn’t. Which makes me now think that he is probably innocent.
Sally (10): Seems pretty innocent to me.
Shasta (10): His few sentence pop ins are sounding not right to me. I don’t like it, seems like he could be playing a safe wolf.
I really don't like Kent is sounding toDay and how he sounded before. He seems way too defensive and I don't like the way he figured out his suspicions.
++Kent (2)
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 07:40 PM
Oh good, I'm not completely crazy then.
(A note that this post was started after Shasta's #643, then I picked it back up after the Downs de-hiccuped.)
So as far as I can see Kent's really only suspicious of the people who are suspicious of him, and added a couple more people to the list just to hide that fact. He's been overly defensive and paranoid, thinking apparently that everyone who's after him is a wolf. I rather think it's the other way around, and though I'll feel bad if he's innocent I have too strong a vibe from him to let him get away any longer.
++Kent
I'll probably add in some bonus votes, but for right now (as in at this moment, not toDay) I want to save them and add them in if necessary, because I'm under the weather and am pretty sure that if I do have to retract for some reason I'll forget to take off my bonus too and I'll be in a pickle. Anyway, that's all from me for right now. Sorry I haven't been present, but hopefully the little I am doing will be enough to help the village lynch a baddie toDay. Enjoy~!
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 07:44 PM
If I get lynched today it's over, whether Luthien and/or Finrod survive it's over. The remaining wolves can combine their bonus to override any vote. Mark my words, if I go out it's over the next day.
Lariren you may not like the way I come up with my suspicions, but that's the way I'm doing it. So you can either put up with it or vote me out, if you choose the latter I repeat what I said above.
Heaven forbid someone actually trying today. I hope yall have unit plans or something similar you are busy with because participation today is a joke.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 07:53 PM
Sally and I never said once today (or anytime) that everyone who suspects me is a baddie, to say that is a blatant misrepresentation of my words.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 07:55 PM
Who is having an easy skate of the game Kent?
Perhaps you should make it uneasy for them.
I'm not surprised by your defensiveness.. I guess I was/am merely trying to say in a polite way... that it is getting old. ;)
When did I say I was suspecting you?
'tis a weird day in Werewolf land when the top three living posters are Kent, Izzy, and Gwath.
Sally will 98% probability be getting my vote for toDay.
Jumping on an easy lynch.
Lari would probably get it, if I weren't most likely be voting for Sally.
X'd withKent.
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 07:55 PM
Believe me, Kent, even if the three baddies are Greenie, Gwath, and Shasta (the other people besides myself who still have all 10 bonus votes) the others will still outweigh them, so we (the innocents, that is) still have more power at the moment. That's another reason I'm a bit hesitant to use my bonus votes, becuase the baddies could conceivably be doing the same thing, only obviously with darker motives. I said at the beginning of the game that I find people who horde their bonus votes suspicious, and this is true in a way, but more those that have call to use them and don't, unlike those who can accomplish their purposes and still save their bonus for the final few Days to combat whatever baddies are left. Don't be mistaken, though, and think that I won't use my votes if I feel it's necessary, because as long as there's more votes spread out between the rest of the group than there are in the top three vote holders we're still safe.
Incidentally I'd like to apologize for my whole cracked out Firefoot being killed by Vamp Girl theory. I didn't notice that the death list included the deceaseds' bonus votes so I thought my theory plausible, until last Night when I read the narration and realized she still had all of hers. Again, sorry about that.
EDIT: x'd with Kent and Izzy
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 07:56 PM
Ah, but you implied it, and you continue to bring up the point. That's my main problem.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 08:01 PM
There is this person, whom I think would fit quite well into werewolf.
Here are a couple of quotes.
"People seldom do what they believe in. They do what is convenient, then repent."
Well, a quote. The second one fits perfectly, but I can't find a suitable word to make it all around forum appropriate. xD
Shastanis Althreduin
04-19-2009, 08:03 PM
I wouldn't call Kent an easy lynch, exactly, Izzy. I'd more call it... a pattern of behavior that we can focus on now that there aren't more pressing issues? Am I making sense? I just had some alcohol (we are in a bar, after all!), so I'm trying to be coherent.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 08:03 PM
I'm not surprised by your defensiveness.. I guess I was/am merely trying to say in a polite way... that it is getting old.
-Isabellyka
I am naturally combative and on guard, that's who I am, so if it's old I am sorry. But get used to it or get rid of me, the 1st option you might grit your teeth, but there's a better chance of winning. The latter option there is no chance - ok I should say a 99.9% failure.
Ah, but you implied it, and you continue to bring up the point. That's my main problem.
-Sally
I keep bringing it up because everyone keeps repeating it. :rolleyes:
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 08:04 PM
Who is having an easy skate of the game Kent?
Perhaps you should make it uneasy for them.
I'm not surprised by your defensiveness.. I guess I was/am merely trying to say in a polite way... that it is getting old. ;)
When did I say I was suspecting you?
'tis a weird day in Werewolf land when the top three living posters are Kent, Izzy, and Gwath.
Sally will 98% probability be getting my vote for toDay.
Jumping on an easy lynch.
Lari would probably get it, if I weren't most likely be voting for Sally.
X'd withKent.
Sorry random question. The bit that's bolded, right? Are you saying that you're going to jump on an easy lynch or that I did jump on an easy lynch? Sorry, I'm tired and easily confuzzled right now. Thanks in advance for clarifying! :)
EDIT: x'd with Izzy, Shasta, and Kent. And never mind, I get it. Response to follow in another post.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 08:04 PM
Kent is an easy and convenient lynch choice.
He is new.
He is defensive.
It is overtly apparent.
What about that is not easy?
X'd with Sally and Kent
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 08:08 PM
Do you see me voting for you Kent?
Have I voiced anywhere that I wanted to lynch you?
Just because something is "annoying" or "getting old" does not mean it should be a lynchable quality - unless of course there is undeniable proof that said person is a wolf or Vampire.
I was referring to you jumping on an easy lynch, Sally.
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 08:10 PM
That is not 100% accurate, just yesterday I went after Formendacil and he has remained relatively supportive of me through out. In fact, I went after him pretty good, but his posts at the end of the day relieved my doubts.
I wouldn't take his support of you despite your suspicion of him as a reliable sign of innocence. That is common wolf behavior.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 08:10 PM
Why are you so certain we will fail if you are lynched toDay?
X'd with Gwath.
Feanor of the Peredhil
04-19-2009, 08:10 PM
++Sally
I kind of meant to do this yesterday, though I'd much prefer not to specify why...
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 08:13 PM
Izzy, I've been after Kent most of the game, so while you can accuse me of going for an easy lynch you can not say that I'm jumping onto it. Just sayin'.
Blah, the smell of alcohol and everything in this silly pub is making me ill. Perhaps it would be best that you all lynch me, because then at least I know I won't be killed by Vamp Girl at Night and have the possibility of vote suckage.
EDIT: x'd with Fea. Oh lovely.
Shastanis Althreduin
04-19-2009, 08:14 PM
Kent, everyone keeps repeating it because you keep bringing it up. That's a circular argument.
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 08:14 PM
Kent, everyone keeps repeating it because you keep bringing it up. That's a circular argument.
Thank you! It's like "does no one see the big gaping holes in the logic of Kent's plan?" *hugs Shasta and hopes he's not a nassssty wolf*
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 08:16 PM
Why are you so certain we will fail if you are lynched toDay?
-Isabellyka
Because the score will be 5-3, or if Finrod has a successful protection 4-2. All it takes is one more day.
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 08:19 PM
Blah, the smell of alcohol and everything in this silly pub is making me ill. Perhaps it would be best that you all lynch me, because then at least I know I won't be killed by Vamp Girl at Night and have the possibility of vote suckage.
I don't like it when people dare me to vote them. It's always looks like reverse psychology, and it always has the effect of making me want to vote them.
But this really does look like an attempt at reverse psychology, sally.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 08:21 PM
Kent, everyone keeps repeating it because you keep bringing it up. That's a circular argument.
-Shasta
I'm sorry I always have a need to get in the last word, but if it helps I'm done. And I want to tell you all to pay attention to the white washing of the Brinn kill that Nilp did, in trying to suggest she was killed because she would have been an easy lynch.
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 08:22 PM
I don't like it when people dare me to vote them. It's always looks like reverse psychology, and it always has the effect of making me want to vote them.
But this really does look like an attempt at reverse psychology, sally.
Meh, make of it whatever you want at this point. I don't want to die, but it's one of those "I'd rather be mis-lynched than be killed at Night and give the baddies my bonus votes". Just stating a fact. Basically if you vote me I won't be offended, but I'm certainly not asking you to do so.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 08:22 PM
I thought the score was currently 7-3.
X'd with Gwath, Kent, Sally
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 08:23 PM
This is repeating as the Kuru and my situation a couple days ago, and we have to stop the high emotions right immediately it only benefits the baddies.
Let's step back and please everyone look and respond to what Nilp said about Brinn's death, and why Firefoot was killed for that matter.
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 08:23 PM
I think you are being just a tad overly paranoid here Kent.
I agree that Kent does seem paranoid, and I hate to go meta-game on us here, but that might be a result of it being his first game. It took me four or five games before I ceased to be paranoid all the time when I was in a game.
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 08:24 PM
Because the score will be 5-3, or if Finrod has a successful protection 4-2. All it takes is one more day.
Incidentally, your numbers are off. It's currently 7-3 toDay, and will be either 6-3 or 7-2 toNight. I really hope that was an honest mistake.
EDIT: x'd with Gwath, who does have a point, but I don't want to give a wolf a free pass because of newbie status
Shastanis Althreduin
04-19-2009, 08:24 PM
I thought the score was currently 7-3.
Kent is saying that if we kill him and he's innocent, the wolves will either kill an innocent at night or be revenge-killed by Finrod at night. If the wolves kill an innocent, it would end up being 5 - 3; if Finrod suicide-kills a wolf, it would end up being 5 - 2.
X'd with Kent, Gwath, Sally.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 08:25 PM
I thought the score was currently 7-3.
If I go it's 6-3, with a kill it's 5-3. But I actually counted wrong a successful Finrod protection, if Finrod protects, he dies so does a baddie, which makes it 5-2. Unless that baddie is Thuringwethil.
Shastanis Althreduin
04-19-2009, 08:26 PM
Look -
It's 7-3 now.
If we lynch an innocent, that drops to 6 - 3.
The wolves kill an innocent.
The score drops to 5-3.
Or:
The wolves attack someone Finrod was protecting. Finrod kills a wolf, but dies in the process.
The score drops to 5 - 2.
Edit: X'd with Kent
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 08:37 PM
The more I look at it, the less I like this suspicion of Kent. Izzy remarks that Kent seems paranoid, Shasta builds upon that and says he's starting to wonder about Kent, and then Lari actually votes for him. My question is, which one is the wolf? The one who is trying to encourage suspicion of Kent or the one who is taking advantage of already present suspicion to try to get him lynched?
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 08:40 PM
I kind of meant to do this yesterday, though I'd much prefer not to specify why...
-Fea
But you would specify if you were asked?
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 08:45 PM
The one who is trying to encourage suspicion of Kent or the one who is taking advantage of already present suspicion to try to get him lynched?
-Gwath
You reap what you sow, just as I said Kuru put himself in the situation he did, I've blindly done it to myself. Looking at the bonus votes, and seeing the stir up, I am burnt out and more of a hindrance. Plus, I have a unit plan and microteaching assignments this week, so I am really going to be burnt out. It might be best to take me out, because I am innocent, but I think Sally is the wrong person too, and she would be more valuable to have around as an innocent than me.
(This isn't reverse psychology to save me, I swear it, I am literally burnt out from fighting tooth and nail)
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 08:50 PM
Izzy, I've been after Kent most of the game, so while you can accuse me of going for an easy lynch you can not say that I'm jumping onto it. Just sayin'.
Blah, the smell of alcohol and everything in this silly pub is making me ill. Perhaps it would be best that you all lynch me, because then at least I know I won't be killed by Vamp Girl at Night and have the possibility of vote suckage.
EDIT: x'd with Fea. Oh lovely.
Would you agree that 'most of', is at least more than half?
Day 1 - nada word about Kent. Vote for Nienna
Day 2 - nada word about Kent. Didn't vote
Day 3 - #467 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=593465&postcount=467) is I believe your first mention in regards to Kent.
#469 - you say "concerned by the fact that Kent was after Kuru for perhaps being the cobbler and didn't seem to be bothered much by everyone else. Maybe I'm just paranoid or something."
#490 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=593514&postcount=490) - you vote for Kent. With the preceding stated reason of "Okay, I know this is a bit silly but I'm going with my gut." Stating this after the vote; " Again, this is hopefully just a placeholder vote until I get back, but I'm actually getting some vibes from Kent and they're not so shiny."
#496 - says Kent still makes me uneasy, just in general. I don't know what exactly it is, but a lot of the things he's said have made me uneasy and while I don't want to kill him just to find out what he is I'm not going to complain if he ends up dead at the end of the Day, because I keep smelling a Kent....erm, rat.
Day 4 -
#647 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=593813&postcount=647) (you can even scroll up this same page to see this post).
You vote for Kent.
So as far as I can see Kent's really only suspicious of the people who are suspicious of him, and added a couple more people to the list just to hide that fact. He's been overly defensive and paranoid, thinking apparently that everyone who's after him is a wolf. I rather think it's the other way around, and though I'll feel bad if he's innocent I have too strong a vibe from him to let him get away any longer.
I may be mistaken, but you mind pointing out where you 'went after Kent for most of the game'?
The majority of your "suspicions" against Kent came from Day 3. Which they were mostly vague mentions. I don't think you thoroughly analyzed him, or even "went after" him a single time.
So yes, I think if I say that you jumped on an easy lynch - it is completely valid, and supported by your lack of actually going after him.
X'd with Gwath and Kent x2.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 08:53 PM
Tooth and nail, Kent?
Maybe you mean.. claw and fang? xD
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 09:00 PM
'tis a weird day in Werewolf land when the top three living posters are Kent, Izzy, and Gwath.
That is very true. Weird weird weird. Although, I have a lot of short posts, whereas other players have longer ones, but fewer. So it doesn't necessarily mean I've contributed more.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 09:01 PM
If you were to ask me Sally why I am now not suspicious of you, even if I listed you as a possibility at the start of the day, that is because I have been taking note of the collaborative effort to defend me and those turning the attention on you. ;)
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 09:08 PM
Vote Tally.
Nilp -> Sally(4). 5
Greenie -> Sally. 6
Kent -> Nilp(2). 3
Lari -> Kent(2). 3
Sally ->Kent. 4
Fea -> Sally. 7
Sally 7. Kent 4. Nilp 3.
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 09:09 PM
It might be best to take me out, because I am innocent, but I think Sally is the wrong person too, and she would be more valuable to have around as an innocent than me.
Indeed? Well who DO you recommend we lynch?
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 09:10 PM
Ya know Kent.
In one post you say we will lose if you are lynched toDay.
Then you say that it would be better to lynch you.
Which is it?
X'd with Gwath. haha.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 09:15 PM
Gwath, well I voted for Nilp and I have asked about him twice but that had gone ignored twice.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 09:19 PM
I know, it's unreasonable to suspect everyone, but, as demonstrated by the previous two NIGHT kills before last NIGHT, the Three seem to have been relatively unconcerned by the DAY's discussion, killing people who could have easily been lynched the next DAY instead! We need to push everyone, start pointing out little things and hope, somehow, that those with guilty consciences would slip something. It has happened a lot before, after all.
-Nilp
Now if this isn't an evil attempt to white wash the Brinn kill than I don't know what is. She was obviously killed because she falsely claimed to be Finrod, and the baddies bought it. Now maybe you could say, well if Brinn wasn't killed the real Finrod would have stepped out and Brinn would have been lynched. But come on, she claims to be Finrod the baddies have to attack because Finrod can kill one of them with a successful protection, and add on top of that Finrod can't defend himself. Brinn was killed because they fell for her fake Finrod reveal. To try and sweep it under the rug as if they were going for easy lynch targets is fishy...especially since I have said earlier today that I believe I am an easy lynch target. - Kent
Are you sure you didn't misread it Kent? He didn't lump all three kills together. He said "....demonstrated by the previous two NIGHT kills before last NIGHT,..."
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 09:21 PM
Tooth and nail, Kent?
Maybe you mean.. claw and fang? xD
Doctor Who reference? :D
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 09:23 PM
No Gwath.
Just a plain ol' werewolf and Vampire reference. xD
Formendacil
04-19-2009, 09:24 PM
Oh dear... what an Easter week this has been! I realise it is looong past due when I said I'd be back--nearer the 24 than the 12. In my defence, however, the Easter Octave only lasts 8 days, and night's the end. So if I've been deep in the wine and the ice cream and the beer and the smokes and the conversations and the scotch and the chocolate and the pancakes and the sausages (not all at once mind, but that's sort of my day right there...), then I'm not sure I can be blamed.:smokin:
Not, however, that my day would have been much more productive here. I all but came out yesterday as the Seer, but Brinn is the only person--except the Wolves, I'll wager (though they must have known I was the Seer)--who seems to have picked up on this.
Anyway, thanks to Brinn, I had no dream last night, but because she's dead, I know none of my known innocents is Gríma. Of course, Nogrod is dead now, but Fea, Kent, and myself are all still alive, and can't be worse than a Pippin.
As regards the current votee candidates, obviously, I don't hold with voting for Kent, but Sally and Nilp both strike me as possibilities. Isabellkya also worries me, and if those three were the Triumvirate of Pure Evil (tm), I would not be surprised at this point.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 09:25 PM
Oops, well the Brinn kill was a misreading, but that still begs the question of how does he conclude Agan and Firefoot were killed because they were easy lynch targets? Since when he analyzed Firefoot's post he suggested they might have thought Firefoot was Luthien. And with Luthien still out there, I assume that is their primary motive, not to cause confusion by taking out easy lynch candidates.
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 09:25 PM
No Gwath.
Just a plain ol' werewolf and Vampire reference. xD
Oh well. It can be if I want it to.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 09:28 PM
I all but came out yesterday as the Seer, but Brinn is the only person--except the Wolves, I'll wager (though they must have known I was the Seer)--who seems to have picked up on this.
-Formendacil
That is why I dropped my entire case against you yesterday, and didn't mention what you said today, because I wasn't sure if you wanted to remain hidden today or not.
I would feel better about Nilp today, I think his explanations regarding all 3 kills is fishy. I don't like when I had asked about Nilp (though it might have been missed in the mass posting boom), the attention turned from defending me to trying to get Sally. But that's just my opinion.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 09:28 PM
It sure can be.
Why are you revealing now Form?
X'd with Kent.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 09:31 PM
To be perfectly blunt Kent. Perhaps reread the entire game thread?
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 09:37 PM
Oh dear... what an Easter week this has been! I realise it is looong past due when I said I'd be back--nearer the 24 than the 12. In my defence, however, the Easter Octave only lasts 8 days, and night's the end. So if I've been deep in the wine and the ice cream and the beer and the smokes and the conversations and the scotch and the chocolate and the pancakes and the sausages (not all at once mind, but that's sort of my day right there...), then I'm not sure I can be blamed.:smokin:
That's MY kind of Easter: celebratory.
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 09:39 PM
To Izzy: By most of the game I meant most of the game, not all. Big difference.
Now, to something not about me. Gwath's recent behavior is very curious. First (as in first in the last few hours) he semi-agrees with my opinion of Kent, then says 'oh it's okay he's new', then says that he dislikes the suspicion against the New Kid. I mean it's possible he just changed his mind but it still raises an alram bell if you ask me. (Which no one did, but that's not the point.:D)
EDIT: x'd from Formie on. Oh, now that's interesting
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 09:39 PM
So who have you dreamt of, Form?
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 09:41 PM
To be perfectly blunt Kent. Perhaps reread the entire game thread?
Be perfectly blunt...if Nilp is lynched and his role revealed, does that expose you?
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 09:42 PM
Now, to something not about me. Gwath's recent behavior is very curious. First (as in first in the last few hours) he semi-agrees with my opinion of Kent, then says 'oh it's okay he's new', then says that he dislikes the suspicion against the New Kid. I mean it's possible he just changed his mind but it still raises an alram bell if you ask me.
Pardon me? Could you explain again, please?
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 09:43 PM
I have something I'd like to bring up, but I need to find it first. Back soon I hope.
Formendacil
04-19-2009, 09:45 PM
It sure can be.
Why are you revealing now Form?
X'd with Kent.
Because I'm pretty sure at this point the only people who hadn't figured that I was the Seer were most of the Ordos. I trust Kent (as he's one of my Known Innocents), when he says he knew, and if Brinn had me pegged, I'm sure a group of three wolves had at least one member able to peg me too--but the thing with the baddies is that they're looking for Seer clues, so they can feast on Seer.
At this point, I may be the kill tonight (Ranger, if you haven't eaten me yet, that'd be awesome to NOT be the case). That being the case, I won't be able to garner any more information through dreams, so I wanted to make sure my Known Innocents were known--by the innocent part of the village, which was clearly not happening as long as Kent was on the deathlist.
Which means, incidentally, that anyone who voted Kent obviously was obviously not an innocent who had figured I was the Seer--but whether that makes them a clueless innocent or a wolf remains to be seen.
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 09:45 PM
Now, to something not about me. Gwath's recent behavior is very curious. First (as in first in the last few hours) he semi-agrees with my opinion of Kent, then says 'oh it's okay he's new', then says that he dislikes the suspicion against the New Kid. I mean it's possible he just changed his mind but it still raises an alram bell if you ask me. (Which no one did, but that's not the point.:D)
See, what I don't understand is where you think I changed my mind.
Formendacil
04-19-2009, 09:48 PM
So who have you dreamt of, Form?
Have I not made this clear yet?
Fëa, Nogrod, and Kent--all three were "innocent as far as Lúthien could tell"--which means they might have had Gríma among them, but as Brinn has been revealed as Gríma, that's not so.
My dream last night was useless, since Brinn blocked me.
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 09:51 PM
Have I not made this clear yet?
Fëa, Nogrod, and Kent--all three were "innocent as far as Lúthien could tell"--which means they might have had Gríma among them, but as Brinn has been revealed as Gríma, that's not so.
My dream last night was useless, since Brinn blocked me.
Now I see.
Formendacil
04-19-2009, 09:56 PM
Sally and Lari both voted for Kent. Of the two, Sally has struck me as the more suspicious... but I'm wary of under-the-radar voting, and voting for Kent is a tenuous connection at best.
I've got more last-minute Easter Octave celebration waiting... another bottle of wine has been opened, and I'm not likely to get any sudden inspirations at this late hour. So I'm going to put more pressure on the Nilp vote. He was my dream last night, and I may be irked I didn't get an answer.
++ Nilpaurion Felagund (+2)
EDITED TO FIX TAGS, SO AS TO HAVE A VALID VOTE
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 09:57 PM
To Sally.
We will see the result of the Vampire's vote sucking. It will be reflected in the bonus vote tally.
It may just be because it seems to be the current focus of attention.
Yet, I think we all give these Bonus Votes too much credit, and weight.
As if the three's decisions and world only revolve around how to better their situation with the BV's. They have Luthein and Finrod to worry about. As well as any other normal worries, of someone suspecting them and getting them lynched.
If LUthien discovers one of them, you think their BV's could save their mate; without exposing the other two? The longer LuThien is alive, I don't think it really matters how many BV's the three have - as long as LutHien has a smattering of innocents they know about. Then again if LuthIen is alive towards the end with the three, and a few others; who can really predict how many BV's the three and LuthiEn will have with them? No one can truly predict how each day will go, with BV's, Finrod, the three, and LuthieN.
Haha. That was totally for your benefit Kent. xD
X'd with Nog and Green.
Is it just me or does someone have some explaining to do?
(Meta-game note: I'm currently having my pretty much first meal of the day, so please excuse me for a while. Thanks)
EDIT: x'd with Form. By the way, I may be a skeptic but I've considered Form fairly innocent and now that....oh, it's going to be in another post. x'd with form, etc.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 09:57 PM
Even though Sally and Lari voted for me, I would suggest not to vote for them today. Lari I am not sure about, but Sally looks innocent and like I said I found it curious that after my spiritted defenses, both Isabellyka and Gwath turned to Sally and offered her up (following Fea's vote I believe).
I am unsure about Gwath still, but I will point out even though Gwath has been defending me today, I don't think that points to him knowing you were the seer yesterday. Based on the fact that he has just questioned you about it. ;)
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 09:59 PM
To Sally.
Where did I say 'all'?
You haven't even "been after" Kent for a full two days. Which isn't even half of the game Days. Which isn't even "Most". Now, if you've been after him off thread and during the Night I suppose amongst your mates. Then yes, I suppose you could say 'Most'. Biiiig difference between most and not even half.
Kent. I've no idea about Nilp's role. Why don't you tell me?
"I don't like when I had asked about Nilp (though it might have been missed in the mass posting boom), the attention turned from defending me to trying to get Sally. But that's just my opinion." In whom(s) were you referring to in this? Not the time to be insinuating things.
Form. If you think at least one of the wolves had caught on to you, then why weren't you gone after during the Night? I guess because you thought most of the Ordo's had not caught on to you? Well, why didn't the Vampire just kill you last Night - then their kill wouldn't be blocked by Finrod.
X'd since Gwath's #703.
Shastanis Althreduin
04-19-2009, 09:59 PM
...I see. Well, then.
With Form, Kent, and Fea all confirmed innocent (should we choose to believe Form... although since no one has come forward to challenge his reveal I think this should be the case), that leaves...
Izzy
Sally
Lari
Greenie
Gwath
Nilp
as possible voting candidates for me today. I still hold to my suspicion of Gwath, but I can see voting him today would be folly considering the spread of votes so far. I still think that Sally is lynchable today as well, but I should probably go ahead and do a list of all six of them to be sure.
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 10:01 PM
I am unsure about Gwath still, but I will point out even though Gwath has been defending me today, I don't think that points to him knowing you were the seer yesterday. Based on the fact that he has just questioned you about it.
Yeah, I kind of thought he was a wolf.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 10:09 PM
Sally.
Direct response to this...
#466 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=593463&postcount=466)
.....Some may think an ordos job is to vote, let the specials fight it out, and die, but I don't. I will jump right into something, if smiley and punctutation placement can be scrutinized I will call out coded messages and titles. Think twice before anyone tries nifty mind tricks and manuevers. ....
-Kent
What would your point be?
Kent - I've been suspicious of Sally since Day 2. I've voted for her two Days in a row. As I said, perhaps you should reread the entire game thread.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 10:13 PM
Yeah, I kind of thought he was a wolf.
I did consider why he wasn't killed then last night, but with Brinn claiming Finrod, I assumed the wolves bought it and that's why she was killed. To take away the chance of going after Formendacil and having Finrod defend him.
Form. If you think at least one of the wolves had caught on to you, then why weren't you gone after during the Night? I guess because you thought most of the Ordo's had not caught on to you? Well, why didn't the Vampire just kill you last Night - then their kill wouldn't be blocked by Finrod.
-Isabellyka
There are some factors to consider. For example Grima's 'fall ill' or whatever it's called ability. Even if one of the wolves caught onto Formendacil, if Grima caught on, theoretically Grima could block Luthien's ability (which according to Form did happen), they could take out Finrod because Finrod can't defend himself, and not risk being found by Luthien because the ability was blocked by Grima, and be able to get rid of Luthien the next night.
Also, Thuringwethil can't choose a kill every day. It says in the rules that each one of the baddies has to make a selection before one of them can kill again...maybe Thuringwethil made her choice one of the two days before?
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 10:13 PM
Kent - I've been suspicious of Sally since Day 2. I've voted for her two Days in a row. As I said, perhaps you should reread the entire game thread.
And I voted sally yesterDay.
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 10:19 PM
Very true Kent, there is no certain way to determine when each of the Three killed. I would just think that a Luthien kill would trump a Finrod kill. Would they not have to assume that others, including Finrod spotted Luthien? So that is why they went after Finrod instead of Luthien?
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 10:21 PM
And I voted Sally....oh, wait.
Anyway, I can assure you that I'm not evil, I'm just really slow. I think I'll be following Form's vote since he's the only person I can (hopefully) trust. I'll wait around a bit and see what's happening, then go from there.
Gwath still seems off to me, though. Just sayin'. Then again, with my crappy hunches this game, I obviously don't know what the Fangorn Forest is going on.
EDIT: x'd with Izzy.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 10:22 PM
Very true Kent, there is no certain way to determine when each of the Three killed. I would just think that a Luthien kill would trump a Finrod kill. Would they not have to assume that others, including Finrod spotted Luthien? So that is why they went after Finrod instead of Luthien?
-Isabellyka
I have absolutely no idea, but I would agree that Luthien would trump Finrod in the mind of the baddies.
I was wondering why Brinn claimed to be Finrod, but now I think it could actually be to get the real Finrod to reveal. That way as Grima she could have blocked Finrod's power and the wolves could have had a free shot on Luthien. But that didn't work out too well hehe. :D
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 10:23 PM
Sally we've all had very crappy hunches this game. :rolleyes:
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 10:26 PM
Sally we've all had very crappy hunches this game. :rolleyes:
True, but I get frustrated when I'm really wrong, which is why I've been so short and crabby.
My apologies, by the way, Kent. I really did think you were evil, nothing personal, of course.
ETA: Going to do a vote count. Back in a tick.
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 10:27 PM
Gwath still seems off to me, though. Just sayin'. Then again, with my crappy hunches this game, I obviously don't know what the Fangorn Forest is going on.
Earlier you were trying to use my position on Kent as an argument for my guilt. So which is it: a hunch or an argument?
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 10:32 PM
Earlier you were trying to use my position on Kent as an argument for my guilt. So which is it: a hunch or an argument?
Both. A hunch, and that seemed to support it.
A vote count! The number behind the votee indicates total number of votes given at that time, bonus included, by the way.
Nilp-->Sally (5)
Green-->Sally
Kent-->Nilp (3)
Lari-->Kent (3)
Sally-->Kent
Fea-->Sally
Form-->Nilp (3)
Which brings the total to Sally (7), Nilp (6), Kent (4)
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 10:34 PM
(Meta: laptop battery's dying, so this'll be the last from me, at least for toDay)
--Kent
++Nilp (4)
Nilp 11
Sally 7
Kent 3
Village, good luck no matter what you do. Good night.
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 10:34 PM
Both. A hunch, and that seemed to support it.
It's hardly a "crappy" hunch if you have an argument to support it, metthinks.
Shastanis Althreduin
04-19-2009, 10:35 PM
Nilp -> Sally(4). 5
Greenie -> Sally. 6
Kent -> Nilp(2). 3
Lari -> Kent(2). 3
Sally ->Kent. 4
Fea -> Sally. 7
Form -> Nilp(2). 6
Sally - 7
Nilp - 6
Kent - 4
You mean you'll follow Form's vote because it will save you, Sally? :p
Izzy - She's speaking sense today, but with Kent revealed innocent, I'm unsure whether to think she's a sensible innocent or a sensible wolf. Voting priority - 4.
Sally - From her slips near the beginning of the game and her willingness to follow other people here near the end game, I'm really thinking she's a good wolf/vampire candidate. Voting priority - 1.
Lari - Is suspicious of me even though she hasn't been around too much. I'd need to see more of her to formulate an opinion. Voting priority - 3.
Greenie - I suspected her early on, and I haven't seen an awful lot to change my mind, but she speaks sense. I don't want to vote her. Voting priority - 6.
Gwath - I feel pretty confident of his guilt based on what I've said the past couple days. However, he's nowhere close to being executed today, and Sally, whom I suspect almost as much, is a possibility for execution. Voting priority - 2.
Nilp - I think he's innocent, but Form apparently sees something and was dreaming him last night. I'm not going to vote him today, though. Voting priority - 5.
So in the following order...
Sally
Gwath
Lari
Izzy
Nilp
Greenie
...meaning I'll probably be voting Sally today.
Edit; X'ed with everything on this page.
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 10:35 PM
It's hardly a "crappy" hunch if you have an argument to support it, metthinks.
Good to know you're okay with me wanting to lynch you? :rolleyes:
Really going now. Sleep well, dear village. :)
~~Sally~~
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 10:36 PM
My apologies, by the way, Kent. I really did think you were evil, nothing personal, of course.
Nothing to forgive. :) If my combative attitude has come off mean, I am a naturally intense person, that's something I have to work on. The weakness that appeared most in the Evals filled out by students was I need to smile and relax more. :rolleyes:
satansaloser2005
04-19-2009, 10:38 PM
Nothing to forgive. :) If my combative attitude has come off mean, I am a naturally intense person, that's something I have to work on. The weakness that appeared most in the Evals filled out by students was I need to smile and relax more. :rolleyes:
Meh, I've just been out of it so I've not really been myself either. It happens. :D
Gah, really really going now. I know, I'm silly.
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 10:42 PM
Good to know you're okay with me wanting to lynch you? :rolleyes:
My point was that you have not held a consistent position regarding your suspicion of me. First you said that I looked suspicious for changing my mind about Kent (which I did not do). Then you said you had a crappy hunch. THEN you said you had a hunch which was supported by good arguments. It looks to me like you can't keep your own story straight.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 10:53 PM
My point was that you have not held a consistent position regarding your suspicion of me. First you said that I looked suspicious for changing my mind about Kent (which I did not do). Then you said you had a crappy hunch. THEN you said you had a hunch which was supported by good arguments. It looks to me like you can't keep your own story straight.
Maybe I'm fooled by the straight forwardness, because this is my first go, but I trust Sally's innocent claims. Even though she has been all over the place with you, this last two hours have seen a big burst of activity and right now what you are reading might look like an evil Sally, but in a few hours or maybe the next day when you read over it again, you might think 'wow where did I get that interpretation?'
Anyway I think my point is, you are not in any trouble of getting lynched today, I admit to becoming significantly less confident about your innocence, but there several things to believe you are innocent, and maybe you and Sally are having your senses skewed by the crazy last couple hours.
I think it would be a mistake to lynch her or you today, the difference is you are not in trouble, she still is.
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 10:55 PM
(+2) to Nilp
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 10:55 PM
Yeah, MAYBE.
EDIT: Crossed with Kent 1x
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 10:58 PM
I think it would be a mistake to lynch her or you today, the difference is you are not in trouble, she still is.
Yeah, but if she's evil, we WANT her to be in trouble.
Shastanis Althreduin
04-19-2009, 10:59 PM
I'm not sure if Kent needed to seal Nilp's fate like that, but it makes my vote summarily worthless.
++Gwathagor
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 10:59 PM
Well, whatever, I'm voting my mind.
++Sally
Isabellkya
04-19-2009, 11:00 PM
++Sally(4)
Kent2010
04-19-2009, 11:00 PM
I'm not sure if Kent needed to seal Nilp's fate like that, but it makes my vote summarily worthless.
-Shasta
I just wanted to use all mine and not let Thuringwethil steal my last two away. :D
Gwathagor
04-19-2009, 11:01 PM
I'm not sure if Kent needed to seal Nilp's fate like that, but it makes my vote summarily worthless.
Yeah, same here.
Shastanis Althreduin
04-19-2009, 11:01 PM
+2 to Sally
Edit: Blast. After the deadline.
Mirandir
04-19-2009, 11:06 PM
Mkay, enough with the posting for now.
Sally is dead. She was an ordo.
Shasta's vote doesn't count because a) it was after deadline and b) you can't add bonus votes for someone you didn't vote for.
Narration will be up sometime tomorrow since Mira is about to keel over from sleepiness.
Shastanis Althreduin
04-19-2009, 11:11 PM
Um, my actual vote was for Gwath at 11:59. Don't modkill me because I failed to add bonus votes! :(
Mirandir
04-20-2009, 06:05 AM
Your vote for Gwath counts, just not the bonus votes for sally. So no worries. :D
Mirandir
04-20-2009, 08:44 PM
The group of Downers was beginning to get hostile. Insults were tossed around like rotten fruit at a bad comedy show. Things were said that were less than nice. Had there been small animals around, they probably would have gotten kicked.
Kent was beginning to get on people's nerves. A few votes were thrown out for him, some retracted.
Shasta and Izzy chimed in right as the clock struck deadline, sealing poor sally's fate.
"Why does everyone want me dead?!" Sally cried, shielding her head instinctively. "I'm just an ordo!"
An icy chill swept through the room as sally fell the the ground with a deadish thud. The others watched intently, waiting for an indication that she was evil. No such sign came, however. Another innocent was dead.
Mirandir
04-20-2009, 10:41 PM
In the dark of the Night the villagers slept uneasily. Most were unsettled by the relative silence of the Day. There was one, however, that could not seek refuge in the solace of slumber. Form, plagued by the dreams he had been having, stumbled around in the dark. He knew he had little time left and was attempting to figure out how to make the most of what he did have.
His reverie was about to be interrupted, however. The form of a villager possessed by one of the evil sprits was also awake. Form didn't hear a thing as the old fashioned candlestick holder was raised above his head and brought down with a sickening thud. As his body fell to the ground, an orb of blue light detached itself from his physical form and disappeared into the space where the portal to the other world had been.
Form had been telling the truth. The spirit of Luthien had been sent back to its rightful plane. The village had lost another member.
THE LIVING
Fea (6)
Green (10)
Gwath (10)
Izzy (4)
Kent (0)
Lari (5)
Nilp (3)
Shasta (10)
THE DEAD
Nienna (10) (Ordo, Day 1 lynch)
Aganzir (9) (Ordo, Night 2 kill)
Alonariel (10) (Ordo, modfire)
Firefoot (10) (Ordo, Night 3 kill)
Nogrod (5) (Ordo, Day 3 lynch)
Kuruharan (0) (Beren, Day 2 lynch)
Brinniel (0) (Grima, Night 4 kill)
Sally (6) (Ordo, Day 4 lynch)
Formendacil (0) (Luthien, Night 5 kill)
Score: 5-3
Isabellkya
04-20-2009, 11:54 PM
I think the Vampire killed Form last Night.
Which, if we make it to toMorrow. We will know whom the Vampire is and thus have an automatic voting target.
Bad news about that, they've five extra bonus votes.
The other good news, is that the next two Nights the Vampire can not thwart Finrod.
The other other good news - of course I'm choosing to look on the bright side of this seeming dismal situation - is that we now know the vote sucking has occurred, so we don't have to worry about losing our votes.
I think it imperative that we lynch ourselves a Wolf toDay.
Nilpaurion Felagund
04-20-2009, 11:54 PM
If Green, Gwath, and Shasta are our Wolves, then it's game over already.
End our misery, then.
Nilpaurion Felagund
04-20-2009, 11:58 PM
Oh, and Form voted for me, which must mean something. :D
DAY 4 vote list in next post.
Isabellkya
04-21-2009, 12:03 AM
I think part of the reason he voted for you was because his dream of you was blocked by Brin.
Why would it be game over?
Kent2010
04-21-2009, 12:10 AM
Form's votes have been taken by Thuringwethil, not to be bleak, but it's game over. Unless someone can devise a plan to use our remaining bonus votes, to prevent Thuringwethil from altering the outcome, and still have enough bonus to take out the two other baddies the next two days, this one's over.
Isabellkya
04-21-2009, 12:16 AM
Do you think the wolves would be bold and openly put all of their bonus votes towards another just to lynch them?
Let alone confident that they've got the game in the bag?
Kent2010
04-21-2009, 12:58 AM
Well two of you are already revealed, there's no use in hiding it Isabellyka - you and Nilp being baddies that is.
The question is which is the devious third at the end of voting yesterday - Gwath or Shasta?
Edit: Shasta is supposed to be bolded, there's no special code. I'm just tired and have to be at work in an hour, and will leave him italicized. :p
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