WWLXII: Dead Men Do Tell Tales

[Rikae]

At th' risk o' somebody thinkin' I'm gettin' uppity fer havin' an opinion:

I seen this here problem on another ship once: one pirate was goin' overboard, an' th' mutineers were th' ones arguin' that we should lynch somebody else, too. I tried t' convince th' crew that we'd give ourselves one more day by lynchin' th' doomed one - one more day for findin' th' mutineers.

So, although I complained 'bout wastin' my vote, maybe it ain't wasted after all. Ef we have two deaths t'day (or t'night) that's a day we lose, an' later on we'll know more an' choose better (even statistically). So mebbe we'd best lynch Mira after all.

Yes, Nog, we'll only win this by lynchin', but only by lynchin' th' right people. Now it's still very much a shot in th' dark, but later, th' odds and our knowledge will be better - usin' the lnch on Mira t'day saves us an extra day at t' end o' th' game, when we can make our lynch count.

[Boromir88]

So let's lynch Nogrod? See what I said about the mutineers wishing to do at the previous page: some should be lynched to keep people insecure about their status? Didn't you Boro just say you'd like to let the mutineers do the choices, why you'd wish otherwise with me?~Nogrod
If you're a mutineer yes...

I'm not sure what your point is, I'm considering the options...

Should it be Mira, to avoid losing 2-people?

Should it be Nogrod, who I have only a gut feeling is a mutineer based on behavior and the end of Day 1 voting.

Should it be Rikae, who I have a theory is a co-conspirator, based on all the mixed and twisted words?

Should it be Shasta whose vote I took as a challenge?

Why are you acting like I'm speaking in absolutes with regards to you?

Edit: crossed with Rikae...exactly! (and I'm sure this is going to be taken as we're working together, but who cares? I don't, sorry.)

[Gwathagor]

I be takin' a second shot at that thar Shasta-Rikae-Annu-Kath tussle (was thar anyone else involved that I be missin'?). It's the sort of spot I'd be expectin' to find a mutineer.

As far as I be able to navigate it, Rikae's initial challenge to Shasta's "pros and cons of lynching LG" post be seemin' pretty rational and tame, especially when it be comparrrred to Shasta's initial defense, which be strikin' my flint as awrful abrupt - particularly if you be considerin' that Shasta proceeds to get into it with Rikae, while if anyone had twisted Shasta's words, it was Annu. Annu probably be lookin' the worst of the gang of 'em - s/he latches onto Rikae's post like a crab onto a fish and then be takin' it a league or two farther, and then goin' on to vote Shasta in his/her second post. Now that looks suspicious, if you be askin' this honest seaman's opinion - a far sight more suspicious 'n Shasta, Rikae, or Kath. Kath doesn't do much - she just be mentionin' that Rikae's twistin' Shasta's words, which I be disagreein' with, although I think I be seein' how it could seem that way. I do think she is attributin' motives, at least at first, and reading into Shasta's remarks - but she takes a less negative stance toward our first mate later on, which, to my spyglass, makes her looks awrful reasonable. Based on the exchange, I be thinkin' that Shasta's an innocent experiencin' a case o' righteous indignation (rare enough in these parts), that Rikae's a shrewd innocent, and that Annu's either a lazy son of gun or a black-hearted, opportunistic, privateerin' mutineer. Kath could be goin' either way, hard to tell from her brief involvement. Regardin' Annu, I'm leanin' towards guilty. Sure, Annu admits that his/her reasons are weak, but I be thinkin' they're weaker than s/he be admittin'.

[Gwathagor]

I wonder if th' whole 'isterical womin thing - th' "intense" n' "over-the-top" tone folks seem t' read into me posts would 'ave been there if I''d orig'nally signed up t' th' 'downs pretendin' I was a fella. Just sayin'.

Because I really don't enjoy being accused of a tone I'm not using. That's all.

For all it be worth, I don't think your tone's been particularly intense or anythin'. I warn't meanin' to sound like I was sayin' so. Sorry!

[Macalaure]

Almost known innocent:
Nerwen

Fairly good feeling:
Rikae
Boro

Not sure, but tend to trust:
Sally
Kath
Mith

Simply no idea:
Wilwa
Mirandir
Isabellkya
Eonwe

A bit doubtful about:
Inziladun (can't put my finger on it, but some vague bad feeling)
Shasta (might be conspirator)
Annu (see Inzy)
Gwath (can't put him anywhere, which makes me nervous in his case)
Nogrod (can't shake it off)

Suspicious:
Eomer (more confused about him than really suspicious, but I have no one better...)

++Eomer

I admit, though, that voting with Nogrod gives me a bit of a toothache...

[Brinniel]

In that case it might be even more beneficial to make Mira go ghostly. I mean we won't know her role, but if she's having computer issues, she won't be posting as a ghost anyway, we won't have to worry about her role anymore (even if it only is for an extra day), and we would spare our Cap'n from having to mod-fire someone.
Yeah, I don't think I'd reveal her role anyway since that would defeat my purpose of the game. All players have to be killed twice to have their role revealed, regardless of cause of death. Though thinking about it, mod-fire isn't quite as bad as it usually is since Mira could still participate if she ever returns, so I'm not completely cutting her out of the game. Though like any other mod-fire, it still does affect the innocent: baddie ratio.

Anyway, as of this moment Mira is still in the game. Once deadline hits, I'll give a final decision about mod-firing her.

[Gwathagor]

Suspicious:
Eomer (more confused about him than really suspicious, but I have no one better...)

++Eomer

I admit, though, that voting with Nogrod gives me a bit of a toothache...


Care to explain? Where be all this suspicion of Eomer spewin' from? I've been feelin' stupid not knowin' why Eomer is supposed to be suspicious. What has he done, even?

[Boromir88]

++Mira

I'm being ultra conservative on this ship, so sue me...voting for someone who's very doubtful to return, we avoid essentially what would be a double lynching if we chose someone else, which means we get an extra day. Also we won't have to spend another day thinking about should we lynch Mira, or let her go, also who's to say she's not a mutineer?

[Inziladun]

Care to explain? Where be all this suspicion of Eomer spewin' from? I've been feelin' stupid not knowin' why Eomer is supposed to be suspicious. What has he done, even?

I'm not easy abou' him because 'o his two Mira votes w/ no explanation.

[Rikae]

Thanks, Gwath.

An' ever'body give some thought t' votin' Mira, like I said. An' Mac, I'd like t' know why ye be votin' fer Eomer, too.

[Gwathagor]

++Mira

I'm being ultra conservative on this ship, so sue me...voting for someone who's very doubtful to return, we avoid essentially what would be a double lynching if we chose someone else, which means we get an extra day. Also we won't have to spend another day thinking about should we lynch Mira, or let her go, also who's to say she's not a mutineer?

Well now, Boro matey.

I was thinkin' on votin' for Annu, but now you've made realize that lynchin' Mira would buy us another day, at any rate. And there is always the off-chance that she could be a mutineer or a co-conspirator.

[Boromir88]

Care to explain? Where be all this suspicion of Eomer spewin' from? I've been feelin' stupid not knowin' why Eomer is supposed to be suspicious. What has he done, even?

He pops in, votes for Mira two days in a row and goes, I can see the suspicious reasons.

But, for me, I interpret it as Eomer being a bored ordinary. Usually with any type of special role (good or evil) Eomer is in the thick of the action...he's always confusing of course, and you always wonder what he's up to, but he's always right there, if you know what I mean.

[Isabellkya]

Are you trying to find out how many people can be gotten rid of in one day Boro? *insert one eyebrow raise*

I've no intention of making a record stat anytime soon.


Why do you think those two are baddies Shasta?


Rikae, I think if you'd signed up as a guy - it would be called "dueling".


Voting alongside one of your suspects Mac?

I think Eomer has only posted song-like posts.


X'd since #258.
Edit2. Took out a rogue i.

[Boromir88]

I was thinkin' on votin' for Annu, but now you've made realize that lynchin' Mira would buy us another day, at any rate. And there is always the off-chance that she could be a mutineer or a co-conspirator.~Gwath
Hmm...I'm actually going to go and look at Annu, I admit to just scanning his posts so far and didn't realize he was also involved in the 'word twisting' earlier...

[Inziladun]

Thanks, Gwath.

An' ever'body give some thought t' votin' Mira, like I said. An' Mac, I'd like t' know why ye be votin' fer Eomer, too.

Well now, Boro matey.

I was thinkin' on votin' for Annu, but now you've made realize that lynchin' Mira would buy us another day, at any rate. And there is always the off-chance that she could be a mutineer or a co-conspirator.

Sorry fer bein' a poor addled pilot, but I jus' don't see th' point 'a goin' fer Mira. What's she done, anyway? Buys us another day? 'N meanwhile th' baddies get another un' of us toNight.

[Inziladun]

Vote must be now.

++ Annu

[Isabellkya]

Nerwen -> Zil
Mith -> Nog
Annu -> Shasta
Rikae -> Shasta 2
Kath -> Annu
Eomer -> Mira
Shata -> Rikae
Wilwa -> Eonwe
Rikae -- Shasta
-> Mira 2
Nog -> Eomer
Mac -> Eomer 2
Boro -> Mira 3
Zil -> Annu 2


Mira 3. Annu, Eomer, Shasta 2. Zil, Rikae, Nog 1.

[Gwathagor]

Sorry fer bein' a poor addled pilot, but I jus' don't see th' point 'a goin' fer Mira. What's she done, anyway? Buys us another day? 'N meanwhile th' baddies get another un' of us toNight.

Seriously, matey, what be the odds that we're gonna get us a mutineer today? If Mira's going to be modfired anyway, then why risk lynchin' two innocents by votin' for Eomer or Annu or whoever? (Though I be ponderin' votin' for the latter meself.) That's the point.

[Isabellkya]

Right now I'm debating between Sally, Nog, and Mac.

Sally - For her voting of Shasta yesterDay after saying it wouldn't be a good idea.

Nog - Because it isn't his usual self. When ever I see him as his usual self, he is on the innocent side. So mostly feeling of his behaviour thus far.

Mac - Because his voting is... a bit whack, and looks like bandwagon votes. Voting alongside a seemginly top suspect of yours, even though it gives you a toothache?


X'd with Gwath.

[Macalaure]

I happen to be with Nogrod about Mira. We can only lynch mutineers if we try to. Lynching Mira will cost us one opportunity to do that.

I voted for Eomer because, looking at his two vote-posts, I have a hard time imagining him innocent. I do think he's more likely a conspirator than a mutineer, but if I have a choice between lynching a conspirator and shooting into the dark, I do the former.

But, for me, I interpret it as Eomer being a bored ordinary.I've heard that kind of reasoning before. Being an ordo isn't always fun. But if one is bored, then one can simply stir up the pot (I, for example, enjoy acting somewhat suspicious when ordinary and bored). Just making less than a handful of posts in two days means either that the person is up to no good or that the person has maybe played a game too much. No offense to anybody, seriously, but if you're not motivated to play if you're an ordo, then you shouldn't play - because chances are you will be one (about 55%, to be more precise :cool: ).

[Boromir88]

Are you trying to find out how many people can be gotten rid of in one day Boro? *insert one eyebrow raise*~Izzy
hehe, just wonderin' if you would be joining us on the ship this stormy evening. :p (well it's been storm out on my part of the ship!)

Sorry fer bein' a poor addled pilot, but I jus' don't see th' point 'a goin' fer Mira. What's she done, anyway? Buys us another day? 'N meanwhile th' baddies get another un' of us toNight.~Inziladun
I don't know if you have been on a boat where double-lynches were allowed during the day. It's where two people can get lynched if they are tied in votes, and those mostly turn out bad, because wolves happen to love double lynches, they take out two people in one day, thus shortening the total days they need for victory.

Since we are already pretty much guaranteed to lose Mira, whether it be tonight, or tomorrow, if we chose someone else, that would virtually be like a double-lynching...am I wrong? Mira hasn't done anything wrong, her computer is just evil, but that doesn't change the fact that she can't be here and could be killed off anyway. And whether we decide to lynch Mira or someone else, the wolves will get a kill choice...which means we risk losing 3 people in one day, not good.

Maybe Mira is a wolf...maybe we chose someone else and he/she is a wolf. Who knows? But I would rather keep the death numbers down at this point, so we don't have a double-lynching (by double-lynching I mean losing Mira to mod-fire and lynching whoever else is decided) and thus getting an extra day.

[Gwathagor]

I happen to be with Nogrod about Mira. We can only lynch mutineers if we try to. Lynching Mira will cost us one opportunity to do that.



Aye, aye, that's true, thar be no denin' it. I reckon you be feelin' pretty confident about your vote, then?

[Boromir88]

I happen to be with Nogrod about Mira. We can only lynch mutineers if we try to. Lynching Mira will cost us one opportunity to do that.~Mira
Why so sure about Mira's role? She could be a mutineer just as like as she could be innocent. Just because someone's computer crashed doesn't mean she is all of a suddenly innocent.

[Nerwen]

So I am inclined to believe Greenie, and therefore trust Nerwen (though she could still be a cobbler right?). But it could help us to kill her a second time cause then we'd either see she is the spy and have a known innocent in Nerwen, or see that she is a cobbler and get rid of a baddie who's oppinion can't sway us negatively any longer. But it may also be a good idea to keep that as an option for when we're more desperate for information.

Aye, I'd be leavin' it fer later, lass. Be different if she ha' an aggressor for us.

You speak for the rest of the crew now, do you? If I "slipped up" by asking a question, then please, by all means lynch me for showing curiosity.

No one's asked me, but I'll avoid Rikae and her attempt to distract me and say it anyway; while I don't at all advocate mass double-lynching, I think in this case, with Greenie claiming to be our Spy, it could be a good idea. If she is the Spy, she can't help us with her role any more, and either way we get information on Nerwen.

Shark Tooth be still a'carryin' on wi' his pecul'ar lay o' double-killin' th' powder-monkey. He be gettin' main agitated too.

So be th' Cabin Boy:

I wonder if th' whole 'isterical womin thing - th' "intense" n' "over-the-top" tone folks seem t' read into me posts would 'ave been there if I''d orig'nally signed up t' th' 'downs pretendin' I was a fella. Just sayin'.

Ease off a point! Who be accusin' of ye?

Arrrr, ye be close to a known innocent at this point, so, if ye say so, I will let him be for now, although he literally begs for me vote.

Nay, ye'd best be makin' up yer own mind. I ha' no special knowledge o' yon gunner's role, remember. I were but sayin' that his confusion 'bout yer "confessin'" seemed to ha' nowt in't to me.

EDIT:X'd wi' a host.

[Gwathagor]

Well, I be votin' now. I'm awrful suspicious of Annu, but I'm gonna put it off until tomorrer, so:

++Mira

[Isabellkya]

++ Mac

I've got to vote now.
He feels the foulest of the three, for previously stated reasons.

X'd with Gwath.

[Macalaure]

Why so sure about Mira's role?I'm not. As you can see from my list up there, I don't know about her at all. But she will most probably be modfired, so she will be dead anyway. Why waste the lynch opportunity?

[Rikae]

I happen to be with Nogrod about Mira. We can only lynch mutineers if we try to. Lynching Mira will cost us one opportunity to do that.


Mac, you should know better. We'd still have the opportunity, and when we could better use it (sorry, too tired for attempting pirate speak).

If we lose 2 people today (or 3 today/tonight) instead of 1 (or 2), if we're lucky, we're getting rid of an aggressor, but if we're not - we're losing two innocents. We're already probably losing one (because an aggressor would be less likely to quit).

If we lose 2 innocents in a day, that's one less day until the aggressors can win - and our odds of lynching one of them get better later in the game. Think about it - it just doesn't make sense to have 2 deaths on Day 2, when we're basically clueless, and lose the possibility of a day n that we might need.

[Boromir88]

I'm not. As you can see from my list up there, I don't know about her at all. But she will most probably be modfired, so she will be dead anyway. Why waste the lynch opportunity?~Mac
We're technically not wasting one though, we are just delaying the oppurtunity for a day. We're really just looking at the same thing from two different ways...either we take the oppurtunity today, lynch someone else and lose Mira (that amounts to a doube lynching) as well as all likely hood losing someone else at night from the wolf kill. Or we pass the oppurtunity, but gain it back by avoding losing 2 people in one day, and thus gain the oppurtunity back.

[Macalaure]

Nerwen -> Inzy
Mith -> Nogrod
Annu -> Shasta
Rikae -> Shasta (2)
Kath -> Annu
Eomer -> Mira
Shasta -> Rikae
Wilwa -> Eonwe
Rikae -- Shasta (1) -> Mira (2)
Nogrod -> Eomer
Mac -> Eomer (2)
Boro -> Mira (3)
Inzy -> Annu (2)
Gwath -> Mira (4)
Izzy -> Mac

Mira 4, Eomer, Annu 2, plenty o' 1's.

[Nerwen]

I were considerin' switchin' me vote to Shark Tooth Shasty, for I be not likin' the sound o' he toDay. But if ye be all set to vote fer som-un as is goin' to jump ship anyhow, 'tis no p'int me switchin'.

[Macalaure]

Too tired to go into this in much detail, but

We're technically not wasting one though, we are just delaying the oppurtunity for a day.

Not necessarily. We are saving one kill, that means we gain one phase, not one day.

[Nerwen]

Look, ye dogs, if ye be goin' to waste the vote entire, we may as well follow Shasty's advice o' lynchin' th' powder-monkey!

[Brinniel]

Deadline. Mirandir has been lynched. Looks mod-fire won't be necessary after all.

I don't think I'll be writing the narration tonight as I worked today a nine hour shift on my feet which means I am tired and hurting. The narration probably won't be written until shortly before the Night's deadline since I intern during the day, but it shouldn't be too much of a problem since no new info will be given. My apologies as I hate not writing a narration right away, but considering I'm having trouble keeping my eyes open, it probably wouldn't be too decent anyway. :rolleyes:

[Brinniel]

Th' crew was slightly disheartened by th' death 'o their claimed spy. It didn't help that they couldn't completely take her word fer it; while some did, others were more cautious. Thar would be no way to be knowin' th' staggerin' drunk's true alignment so long as her ghost wandered th' ship.

Th' second day was just as intense as th' first, if not more, as th' crewmembers began to turn on each other, one by one. Mira Blythe couldn't take th' insanity. Halfway through th' day, she fell silent 'n as she stared out into th' sea, she wondered if she would be better off in Davy Jones' treasure chest. But she did not jump, as this day th' sea looked cold 'n uninvitin' while th' deck remained warm 'n gleamin'.

Meanwhile, th' other crewmembers were not grog-filled wit' Dancin' Mira's self-removal from th' conflict at hand.
"'Tis not fair," complained Boromir th' Malformed. "She's not even tryin' to help figure out who the culprits be. We'll never get anythin' done if not all hands participate."
"Aye," Puffy Shirt Rikae agreed. "We might as well murder her. 'tis not like she wants to stick around anyway."
'An so it was decided that Mira Blythe would be th' next to be off.

"But how we dispose 'o her?" wondered Cowerin' Gwath.
Th' crew scratched their heads as they attempted to come up wit' a clever execution.
"Ooh ooh, I be knowin'!" cried out Eomer Bonny. "If Dancin' Mira loves to dance so much, why not gift her some proper dancin' shoes?" He held up a pair 'o iron shoes. "Poop Deck Kath 'n me can even provide th' music."

Dancin' Mira's dancin' shoes were fitted 'n prepared as they sat under some steamin' coals. When th' iron began to glow orange, they were ready to be placed on th' striker's feet. Th' musicians began to play; Poop Deck Kath piped a jolly tune while Whinin' Eomer screeched on his violin what th' crew could only assume were notes. Once th' shoes were on her feet, Dancin' Mira immediately hopped up 'n started to dance a jig. Th' crew clapped 'n cheered as she hopped up 'n down shriekin' from th' pain, her feet beginnin' to sizzle. Th' others enjoyed it so much, they didn't notice that Mira Blythe had shifted her jig towards th' edge 'o th' deck. "Ow, ow, ow," Dancin' Mira gritted through her teeth, but she continued to put on a fake smile purely fer entertainment reasons. Her feet nearly seared to th' bone, suddenly th' cold sea did not look so uninvitin'. As she neared th' ship's railin', she grabbed hold 'n threw herself over. Dancin' Mira disappeared wit' a splash followed by a hiss.

"Well, I guess that takes care 'o it," Mac Sparrow shrugged.
"Not quite," answered a voice.
Th' crew turned around to find a extra wet seaweed-covered Mira Blythe standin' behind them.
"Shiver me timbers," gasped Shark Tooth Shasta.
"Ye were just- how did ye get back up here?" gaped Ham-Hands Izzy.
Dancin' Mira shrugged. "I be in Davy Jones' treasure chest, remember? Cursed to walk th' ship among all th' other ghosts hearty thanks to ye lot."
It was yet another reminder to th' crew that death would not necessarily solve all their problems.


The Living:

-Legless Sally Dawkins ~ Carpenter
-Puffy Shirt Rikae ~ Cabin Boy
-Pirate Lommy the Infected ~ Quartermaster
-Gangrenous Inziladun Jones ~ Pilot
-Pirate Boromir the Malformed ~ Gunner
-Stutterin’ Wilwa Scab ~ Cook
-Shark Tooth Shasta ~ First mate
-High-Pitched Annu ~ Surgeon
-Whinin’ Eomer Bonny ~ Musician (Pur-loined Violin)
-Snifflin’ Mac Sparrow ~ Cooper
-Almost-Blind Nerwen ~ Navigator/Sea Artist
-Poop Deck Kath ~ Musician (Pipe)
-Cowerin' Gwath Slasher ~ Powder Monkey
-Pirate Nogrod the Fashionably Late ~ Gunner
-Ham-Hands Izzy ~ Striker
-Short Ruth Mithril ~ Cook
-Stinkin' Eön Bloodbeard ~ Powder Monkey


The Ghosted:

-Black Death Brinn ~ Captain ~ shish kabobed (mod)
-Slippery McCabbie Dagger ~ Boatswain ~ danced the hempen jig
-Lil' Green the Staggering Drunk ~ Powder Monkey ~ drank up all the rum
-Dancin' Mira Blythe ~ Striker ~ danced her way off the deck


Night 3 has begun. Aggressors, protectors, spies, avengers, whatever....do what you need to do.

[Brinniel]

That nightfall when Eomer Bonny returned to his bunk, he noticed his violin had gone missin'. Frantically he searched all around him, but it was nowhere to be found.
"Lookin' fer somethin'?" said a voice from behind.
Eomer Bonny turned around to find a hidden form holdin' his violin.
"Avast, thar, ye be pur-loinin' me violin," he accused.
"Me pur-loinin'?" replied th' mysterious form. "Maybe. But I believe it was ye who pur-loined it first."
"So what if I did? I be a scurvy pirate. What else do ye expect?"
Th' stranger shrugged. "Nothin' different, really, I suppose. But that don't change th' fact that I be goin' to murder ye."

Th' next mornin', th' crew arose to discover th' body 'o Eomer Bonny lyin' next to his bunk. An E-string was wrapped tightly around his neck 'n a bow protruded from his chest. Next to him lay his violin, smashed into pieces.
"Now how th' kraken did we sleep through that?" Sally Dawkins wondered aloud.
Eomer Bonny stirred, then open his eyes only to spy wit' his eye th' remains 'o his precious instrument.
"Oh begad," he moaned. "They just had to be off 'bout ruinin' me pur-loined violin too, didn't they?"
"Huzzah fer that," voiced Short Ruth Mith. Th' other hands couldn't agree more.


The Living:

-Legless Sally Dawkins ~ Carpenter
-Puffy Shirt Rikae ~ Cabin Boy
-Pirate Lommy the Infected ~ Quartermaster
-Gangrenous Inziladun Jones ~ Pilot
-Pirate Boromir the Malformed ~ Gunner
-Stutterin’ Wilwa Scab ~ Cook
-Shark Tooth Shasta ~ First mate
-High-Pitched Annu ~ Surgeon
-Snifflin’ Mac Sparrow ~ Cooper
-Almost-Blind Nerwen ~ Navigator/Sea Artist
-Poop Deck Kath ~ Musician (Pipe)
-Cowerin' Gwath Slasher ~ Powder Monkey
-Pirate Nogrod the Fashionably Late ~ Gunner
-Ham-Hands Izzy ~ Striker
-Short Ruth Mithril ~ Cook
-Stinkin' Eön Bloodbeard ~ Powder Monkey


The Ghosted:

-Black Death Brinn ~ Captain ~ shish kabobed (mod)
-Slippery McCabbie Dagger ~ Boatswain ~ danced the hempen jig
-Lil' Green the Staggering Drunk ~ Powder Monkey ~ drank up all the rum
-Dancin' Mira Blythe ~ Striker ~ danced her way off the deck
-Whinin’ Eomer Bonny ~ Musician (Pur-loined Violin) ~ his pur-loined violin pur-loined him (or rather, his life)


Day 3 has begun. Now be off on 'n yak ye wee hearts out.

[Isabellkya]

Eomer huh?

Did they think he had a special role or something?
Or just looking to confuse us all around.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

I'll be pur-loinin' a new vio-lin fer ye come next landfall, Ghostomer. 'M prob'ly the on'y scurvy dog what aperciated yer musical ability. :(

[satansaloser2005]

++Shasta


See, me mateys, it be a friend's birthday today (well, yesterday now) and I be going out with her tomorrow (well, today now). I not be risking th' wrath of th' capn' by not voting again, so I place me vote for me currently favorite suspect. I be willing to change it if ye can give me a new hammer and a good reason, but for now I best be heading to bed. Sleep ho!

[Nogrod]

Eomer?

Hmm, that's an interesting choice... although it fits at least one reasonable pattern. Like I've said already, the mutineers would be likely to kill by Nights people who could be sensible voters (independent-minded) but would not post much thus leaving the more talkative people to be lynched as it would fit their intentions leaving those people in the insecurity "trustwise" that follows from the lynches.

So they took Boro's explanation for Eomer's behaviour at face value and thought he was a bored ordo and would thus not help us after being dead with his "most likely a goodie"-status?

Okay. Here's my challenge to you Eomer: prove them wrong and become an active one!

I'll go and distill the potato-mash I made yesterday. Vodka on offer in just a short while!

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Ee, well, howdy all. It ain't so different being dead, so it seems. :p

Ok, first things first: I ain't barely had a moment to spare in the last few days, and nor will I in the next couple! Mayhaps I'll be freeer after that. That be why I post so little. But I ain't dropping out: long as you post once a day and vote then you've just as much a right to be here.

As for Mirandir, I honestly can't remember why I voted thatway first day; but certainly on the second day Mira's post investigating Greenie's slaying struck me as highly suspicious. Not useful but trying to give the impression of being useful. That's what I thought. Plus nothing else really struck me.

Not sure why I put it in rhyme form but it seemed a good idea at the time. :cool:

[Nogrod]

Lemme be straight with you soon again drunken bastards about the issues from yesterDay. As I’m going to pass out soon I’d like to share my thoughs on the issue.

Everytime we lynch someone we get to choose between the innocents and those vermins called mutineers. Everytime the mutineers kill someone they only kill innocents (possibly co-opsies). Now you have chosen not to try taking as many mutineers down as possible thus adding to the ratio of how many of the deaths so far are dictated only by the mutineers eg. choices that involved only innocents.

Now I see some of you arguing we win a Day for later use. Might be, might be… But that Snifflin’ Mac Sparrow is right and we only gain a phase. What follows is that gaining a phase will lead us only into a 50-50 chance of gaining a Day for voting. And whether we will have it or not will depend on how many mutineers we manage to lynch and when & whether the avenger or protector get into business. So it’s impossible to say right now.

Now it looks more likely that Mira is/was an ordinary innocent. Were she something else she probably would have not quitted on the first problem but tried to hang on (she would have had two days IRL to fix the problem – or take part in a net-café, library or by a friend or anything if not getting her computer fixed). That being quite believable, the choice is downright horrible. So you preferred to lynch someone who is more probably an innocent who would have died anyway and decided not to try lynching a mutineer in the first place! And for what? For a chance that it may affect the number of Days we can vote, or then it might not.

What would you do with a chance for extra lynching if you already have thrown away a lynching?

Okay, someone might contest what I’m saying by stating that deciding not to lynch on Day2 and exchanging that for a later lynch would be preferable as we can possibly make better educated decisions later (in this game, huh, sounds like wishful thinking to me at least at the moment). But because it’s not sure we get that “extra-lynch” in the first place I still say it was a waste of our only weapon yesterday.

The question then remains whether those who advocated Mira’s lynching were just not thinking it through or whether some of them were also malicious… Were any of them baddies in danger there at the end of the Day yesterDay? That might explain some of the enthusiasm…

Looking at the voting from yesterDay the only one looking like a possible candidate besides Eomer (who clearly is not a mutineer) would have been Annu.

Okay, one positive thing about your decision. As the lynched ones are those we will not have any clue of, it’s good Mira, who probably isn’t going to post much or at all, is the chosen one as someone must be lynched anyway and thus becomes one we have no clue of.

[Isabellkya]

So the scurvy Sally is merely looking to hammer a candidate eh?
Not exactly a thing an innocent would do.

I think at appearances, Eomer wasn't looking like a sensible voter.
At least what I recollect from those whom voted for him.
I would have to look back and check. But Nog, I don't think you can have it both ways. Either Eomer was killed because he was one whom fit the bill of being a sensible voter, or he wasn't - courtesy of your vote for him. Which I think had something to do with how he had voted. Savvy?


X'd with Nog himself.

[Nogrod]

But Nog, I don't think you can have it both ways. Either Eomer was killed because he was one whom fit the bill of being a sensible voter, or he wasn't - courtesy of your vote for him. Which I think had something to do with how he had voted. Savvy?Bingo! :)

Well he can be a very sensible voter and would surely have been one as the game went on. I think everyone who has played with him knows that.

His two votes looked fishy to me (especially as he voted for the same person) and that's why I suspected him. Now as I know he was not a mutineer, things look different (and to be honest my reasons for suspecting Mira yesterDay before hearing that she would have to quit were basically the same Eomer told us toDay - and I hold them to be quite sensible suspicions - although they turned out to be wrong).

On a second subject altogether. As you all know the main target of the baddies is the seer / spy: the sooner they got her/him the better for them. Now Eomer really wouldn't be the first choice if hunting for a seer: he's act was too weird - as it almost got him lynched. So can we then deduce from that that they believe they have the spy bagged already?

If so - then whether Greenie tells the truth of being the spy or is a co-opsie trying to fool us - it would make Nerwen look more trustworthy. For surely she must be "non-mutineer" if the mutineers think Greenie could be the spy? Otherwise they'd see the discrepancy (for Nerwen would be a mutineer herself for them to be able to see Greenie lied). But in that case they would be going for the spy with all they have! And it looks like they aren't...

Well, it's not anything conclusive like nothing will be in this game. But we need to gather circumstantial evidence - or plausible hypotheses - and when we one Day have a load of them concerning one person we might start trusting that one a bit more.

[Nogrod]

Okay too much vodka in a too short a time... I think I'm going to pass out for a Day *

Sad I hadn't more time to take any detailed look on some of you guys. But I'll do it when I wake up, dead or alive. That's a promise.

My vote then:

++ Annu

For my suspicions from yesterDay (well already from Day1 to be exact) added with the "let's lynch Mira"-campaign which I still find a bit fishy. Annu being one of the mutineers would explain some of the enthusiasm there.

I'm not confident enough to vote for Boro yet: I'd hate to have him as an unknown (eg. lynched) this early in the game. Btw. that would be a kind of ingenious mutineer-tactics - even if daring. A loudmouth mutineer (there being one that is) would get her/himself lynched and then starts being overly helpful while we don't know whether s/he's a baddie or not. But we'd sure feel a bit guilty for lynching her/him because of her/his helpfulness and could be more easily persuaded to consider her/his points not knowing the advices could be our destruction in the worst case...

Hah, I'm finally getting my conspiracy-brain working! :rolleyes:

Ahh... please help yourselves with the vodka, it's pretty raw but there's plenty of it. :)


* See the discussion thread.

[Inziladun]

Okay, someone might contest what I’m saying by stating that deciding not to lynch on Day2 and exchanging that for a later lynch would be preferable as we can possibly make better educated decisions later (in this game, huh, sounds like wishful thinking to me at least at the moment). But because it’s not sure we get that “extra-lynch” in the first place I still say it was a waste of our only weapon yesterday.

I thought then, n' I think now: what a waste! As someone (think it were Mac) pointed out, we're always takin' the chance of killin' an innocent when we vote, n' things bein' as they be n' this game, w' no deathly reveals, I be wondrin' how it be easier later t' find the baddies than now. Cud'a had one yest'dy. along w' Mira.
N' like Nogrod said, seems like Mira likely wud'a found a way t' come back if she'd been a mutineer.
Agree t' disagree? Arrr. Maybe. But I be taken a look at them what was so hot on killin' Mira.

[Rikae]

I be wondrin' how it be easier later t' find the baddies than now.

If it isn't, than this is nothing but a game of chance (or even worse than pure chance). We might as well all vote randomly/according to hunches and not bother talking at all.

As for what Nerwen said yesterday - yeah, we might as well have lynched Greenie instead of Mira then - I wish I'd thought of that in time. Generally, though, I'm still against double lynching on a regular basis, at least when someone was killed by the avengers. We already know that person isn't one of them, so we stand to gain relatively little knowledge from such a lynch (Mira most likely wasn't one either, but I thought it best to avoid the high risk of losing tow innocents in one Day).

Nogrod, why don't you suspect me, then? If you think those who lynched Mira are evil, well, I was the one pushing for it. Why not, then?

[Macalaure]

*reads Nogrod's posts and gets a stiff neck from nodding*

I absolutely agree with the probable intentions behind the kill(s), and of course with the explanation why it would have been better to lynch someone else. I also agree that Eomer's death makes Greenie's claim more believable and Nerwen certainly more innocent-looking.

Not sure, though, whether we should really believe that Mira was innocent. Likely, yes, but I wouldn't want to assume anything on it.

What position would a mutineer take in yesterday's debate? He would certainly be for lynching someone else, irrespective of Mira's role, as long as the one on the chopping block isn't a mutineer. We know Eomer isn't, and Annu was the other one with two votes. If Annu is evil, then likely Rikae, Boro, or Gwath are. Not much to conclude, but hey...

*wonders whether agreeing with Nogrod should make him suspicious* :rolleyes: :p

[Inziladun]

*reads Nogrod's posts and gets a stiff neck from nodding*

I absolutely agree with the probable intentions behind the kill(s), and of course with the explanation why it would have been better to lynch someone else. I also agree that Eomer's death makes Greenie's claim more believable and Nerwen certainly more innocent-looking.

What position would a mutineer take in yesterday's debate? He would certainly be for lynching someone else, irrespective of Mira's role, as long as the one on the chopping block isn't a mutineer.

I'm a bit confused. You say you agree with Nogrod that it would have been better to lynch someone other than Mira, then you say a mutineer probably would have taken the same position?

[Thinlómien]

Alrightey, I'm back here.

First off my thoughts on the big issues - I think Greenie is telling the truth (sadly), Nerwen is therefore innocent and Mira was innocent. And even if these facts are not true, there's not much danger in assuming this, at least for now, and even if Greenie is lying it is still matemathically probable that Nerwen is innocent.

When I read through Day2 late yesterday after sleeping only four hours in the night and looking after two energetic kids for several hours in the evening, I got a headache but it's getting a bit clearer now. There's precious little evidence in this game, but stuff can still be concluded from people's general manner and the solidity of their arguments.

I'll make a list of my thoughts about people now and I will be writing about Eomer's death soo too, I hope...

[Macalaure]

I'm a bit confused. You say you agree with Nogrod that it would have been better to lynch someone other than Mira, then you say a mutineer probably would have taken the same position?

Ah, you're right there. I didn't think of that side of the argument, because I took the same position and I know I'm innocent. Annu's innocence would indeed point to Nogrod (and all else who advocated leaving Mira alone). I wouldn't say it points strongly, though, since there was no real counter-waggon to keep up with Mira. Annu was in sufficient danger to make a fellow mutineer afraid of her death, but it doesn't look like either her death or Eomer's were pushed.

Now that I think of it again, why would the mutineers actually have to fear Annu's death? They all had votes of their own, they could have voted Eomer, have their two deaths, and kept their fellow out of trouble. Doesn't make much sense.

Darn it. Most likely they're all innocent and the mutineers were leaning back and enjoying the show...

[Macalaure]

There's precious little evidence in this game, but stuff can still be concluded from people's general manner and the solidity of their arguments.I more and more get the feeling that that is indeed the only reasonable thing we can do.

[Annunfuiniel]

Well well, me nearly got lynched yesterDay, huh? :eek: Couldn't see that comin'... Or then again, maybe I could. 'Twasn't quite wise to tell I wouldn't be 'round 'n 'bout durin' th' DL - thus some obviously figured out I wouldn't be able to defend against all th' accusations.

Tho' I can well see why ye could find me suspicious. Me vote be hasty, to say th' least but I honestly thought thar be somethin' fishy in that Shasta fella... Mostly a hunch but better than no clue at all. Me feelin's haven't changed that much but let me take a much more closer look on thin's and then maybe I'll be able to give you some better reasonin' fer me comin' vote (not sayin' I'll be lookin' only at Shasta's writin's, mind ye).

Oh, 'n Nogrod is votin' fer me already? Nay even givin' me a chance to explain 'n defend meself? Well, if that ain't hasty.... 'n fer the record, that "lets-lynch-Mira campaign" was none of me doin' 'n could easily have ended either way. Fer me Mira looks more innocent than not but guess it doesn't matter much fer now, unless she starts to ghostpost.

P.S. And, to avoid any further confusion: Annu the Surgeon be a he. :)

EDIT: X-ed since #298

[wilwarin538]

I'll be back more later on, I just had to come on and comment on the Mira lynch. It makes absolutely no sense to me, it said on the admin thread that she would be modfired so why on earth did people vote for her and waste a lynching??? Unless I totally missed something, I'll have to read back threw those last posts. Either way I'm going to be keeping a close eye on those last few people who voted for her.

So anyway, I had to say something about that quickly, I desperately need to get some work done on an assignment and will be back far more in a few hours.

[Boromir88]

Nogrod, Nerwen, and whoever else let me speak slowly so you can get this...:p

It's partially my fault, because technically we are not 'gaining' or 'losing' anything, we're just postponing, puting on a raincheck.

Now I'm randomly going to choose 7 people to prove a point (and hopefully that be the end).

Nogrod
Nerwen
Mac
Mira
Boro
Rikae
Lommy

For arguments sake let's say there is one wolf, and that is Nerwen...no Ranger, hunter or anything, just wolf-Nerwen.

Lets go first with your plan. We know Mira will be leaving the game, she will die at night. So, we decide to lynch Nogrod (chance 1). The wolves kill Mac at night (plus), losing Mira, which leaves...

Nerwen
Boro
Rikae
Lommy

There is one more chance to lynch Nerwen (chance 2)

Now, here is what we did yesterday...

Nogrod
Nerwen
Mac
Mira
Boro
Rikae
Lommy

We said...well Mira is going to be gone anyway, let's lynch her (we are conceding the oppurtunity of going for someone else, and a chance at a mutineer...but only putting a raincheck).

Nerwen kills Nogrod at night leaving...

Nerwen
Mac
Boro
Rikae
Lommy

We lynch Mac (chance 1). Nerwen kills me at night, leaving..

Nerwen
Rikae
Lommy

There is one more chance to get Nerwen (chance 2)

So, please stop saying we blew or wasted anything, because the fact is we didn't. We decided to just have a rain check. We didn't gain or lose any chances, the only way we gain chances is if the Ranger saves someone. We have the same exact chance, just extending it by a phase (Mac is technically right, it is an extra day phase).

In this style there are many benefits to doing what we did.

1) We don't know the role, eventhough it's unlikely Mira is a baddie (and not wanting to quit so easily), the fact is just because someone's computer is dead doesn't mean she is automatically innocent). So maybe we did get a wolf, or co-conspirater...is someone going to say for sure we didn't?

2) Even if Mira was going to get another day to get internet back, it saves us from being left another day with someone who isn't going to post (albeit no fault to Mira and I'm not blaming her for anything, stuff happens, but the fact is it was highly doubtful she could continue).

3) We, again, don't know the roles. Why take a shot at the dark with someone (say it would have been Annu) on day 2, plus losing Mira, plus what it turns out...losing Eomer. In a normal game, maybe you are right, but in this one, we wouldn't have found out about Annu's role, whether he is lynched yesterday, today, tomorrow, or if never.

It is never good to have multiple deaths in one day or one night, and in this set up it really isn't good, because we won't get any information out of it anyway, as we don't know people's roles!

Well...the mutineers do, but come on stop being so obsitinate, that will be enough of the decision to lynch Mira yesterday. Because there is no argument, you are flat out wrong if you say we wasted a chance.

Edit: bolding names

[Mithalwen]

I am here but I need to read up.

[Thinlómien]

Oh and I forgot to mention about McCab - I think he was innocent. There's not much to conclude from his posts and his lynch was a shot in the dark and those tend to go awry. But we can look at his and Mira's deaths the way that at least they're both people who probably have a higher than average tendency to miss the vote and that's why it's better they're dead not someone else - although by this standard we should lynch Nerwen even though she's almost a known innocent. :p

Okay, now off to me list:
Sally - too slippery fer me, bears watching
Rikae - back to the aggressive Rikae mode - what does it mean?
Inziladun - too smooth fer me taste, but I have no picture of an innocent Zil to compare his current behaviour to, so it's hard to say anything definite...
Boromir - my special boroscope radar :p is judging him innocent, but then again, I'm sure me boroscope's gonna fail some day and it may just as well be in this game...
Wilwa - as slippery and watching-worthy as Sally, I just have a slightly better gut-feeling about her
Shasta - I think he's innocent but I have nothing concrete to back this up
Annu - could be anything, I need to see more of her to judge better
Mac - seems innocent but I know better than to trust my judgement of him
Nerwen - by all mathematical odds is most likelily an innocent
Kath - her normal self ie unreadable until Day4 or 5
Gwath - I'd like him to post more, I have little idea of him but I'm not too suspicious...
Nogrod - seems rather innocent except for the rather weird Annu-vote
Izzy - I like what I'm seeing this far
Mith - probably an innocent?
Eönwë - I'm sorry to say this, but I'm not worried about him because I think he will incriminate himself soon enough if he's evil :p

So my best guess at the mutineer team is Wilwa + Sally + Nogrod/Rikae + Inziladun/Annu/Eönwë. (Mmh why to format it that way is because it is kind of probable that there aren't two gurus or two relative newcomers in the team.)

I just realised that with two co-conspies and four mutineers, more than a third of the living are probably evil. (I think there are no dead mutineers yet, Eomer or McCab may have been a co-conspirator, but I don't know how probable is that...) We have to be really careful then about trusting people and remember that the evil-doers can form quite a mighty consensus...


edit: xed with everyone

[Macalaure]

Boro, let's play the same example with 8. ;)

A) If only Mira dies, then after another night phase, we're down to 6. One day later, 4, and that's the last day. Including the lynch on the last day, the village had 3 lynches, the wolves 2 kills.

B) If Mira and someone else dies, we're down to 5 instead of 6, and one day later 3 instead of 4. This time, the village had 4 lynches and the wolves 2 kills.


In case of your 7, you gain a day phase. In case of my 8, you gain a night phase (when the village is down to 4, the wolves need to theoretically excercise their following night kill before they win).

In the case of 7, you postpone a lynch, in the case of 8, you lose one. (The same holds for all even and odd numbers, of course, and since we don't know what ranger and hunter will do, we don't know in which case we ourselves are.)

[Mithalwen]

Oh good, I am glad the mathmagician turned up before I had to try and explain that ;) .

[Boromir88]

Lommy...you will be able to trust your boroscope this time, but you might want to get your nogscope fixed. Was Greenie a Nogrod kill? Or maybe there were even two family members involved in that one? :p

So they took Boro's explanation for Eomer's behaviour at face value and thought he was a bored ordo and would thus not help us after being dead with his "most likely a goodie"-status?~Nogrod
Slip-up? By they you are referring to the mutineers, I assume, and obviously you have excluded me from 'them' (that part you got right at least), but you seem pretty sure as to why Eomer was killed...what's stranger Mac is suddenly agreeing with you, after really wanting you lynched on Day 1, and I believe saying you were his 'enemy' on Day 2...?

I'm not confident enough to vote for Boro yet: I'd hate to have him as an unknown (eg. lynched) this early in the game. Btw. that would be a kind of ingenious mutineer-tactics - even if daring. A loudmouth mutineer (there being one that is) would get her/himself lynched and then starts being overly helpful while we don't know whether s/he's a baddie or not. But we'd sure feel a bit guilty for lynching her/him because of her/his helpfulness and could be more easily persuaded to consider her/his points not knowing the advices could be our destruction in the worst case...
This may be the final nail in your coffin, at least for me...I'm pretty convinced and feel confident now you are a mutineer. Is that a strategy you will try when you end up dead? But I may need to clear my head before I pass that type of final judgement.

[Thinlómien]

Okay, I can't say much of Eomer's death. Even if the mutineers hadn't believed Greenie's claim and therefore killed Eomer for seeming seerish by blaming an evil Mira it does not give us any clues as Mira is dead.

I'm inclined to agree with Nogrod about reasons why Eomer died, and add this - Eomer was a rather no track kill as the only tracks he has lead to Mira who's dead.

I have a feeling Nog may be a co-consp.


edit: xed with everybody

[Macalaure]

Oh good, I am glad the mathmagician turned up before I had to try and explain that ;) .

At ye serrvice. ;)

[Thinlómien]

Boro, I don't know if Greenie would've been a Nogrod kill. Yes because she's a silent player but I think he may have refrained from killing his daughter on Night2.

[Boromir88]

Mac, umm how do you get 4 lynch chances with 8 people?

In B, your counting is off...

If Mira and someone else dies
That's 1 lynch (Mira isn't a lynch, she is booted)

Between 5 and 3 is lynch 2.
Then the last dayis lynch 3.

If you start with 8, 10, 20, 500 people it doesn't matter. The village (erm ship) will get the same amount of lynch chances, to find the baddies. The only thing that can change that is the Ranger stopping a night kill.

[Macalaure]

Boro, I counted Mira's death as a lynch in both cases (since she's not a wolf kill). However, you can't decide to count her in one case and not in the other. In case A, even though she is technically lynched, you can't count it because she would have died anyway. It was basically an abstain.

Which ever way you count, you still lose a lynch opportunity in the worst, and postpone only in the best case.

[wilwarin538]

Boro what you are saying does make a bit of sense, but I still don't like it. When the wolves choose someone to kill they don't run the risk of killing one of their own, we do. So we should take every possible oppurtunity to try and get a wolf, that's the whole point of us lynching someone. And this whole gaining a day thing is not guaranteed, at all, we have no clue at any time what the ratio is between the good guys and the bad guys so likewise we can't try to figure out how many days we possibly have left, so we shouldn't waste them.

Some of what you say does make sense, and I know we could have just ended up lynching another innocent, but I still don't like that we lost the chance of getting a wolf. Makes me very uneasy.

Anyway, I don't want to talk about that anymore, it's making me dizzy with all the statistics and stuff. :rolleyes: I'm going to read back through yesterDay and toDay and come back with a list eventually.

[Inziladun]

Boro what you are saying does make a bit of sense, but I still don't like it. When the wolves choose someone to kill they don't run the risk of killing one of their own, we do. So we should take every possible oppurtunity to try and get a wolf, that's the whole point of us lynching someone. And this whole gaining a day thing is not guaranteed, at all, we have no clue at any time what the ratio is between the good guys and the bad guys so likewise we can't try to figure out how many days we possibly have left, so we shouldn't waste them.

I'm of the same mind. I understand the point Boro is trying to make and I'll not 'argue' about it anymore, but I've no regrets about not latching onto the Mira train.

[Boromir88]

Oh fishsticks, we messed that up...didn't we? (You can check this thread though, where I admit to not being good at math (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=599995&postcount=112))

The good news is, now Mac, I know you are not crazy and are just trying to mess with my head (i.e. not the co-conspirator). Although, ye may be a mutineer, considering my own feelings about Nogrod and you going after him early, now for some unknown reason trust him...care to explain?

As well as feeling really good about Wilwa and Inziladun, because of their responses to me.

Lommy and Mith are under my watch too.

[Nerwen]

Shiver me timbers, we be all at sea here wi' ne'er a way o' gettin' our bearings. 'Tis like tryin' to navvy-gate in a fog!

Boro, I counted Mira's death as a lynch in both cases (since she's not a wolf kill). However, you can't decide to count her in one case and not in the other. In case A, even though she is technically lynched, you can't count it because she would have died anyway. It was basically an abstain.

Which ever way you count, you still lose a lynch opportunity in the worst, and postpone only in the best case.

Aye, Snifflin' Mac ha' some sense in his skull. 'Tis more'n I can say fer them as threw the lynch yesterDay.

Be main likely some o' they was mutineers– or, e'en liker, co-conspies as was a-feard o' takin down a mutineer by chance– but which on 'em?

EDIT: X'd since the Cooper.

[Boromir88]

Another point of interest...

I remember a recent past history, actually arguing the same thing before that if someone will be mod-fired, why not lynch them that day anyway.

I believe I remember Gwath disagreeing with my what I called 'conservative' approach...at least I think it as Gwath. If it was, care to explain the change Gwath?

[Isabellkya]

As much as we are used to certainties upon death.
I don't see how people want to write off such and such person as certainly this role/alignment - so quickly.

Yes, there could be a higher likelihood of person A being innocent because of reason(s) xyz. Yet you can't say it is for certain.

Zil - would those regrets have anything to do with it being a fiery topic toDay?


Is there something going on between Nog and Mac? Yes. What is it? Remains to be seen.

Boro is added to the mix as well.


X'd with Boro x2 and Nerwen.

[Inziladun]

Zil - would those regrets have anything to do with it being a fiery topic toDay?

I said I had no regrets about not going along with the Mira lynch, despite passionate defenses of it by Boro and, to a lesser extent, Rikae..

[Thinlómien]

The last time I saw an argument like the one that took place yesterday, there were innocent and guilty ones on both sides - even though I was rather forcibly saying no innocent can advocate wasting a lynch by voting a person who's to be modfired. So I'm hesitant to judge which party is more innocent (even though I know which party was right ;)).

I wonder if I should look at the Mira argument or if it's just waste of time. *shrugs*


edit: xed with Zil

[Mithalwen]

Another point of interest...

I remember a recent past history, actually arguing the same thing before that if someone will be mod-fired, why not lynch them that day anyway.




The point is that in this game, if you wanted to be conservative then the sensible thing to have done since Mira was going anyway would have been to double killed someone and got a concrete piece of information which we so desperately needed. All that happened is we lost a kill chance - not a raincheck because we can't take it later.

[Nerwen]

Okay, I can't say much of Eomer's death. Even if the mutineers hadn't believed Greenie's claim and therefore killed Eomer for seeming seerish by blaming an evil Mira it does not give us any clues as Mira is dead.

I be wonderin' –were there too much risk in killin' another on us? These swabs be main careful 'bout leavin' a trail... belike there's trails to be left, if ye get me drift.

The last time I saw an argument like the one that took place yesterday, there were innocent and guilty ones on both sides - even though I was rather forcibly saying no innocent can advocate wasting a lynch by voting a person who's to be modfired. So I'm hesitant to judge which party is more innocent (even though I know which party was right ;)).

Aye, happen there's bad 'uns on both sides.

But 'tis this way: them dogs o' mutineers would liker support the lynch o' Dancin' Mira if one o' they was set to walk the plank else. Arr, 'tis main hard that there be no easy way o' finding out what Annu or Shasty be. Makes a power o' difference.

I'll tell ye what us will find along o' them as lynched Mira –leastways very like– an' that's co-conspies. They be as much adrift as we, an' main afeard o' lynchin' one o' they allies.

I reckon I mark the voyage yer a'speakin' of, an' 'twere a co-conspirator as put for'ard the plan o' lynchin' som'un as were leavin' anyhow in th' first place.

[Boromir88]

The point is that in this game, if you wanted to be conservative then the sensible thing to have done since Mira was going anyway would have been to double killed someone and got a concrete piece of information which we so desperately needed. All that happened is we lost a kill chance - not a raincheck because we can't take it later.

No matter who we lynch we won't get any concrete information, unless we kill the person again. That's the only way we can get some sort of concrete information, as well being sure the mutineers' kills aren't mutineers. However, that isn't too helpful seeing as ghosts can't vote.

And seeing as supposedly our spy is dead...well we're pretty screwed unless the hunter gets a kill, or the Ranger saves someone. All we can do is really take some blind shots in the dark based on feeling, or people's behaviours.

[Thinlómien]

I be wonderin' –were there too much risk in killin' another on us? These swabs be main careful 'bout leavin' a trail... belike there's trails to be left, if ye get me drift.A good question, but it would take a lot of rereading to prove or disprove it... but if someone is willing to do that, why not.

But 'tis this way: them dogs o' mutineers would liker support the lynch o' Dancin' Mira if one o' they was set to walk the plank else. Arr, 'tis main hard that there be no easy way o' finding out what Annu or Shasty be. Makes a power o' difference.Okay, Nerwie, you made me change me mind - I'll go to reread some of yesterDay (even though the pirate talk kind o' gives me headache yarr).

[Thinlómien]

There's not much to say about yesterDay's voting, except that Gwath seems suspiciously much like going with the flow and supporting the wrong ;) decision, there's something very fishy in his manner.

[Mithalwen]

No matter who we lynch we won't get any concrete information, unless we kill the person again. aren't mutineers. However, that isn't too helpful seeing as ghosts can't vote.

.

Boromir, did you read what I said or are you the ship's parrot?

[Inziladun]

There's not much to say about yesterDay's voting, except that Gwath seems suspiciously much like going with the flow and supporting the wrong ;) decision, there's something very fishy in his manner.

You could have a point there.

Well now, Boro matey.

I was thinkin' on votin' for Annu, but now you've made realize that lynchin' Mira would buy us another day, at any rate. And there is always the off-chance that she could be a mutineer or a co-conspirator.

Like many have noted, the 'off-chance' looks to be what we're mainly dealing with in this game without knowing the identities of the dead.

[Mithalwen]

I be wonderin' –were there too much risk in killin' another on us? These swabs be main careful 'bout leavin' a trail... belike there's trails to be left, if ye get me drift.


I am not fluent in pirate but I can't see there is much risk to the aggressors with the seer dead. They can kill anyone they like at night unless the protector gets lucky and can vote for who they like during the day knowing that unless we double kill the identity of the lynchee will not be revealed to incriminate them.

[wilwarin538]

A quick little list, don't really like that I'm lacking in suspects.


Sally - not too too much from her, she makes me uneasy like always, but not enough to really vote for her

Boromir - not big on his choice to lynch Mira, but it's not enough to really find him suspicious, he makes a good case and obviously thinks it will help the crew in the long run, so I won't hold our difference of opinion against him.

Rikae - Kinda the same as Boro, and yesterDay I mentioned not liking her tone but after re-reading it I don't really see it as being the way I thought. I don't know, I'm on the fence here.

Lommy - Fine.

Inziladun - Fine with him so far, I've tended to agree with him.

Shasta - hmmmm, well he's defensive, but that's not new. So I don't really know about him.

Annu- got nothing, I must have missed something cause I don't know why everyone finds him so suspicious, I'll have to go back and find it I guess

Mac - I've been agreeing with him aswell, with the whole Mira thing. I was good with him before that anyway though.

Nerwen - because of Greenie's reveal I'm gonna go ahead and think innocent

Kath - Good with her.

Gwath - Haven't liked either of his votes. So I'm still suspicious of him.

Nogrod - Good with him.

Izzy - Makes sense, don't really have too much on her.

Mith - Fine.

Eönwe - I remember yesterDay he seemed quick to not trust Greenie and Nerwen, I voted him for that. I'm gonna go back and re-read his stuff later today.

Well, those are just my quick thoughts for now. I do think that atleast one person who voted Mira yesterDay has to be bad, even though there is a tad of logic behind it I don't think it's something that only innocents would agree too. On the other hand if she was being modfired anyway and is innocent (hypothetically) a baddie may have pushed to lynch someone else in order to get 2 people out of the way at once. So it's a tough situation really.

So I'll be back yet again in another few hours with more specifics on certain people. Just checking in here and there to try and keep up so that I don't have pages upon pages to read all at once tonight.

[Rikae]

Snifflin' Mac, you're still wrong. We don't know which of those scenarios we're in, since the ranger or hunter might or might not influence it, but even gaining an extra night phase would help us. Games have been decided in the night phase before. A 50/50 chance on a lynch or ranger/hunter pick on Day//Night x is still better than a shot in the dark on Day 2.

I agree with you, though, that the baddies are probably not among those who are being scrutinized right now. I would like a closer look at the following:

Kath
Lommy
Wilwa
Gwath
Izzy
Sally

I'm betting that group is disproportionately skewed toward evil.

[McCaber]

Wow, being out of commission for a few days really throws you behind. I will read from where I left off, and see if I have anything to contribute.

[Eönwë]

I'm here and reading the thread... currently on page 6.
I wonder if th' whole 'isterical womin thing - th' "intense" n' "over-the-top" tone folks seem t' read into me posts would 'ave been there if I''d orig'nally signed up t' th' 'downs pretendin' I was a fella. Just sayin'.

Because I really don't enjoy being accused of a tone I'm not using. That's all.

First of all, I never said you were either. All I said (or meant to say) was that I didn't think that a wolf would want to draw that much attention to themselves. Having read my post, I can see why it might have sounded otherwise. Sorry about that.

[Eönwë]

And also, how about a theory:

It could be that Rikae and Shasta are wolves. Being obvious usually makes players seem less suspicious, so maybe this little "kerfuffle" was just to make them seem "too obvious" to be wolves together. It also serves to distance themselves for each other. It would be a risky plan, but both Rikae and Shasta are experienced players, and from the times I've played with them I've seen them get into similar situations (especially with [B]Shasta[/B- which is sad, as he often gets killed early), so it wouldn't be too out of the ordinary.


edit: And I didn't x-post, which shows how lonely this thread is at this time. :(

[Boromir88]

Boromir, did you read what I said or are you the ship's parrot?

Well I read it...but I had just misread it. When I read Mira and 'double-kill' in the same sentence, I thought you meant Mira was going plus if we decided to lynch someone else, and by lynching someone else we would get concrete information. I didn't read it as 'double-kill' being lynching someone and then killing that same person.

Lommy, there is no right or wrong...what have I told you about choices in the States? It's Morgoth or Sauron, it doesn't matter who is less evil, you're screwed either way. :p We'd still have to spend a day on killing someone again just to get information, and that information may turn out totally useless anyway, so no matter what we decided to do we were screwed. Sorry to sound so bleak, just stating the truth.

Rikae feel free to call me intense, aggressive, or whatever, because that is like my tone. Although, currently that is mostly due to allergies, a massive headache, and finding out I am out of coffee grounds. My tone is really the only weapon I feel I have left.

++Nogrod

Still based on Day 1 uneasiness and some other things...like his paranoia in suspecting everyone who mentions that he himself is suspicious. Plus, he is managing to create theories as to why only mutineers would want him lynch, and describing the scenarios to strike up pity. Like here, being a good example:
So let's lynch Nogrod? See what I said about the mutineers wishing to do at the previous page: some should be lynched to keep people insecure about their status? Didn't you Boro just say you'd like to let the mutineers do the choices, why you'd wish otherwise with me?
In general he seems pretty sure about what the mutineers are doing...like again with the Eomer kill...something that was quickly supported by Mac.

[Boromir88]

Oh and that vote probably won't be retracted.

Plus, I still feel good about Inziladun, Wilwa, Rikae, and Nerwen.

I'm flip-flopping on Mith, and thinking she's better.

Lommy, Gwath, and Mac I'm watching. And of course, you can see how I feel about Nogrod.

Sorry but I must lump everyone I haven't mentioned as 'unsure,' I have to run...one of my old teachers I had for 4 years is getting married tomorrow, and I have absolutely nothing good to wear.

[Eönwë]

Annu - could be anything, I need to see more of her to judge betterHer?

[Inziladun]

P.S. And, to avoid any further confusion: Annu the Surgeon be a he. :)

He did try to clear that up.

[Annunfuiniel]

Oh headaches! I wish I had boarded a whole another ship... I've been reading and re-reading and nothing makes sense anymore! How on earth do you guys and gals go on with no sure knowledge of anything that has happened so far?? :confused: May be this is too big of a bite for me to swallow...

So what can I say (without rousing another wave of suspicions against me)? Not much I guess. But some points seem valid enough to say out loud:

About Boro: he's awfully loud and making such a fuss about everything that I rather deem him a co-conspie... I didn't like his "sacrificing" himself somewhere during day2, when hoping to be voted by someone (Mith?) (perhaps it was a bad joke - and perhaps not) and his voting during day1 was rather queer too. But I think he's making too much noise to be a wolf? Wish I had been in the same crew with him before to know how his mind works...

And what about Nog then? His vote for me early today tells tales. But especially as he seems to have had suspicions about me since day1! Giving me the benefit of a doubt as I'm a newbie (day1), not wanting to vote me when there are some other (and more experienced or loud?) suspects (day2) and then attacking me without further ado (day3). Guess my newbie status won't save me anymore... :rolleyes:

Mac the mathematician still gives me gray hairs but I've no real reason thinking him foul. Maybe its just his interaction with my main suspects? Wish I had something other to offer than gut instinct!

Nerwen is ok, so far as we don't take her as an absolutely certain innocent. Same goes with Eomer and Greenie - most likely not baddies.

I still can't get rid off my suspicions about Shasta but will delay any action against him for now. His little skirmish with Rikae shouldn't perhaps weigh so much in my scales but that's the most tangible thing I've found thus far. Though things have calmed down since.

Lommy doesn't say much about anyone or anything but seems quite certain about the reasons why Eomer was killed by the aggressors. Inside knowledge perhaps? Doubts Nog is a co-consp but gives no reasons. So co-conspirator protecting a wolf or the other way round? Or plain innocent giving us good counsel??

Wish I had the time to make a coherent and complete list but alas! I should be packing my things and going to bed for tomorrow will be one hectic day to say the least...

[Mithalwen]

Oh and that vote probably won't be retracted.


I'm flip-flopping on Mith, and thinking she's better.

.

well Inearly voted you for being dim but fish-slapping may be more appropriate .. :rolleyes:

With Nogrod... I know this sounds self obsessed but I am afterall the only one I know about... It bugs me that he bangs on about me giving suspicious vibes (practically before I even posted!), and consistently lists me as suspicious - without actually putting his vote where his mouth is or providing evidence for his suspicions then accuses me of being over defensive and retaliatory, when I challenged him on it. Now bad vibes is such an un-Nogrod like reason that I have to find it suspicious. Now I know I was quiet but there has been so little going on when I have been around - even today when I have been here for nearly five hours there has been very little interreaction - and I find piratespeak difficult. But I can understand the quietness... the ordos have nothing to go on. :(

[Mithalwen]

About Boro: he's awfully loud and making such a fuss about everything that I rather deem him a co-conspie... I didn't like his "sacrificing" himself somewhere during day2, when hoping to be voted by someone (Mith?) (perhaps it was a bad joke - and perhaps not) and his voting during day1 was rather queer too. But I think he's making too much noise to be a wolf? Wish I had been in the same crew with him before to know how his mind works...

And what about Nog then? His vote for me early today tells tales. But especially as he seems to have had suspicions about me since day1! Giving me the benefit of a doubt as I'm a newbie (day1), not wanting to vote me when there are some other (and more experienced or loud?) suspects (day2) and then attacking me without further ado (day3). Guess my newbie status won't save me anymore... :rolleyes:

[..

Hi Annu, Boromir often tries to stir things up to provoke a reaction if he is an ordo - has been lynched early often for this, however he is far too good as a villain to take it as read....

[Rikae]

Rikae feel free to call me intense, aggressive, or whatever, because that is like my tone.

Huh?

Oh yeah, and:

++Sally

For generally bad vibes and sleeping under reindeer.

[Eönwë]

He did try to clear that up.

I know. That's why I said that (Lommy's post came after Annu's- but maybe she x-posted).

[Mithalwen]

Oh no not more bad vibes... ;)

And why do peopel show up just when I really can't take any more?

[Mithalwen]

++Nogrod

Vodka is a barbarous drink...

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Mith, how come you're voting for Nogrod if he's been saying the same things as Mac, whom you claim to agree with?

++Annu

I still think Rikae's bad, but there's a vote for Annu (whom I also think is bad) already and it's likely I won't be back today; Shark Tooth has got a mild case o' scurvy! (OOC: Food poisoning. :()

[wilwarin538]

Alright, most likely the last time I can make it on so I'll be voting now. The only one I really feel suspicious of is Gwath, for his vote Day 1 and also for his vote yesterDay, not only was it for Mira (when he was actually suspicious of Annu) but it also seemed like he did it just to kinda go with the crowd and not attract attention. I'm not suspicious of any one else really so this is an easy choice of me.

++Gwathagor

So that'll probably be all from me toDay. See you all tomorrow.

[Eönwë]

It be a quiet day... anyway:

-Legless Sally Dawkins - Quiet and not giving away much. She seems innocent however (usually she posts more as a wolf).
-Puffy Shirt Rikae - Seems generally innocent to me, unless the whole Rikae-Shasta thing was a[n anti-]cover. She generally seems to speak sense, even though I don't agree with her about the Mira lynching.
-Pirate Lommy the Infected - To be honest I have no idea.
-Gangrenous Inziladun Jones - He speaks wisely, but also very carefully.
-Pirate Boromir the Malformed - Though I disagree with him about the Mira lynching, I can see where he's coming from and it makes sense.
-Stutterin’ Wilwa Scab - She be votin' fer me without a good reason, but she always findsme suspicious for no reason.
-Shark Tooth Shasta - Seems like he could be genuine, and just an ordinary innocent. There is my conspiracy theory, but I haven't got much evidence tto back it up so I'll leave it for now.
-High-Pitched Annu - I don't see why others find him suspicious.
-Snifflin’ Mac Sparrow - A lot o' banter at the beginning, yet he also posts some other helpful posts, and others that show what he thinks. I also like his stance on the Mira lynch.
-Almost-Blind Nerwen - Until proven otherwise, I'm trusting Greenie, so for now I'm putting her under innocent.
-Poop Deck Kath - Another one of 'em quiet ones. She needs to post more.
-Cowerin' Gwath Slasher - Hasn't said much of substance at all. I don't like it. He is hibernating under Rudolph.
-Pirate Nogrod the Fashionably Late - I like his view on the Mira lynching, but he has been unusually reserved this game, and hasn't been attacking the quiet ones as he usually does, which makes me suspicious.
-Ham-Hands Izzy - Hasn't posted enough for me to get an idea.
-Short Ruth Mithril - If an aggressor then very cunning. Seems quite sleek and not sticking out yet not suspicious either. I like her thoughts today on the lynching yesterday and what we could have done. Could be either.

Hmm... I can't think of much more to say- we have much less to go on than normal.

edit: x-ed wi' Wilwa, who be stealin' me vote.

[Eönwë]

And so, I'm sadly goin' t'vote for me last fellow monke'. Shame that:

++Gwathagor

He's been going with the flow a lot, and not made many points of his own. He is maintaining a low profile even with the number of posts he has, and though he talks a lot, he seems to not say much of substance. I shall have to fill up the powder on my own.

[Isabellkya]

Ah yes. I forgot the words lack of.

I will rephrase it.

Would you be vocally not-regretting your choice, if the topic had not become a fiery issue toDay?


Sally -> Shasta
Nog -> Annu
Boro -> Nog
Rikae -> Sally
Mith -> Nog (2)
Shasta -> Annu (2)
Wilwa -> Gwath
Eonwe -> Gwath (2)

Gwath, Annu, Nog 2. Sally, Shasta 1.


I hope I'm not the only one going... o.O @ the votes.

[Thinlómien]

Zil, Eönwë - as for the Annunfuiniel issue, I kind of got confused/forgetful/whatever because he's really a she (unless someone impersonates her on Facebook ;)) but is just to be called a he in this game because of the masculine role....

So what can I say (without rousing another wave of suspicions against me)? Not much I guess.This comment cries a wolf to me, but as it's a newbie I'm a bit hesitant to judge... nevertheless I'm watching Annu now.

And what about Nog then? His vote for me early today tells tales. But especially as he seems to have had suspicions about me since day1! Giving me the benefit of a doubt as I'm a newbie (day1), not wanting to vote me when there are some other (and more experienced or loud?) suspects (day2) and then attacking me without further ado (day3). Guess my newbie status won't save me anymore...Well I'd say it's pretty normal - no one wants to lynch newbies on Day1 but you have to stop being so nice at some point so that newbie wolves wouldn't win by default. ;)

Doubts Nog is a co-consp but gives no reasons. So co-conspirator protecting a wolf or the other way round? Or plain innocent giving us good counsel??Well I can't quite back it up rationally, it's more like a gut-feeling. But it's maybe that he doesn't seem particularily innocent but the kill choices don't look too characteristic of him either... I don't know.

I'm getting more and more suspicious of Rikae. Don't exactly know why. That Sally-vote looks a tad too easy. I have to vote soon and I will probably vote her or Gwath or Sally (yes I know I just said Rikae's Sally-vote looks too easy). I'm most inclined to vote Rikae but I won't vote her if there's to be no support, I think I don't want Nogrod dead just yet, nor Annu.

[Nerwen]

I still think Rikae's bad, but there's a vote for Annu (whom I also think is bad) already and it's likely I won't be back today; Shark Tooth has got a mild case o' scurvy! (OOC: Food poisoning. :()

Arr. 'Tis a shame, lad. I were down wi' th' scurvy a for'night ago. Leastways, I reckon 'twas scurvy. Me lips was bleedin', anyhow.

Now who to vote?

Hmmn. I be thinkin' Rikae might be a bad 'un... but then Shasty don't like her, and I be none too easy wi' he, neither.

Likewise, yon striker Gwathagor be lookin' a bit sus'pic-u-ous. But Eön ha' voted him, and I reckon he be a sneaky 'un heself.

An' 'twould be a famous joke if Nogrod an' Snifflin' Mac was in't t'gether. Stranger things ha' happened at sea.

EDIT:X'd wi' the quartermaster.

[Thinlómien]

Nerwen, why discount the possibility of wolf-on-wolf so quickly?

I think I'll vote Rikae or Gwath.

[Nerwen]

I be needin' to get some shut-eye now.

++Rikae.

EDIT:X'd wi' th' infected.

[Nerwen]

Nerwen, why discount the possibility of wolf-on-wolf so quickly?

Nay, I were doin' no sich thing.

[Inziladun]

I still think Rikae's bad, but there's a vote for Annu (whom I also think is bad) already and it's likely I won't be back today; Shark Tooth has got a mild case o' scurvy! (OOC: Food poisoning. :()

Shiver me timbers! Food poisoning can be rather unpleasant. Hope you feel better soon.
I have some deep reservations about Rikae myself. The previous Day she first brought the case against Shasta that seemed too overblown. She then climbed on the Mira band wagon, and toDay has voted Sally for what she admits is nothing more then 'bad vibes'.

High-Pitched Annu - I don't see why others find him suspicious.

I was uneasy about the way he piled on Shasta.


Would you be vocally not-regretting your choice, if the topic had not become a fiery issue toDay?

I was simply responding to Boro, who seemed to be insinuating that anyone who didn't see his logic in voting Mira was utterly clueless.
If you want to read more into it than that , it's your affair.
I believe at this point my choice will likely be Annu (again) or Rikae.

Boro is unreadable at this point. I still don't buy the push for Mira when there were more constructive uses of our votes, but he seems to have defended himself well. Still could be evil, but I'm not willing to go for him now.

Nogrod makes sense to me. He appears to raise the hackles of those who know him well, but then again they could be the baddies for all I know.

Wilwa I'm on the fence about. Her votes don't seem all that well explained, and she hasn't been around all that much.

Izzy. Just like last game. That time I knew she was innocent, and she gives the same vibe here. Which means nothing, of course.

Ëonwë is a tough one. Could be anything.

Gwath: as I said, I didn't really care for the Mira thing much. Otherwise, I haven't seen much of him.

Shasta I'm pretty well convinced is innocent. If evil, he's been awfully brazen and careless.

Mac doesn't ring any bells. Seems sensible.

Mith is another one who feels innocent.

Sally seems a bit flippant in general. I'm not sure how to take her.

Lommy is utterly grey. Hasn't posted much, but seems to make sense when she does.

Nerwen. I know from experience how devious a Nerwolf can be. The only guarantee of her innocence comes from Greenie, who for all we know could be a co-conspirator. Might want to keep that in mind.

[Boromir88]

well Inearly voted you for being dim ~Mith
Well you know..."Why youth? We already have enough youth. Why not a fountain of smart?" :p

but fish-slapping may be more appropriate ..
As long as it's tilapia

Well I can't quite back it up rationally, it's more like a gut-feeling. But it's maybe that he doesn't seem particularily innocent but the kill choices don't look too characteristic of him either... I don't know~Lommy
Kills don't seem like him? Yet, he seems to provide answers to why they were killed?

I think what Rikae says makes sense, but right now I find it more telling that Nogrod gave a reason for Eomer's death and two others (Mac and Lommy) came in for support as if to say case closed...that is usually a telling sign of wolf (or mutineer behavior).

And of course Nogrod's assured-ness of the matter, usually he's debating theories and possibilities, but not this time...nope Eomer was killed because he's usually a sensible player who can be a dangerous voter...the end.

Also, he rather sneakily blames me for it, yet also makes a statement that I'm innocent:
So they took Boro's explanation for Eomer's behaviour at face value and thought he was a bored ordo and would thus not help us after being dead with his "most likely a goodie"-status?~Nogrod
Ahh...so I'm to blame for Eomer's death? And 'they' took my advice...which Nogrod happens to clearly distinguish me as being separate from 'them.' He's right about that, I'm not 'them,' but Nogrod's assuredness regarding Eomer's death and 'them' (the mutineers) is suspicious.

Also, if you think about it...Day 1 McCaber, Day 2 Mira...we've tried the quite thing, I'm assuming it hasn't worked so far...maybe we've chosen the wrong ones, but there's something up between that group of 3 who agree about Eomer's death. No one should overlook that.


Huh?~Rikae
Oh just saying that I'm a male, and you can say I'm intense, aggressive, whatever...I don't mind. :)

But that's because that actually is usually my tone, I'm a pretty intense person...most of the times it's just because I like to give everyone (including friends) grief over the silliest things, and other times I seriously am frustrated and that shows. That's just my behavior, so it's ok to call me intense, over-the-top, maybe dim and delusional because that's me. :D

[Kath]

I'm feeling not so great toDay, really worn out for some reason, so I think I'm just going to look at the people who have votes so far. This late in the Day it seems stupid to add yet another candidate in anyway.

So:

Gwath - is it just me or has he not actually said anything toDay and yet has accumulated two votes? From Eonwe and wilwa who are both voting for him for slipping under the radar ... pot kettle hmm?

Annu - firstly, sorry, he from now on! Interesting post. Defends his vote pretty well, calls it hasty but not ill-considered. Would like to see more reasoning about his vote for Shasta then since he said he'd look at him in much more detail. Ah we get: I still can't get rid off my suspicions about Shasta but will delay any action against him for now. His little skirmish with Rikae shouldn't perhaps weigh so much in my scales but that's the most tangible thing I've found thus far. Though things have calmed down since. Not much of a case really there. I was under the impression that it was what he said in his original 'pros and cons' post that caused Annu to be suspicious of him rather than the argument with Rikae. Would really like to see some more reasoning on this, especially if he's not going to be around much tomorrow.

Nog - now, this argument. I got very bored reading the posts with statistics in for the simple reason that I just couldn't follow them. So I want to simplify the Nog/Boro/Mac thing. Is it that basically, Nog wanted to lynch someone other than Mira in order to have more of a chance of getting a wolf? Mac also agrees with Nog on that ... but then seems to change his mind. But Boro thinks it was right to lynch Mira. Is that right? Looking at the intensity with which this argument has been conducted toDay I would say it's likely that most if not all of these three are innocent. Time after time we see a huge blow up over something that is simply between two paranoid innocents, or possibly three here. Given the players involved, however, I think it's possible there might be a wolf hopping on the argument bandwagon. It would have to be a bold wolf who could cope with the attention but that's why I said given the players involved.

sally - voted Shasta very early because she knew she might not have another chance to vote and because he was her top suspect. That's fine, but I can't anywhere find her reasoning for why he's her top suspect! If I had that I'd be much happier about her.

Shasta - votes Annu but again no reasoning!

Hmm. I don't know what to make of this. Annu I'm worried about because I would really like to see some thought through reasoning from him on why he finds Shasta suspicious because to me it feels like he's riding on Rikae's coat tails. Despite that I think he is more suspicious than her because while she may have (in my opinion) reacted overly strongly to what Shasta said I think Annu jumped on that far too quickly. I would be tempted to vote Shasta for the lack of reasoning. If you've got long enough to vote you've got long enough to write even a short sentence on why that person ... same goes for sally actually. That said Shasta I thought looked pretty innocent yesterDay so I won't vote for him.

Oh that's it, I'm arguing myself in circles now so I'm voting and going to bed:

++ANNU

Just still haven't got any worthwhile reasoning on his suspicion of Shasta, despite a post in which he had good reasoning for some suspicion or non-suspicion of many others.

[Thinlómien]

Nay, I were doin' no sich thing.You used it kind of as a counter-argument against your suspicions.

I have some deep reservations about Rikae myself. The previous Day she first brought the case against Shasta that seemed too overblown. She then climbed on the Mira band wagon, and toDay has voted Sally for what she admits is nothing more then 'bad vibes'.I think there's nothing bad in voting just based on "bad vibes" because in this game there's really not much else to go on. (Although let's not repeat this mantra too much or "much else" will become "nothing else" and it will only benefit the baddies.) In Rikae's case it is slightly interesting, though, as she has been so sure of stuff before. So you may still have a point here.


edit: xed with Kath and Boro

[Rikae]

I think this might be an opportune time to mention that if you lynch me, Sally dies too.

If you leave me for the aggressors toNight (and they decide to go for it) my pick will be Lommy.

[Inziladun]

I think this might be an opportune time to mention that if you lynch me, Sally dies too.

If you leave me for the aggressors toNight (and they decide to go for it) my pick will be Lommy.

A reveal, hmm? I wasn't aware the axe was that close to falling on you. How many actual votes (not mere suspicions) have you gotten today?

[Thinlómien]

I just wrote a rather lengthy paragraph discussing Rikae's latest post and then realised saying the stuff aloud isn't exactly smart whatever she is. She's giving me a headache, though.

Boro I must say you make a convincing case against Nogrod. I agree his resourcefulness concerning the kill reasons is a bit baffling and it's good you brought it to the spotlight (I had forgotten it). I also like what you say about his "them" thing. However, I'm still hesitant to think he's evil. I think he could have done all of that as a baddie.

++GWATHAGOR

for being a rotten fish.


edit: xed with Zil

[Boromir88]

A reveal, hmm? I wasn't aware the axe was that close to falling on you. How many actual votes (not mere suspicions) have you gotten today?

Well it is a close contest and she's already got 1. I'm not sure what you're trying to prove here. The hunter is actually usually more dangerous to the wolves known...it's a crew weapon they will want to stay away from. So, unless you're going to refute it, I really can't see why a mutineer would claim to be the hunter, even if one was in trouble. Because the real hunter would have him/her pegged. If Rikae was a mutineer, the ranger would have been a much better bluff.

[Rikae]

I believe you, Inzil, said you were considering voting for me, along with Lommy, and Nerwen did so. Since we have some among us who might like to take the easy route of following the the "known innocent"...

I thought it might be more useful to lay my cards on the table. Now we'll see who would prefer Sally dead, and who would prefer Lommy. :Merisu:

As for questioning me, relax - mine is the one role you'll have confirmed with one lynch or kill (although if I'm killed and the one I take with me claims to be hunter, you won't know which it is - but then it's kind of moot, you'll know one's hunter and one's evil).

EDIT: X'd with Lommy and Boro

[Boromir88]

Would a wolf Gwath not show up for a day? :rolleyes:...just asking

[satansaloser2005]

*blinks sleepily*

What be that, then? A wench tries to send her headache to the depths and she misses everything. What's going on?

(Hey, I'm not going out tonight but I'm feeling completely rubbish. I'll be back to say what I can later, but for now I don't feel up to reading stuffs.)

Best be careful who you be lynching toDay, folks. I'd hate to have the village lose their protector so soon in the voyage as well. I just be sayin'.


(I'll be back later if I can. I'll probably retract, and note that I did say my vote was a placeholder in case I couldn't come back. I still suspect Shasta, but after skimming through the thread I'm pretty sure I won't be up for killing him toDay, in favor of going after someone else.)

[Inziladun]

Well it is a close contest and she's already got 1. I'm not sure what you're trying to prove here. The hunter is actually usually more dangerous to the wolves known...it's a crew weapon they will want to stay away from. So, unless you're going to refute it, I really can't see why a mutineer would claim to be the hunter, even if one was in trouble. Because the real hunter would have him/her pegged. If Rikae was a mutineer, the ranger would have been a much better bluff.

I wasn't trying to 'prove' anything. Don't others have more votes at this point? And with several hours to go before DL, does this not seem premature?

[Thinlómien]

Would a wolf Gwath not show up for a day? ...just asking
I would not bet my money I'm right, but I think he's done that before.


edit: xed with Zil again

[Inziladun]

I believe you, Inzil, said you were considering voting for me, along with Lommy, and Nerwen did so. Since we have some among us who might like to take the easy route of following the the "known innocent"...

I thought it might be more useful to lay my cards on the table. Now we'll see who would prefer Sally dead, and who would prefer Lommy. :Merisu:

So people voicing mere suspicions of you hours before DL leads you to this?

Best be careful who you be lynching toDay, folks. I'd hate to have the village lose their protector so soon in the voyage as well. I just be sayin'.

And how many actual votes to this point have you had today?
Does no one else find this odd?

[satansaloser2005]

Dun, I didn't say me specifically. I just said to be careful in general.


Sorry, but I'm really out now. Back when I can be, I swears.

[Boromir88]

And how many actual votes to this point have you had today?
Does no one else find this odd?
Sally's move is odd, but Rikae's isn't.

[Rikae]

So people voicing mere suspicions of you hours before DL leads you to this?


So what's your point? That I'm a wolf? A cobbler? Fine, put your vote where your mouth is, if you don't mind taking the chance Sally dies too (and I can't change my pick until DL, anyway).

[Rikae]

Anybody else find what Inzil's doing here rather fishy, by the way?

[Inziladun]

So what's your point? That I'm a wolf? A cobbler? Fine, put your vote where your mouth is, if you don't mind taking the chance Sally dies too (and I can't change my pick until DL, anyway).

You've got it. You have one vote at this point, by my count (now two).

++ Rikae

Lynch me if you will. It'll do no good to the loyal crew.

[Boromir88]

Anybody else find what Inzil's doing here rather fishy, by the way?
I'll get back to you, I'm still thinking about it.

His reaction to your reveal was suspicious, because usually I would expect an ordo to be skeptical but still willing to believe it until there was a reason not to. But his reaction was more of an automatic "I don't believe you" and saying you were being hasty and not in any real trouble.

But then again, the reason I asked you Inziladun, if you were trying to prove something, was not to be snarky, but to simply ask what are you hoping to gain from doubting Rikae's claim so fast?

[Isabellkya]

I'm beginning to think Nerwen is quite furry underneath her Pirate get-up.
I've seen her before when she was a confirmed innocent. She corroborated that Greenie was telling the truth in that she was an innocent. So if you believe Greenie's claim of Seership, then you believe that Nerwen is an innocent. Yet she is hardly acting so innocent. Voting with not much reason? Voting with what seems to be the flow at the time?

Zil, would that be an indirect claim of Wolfship? Last game you "knew" I was innocent because you were furry.

Sally. My biggest grievance with her, is that she found Shasta "funny" on the first day, yet said it wasn't worth while to follow a hunch with a lynch. Yet voted him aways. Then returns toDay and votes him again, without any more reason. Or explanation for her previous actions.

I can understand Rikae's position. I'm fifty-fifty on whether or not to believe it.
Sally on the other hand... I think it hogwash.

Zil questioning reveal(s), and not so adamant to believe them? Erm, he did it when he was furry.

X'd with zil and Boro.

[Inziladun]

But then again, the reason I asked you Inziladun, if you were trying to prove something, was not to be snarky, but to simply ask what are you hoping to gain from doubting Rikae's claim so fast?

If her neck had actually been in the noose, maybe I could understand the reveal.
By my count, she was not even in the lead for votes!

[Boromir88]

I can understand Rikae's position. I'm fifty-fifty on whether or not to believe it.
Sally on the other hand... I think it hogwash.~Izzy
I'm not saying to not be skeptical, I still think maybe she's a co-conspirator, but she's not a mutineer. A mutineer who makes a hunter claim is a dead one, because the real hunter will know, and a mutineer doesn't have a death warrant. Which is why I told Inziladun, if she was a mutineer she would make a Ranger claim...simply because a ranger can't kill you.

However, I think the bigger question is, why have a knee-jerk that's a "fake claim" reaction. Someone says they are the hunter, and this is the person who will die, you shouldn't automatically react with "that's false," unless that person was the real hunter, or the real hunter did refute it.

[Isabellkya]

Zil.
If you have numerous people voicing that they may vote for you, and DL is approaching. And some have already voiced they wont be back, and have placed their vote. In a game where someone can be lynched with as little as four, maybe even three votes.. or even two for that matter. One as well, if everyone else abstains. The difference between one already made vote, and the discussion of possible.. two, maybe three more. Equals four. At the time, four total would've put her at the lead. I'd have to look back, but if tied.. first person with the tying number gets the noose?

X'd with Boro.

[Inziladun]

Zil.
If you have numerous people voicing that they may vote for you, and DL is approaching. And some have already voiced they wont be back, and have placed their vote. In a game where someone can be lynched with as little as four, maybe even three votes.. or even two for that matter. One as well, if everyone else abstains. The difference between one already made vote, and the discussion of possible.. two, maybe three more. Equals four. At the time, four total would've put her at the lead. I'd have to look back, but if tied.. first person with the tying number gets the noose?

X'd with Boro.

It still seems way premature to me. For what it's worth, I was leaning toward Annu again.
Boro may be right in that she's only a cobbler. Whether that's enough to make me retract is up in the air.

[Isabellkya]

You also have to take into consideration who is making the reveal/claim, Boro. Are they one bold enough to fake claim? To not?

I agree about the Hunter aspect. However, can't it be a multi-bluff? "Ooh, a wolf would never claim as Hunter because of such and such reason". Yeah they would be dead, only if the wolves killed the Hunter while the Hunter was hunting the outed wolf via fake claim. Would it then be wise for the hunter to out themselves, to reveal an outed wolf. Well then the Wolves would not kill the Hunter. They would leave them alone, thus rending them pretty useless. Unless I suppose they thought the hunter was not hunting one of them - which is a stretch in probability.

X'd with Zil.

[Isabellkya]

If she is a Cobbler, then why not just stay silent; to insure a mis-lynch?

The same could go. If a wolf won't fake claim as Hunter. Why would a Cobbler do so? To try and oust the real Hunter?

[Boromir88]

You also have to take into consideration who is making the reveal/claim, Boro. Are they one bold enough to fake claim? To not?

I agree about the Hunter aspect. However, can't it be a multi-bluff? "Ooh, a wolf would never claim as Hunter because of such and such reason". Yeah they would be dead, only if the wolves killed the Hunter while the Hunter was hunting the outed wolf via fake claim. Would it then be wise for the hunter to out themselves, to reveal an outed wolf. Well then the Wolves would not kill the Hunter. They would leave them alone, thus rending them pretty useless. Unless I suppose they thought the hunter was not hunting one of them - which is a stretch in probability.

X'd with Zil.

That's probably true, but usually I don't put that much thought into bluffs and others bluffing...but yes.

For what it's worth...Rikae, I thought you were the ranger based on a post and something else, and if it's ok I can point out why I thought that?

So, if anyone's wondering that's why I believed it fairly quickly.

Edit: Oh, and to totally confirm my thoughts you can say who you hunted on the previous day, but I'm not going to require that unless you want to.

[Rikae]

I find it a bit odd that Izzy is suspecting Nerwen at this juncture. I mean, sure, she could be evil, but there's good reason to focus on others now, as far as I can see - also, the way she's sort of on the fence about me looks baddie-ish. Seems more like a cobbler's diversionary tactics than anything else, though.

Boro, go ahead, why not - assuming it doesn't put the ranger at risk.

[Boromir88]

In 333...when you said this I got a feeling you were either the Ranger or the hunter.
We don't know which of those scenarios we're in, since the ranger or hunter might or might not influence it, but even gaining an extra night phase would help us. Games have been decided in the night phase before. A 50/50 chance on a lynch or ranger/hunter pick on Day//Night x is still better than a shot in the dark on Day 2.

And then in your vote post, you voted for Sally but used the "mug" icon...and I checked your other posts from the day, and you hadn't used an icon. So, I thought, mug--->bree---->Aragorn----->Ranger. Kind of twisted I know.

But also seeing as you have said sally will die if you are lynched, now the hunter makes more sense...as I checked your previous days vote for Shasta and you used the sword icon. But, when you switched to Mira, you used nothing, so I assume if you were lynched yesterday...Shasta would have died?

I haven't checked Day 1's vote, but 2 examples was good enough for me.

[Isabellkya]

Hehehe.
I'm not on the fence about you. I'm on the fence about your claim.


Really, I'm looking to see which way the wind blows in these here sails. Because I'm totally a Cobbler or Wolfy. So if you get lynched and are the Hunter, totally better for me and my mates. But if I'm a Cobbler like you think; then why aren't I trying to get myself lynched? Unless of course I think you my co-Cobbler, and figure.. what they hey. Might as well create a line-up of Cobbler lynches.

[/sarcasm]


Three hours until deadline. I don't see the point in focusing ONLY on others - whom you find good reason to think they deserve focus. Are you guaranteeing that each and everyone of us will be here toMorrow, so we can suitably spread the focus out on everyone else? Distraction tactics much?

[Rikae]

Haha... actually, I was just using the icons more or less randomly. :D Well, I did think the sword one would sort of imply hunter, though - and, actually, I tried to switch to hunting Shasta (from Eonwe) yesterday, but learned I couldn't.

[Macalaure]

Boro - probably innocent, but misguided about both Nogrod and Inziladun, I think.
Mith - innocent, methinks
Annu - really not sure about him
Lommy - feels pretty innocent
Wilwa - not sure, has escaped my attention so far
Inzy - feel confident about him, didn't find his reaction to Rikae suspicious
Izzy - no alarms
Gwath - I was leaning innocent, but I read a couple of good points about him today, so I'm going to have another look
Rikae - I think she's innocent, and I don't understand where the people that suspected her (pre-reveal) came from
Nogrod - suspicious til mid-Day 2, mounts o' sense afterwards. I think Boro's reasons against him are far-fetched (funnily, usually it's Nogrod who's far-fetched, and Boro who's matter-of-fact)
Sally - not sure, need to make mind up, protector-thing be mighty queer
Kath - probably innocent
Shasta - co-conspirator possibly, but no mutineer
Eonwe - leaning toward innocent
Did I forget someone?

I think what Rikae says makes sense, but right now I find it more telling that Nogrod gave a reason for Eomer's death and two others (Mac and Lommy) came in for support as if to say case closed...that is usually a telling sign of wolf (or mutineer behavior).

Just said that I agreed with him. Haven't seen a better explanation than his so far.

Mac also agrees with Nog on that ... but then seems to change his mind.

Huh? No. Never changed my mind about it.


About Rikae's reveal. 65% she's honest, 15% she's not the hunter, but still innocent, 15% she's a conspirator (who needn't fear being the hunter's pick), 5% she's a mutineer.

[Rikae]

Wait a minute - you say everyone's innocent.

[Macalaure]

I know! :(

I'm working on it... ;)

[Macalaure]

About Gwath - reading over his posts from yesterday again now - did anybody else get the impression of a mutineer-mutineer thing with the way he went after Annu? He didn't say anything of consequence the whole day, then makes an analysis and ends up with Annu being his top suspect. Then he takes the first opportunity to opt out of his suspicion (Boro's plead for Mira). He even defends Boro's idea to Inziladun and me. What wonders me most:

First he wrotes this about my vote for Eomer:
I reckon you be feelin' pretty confident about your vote, then?

Then he says:
Well, I be votin' now. I'm awrful suspicious of Annu, but I'm gonna put it off until tomorrer, so:

I don't know about you, but when I'm awfully suspicious of someone, I'm definitely confident enough to lynch the person even if I'm convinced that mathematically someone else's death would be beneficial.

And I only just realised that he hasn't posted today so far. Hmm.

[Isabellkya]

Sally: I find her actions in regards to Shasta a bit suspect.

Rikae: Brief. Short. In terms of reasonings and suspicions.

Lommy: Leaning Innocent.

Zil: Fishy.

Boro: Leaning Innocent.

Wilwa: Nada.

Shasta: Where is he?

Annu: I don't get what the fuss is about.

Mac: Something funny going on between him and Nog. Voting alongside your top suspect?

Nerwen: I find her behavior and lack of reasons for her vote choices suspicious - as previously mentioned/stated.

Kath: Waffling between innocent and nada read.

Gwath: I don't get what the fuss is about.

Nog: Something funny is going on between him and Mac. He isn't normal NogSelf. So I'm inclined to believe he is either a Cobbler or a Wolf.

Mith: Leaning Innocent.

Eonwe: Where is he?



Between Nog, Mac, or Sally. My vote will be placed.

[Gwathagor]

Arr, Mac me mate, I be busy all day ye see. But I be here and ready to read. And it seems I'll have some answerin' to do, as well. No problem thar though.

[Macalaure]

Just had another look at Sally and found nothing that enlightened me. Still wondering about that protector-thing out of nowhere. It makes no sense, but the way she mentioned it doesn't look very cobbler-ish.

[Rikae]

Voting alongside your top suspect?

What's so odd about that? People do that all the time. Izzy, I have to say, your lists and opinions have a very... fabricated look about them.

[Macalaure]

Just to see where we're standing right now:

Sally -> Shasta
Nogrod -> Annu
Boro -> Nogrod
Rikae -> Sally
Mith -> Nogrod (2)
Shasta -> Annu (2)
Wilwa -> Gwath
Eonwe -> Gwath (2)
Nerwen -> Rikae
Kath -> Annu (3)
Lommy -> Gwath (3)
Inzy -> Rikae (2)

Annu, Gwath 3, Nogrod, Rikae 2, Shasta, Sally 1

[Inziladun]

I took a break to relax and try to get a clear head. Not much success there.
Right. My problem with Rikae's reveal is I still don't see why it had to be done just then. If she'd made it clear she had to go and wouldn't be back before DL, that might have changed things. But I see she's been posting recently. What gives? Honestly? Coming out with that when she wasn't even in the lead on votes? And no one else seems to be batting an eye.
Sally's remarks were even more bizarre. Since Rikae had cast a vote for her, it muddies the waters even more.
I have a few minutes to see if some burst of enlightenment arrives.

[Gwathagor]

Alright, most likely the last time I can make it on so I'll be voting now. The only one I really feel suspicious of is Gwath, for his vote Day 1 and also for his vote yesterDay, not only was it for Mira (when he was actually suspicious of Annu) but it also seemed like he did it just to kinda go with the crowd and not attract attention. I'm not suspicious of any one else really so this is an easy choice of me.

++Gwathagor

So that'll probably be all from me toDay. See you all tomorrow.

Wilwa clearly be out for some revenge against her shipmate, for votin' for her in Day 1.

And so, I'm sadly goin' t'vote for me last fellow monke'. Shame that:

++Gwathagor

He's been going with the flow a lot, and not made many points of his own. He is maintaining a low profile even with the number of posts he has, and though he talks a lot, he seems to not say much of substance. I shall have to fill up the powder on my own.

Bandwagon?


++GWATHAGOR

for being a rotten fish.




Aye, bandwagon.

I think this might be an opportune time to mention that if you lynch me, Sally dies too.

If you leave me for the aggressors toNight (and they decide to go for it) my pick will be Lommy.

Now Rikae, this be makin' things difficult for me since you be the sensible defensive vote for me, if I want to stay in me skin a few days longer. It's nothin' personal, but you be havin' the next highest number of votes. What to do, what to do...



Gwath: I don't get what the fuss is about.



I'll ye what happened. Boro made some remarrrrk about how I be disagreein' with his conservative approach yesterday, someone else be sayin' they need to see more from me, and next thing ye know, Wilwa be votin' for me out of revenge. Eonwe (of all people!) comes alongside and accuses me of followin' the obvious flow of opinion among me fellow pirates - this be Captain Obvious Eonwe we be speakin' of here, mind ye! At this point, other scurvy dogs begin to get ideas because they can't think for themselves, they make mention of how they be wonderin' about me, and soon enough, the rest of the crew has got the idea that I've been behavin' in a most peculiar and suspicious mannaarrrr. Ask anymate who's sailed with me beforrre, and they'll tell ye that this how I always be gettin' lynched. Every time. I become the default lynch, to speak uncouthly.

[Isabellkya]

Hahaha.

You know what happens when people say my lists and opinions look fabricated?

Most, if not all of the time. Either A) They are wolves and are trying to find someone to lynch or throw under a moving ship to save themselves. Or B) They actually have nothing to say.

;)

[Gwathagor]

So what's your point? That I'm a wolf? A cobbler? Fine, put your vote where your mouth is, if you don't mind taking the chance Sally dies too (and I can't change my pick until DL, anyway).

Well now, Rikae, if you be tryin' to hold Sally's death over our heads, then why be you votin' for her? You apparrrently find her suspicious enough to have to walk that tharrr plank.

[Inziladun]

Can someone answer this? If Rikae is truthful, and as Boro said, the hunter is more dangerous known to the baddies, what would the reason be for broadcasting her current pick, as well as who she's considering for the next Night? What if she's made the wrong choice?
They lose nothing by doing away with her in the Night.

[Gwathagor]

No answer now? Doesn't matter. I probably wouldn't be believin' ye now if ye did answer me.

[Rikae]

Now Rikae, this be makin' things difficult for me since you be the sensible defensive vote for me, if I want to stay in me skin a few days longer. It's nothin' personal, but you be havin' the next highest number of votes. What to do, what to do...

Along with Nogrod - and Annu has the same number of votes you do. But of course you'd rather get rid of the hunter as safely as possible, wouldn't you?

I could help you in your dilemma by switching my vote to you, though, if you like...

[Gwathagor]

Can someone answer this? If Rikae is truthful, and as Boro said, the hunter is more dangerous known to the baddies, what would the reason be for broadcasting her current pick, as well as who she's considering for the next Night? What if she's made the wrong choice?
They lose nothing by doing away with her in the Night.

Hm, that be sound salin' and true words, methinks.

[Inziladun]

It's too late for this.
I'm staying the course. Let the cards fall as they may.

[Macalaure]

Gwath, while I agree that the other people voting for you may not have the best reasons, I'm afraid I still suspect you more than the rest o' the crew.

what would the reason be for broadcasting her current pick, as well as who she's considering for the next Night?What she says about her picks might or might not coincide with the truth. ;)

[Gwathagor]

Along with Nogrod - and Annu has the same number of votes you do.

Oh. :o You be right about that.

[Rikae]

Don't expect me to answer your questions instantly, I'm not just sitting by the computer.

I think recent posts give me an idea what's going on here (which is a very nice thing for a hunter to have):

Izzy looks like a co-conspirator.

Gwath appears to be an aggressor.

Sally is not an aggressor, in that case.

Inzil is either not thinking at all before typing, or evil.]

It appears my reveal has been very helpful - which it would not have been if I had not made it in time to influence people's actions. :p

[Rikae]

Hm, that be sound salin' and true words, methinks.

Translation: "Thanks for the tip, cobbler"?

[Isabellkya]

I personally think the Hunter is more dangerous not known to the baddies.

If known, why would the baddies try to kill them? Hunter could be hunting one of them. Trying would be like waving a flag saying "Woof Woof. I'm a baddie!". Also if more dangerous known, then why isn't the hunter known from the beginning?

I think she said she was looking for those willing to lynch Sally/Lommy.. or something of that nature.

If people are un-willing to lynch either of those, then it could suggest that one of them or both is a wolf. If Hunter is hunting an innocent and blurts it out...

X'd since #407.

[Gwathagor]

Arrr, this be sour. At this point, I more than likely will be votin' either Annu, since I don't feel like dyin' today, or Rikae, whose hunter claim doesn't make a great deal of sense to me - though there be no reason she couldn't wait till tomorrow.

[Macalaure]

At first I didn't think Inzy's initial mistrust of Rikae was suspicious, but now that he insists on it, I get a co-conspiratory feeling from him.

[Macalaure]

++Gwathagor

To take the winds out of the sails of the Rikae-waggon.

[Gwathagor]

Translation: "Thanks for the tip, cobbler"?

Because...the remark was anti-Rikae?

[Rikae]

Because...the remark was anti-Rikae?

Because the remark was helpful only to aggressors?

[Nerwen]

Arr, shipmates, now that Rikae ha' revealed, I reckon we can no be lynchin' her toDay.

She might be lyin', 'tis, true, but we dursn't risk lynchin' th' venger.

--Rikae.

EDIT:X'd wi' some lubbers.

[Nerwen]

I be agreein' that yon Izzy is liker a co-conspie than anythin'.

An' Mr Gangrenous, ye ha' made fair p'ints against Rikae to begin wi', but ye ha' taken it too far– can ye not see 'tis too great a risk to lynch her?

Now who to vote?

EDIT: punctuation.

[Isabellkya]

I think the helpfulness of your reveal, remains to be seen.

If you thought so.. your vote speaks otherwise.


++Nog

For reasons stated previously.


X'd with Nerwen.

[Nerwen]

++Annu.

'Tis he or Gwath... they both looks summat suspic-u-ous.

EDIT:X'd wi' Izzy.

[Gwathagor]

Because the remark was helpful only to aggressors?

Well, now I'm mad enough to swear. I'm more than a little offended that you honestly think I'm that stupid and that you honestly think you're that brilliant. Done talking to you now.

[Gwathagor]

++Annu

[Brinniel]

Belay that talk! Deadline. I should probably check my tally since it was close, but I believe it is Annu who is dead.

[Rikae]

Well, now I'm mad enough to swear. I'm more than a little offended that you honestly think I'm that stupid and that you honestly think you're that brilliant. Done talking to you now.

What the @#@%@#$ are you talking about?

EDIT: "and that you honestly think you're that brilliant"
That is unforgivable. Apparently you're not just offended because I supposedly think you're stupid, but because I have a higher opinion of myself than you consider appropriate. Outrageous.

I'm seriously considering dropping out of the game now. I don't need to put up with this crap.

[Brinniel]

It was a steamin' day 'n th' tension on th' Grey Gaurhoth was almost as stiflin' as th' heat. Th' crew was droppin' like flies, 'n yet they remained as clueless as ever as to who their mutineers could be. They argued 'n discussed, 'n fin'ers went in all directions.
When accusations were flung at Puffy Shirt Rikae, she retorted, "Well if ye lynch me, then that Legless Sally Dawkins dies too." Her claim as avenger had various responses; some found themselves willin' to believe her, while others remained a wee bit more paranoid. "Why reveal now?" asked Inziladun Jones. "Ye weren't 'bout to walk th' plank just yet."

But in th' end, it was decided that High-Pitched Annu was bein' far too sneaky fer her own jolly. Surely she was up to no good, 'n to be rid 'o her would be fer th' better 'o th' crew.
"Have ye any final words?" Shark Tooth Shasta asked th' surgeon.
But Annu, tired from th' day's events, was too busy takin' a caulk to notice her own fate. Poop Deck Kath gave her a harrrd nudge, but she only rolled over 'n continued to snore.
Shruggin', Cowerin' Gwath said, "Well, who said she had to be awake fer her own execution?"

So Almost-Blind Nerwen picked up High-Pitched Annu's saw 'n began sawin' her right down th' middle. Meanwhile, th' surgeon continued to snore away. Halfway through, she began to giggle 'n she muttered, "Arrr, that tickles," then resumed snorin'. When Nerwen finished, High-Pitched Annu had be split in a pair. Immediately, her bottom half jumped to its feet 'n ran around in confused circle in a similar manner to a headless chicken. After 'bout a jolly five minutes, th' dizzy legs wobbled, then toppled overboard wit' a loud plop.

When High-Pitched Annu finally awoke, dusk had already settled in. Her long nap had left her feelin' rejuvenated, yet she could not help but feel 'tis odd ting'lin' sensation below her...
"Avast, thar, whar did me legs be off?" she cried aloud.
Lookin' around, she observed th' pool 'o blood she was lyin' on 'n th' pair 'o very familiar footprints that circled her several times over, then led straight off th' edge 'o th' deck.
Th' surgeon sighed. "Well, they may have gotten me bottom half, but at least me better half remains onboard. Hands be all a surgeon needs 'n so long as I got them, I be jolly."
'An since she had no legs to take her to her bunk, High-Pitched Annu closed her eyes 'n went back to sleep on th' deck.


The Living:

-Legless Sally Dawkins ~ Carpenter
-Puffy Shirt Rikae ~ Cabin Boy
-Pirate Lommy the Infected ~ Quartermaster
-Gangrenous Inziladun Jones ~ Pilot
-Pirate Boromir the Malformed ~ Gunner
-Stutterin’ Wilwa Scab ~ Cook
-Shark Tooth Shasta ~ First mate
-Snifflin’ Mac Sparrow ~ Cooper
-Almost-Blind Nerwen ~ Navigator/Sea Artist
-Poop Deck Kath ~ Musician (Pipe)
-Cowerin' Gwath Slasher ~ Powder Monkey
-Pirate Nogrod the Fashionably Late ~ Gunner
-Ham-Hands Izzy ~ Striker
-Short Ruth Mithril ~ Cook
-Stinkin' Eön Bloodbeard ~ Powder Monkey


The Ghosted:

-Black Death Brinn ~ Captain ~ shish kabobed (mod)
-Slippery McCabbie Dagger ~ Boatswain ~ danced the hempen jig
-Lil' Green the Staggering Drunk ~ Powder Monkey ~ drank up all the rum
-Dancin' Mira Blythe ~ Striker ~ danced her way off the deck
-Whinin’ Eomer Bonny ~ Musician (Pur-loined Violin) ~ his pur-loined violin pur-loined him (or rather, his life)
-High-Pitched Annu ~ Surgeon ~ halved by her own saw


Night 4 has begun. Gifteds and aggressors, do whatever you need to do.

[Brinniel]

That nightfall, Stutterin' Wilwa Scab could not sleep. While everyone else's minds were on who to lynch next, her thoughts remained elsewhere. Sighin', she pulled out her journal 'n began to doodle. In th' candlelight, th' scribblin's could be read as "I heart Davy Jones."
She whispered to herself, "Oh Davy Jones, don't ye be knowin' how I lust ye? Just gift me a sign 'n I'll be yours fer all eternity."

'An as though Davy Jones had indeed heard her, Wilwa Scab shifted her candlelight to spot baskin' in th' small flame's glow, a small chest wit' a dagger restin' on top.
"Well, I suppose that's gunna do," said th' cook. Grabbin' th' chest 'n dagger, she eagerly ran up to th' top 'o th' deck.

Above deck, th' air smelled 'o salt 'n dark clouds threatened that a rainstorm was on its way. Standin' at th' railin', Wilwa Scab closed her eyes 'n smiled.
"I can almost spy wit' me eye ye now, Davy Jones," she gushed.
Without further thought, she plunged th' dagger into her chest 'n wit' it, she dug out her own heart. She then carefully placed her heart inside th' chest, shut it tight, then threw it into th' sea. Wilwa Scab watched th' chest disappear wit' a giddy smile on her face. Her smile soon turned to worry as she realised she was still on deck.
"Oh begad," she moaned. "Bein' a ghost be just plain rotten. How be th' infamous tale 'bout th' affair 'o Wilwa Scab 'n Davy Jones ever to be told if I be to forever walkin' upon 'tis cursed ship?"
Th' disappointed Wilwa sat below upon th' deck 'n waited fer her lover to snatch her away. Unfortunately fer th' cook, it was a wait that could take a very long time.

Th' next mornin', th' crew woke to find th' body 'o Wilwa Scab. She told them her desperate tale, 'n it was apparent that she was her own victim, not th' aggressors'. Yet no other body could be found in sight.
"What happened?" wondered Lommy th' Infected. "Be all th' aggressors dead?"
"Nah," Boromir th' Malformed replied. "If that were so, we wouldn't still be in 'tis mess. Seems that not only be these swabs filthy mutineers, but they be lazy too."
"Lucky fer us," noted Ham-Hands Izzy.


The Living:

-Legless Sally Dawkins ~ Carpenter
-Puffy Shirt Rikae ~ Cabin Boy
-Pirate Lommy the Infected ~ Quartermaster
-Gangrenous Inziladun Jones ~ Pilot
-Pirate Boromir the Malformed ~ Gunner
-Shark Tooth Shasta ~ First mate
-Snifflin’ Mac Sparrow ~ Cooper
-Almost-Blind Nerwen ~ Navigator/Sea Artist
-Poop Deck Kath ~ Musician (Pipe)
-Cowerin' Gwath Slasher ~ Powder Monkey
-Pirate Nogrod the Fashionably Late ~ Gunner
-Ham-Hands Izzy ~ Striker
-Short Ruth Mithril ~ Cook
-Stinkin' Eön Bloodbeard ~ Powder Monkey


The Ghosted:

-Black Death Brinn ~ Captain ~ shish kabobed (mod)
-Slippery McCabbie Dagger ~ Boatswain ~ danced the hempen jig
-Lil' Green the Staggering Drunk ~ Powder Monkey ~ drank up all the rum
-Dancin' Mira Blythe ~ Striker ~ danced her way off the deck
-Whinin’ Eomer Bonny ~ Musician (Pur-loined Violin) ~ his pur-loined violin pur-loined him (or rather, his life)
-High-Pitched Annu ~ Surgeon ~ halved by her own saw
-Stutterin’ Wilwa Scab ~ Cook ~ gave her heart to Davy Jones


Day 4 has begun. Start talkin'.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Iiiiinterestin'. So there was no kill because of inactivity?

[Inziladun]

First thing toDay is to explain, not defend, my vote for Rikae.
As I said earlier, I thought the timing of the reveal highly suspect. It simply seemed unnecessary at that point. I began asking questions of Rikae which I thought reasonable. I had no intention of voting for her at first, even though many people were not there at that time and a counter claim still seemed at least possible to me. Still, I was willing to wait til the next Day to see what the others would say when given a chance.
Then, I was met with this:

So what's your point? That I'm a wolf? A cobbler? Fine, put your vote where your mouth is, if you don't mind taking the chance Sally dies too (and I can't change my pick until DL, anyway).

Now, I was more than a little tired, and this put my back up. So I voted for her. Then I got rather frustrated, because from what I could tell, everyone else seemed to think nothing unusual of Rikae's behaviour. Finally, I went to bed, sticking with my vote, since it appeared it would make no difference anyway.
It's no more complex than that. Make of it what you will.

[Inziladun]

Iiiiinterestin'. So there was no kill because of inactivity?

Strange, indeed. I wonder what is going on.

[satansaloser2005]

Mehbe Willa was the kill, so Brinn didn't modfire her because....well, because I suppose, since she was just going to be ghosted anyway. What do you think? Plausible?

[Isabellkya]

There are no mutineers and Brin is running some sort of sick and twisted experiment on us all.

[satansaloser2005]

There are no mutineers and Brin is running some sort of sick and twisted experiment on us all.



If that's the case I'm suing for plagiarism, because I totally thought of it when doing my game. (Then again, who hasn't?!:p)

[Nerwen]

Mehbe Willa was the kill, so Brinn didn't modfire her because....well, because I suppose, since she was just going to be ghosted anyway. What do you think? Plausible?

Nah. Either it's a Ranger-save, or else the baddies forgot to send in the kill... and the narration indicates the latter.

Which might mean we've managed to knock off one or two of them.

If that's the case I'm suing for plagiarism, because I totally thought of it when doing my game.

Why doesn't that surprise me?:rolleyes:

[Nerwen]

Anyone around?

[Eönwë]

Hmm... So I'm guessing that either the wolves forgot/weren't able to send their kill or a modifiring takes the place of a kill to give us clueless innocents more of a chance.

[Inziladun]

Nah. Either it's a Ranger-save, or else the baddies forgot to send in the kill... and the narration indicates the latter.

I tend to agree with this. The narrative didn't appear to say anything about ranger involvement.
All this time and no one else has been here? After the chaos yesterDay? :p

[Eönwë]

And just before I start being accused of bandwaggoning (like Gwath already did yesterday), I would like to say that I was working on my list and vote post at the same time (on different tabs) and so didn't see Wilwa's vote until I refreshed the thread before posting my vote post (if you look carefully you'll see I added the x-post bit just before I posted my vote post).

Just wanted to point that out...



Now to mutineer hunting! (No, that's not a reveal :rolleyes:)


edit: didn't x-post

[Nerwen]

I tend to agree with this. The narrative didn't appear to say anything about ranger involvement.
All this time and no one else has been here? After the chaos yesterDay? :p

Lying low, it seems...

Mehbe Willa was the kill, so Brinn didn't modfire her because....well, because I suppose, since she was just going to be ghosted anyway. What do you think? Plausible?

This is something I forgot to say before: your little theory assumes Wilwa's not an aggressor. We don't know that. At least I don't.

[Thinlómien]

I think the narration implies quite clearly that the mutineers didn't send in a kill. Why, it is an interesting question. The most probable reason is that they messed it up - someone promised to send in the kill and forgot, the others left it up to one of them and s/he didn't happen to come to be around before DL, anything. That's happened before. Or then, they didn't send in a kill in order to confuse us. I think our Cap' has done that as a wolf and with rather confusing results. So, sadly, I don't think we can deduce much of the kill - except that I'm slightly inclined to agree with Nerwen that if the mutineers were all alive, the chance to such a slip would be smaller (if it was a slip). And with no clear reason this missing kill makes me suspicious of the missing Nogrod. :rolleyes::D

[Annunfuiniel]

Ah, I love my death scene to pieces! :D Not the most noble way to go, but definitely entertaining.

I forgot to vote before going to bed and then didn't hear my alarm in the morning. Don't know if it would've made any difference if I had been here though... Anyways, all you managed to do was to lynch a plain ordinary innocent. So, not a total disaster because you hit none of the gifteds but still... Can't honestly say "Keep up the good work". :rolleyes:

But I'll be around, or at least half of me will be. :)

[Thinlómien]

I think Inziladun's explanation of his vote seems ok, it didn't even make me suspicious in the first place, but this makes me raise my eyebrows:
It's no more complex than that. Make of it what you will.A frustrated innocent or an overreacting mutineer? Could be either.

Mehbe Willa was the kill, so Brinn didn't modfire her because....well, because I suppose, since she was just going to be ghosted anyway. What do you think? Plausible?
This is something I forgot to say before: your little theory assumes Wilwa's not an aggressor. We don't know that. At least I don't.Good spotting, Nerwen - that is what I'd call a slip. But then again, I have made a rather similar slip when innocent... although when I made the slip I already knew the person I was talking about was innocent, so Sally's slip is a bit different... interesting.

I'm off to make a list.


edit: xed with a ghost

[Nerwen]

Good spotting, Nerwen - that is what I'd call a slip.

A possible slip, anyway. Not quite on the order of, say, Agan's last game... but I'd certainly be interested to hear Sally's explanation.

[Macalaure]

While it can happen to the best of us to miss a kill, how can it be that four people missed it? It indeed indicates that one, probably even two, mutineers are ghosted. McCaber and Annu were lynched, Mira and Wilwa left. Do you think two of them could be mutineers? Of the two deserters, one could easily be (both would be a bit much). I don't think McCaber was a mutineer, so that would mean that Annu perhaps was.

As an afterthought, while missing a kill indeed can happen to everyone, it might be helpful to have an eye on the ones who do not post very frequently.

Irrespectively, Gwath and Inzy are very high on my suspicion list right now. I'm not entirely sure about Gwath - he might be a mutineer or innocent, but doesn't feel like a conspirator. Inzy, however, has to be either conspirator or mutineer - unfortunately I'm leaning more toward the former.

Another thing about the night kill: The most likely pick of Rikae was either truthfully Sally or Gwath. If those two aren't mutineers, then the night choice was awfully easy for them, and it would make it all the more puzzling that the kill was missed.

[Boromir88]

Another thing about the night kill: The most likely pick of Rikae was either truthfully Sally or Gwath. If those two aren't mutineers, then the night choice was awfully easy for them, and it would make it all the more puzzling that the kill was missed.~Mac
Well if it was not sending in a kill, then there's really no way to tell why.

But, I would like to hear Rikae's night selection, because if it was Lommy, then that's not looking good for Lommy. If Lommy's a wolf, and they fear the Hunter's picked her, they would want to stay away, but if they kill someone else, that just makes Lommy look even more suspicious. So, the laziness could just be cover to confuse us...still I don't really understand why the wolves wouldn't purposefully make a kill. They just handed us another chance.

But, as Lommy did say, it could have just been a slip up in communication.

Now here's a conspiracy theory...Nogrod, Mac, and Lommy are mutineers who are making it look like we have inactive wolves, so they can get us to continue to lynch the less active.

Whatever it is, just a communication mishap, purposefully not killing, or some whacked out conspiracy theory...would now be a good day to perhaps double-kill and get some concrete info?

[Inziladun]

I think Inziladun's explanation of his vote seems ok, it didn't even make me suspicious in the first place, but this makes me raise my eyebrows:
A frustrated innocent or an overreacting mutineer? Could be either.

Could be, I agree. I know how the whole incident could appear. I was at work and quite tired when I wrote that. I am again at work after around 5 hours sleep.

Irrespectively, Gwath and Inzy are very high on my suspicion list right now. I'm not entirely sure about Gwath - he might be a mutineer or innocent, but doesn't feel like a conspirator. Inzy, however, has to be either conspirator or mutineer - unfortunately I'm leaning more toward the former.

I'm sorry you feel that way. As I said, I can understand why people would be suspicious. Consider it well, though.

[Thinlómien]

-Legless Sally Dawkins ~ Carpenter
She's fishy if something. I keep flip-flopping on her - it's difficult to say if she's the evil sneaky Sally or just a busy Sally (or evil busy Sally, you catch my drift). But she does not seem especially innocent, I'm keeping my eye on her for now.

-Puffy Shirt Rikae ~ Cabin Boy
I think she is the hunter and at least it's safe to assume that for now. I was reluctant to talk about it yesterDay but people said aloud everything I was thinking but not saying so I may as well repeat - it is possible she's not the hunter, but then she's just an ordo or a cobbler, not a wolf.

-Gangrenous Inziladun Jones ~ Pilot
A difficult one to judge, no doubt. Not ringing any serious alarm bells but then again he fooled me completely last time too.

-Pirate Boromir the Malformed ~ Gunner
By gut-feeling I'd say he's innocent but I'm not as sure as I was on the earlier Days - the problem is that I know I'm innocent, Rikae seems to be innocent and I don't suspect Nogrod or Mac too much either and it just seems unprobable none of us experienced loudmouths would be evil. Especially as Nerwen seems to be a known innocent, Mith feels pretty genuine and Kath does not ring too many alarm bells either... Well anyway, I'm not very concerned about him.

-Shark Tooth Shasta ~ First mate
I think he is probably innocent. Or then he's a cobbler. But he seems quite genuine and just not very mutineerish. But then again he also slips under my radar. Difficult.

-Snifflin’ Mac Sparrow ~ Cooper
He is hibernating under Rudolph (to paraphrase Eönwë) and that's somthing I don't like. I keep thinking "oh Mac, nice, ok" when I see his posts and I don't like that at all. I have the feeling that he's innocent but I also have the feeling I'm mistaken here. Will watch him closely from now on. (I wonder if this all is due to him being more quiet than normal maybe...?)

-Almost-Blind Nerwen ~ Navigator/Sea Artist
I'm treating her as a known innocent for now.

-Poop Deck Kath ~ Musician (Pipe)
Hibernating under Rudolph as well. And I'm worried - she could very well be evil. The problem is that whenever she's evil, if I happen to catch her it's because she acts incriminatingly with her fellows, but in this game, there is no such evidence to go on. So I'm afraid she's evil and I just won't catch her.

-Cowerin' Gwath Slasher ~ Powder Monkey
I don't know... I still think he's fishy, but his frustration was genuine yesterDay... but wolves can be genuinely frustrated too. I don't know. My suspicion of him has lessened since I voted him but I can't quite give a rational explanation for it. I'm still watching him.

-Pirate Nogrod the Fashionably Late ~ Gunner
I don't like the fact that he can't be around... I keep forgetting to be wary of him. I will return to thinking about him when he returns, as of now I will just remain awaiting and slightly suspicious.

-Ham-Hands Izzy ~ Striker
People say she is slippery or has a fabricated tone to her posts, but she's one of those I feel the best about. There's simply nothing to make me suspicious. And I like her because she's being smart.

-Short Ruth Mithril ~ Cook
I think I can read her pretty well - maybe? - and I'm not alarmed. She seems to be on the busy-ordo-Mith mode right now.

-Stinkin' Eön Bloodbeard ~ Powder Monkey
Seems pretty innocent, I think.

So, in conclusion:
not suspicious of - Rikae, Nerwen, Izzy, Mith, Eönwë
not suspecting too much - Zil, Boro, Shasta
wary of - Mac, Kath, Gwath, Nogrod
suspicious of - Sally

And if my opinions change a little in the course of this post, don't worry, it's just that I think and write at the same time so the whole process gets kind of recorded.


edit: xed with everybody

[Rikae]

Yep, I was hunting Lommy.

Today my main suspect is definitely Gwath. I think his reaction yesterday... well, innocents and baddies alike can get irritated in this game, but it reminded me very much of something that's happened to me before when I was evil. Someone accused me of making a slip I most certainly didn't, and wouldn't, make, and I reacted with righteous indignation (which I showed openly in hopes it would make me look more innocent). It looks like Gwath was having the same sort of reaction yesterDay.

As far as Sally's "slop", I'm assuming Wilwa's more likely innocent for the same reason I'm assuming that about Mira, and so it doesn't surprise me that Sally does so too. Besides, she did say "maybe". I don't think it's a slip.

Actually, I'm starting to wonder about Nerwen - I'd find her suspicious if she wasn't a quasi-known-innocent. Of course, the baddies might just leave her alive to try and force us to check her by double-lynching Greenie, and no one else has claimed to be seer. Best to wait, I guess (this is all sort of stream-of-consciousness).

If we're going to double-lynch at some point, I thihnk it would be best to do so to someone we lynched in the first place, wo we can analyze how everyone acted toward the lynch/bandwagon.

But today, I'm pretty much sure I'll vote for Gwath. Nothing personal, mind you, I just think he's a wolf.

But, I would like to hear Rikae's night selection, because if it was Lommy, then that's not looking good for Lommy. If Lommy's a wolf, and they fear the Hunter's picked her, they would want to stay away, but if they kill someone else, that just makes Lommy look even more suspicious

Well, bear in mind, if you thought it was possible that I was hunting Lommy, the baddies might have thought so, too, regardless of who I actually hunted. They might have also thought, like Mac, I was hunting Sally or Gwath.

[Thinlómien]

While it can happen to the best of us to miss a kill, how can it be that four people missed it? It indeed indicates that one, probably even two, mutineers are ghosted. McCaber and Annu were lynched, Mira and Wilwa left. Do you think two of them could be mutineers? Of the two deserters, one could easily be (both would be a bit much). I don't think McCaber was a mutineer, so that would mean that Annu perhaps was.

As an afterthought, while missing a kill indeed can happen to everyone, it might be helpful to have an eye on the ones who do not post very frequently.
As well as looking at those who do not post very frequently, we should look at those who have been away (like Nogrod). And this all verges on the edge of what is fair play and what is playing on out-of-game reasons (it would be easy to start checking who has posted on the 'Downs during the Night phase etc).

Besides, it can also be misleading. Imagine I - a rather active player who was online on the 'Downs yesterday - was a mutineer. The deadline happens to be 7am my time. Imagine my fellows are Americans who have their most active hours after I go to bed in the evening. What do I do? Probably send my suggestions on who to kill to my mates before I go to sleep and trust them to send the kill to the mod. They are all so called not-so-frequently posting people and they miss the kill (say, one is dead, one appears a few hours before the DL, sees the last one hasn't posted, sends a PM and leaves it up to them, and they don't turn up at all because of some unexpected hindrances). Now, by your logic, it would easy to say that I'm not likely someone to miss the kill, although it is exactly what happened in this example scenario. So, summa summarum, no use making hasty conclusions.

Another thing about the night kill: The most likely pick of Rikae was either truthfully Sally or Gwath. If those two aren't mutineers, then the night choice was awfully easy for them, and it would make it all the more puzzling that the kill was missed.
But, I would like to hear Rikae's night selection, because if it was Lommy, then that's not looking good for Lommy.
Excuse me, gentlemen, but just how on earth do you expect the mutineers to know Rikae's pick?

Mac, you expect the mutineers to have reached the same conclusion about Rikae's possible picks and furthermore, you expect your guesses to be correct. Ever heard of a bluffing hunter? You think too simply for me to be comfortable with you. And you assuming the mutineers to think like you looks like your pack had a nice chat last Night. ;)

Boro - what on earth do you think we gain from knowing whom Rikae really hunted? The mutineers didn't know it either. Whether Rikae really hunted me or just threatened to wouldn't have affected their choice of action, because they had no way of knowing whom Rikae hunted. It doesn't incriminate me any more if Rikae really hunted me or not, what matters is that she threatened to. But there's no way a mutineer-me would have known whether she was bluffing or not, or a mutineer-anyone else would have known it. So, in short, the mutineers couldn't have just acted blindly on the assumption that Rikae hunted me, nor could they have chosen to attack or not attack her based on whom she hunted because they didn't know it.

Huh, you two confuse me.


edit: xed with Rikae

[Boromir88]

Boro - what on earth do you think we gain from knowing whom Rikae really hunted?~Lommy
I thought Rikae was pretty serious it would be sally if she was lynched, and you at night, considering the circumstances she was in and the threat of being lynched. Of course she could have been bluffing the night selection and the mutineers would have no way of knowing who she was really hunting, but if they feared one of their own was someone being hunted they wouldn't want to kill her. If they thought she was hunting an innocent they would. Simple as that.

I took who she said she was going to hunt as not a bluff, and well...maybe the mutineers did too.
By gut-feeling I'd say he's innocent but I'm not as sure as I was on the earlier Days - the problem is that I know I'm innocent, Rikae seems to be innocent and I don't suspect Nogrod or Mac too much either and it just seems unprobable none of us experienced loudmouths would be evil.
It wouldn't be the first time that none of us were...our Cap'n might enjoy watching the loudmouths lynch off eachother after tension builds and the first few days. If you feel I'm innocent, than trust it, don't let your feelings that it's "illogical" that none of the loudmouths are wolves to cloud your judgement of who you feel is innocent or not.

But look at the night kills...Greenie and Eomer, two players who are thoughtful voters, but were less active on this ship. Why wouldn't they kill off the loudmouths, why would they kill off their cover? And look at our lynches...McCaber, Mira, and Annu...how successful have we been? I don't know, maybe the time is right to check one of them. We could end up with some real information if we lynch one of those 3 again.

This will get me in trouble, but I don't care at this point...I wouldn't have passed up a night kill. I would have thought that would exonerate me completely. :rolleyes:

But, I should say Lommy, your last post looks pretty innocent because it is so flippy-floppy :p. If that makes any sense. I could tear it apart for all the inconsistencies in there, but that actually makes you look better.

[Boromir88]

Just spit-ballin' here, knowing Mira's role could be really beneficial. It may sort out that sparring to lynch her or not, and could shed some light on Eomer's nightly death.

McCaber's could be good too, considering somehow he got lynched, with Shasta and Nogrod in danger too. But last minute bandwagons tend to include innocent's and may not involve the mutineers at all...still could be useful.

I never really was suspicious of Annu, so I don't know if his 2nd death would give us something, I will have to check the end of Day 3, but maybe someone thinks that could give us something? Care to explain, if you do?

[Rikae]

Inzil - I'm still wondering what to make of his "if Lommy isn't an aggressor, they might as well just kill Rikae" of yesterday. My first thought was that it was a cobbler pointing out to the baddies that I was probably bluffing about my pick, since it wouldn't serve my interests to be honest, in he guise of an ordo wondering why the hunter would announce a pick at all... now I'm wondering if it was an ordo's attempt to help me bluff, in spite of the earlier distrust... nah, now I'm spinning far-fetched theories Nogrod-style. :D Anyway, I'm inclined to think he's either a conspirator or an ordo.

Sally - Lying low, as Lommy mentioned - fishy. Then again, always seems a bit evil. I can't remember what the especially evil looking thing she did earlier was - I'll have to go back and look.

Gwath - Top suspect for reasons mentioned before.

Mac - Quiet, which I think is mostly due to having the flu. - though that doesn't make him innocent. I don't think he'd be one to miss the kill, though, and he's on EST now, so... leaning innocent.

Lommy - I agree with her that it's unlikely Mac, Boro, Nog, Nerwen, Lommy and I are all innocent. I'm not so sure she's innocent, though, and I have my doubts about Boro, too. Actually, I'm not sure about anyone but myself. :p

Boro - Looks innocent enough, which makes me think he's quite possibly guilty. By that I mean, I don't see any of his usual tricksiness. At this point in the game I would have expected an innocent Boro to have more of an impact. Still, that's just a negative suspicion, and therefore not that strong.

Nogrod - He seems more orless like himself, except that he hasn't gone after me, and he and Mac haven't gone after each other - which is actually very strange. I get the impression he's lying low, but is that what an aggressor-Nog (or ordo-Nog) would do?

Izzy - Flying under the radar, reminds me vaguely of the time I was a wolf with her...

Nerwen - as I said earlier, unsure, but don't see the sense in double-lynching Greenie to check her now.

Kath - Not only flying under the radar, but what she does post makes me uneasy.

Eonwe - I think he's probably innocent.

Shasta - likewise

Mith - I still don't have enough to go on.

[Thinlómien]

But, I should say Lommy, your last post looks pretty innocent because it is so flippy-floppy . If that makes any sense. I could tear it apart for all the inconsistencies in there, but that actually makes you look better.The post where I replied to you and Mac? I thought the other one was slightly illogical due to me writing and thinking at the same time but not that one...

And Boro it still doesn't shed any new light on the mutineers' actions that Rikae now confirmed she hunted me. (Speaking of which, I'm glad she was not killed, in that case. I hope she chooses better the time they really decide to go for her. :p)

It wouldn't be the first time that none of us were...our Cap'n might enjoy watching the loudmouths lynch off eachother after tension builds and the first few days. If you feel I'm innocent, than trust it, don't let your feelings that it's "illogical" that none of the loudmouths are wolves to cloud your judgement of who you feel is innocent or not.Nah, I doubt our Cap would do that. But you're right - I am clouding my judgement. Because it is silly to divide people up to completely random categories like "loudmouths" and expect a certain percentage to be wolves, it's the same as taking a category like "those who wear red socks" and assume a certain percentage of them is wolves. (Or okay, slightly less silly because mods may regulate how many loudmouths they take into a wolf team but not how many people wearing red socks they take - or at least I assume so. ;)) But anyway, whether my reasons to start looking for faults in fellow loudmouths were good or not, I'm glad I did start doing it because I was kind of ignoring people.

And Boro if you're a mutineer I'm saying this now already - you should be ashamed of how you try to manipulate me. But if you're innocent I can just take it as big brotherly advice. ;)


edit: xed with Boro and Rikae

[Nerwen]

I thought Rikae was pretty serious it would be sally if she was lynched, and you at night, considering the circumstances she was in and the threat of being lynched. Of course she could have been bluffing the night selection and the mutineers would have no way of knowing who she was really hunting, but if they feared one of their own was someone being hunted they wouldn't want to kill her. If they thought she was hunting an innocent they would. Simple as that.

Even if Gwath or Sally is a mutineer? They might have considered it too much of a risk. They couldn't have known for sure who Rikae would pick.

I think it's safe to say that if the baddies failed to send in the kill on purpose, it would mean at least one of those three (Gwath, Lommy & Sally) is probably guilty.

EDIT: X'd since Boro at #450; clarification.

[Macalaure]

Well if it was not sending in a kill, then there's really no way to tell why.Not definitely, but some scenarios are more likely than others.

Oh, and I forgot about Lommy up there - it looks a bit worse for her, too.

-Snifflin’ Mac Sparrow ~ Cooper
He is hibernating under Rudolph (to paraphrase Eönwë) and that's somthing I don't like. I keep thinking "oh Mac, nice, ok" when I see his posts and I don't like that at all. I have the feeling that he's innocent but I also have the feeling I'm mistaken here. Will watch him closely from now on. (I wonder if this all is due to him being more quiet than normal maybe...?)That is not vague at all... :rolleyes:

we should look at those who have been awayThose, too, yes.

Besides, it can also be misleading.I don't expect in the least that we could catch all mutineers this way, of course not. But I find the scenario where all mutineers are active and involved and they still missed the kill unlikely (though not impossible).

Ever heard of a bluffing hunter?

Duh. But, if I'm a wolf and the claimed hunter states he is going to pick me then I'm a lot more cautious about killing him than in the case that he states he thinks I'm not suspicious.

Lommy, why are you so defensive about this thing?


You are right, though, that it borders a bit on the "meta" level. I do not advocate lynching someone only because he's more quiet or has been away, just saying we should have an extra eye on them. We are sorely lacking knowledge, so every little valid assumption is helpful.

I wouldn't have passed up a night kill.Says he who missed yesterday's deadline because he fell asleep. ;)

[Rikae]

I thought Rikae was pretty serious it would be sally if she was lynched, and you at night, considering the circumstances she was in and the threat of being lynched.
Actually, I was hunting Kath yesterDay. I just wanted to see how people would react to a Sally-kill.

It wouldn't be the first time that none of us were...our Cap'n might enjoy watching the loudmouths lynch off eachother after tension builds and the first few days. If you feel I'm innocent, than trust it, don't let your feelings that it's "illogical" that none of the loudmouths are wolves to cloud your judgement of who you feel is innocent or not.

Hmm. I don't really like the way you latch on to the idea that none of us are evil - shows an awful lot of certainty wrt Mac, Nog, etc.

We could end up with some real information if we lynch one of those 3 again.
I'd rather lynch Gwath toDay, and try the double-lynch toMorrow.

This will get me in trouble, but I don't care at this point...I wouldn't have passed up a night kill. I would have thought that would exonerate me completely. :rolleyes:
One reason not to kill anyone... it's been done before.

[Nerwen]

Actually, I was hunting Kath yesterDay. I just wanted to see how people would react to a Sally-kill.

Well, at the risk of being Captain Obvious, it certainly looks as if it can't be Gwath and Sally.

Why Kath, though?

[Boromir88]

And Boro if you're a mutineer I'm saying this now already - you should be ashamed of how you try to manipulate me. But if you're innocent I can just take it as big brotherly advice.~Lommy
I know I am pretty manipulative when I'm evil, but I still would live by a code and wouldn't be that evil. :cool:

Says he who missed yesterday's deadline because he fell asleep.~Mac
Haha, you try laying down on it and staying awake! :p

Hmm. I don't really like the way you latch on to the idea that none of us are evil - shows an awful lot of certainty wrt Mac, Nog, etc.~Rikae
I'm actually still most suspicious of Nogrod, but he did tell everyone he would miss today, and it doesn't feel right to push a lynching with someone who won't be here for a day. It may seem contradictory to why I wanted to lynch Mira, but we knew she would not be back and would be gone...Nogrod has assured his return.

[Boromir88]

P.S. Lommy I was referring to your list post, there are so many holes there...hehe. "I'm not suspicious of any of the loudmouths, but I'm wary of Nogrod because of _____" I could drive a semi through those gaps...well if I knew how to drive a semi I could. :p (Oh and so no one gets confused, I'm saying those inconsistencies make Lommy look more innocent to me)

[Macalaure]

I need to get a list out of my head.

Boro - Something makes me uneasy about him, but I don't know what. I need to have a closer look at him, and I hope I will have time to do it properly today.
Eonwe - Probably innocent.
Gwath - A whole lot: possible pick for Rikae, suspicious behavior yesterday, less active yesterday (same at night?), the things I already stated about him yesterday and which he didn't really reply to.
Inziladun - Because of his behavior towards Rikae yesterday, likely cobbler, perhaps mutineer.
Izzy - I'm fine with her right now.
Kath - No reason to suspect her right now, but I'm afraid I might have overlooked her a little.
Lommy - Overdefensive to the guesses about the reasons for the missed kill. Also, picked by Rikae.
Mith - Don't know, but probably innocent
Nerwen - Quasi-known innocent.
Nogrod - His absence makes a missed kill more likely, but I have no other reason to suspect him now.
Rikae - See no reason to doubt her claim.
Sally - Possibly afraid of killing Rikae, and she's been less active than usual, so watchworthy. Wouldn't vote for her without any other reason, though.
Shasta - I still think he might be a conspirator.

That makes:
Innocent: Nerwen, Rikae
Pr. innocent: Eonwe, Izzy, Kath, Mith, Nogrod
Don't know: Boro, Sally, Shasta
A little suspicious: Inzy, Lommy
Suspicious: Gwath

[Isabellkya]

Hehe. You are too funny Rikae. Which is it? Cobbler or Wolf? Can't be both. Or are you just content with trying to throw people under a passing-by moving ship for... whatever reason strikes your fancy at the moment and hope someone other than you goes? Regardless if it matches up with what you say previously? xD


At the moment in time, if I were voting - it'd be for Sally or Nerwen.

Sally - is suspicious. Her behavior.. I would assume she is keeping up with the thread, yet she doesn't make comments? Doesn't respond?

Nerwen - she is latching on to things too easily. Going with the flow too easily, regardless if it makes her opinions and stances differ. Let alone for reasons I've previously stated.


*goes off gathering, not hunting*


X'd with Mac.

[Mithalwen]

Here and reading... but I doubt that the missed kill (assuming that is what it was) was intentional since with the role being hidden it seems an unnecessary tactic. I hope it means that the number of agressors have reduced and the remainder somehow didn't get their act together because their dominant colleague was absent... of course this might be overly optimistic.

[Rikae]

Oh, I see, Izzy - you're trying to pose as a hunter yourself? Meh, you're probably just a cobbler, no sense in wasting time arguing with you.

As for hunting Kath - it was something she said the day before. I'll have to go see if I can find it again. It was also partially process of elimination - thinking everyone but Kath, Gwath, Sally and Lommy looked innocentish at that point.

Izzy & Inzil are our cobblers, I think.

Gwath, maybe Lommy or Boro, maybe Kath are aggressors...?

Well, anyway, I know who I'm voting for, so I might as well:

++Gwath

[Rikae]

Now I remember what had me suspicious of Kath - it was all that talk of "twisting words". It seemed premature and an attempt to add fuel to the fire of the argument between Shasta and I, and see one of us lynched. Since I ended up thinking Shasta innocent, and I know I'm innocent, that remark on Kath's part looked like an attempt to get an innocent lynched. Lately, though, Kath has looked a little better. I made my pick early in the Day yesterDay, and later would have hunted someone else (I won't make that mistake again - I'll make my choice late in the day, to ensure that I take all relevant information into account).

[Thinlómien]

The more I see of Mac, the more wary I get. I hope it's not because I thought he might be a baddie after all and thus am now seeing everything from that perspective... it has happened to me before. But I still don't like him, that list of his, it's oh so fabricated. He's going with the flow a bit too much and I get the feeling he's agreeing with Rikae to avoid her putting all her attention to him and realising he's evil.

Okay, I was refraining to comment on the double-killing thing because I had to check the rules (someone gave me the impression there were double-lynches and it made me wonder why we hadn't done that before :rolleyes: ) but here's my take on it: I don't think we can afford it, but then again, we can probably afford it even less in future. I think it would be most beneficial to know what Mira was and Annu may be less beneficial information - and checking McCab, the Day1 lynch? The fact that Boro even considers it makes him seem cobblerish. I keep kind of forgetting we have those imps in this game, and even two of them - might be good for everyone to take into account that Nerwen may very well be one.

I think it's safe to say that if the baddies failed to send in the kill on purpose, it would mean at least one of those three (Gwath, Lommy & Sally) is probably guilty.I don't think so. If I was a mutineer, I would probably have gone after Rikae because I'd have trusted on her bluffing, or then if my mates had opposed the idea I would've gone for someone looking rangerish instead but there's no way I would have intentionally missed a kill, no never at this kind of point of the game (or actually no never ever in any case but that's a different thing...). Just I can't see the no-kill pointing especially at anyone Rikae could probably have been hunting because there was the option of picking someone else.

That is not vague at all...It is vague because my feelings about you are vague. I don't pay much attention to you and the stuff you say doesn't ring any alarm bells (up until you reappeared now) but I have the bad feeling my good gut-feeling of you is false. That simple.

But I find the scenario where all mutineers are active and involved and they still missed the kill unlikely (though not impossible).Well in the end, it all comes down to timezones and timetables. Imagine all mutineers were active players but the deadline was problematic for all but one either permanently (like me) or temporarily (someone having a meeting with friends then or something) and thus the sending of the pick being left to a certain pack member who should be around but s/he falls asleep, his/her computer fails, s/he has to run for an urgent affair x and can't get back in time... I don't really think we can make too much assumptions on this.

But, if I'm a wolf and the claimed hunter states he is going to pick me then I'm a lot more cautious about killing him than in the case that he states he thinks I'm not suspicious.Well that depends on each individual I'd say - I wouldn't act much differently, really, because there's no way of knowing whether a hunter is bluffing or not.

Lommy, why are you so defensive about this thing?Not intentionally at least. ;) But really, I don't think I'm defensive. I merely don't understand your and Boro's logic, and it always makes me slightly annoyed when people start applying meta-reasons because it's not exactly fair.

Well, at the risk of being Captain Obvious, it certainly looks as if it can't be Gwath and Sally.Well, at the risk of being Quartermaster Dumb, why?

P.S. Lommy I was referring to your list post, there are so many holes there...hehe. "I'm not suspicious of any of the loudmouths, but I'm wary of Nogrod because of _____" I could drive a semi through those gaps...well if I knew how to drive a semi I could.Well I said I was thinking and writing at the same time, I actually started suspecting Mac & Nogrod more after saying it's unlikely all the loudmouths are innocent, because I started sort of rethinking about it. And actually, I've been rather unsure of Nogrod all the game and I was stretching a little when saying I'm not suspicious of him to prove the point that I don't feel secure trusting you... duh. :rolleyes:

Izzy's acting weird. I think she may be a cobbler after all.


edit: xed with the double ladies

[Rikae]

Boro and Lommy mentioned checking Mira, but I actually think that would be rather misleading, since the decision to lynch Mira was influenced by the whole debate of double-lynch-vs.-lynching-doomed-person - a debate that isn't really resolved, as far as I can tell. I know I voted for Mira in good faith and innocently, and that had nothing to do with what her role was, which could very well be the case for others who voted for her,. If she is innocent (which I think she probably is) double-lynching her looks like a tactic for the aggressors to go after those who voted for her , who could well be innocent too. In fact, if we do double lynch her and she turns out innocent (or even cobbler), Boro and Lommy will become more suspicious in my eyes for that reason.

On the other hand, if she' did turn out to be an aggressor, it wouldn't tell us much of use either. The other aggressors wouldn't have much cause to have argued strongly against lynching her, since they were going to lose her anyway, but they also probably would have preferred to see an innocent lynched as well.

I still think the time isn't yet ripe for double-lynching.

Well, at the risk of being Quartermaster Dumb, why?

I think he meant that Gwath wouldn't have encouraged suspicion towards my reveal if he had been a wolf with Sally, since it might have put her in danger? It doesn't really make sense, though, since it's not likely I would have been lynched after my reveal, regardless of Gwath's, Izzy's, and Inzil's suspicions. I'd ask him, but he's making pancakes at the moment. :)

[Boromir88]

The more I see of Mac, the more wary I get.~Lommy
I'm suspicious of Mac, solely for the reason that he said my Nogrod case looked far fetched. I mean excluding Rikae's points today about Gwath, I haven't seen much better reason, or a case to lynch someone, other than what I said about Nogrod yesterday.

Mac saying it looked far-fetched, looks like he's trying to protect Nogrod and since I'm suspicious of Nogrod, I've been watching Mac. But, not knowing Nogrod's role, currently I still think Mac may be a co-conspirator, his first day and half suspicion against Nogrod could have been an attempt to find a mutineer, and his backing off, is to protect a mutineer-Nogrod.

Anyway, those have been my thoughts on Mac for the last day +

I think it would be most beneficial to know what Mira was and Annu may be less beneficial information - and checking McCab, the Day1 lynch? The fact that Boro even considers it makes him seem cobblerish.~
I guess since I want to consider all options that makes me a cobbler? :rolleyes:

I think knowing McCaber's role could be beneficial, considering Shasta and Nogrod were also in danger of being lynched. And in this set up, it would be less risk if mutineers wanted to protect other mutineers.

And actually, I've been rather unsure of Nogrod all the game and I was stretching a little when saying I'm not suspicious of him to prove the point that I don't feel secure trusting you... duh.
You're asking yourself the wrong question which is why you're just confusing yourself. You're asking "Can Boro be manipulative and tricksy when he's evil?" Come on, we all know the answer to that, and that's why you don't feel safe trusting me.

Ask yourself...right now, at this moment, do you think based on the kill choices, the no kill, based on everything I have said, do you think I'm innocent? I expect only a yes or no back, no "yes but..." or "no but..." No thinking yourself into circles, just "yes" or "no."

[Boromir88]

Oh, and I'm not saying we need to double-kill today, I was just bringing up the possibility that since the wolves missed a chance yesterday, now we actually could take a chance to double-kill

[Nerwen]

think he meant that Gwath wouldn't have encouraged suspicion towards my reveal if he had been a wolf with Sally, since it might have put her in danger? It doesn't really make sense, though, since it's not likely I would have been lynched after my reveal, regardless of Gwath's, Izzy's, and Inzil's suspicions. I'd ask him, but he's making pancakes at the moment. :)

I don't think that would do you much good anyway– it was I who said it, not Mac. And yes, I was referring to Gwath's behaviour. He was pushing quite hard to lynch you.

EDIT:X'd with Boro.

[Nerwen]

Now I'm starting to wonder if Gwath and Boro are in it together.

[A Little Green]

Phew. It took me something like 3 hours to read the thread... I'm kinda glad to be a ghost since I really can't make much out of this mess. A few little (green) comments, though.

First of all, a small thing, probably a mistake but I'd like it cleared just in case. However, I'm still hesitant to think he's evil. I think he could have done all of that as a baddie.Eh?

Then a few comments 'bout the people.

-Legless Sally Dawkins ~ Carpenter
Confuses me.

-Puffy Shirt Rikae ~ Cabin Boy
I'm inclined to believe she's the hunter.

-Pirate Lommy the Infected ~ Quartermaster
Seems rather like the innocent Lommy.

-Gangrenous Inziladun Jones ~ Pilot
Hmm. Earlier on in the game I felt pretty good about him but his reaction to Rikae's reveal was interesting and made me unsure.

-Pirate Boromir the Malformed ~ Gunner
I'm thinking him an unlikely mutineer but possible co-conspirator, maybe leaning ordo above anything else.

-Shark Tooth Shasta ~ First mate
Leaning innocent.

-Snifflin’ Mac Sparrow ~ Cooper
No idea whatsoever.

-Almost-Blind Nerwen ~ Navigator/Sea Artist
The only one I have information on. She is not a mutineer. She is either innocent or a co-conspie. I guess she's innocent.

-Poop Deck Kath ~ Musician (Pipe)
Seems genuine and makes shrewd points.

-Cowerin' Gwath Slasher ~ Powder Monkey
I don't like his vagueness (is that a word?). I was somewhat suspicious of him before people started suspecting him, after which he started to seem more genuine.

-Pirate Nogrod the Fashionably Late ~ Gunner
I have the feeling he's being ordo, mutineer, and co-conspirator all at once. :rolleyes:

-Ham-Hands Izzy ~ Striker - Is it only me or is she acting real strange? She has become increasingly weird as the game progresses and I'd really want to know what she is up to. Leaning co-conspie. Probably not a mutineer - I get the feeling that a mutineer-Izzy would be more careful and slippery.

-Short Ruth Mithril ~ Cook
Leaning innocent.

-Stinkin' Eön Bloodbeard ~ Powder Monkey
No idea.

[A Little Green]

Now I'm starting to wonder if Gwath and Boro are in it together.Gwath and Boro? Why them?

I'd like to check the interactions between Nog and Sally. Dunno why, that just popped into me mind. I might do that still toDay.

[Nerwen]

Gwath and Boro? Why them?

*shrugs* Only because Boro seems to be trying so hard for double-lynching someone... it just occurred to me that he might be trying to take the heat off Gwath. I don't really suspect him all that strongly, though.

[Rikae]

I don't think that would do you much good anyway– it was I who said it, not Mac. And yes, I was referring to Gwath's behaviour. He was pushing quite hard to lynch you.

EDIT:X'd with Boro.

:rolleyes: So that's why Mac seemed confused. Well, it seemed to me Inzil was pushing harder - and also that Gwath would have known it wasn't going to happen.

Now I'm starting to wonder if Gwath and Boro are in it together.

Seems like a possibility.

[Nerwen]

:rolleyes: So that's why Mac seemed confused. Well, it seemed to me Inzil was pushing harder - and also that Gwath would have known it wasn't going to happen.

Well, maybe I was a little too hasty in saying Gwath and Sally couldn't be packmates, but I still think it makes it less likely – some goes for Inzil and Sally.

[Thinlómien]

You people are again assuming that the baddies assume the hunter does not bluff. *jumps up and down in irritation*

[Boromir88]

Sorry Nerwen I'm not exactly sure how bringing something up can be called "pushing" for something. I brought it up considering our fortune in no wolf killing...your point? Then Lommy asked why McCaber, so I answered...that's hardly pushing anything.

For what it's worth, as far as my opinions on Gwath. I'm usually more defensive towards him than 'offensive' because of similar histories...or an understanding. At one point, early on I was lynched 3 straight times on Day 1 (and I think 4 out of 5) for who knows what reasons? I couldn't tell you. Gwath had a similar run, I mean being unjustifiably lynched on Day 1 for random reasons...mostly done by the hand of Nogrod. I've usually been pretty defensive for his style, because he's been lynched a lot of times early for really no good reason.

Granted this has gotten me into trouble before, because one time I did declare him innocent and he winds up killing me during Night 2 as the bear, or wolf, or something.

But the fact is I didn't see any good reason for why he was in lynch trouble yesterday. I agreed with him, I mean he has to come back from not being on all day, read through the activity, and suddenly find himself a snowballing of suspicions. I've had the same "what the hell happened?" reaction, that doesn't mean he's a mutineer.

I defended someone...who cares? If he's a mutineer, I'm not one and I've been good...great job Gwath, see if you can do it next time. If he's innocent, I'm glad I've been defensive for him.

[Rikae]

Not sure why no wolf kill makes us fortunate, considering that we're still down one person (Wilwa) who was probably innocent (for the same reason as Mira).

[Boromir88]

Not sure why no wolf kill makes us fortunate, considering that we're still down one person (Wilwa) who was probably innocent (for the same reason as Mira).

Well we're not down another person...I'd call that fortunate.

[Thinlómien]

Wait let me think. If Mira was evil, her mates would have wanted to lynch someone else too to make the game more even, unless all the other options were baddies too. If Mira was innocent, her mates would have wanted to... what? They could have advocated lynching someone else innocent to do better, or they could have advocated lynching Mira if their fellows were in danger. So Rikae may be right - knowing about Mira alone would not be that enlightening. Unless she turns out to be an aggressor, though, we may be able to read something from her behaviour. Ah, I don't know, this is difficult. I really doubt we will find out much by killing Annu again, or McCaber. Just somehow I think it won't lead to any information that is even half-concrete. There should be some more-dividing case that we could double-lynch someone and draw conclusions.

I guess since I want to consider all options that makes me a cobbler?*shrugs* Sometimes that's what cobblers do, sometimes that's what innocents do.

I think knowing McCaber's role could be beneficial, considering Shasta and Nogrod were also in danger of being lynched. And in this set up, it would be less risk if mutineers wanted to protect other mutineers.But it was Day1, and fair or not, people tend to prefer lynching people like McCab on Day1 rather than people like Nog or Shasta.

You're asking yourself the wrong question which is why you're just confusing yourself. You're asking "Can Boro be manipulative and tricksy when he's evil?" Come on, we all know the answer to that, and that's why you don't feel safe trusting me.

Ask yourself...right now, at this moment, do you think based on the kill choices, the no kill, based on everything I have said, do you think I'm innocent? I expect only a yes or no back, no "yes but..." or "no but..." No thinking yourself into circles, just "yes" or "no."Hahahaha, now I have a personal psychologist. :D But sadly my answer remains "yes, but" and you just have to accept it.

Oh, and I'm not saying we need to double-kill today, I was just bringing up the possibility that since the wolves missed a chance yesterday, now we actually could take a chance to double-killYes but now that they've missed it once we can "miss" ours at any point of the game just as well... but of course, who says we shouldn't take an advantage of being one step ahead of them in this game that is highly advantageous for them because of the mystery that surrounds everything?

First of all, a small thing, probably a mistake but I'd like it cleared just in case.
However, I'm still hesitant to think he's evil. I think he could have done all of that as a baddie.
Eh?Eh well I of course meant "goodie" not "baddie"... :o


edit: xed with all the three posts

[Thinlómien]

Well we're not down another person...I'd call that fortunate.Exactly.

But then again, we are not as fortunate as we would be in a normal game - in this game we need every clue we can get and the mutineers deny us our clues by failing to send in the kill. :( (If they're doing it intentionally, I say it's not fair unless it backfires and we get to reduce their numbers without them killing us.)

[Nerwen]

I have to go now, so

++Gwath.

As usual, I'll try and be back before DL and may change my vote.

About double-lynching people: it's like this– we will have to eventually, because otherwise we're completely in the dark. However, every time we do, we're in effect giving the mutineers a free turn. I don't think we'll get more than a couple of shots at it, so we have to choose the time and the person very carefully.

EDIT:X'd with Lommy.

[Mithalwen]

Sorry I have been quiet. Just terminally befuddled. Will have another go... a concrete pieceo of information would be nice ... but it aint a decision to be taken lightly... and most of the people I want to check out are inconveniently still alive.

[Rikae]

Well we're not down another person...I'd call that fortunate.

We're still in the same situation we would have been in after a normal Night. Besides, even if you want to say we're ahead by a round, it's going to be that way for the rest of the game - no need to double-lynch someone today.

[Thinlómien]

Haha everybody's again assuming Wilwa was innocent. Are we all mutineers? ;)

[Macalaure]

Alright, Izzy seems to either not pay attention or isn't on our side.

But I still don't like him, that list of his, it's oh so fabricated. He's going with the flow a bit too much and I get the feeling he's agreeing with Rikae to avoid her putting all her attention to him and realising he's evil.

Fabricated... going with flow... isn't that just a tad generic (as opposed to "vague" ;))? It's also wrong: I included points about some people's absence and activity in there, which nobody else did.

Anyway, I do agree with you that, if we do a double-lynch today, it should be with Mira or Annu. Boro's suggestion of McCaber might suit his pursuit of Nogrod better, but it is not very beneficial in general. I wouldn't call him a cobbler over that, but his approach is too fixed.

In fact, Lommy, reading along your posts more, you're starting to look ok with me again.

I'm suspicious of Mac, solely for the reason that he said my Nogrod case looked far fetched.

Then you suspect me solely for the reason that we differ in opinion.

[Thinlómien]

1, 2, 3, 4, will not get too suspicious of Mac, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 ...

And I have no idea what to make of his and Boro's little quarrel. *shrugs* It feels unlikely they're both innocent. Currently I feel either (if not both :rolleyes: ) of them is a cobbler. *another shrug*

[Macalaure]

1, 2, 3, 4, will not get too suspicious of Mac, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 ...:rolleyes: :p

[Thinlómien]

Mac you're cute. :D But I do suspect you nevertheless. I admit I was being a bit generic in my comments about you, but what I said is true: you agree with others a lot, especially with Rikae. It makes me cautious, because normally you disagree with the majority a bit more. It could be just random, but I doubt that. You seem a tad too eager to please which is why I doubt you're totally honest. But I don't know if you're a mutineer or a co-conspirator. The kill choices don't look particularily you-ish although otherwise you strike me as more mutineerish than co-conspirational. I wonder, though, if a co-conspirator wouldn't be a bit more original in his suspicions - unless he felt they're targeted at totally wrong people. :rolleyes: Boromir then, he seems like his innocent self a lot, but you're doing good job of making him look more suspicious and Rikae made a good point about him being less tricksy than usual (although that could be just due to not having tp around to play with :p). I think it is very well possible he's a co-conspirator (and thus a dangerous one) but I doubt he's a mutineer.

[Thinlómien]

I will be voting and going to bed in 0,5-2,5 hours. I hope there's a lot of discussion before that. Currently I'd feel the most comfortable voting Sally or Mac, and also quite ok voting Gwath.

Sally is not around enough so I keep forgetting she's suspicious and thus may waver at the critical moment.
Macalaure may well talk me around from suspecting him, especially if he's aided by Rikae.
Gwath seems like too easy a solution, especially as more or less everybody is willing to get rid of him. It just goes too easily for my taste.

[Thinlómien]

By the way, where are all our resident ghosts (except for Greenie)? Mira and Wilwa's absences are explainable, Eomer said he'd be busy, but what about McCab and Annu? Annu has been around but not shared much thoughts with us - would it be hasty to conclude he was a mutineer and is thus not too concerned to come and help the village with his points?

I also miss some people who are alive - I'd love to hear more of Sally, Shasta, Kath and Eönwë... (and Nogrod, but he won't be back until toMorrow.)

[Macalaure]

Mac you're cute. :D

:D

you agree with others a lot, especially with Rikae.

Not sure whether that's true. Maybe because there is so little evidence? Anyway, I disagreed with Nogrod a lot on Day1, and with Boro afterwards. I think I only agree with Rikae's suspicion of Gwath and Inzy.

You seem a tad too eager to please which is why I doubt you're totally honest.

Is that why me backing off from you made you more suspicious? Well, I didn't suspect you at all until today, because of being Rikae's claimed pick and your defensiveness about my suspicion of you because of this combined with the missed kill. However, after you moved on from that, I found myself agreeing with the things you said again. Rest assured that I still have half an eye on you, though.

The kill choices don't look particularily you-ish

:D Now, that one you have to explain: What is a me-ish kill choice?

but you're doing good job of making him look more suspicious

Really? I am suspicious of him, but I don't think I actually made that many points against him. (I might still, much later, when I have time to concentrate.)

(all quotes by Lommy)

[Boromir88]

Then you suspect me solely for the reason that we differ in opinion.~Mac
If you want to put it like that, sure, but I also consider you a "vote for me just waiting to happen." :p

It's not a mere difference of opinion, it's how easily you dismissed the suspicion, instead of countering with any reasons why you disagree, you said it was far-fetched. The end. But I would feel more comfortable lynching Nogrod than you at this point, as well my feeling primarily is Nogrod is a mutineer.

Call it guilt by association, which I'm sure is all Nerwen and Rikae were pointing out between Gwath and me, but I'm a hypocrit. ;)

Hahahaha, now I have a personal psychologist. But sadly my answer remains "yes, but" and you just have to accept it.~Lommy
Yeesh, everyone assumes I'm a nasty, manipulating, trickster all the time, always up to something. I'm not, I'm pretty blunt and straightforward about everything, don't know why everyone assumes I'm always up to mind games. :rolleyes:

[Rikae]

Yeesh, everyone assumes I'm a nasty, manipulating, trickster all the time, always up to something. I'm not, I'm pretty blunt and straightforward about everything, don't know why everyone assumes I'm always up to mind games.

Nah, I assumed you were a clever, entertaining trickster (I actually learned a few tricks from watching you). But if you insist, I'll consider you boring. :p

[Eönwë]

Hmm... after reading over the posts toDay, it seems that it has mostly been "morning talk". Nothing's really happened yet, and people are still mostly commenting on yesterday.

[Thinlómien]

Is that why me backing off from you made you more suspicious? Well, I didn't suspect you at all until today, because of being Rikae's claimed pick and your defensiveness about my suspicion of you because of this combined with the missed kill. However, after you moved on from that, I found myself agreeing with the things you said again. Rest assured that I still have half an eye on you, though.I was not actually assuming you were trying to please me by backing away, but something about how you backed away did seem somehow wrong to me. You know, like a wolf thinking "okay, this case is not worth pursuing right now, let's leave it for later".

Now, that one you have to explain: What is a me-ish kill choice?I don't know, actually... just the list Greenie-Eomer-no kill doesn't seem like you, but now that you provoked me to think about it more, it doesn't really seem like anyone. :confused: Except maybe Nerwen - don't ask why - and that doesn't make much sense. Or I don't want to think of it making sense now. Ooh, I just got a brilliant idea but I'll keep my mouth shut for a while before saying more. ;)

Really? I am suspicious of him, but I don't think I actually made that many points against him.Yes - my second thoughts of him are partly due to you and Rikae's suspicion against him, and that's no small part. I think I'm still on my way to learning not to trust anyone except myself in ww, but I'm progressing slowly because it's so tempting to trust nice and smart people and sometimes it's also very beneficial. But I have the feeling that too often I'm sitting here and accusing people or agreeing with them and waiting for someone to tell me "you're right here, you're wrong there" and solve it for me (maybe one of the reasons why I want Nogrod back so badly :rolleyes: ).


edit: xed with Rikae and Eönwë

[Mithalwen]

OK I know I have been quiet but I tend to think our agressors be quiet or absent sinceI can't imagine any of the people who are being very active here wasting a kill chance in the special circumstances of this game. I know that I always try to set up a provisional kill or default if I am wolfing (in Brinniel's last game I did so because my packmates werein wildly divergent timezones and we never got to talk. I can't imagine Lommie or Mac or Boro not bothering or not having the confidence to request a kill on their own authority. Much more likely to have a conspirator among the talkers.

I think there would have been a challenge by now if Greenie were not the seer - so that clears Nerwen.

I therefore do suspect the quiet more and wonder about Nogrod... now I am sure he would impress on packmates the necessity of getting a kill but what if the second in command was unexpectedly unavailable... hmm

So now and quickly I must decide my vote. Aieee

[Shastanis Althreduin]

I don't think so, Mith. With roles not being revealed immediately after death, and Greenie-Seer having only cleared Nerwen before her death, should Greenie not be our actual Seer, the real Seer has nothing to lose by not challenging Greenie at this point.

My own thought is that, whether or not we decide to use today to lynch a ghost, we need to decide pretty quick. I for one agree with Lommy; yes, we lost one person, which is usual for a Night phase, but we're slightly better off in that Wilwa could have been a mutineer. Rikae has a point as well; if we're ahead now, we'll be ahead later. But I'm of the opinion that the longer we have to pore over solid information, the better off we'll be, so I think that lynching someone who's already died once today has merit. My personal suggestions are Annu and Greenie, as I think Mira's lynch points to playstyle differences as opposed to alignment.

[Thinlómien]

I must say I like that latest post of Mith's a lot, she makes a few good points - especially the one about Greenie and Nerwen. I'm pretty confident of her innocence now. But I'm still a bit hesitant to say Nogrod would kill Greenie on Night2 without a specific reason - I'm sure he would not extend such courtesy on Night3 but it was Night2... maybe if his mates pressured him and he had no better option to offer or he went to sleep early for once and left it up to them... or if they saw some gifted-ish in Greenie. (Or then I'm misjudging Nogrod and all this speculation is in vain. :rolleyes: )


edit: xed with Shasta

[Shastanis Althreduin]

I would call it metagaming, Lommy, and metagaming is bad. :p