The Tolkien Coming of Age Club 2

[Estelyn Telcontar]

Our "old" ;) clubhouse has gotten too full; it's time to move to a new one. Welcome to all "old" members and to those who find their way here for the first time!

The membership requirement is you have been reading LotR and other Tolkien books for at least 18 years For more information, check out the old "old" thread (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?t=4672). (I know, that joke is getting "old"!)

Find yourself a rocking chair and tell us your stories of a life with LotR and Co. I won't be around for a couple of weeks, since I'll be in the States on a visit (North Dakota, Texas, Nebraska, for those who ask). However, I'm sure anyone new will be welcomed by the - nope, I'm not going there... Have a good time!

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Wow, I'm glad this thread has become so active again. I've missed it.

In exactly two months my hobbit self will be of age!!! WOOOHHOOOOO! Wish Mr. Frodo could be here...

Samwise - Congratulations! Perhaps we can put together a party and invite a dozen dozen hobbits from off the Barrow Downs! smilies/biggrin.gif

Ealasaide - Now I think this time you are being too kind! Though the character description of Rauthain is based on one of those sketches. (Suddenly I feel like a cartoon chipmunk.)

[Ealasaide]

Does anybody remember the board game version of Lord of the Rings? I found mine the other day in the back of a closet. I'm missing a few cardboard counters, but the rest of it seems to be intact. My set included three games with maps:

War of the Ring: S.R. 1418 to 1419
Gondor: The Siege of Minas Tirith S.R. 1419
Sauron: The Battle for the Ring S.A. 3434

The only one I ever used to play was War of the Ring, but Sauron & the orcs always won!

Hilde - at first I didn't get the chipmunk reference, but now I do! hahaha! Oh, no, really -- I most protest. You are too kind! smilies/wink.gif

[ September 12, 2003: Message edited by: Ealasaide ]

[The Saucepan Man]

So this is the new place, eh? Seems good to me.

LotR games, eh? Now, where shall I start? Being a bit of a fan of boardgames and the like, I have quite a collection of LotR games.

Do you mean the old SPI wargame, Ealasaide? With the huge map of ME and tiny square cardboard counters for the characters and armies? I have that, and it is intact I believe, although I have not played it for many a year. As I recall, the wargame part of it always ended up in a stand-off and it inevitably came down to whether the Ringbearer was spotted entering Mordor and, if so, which player won the fight between the remaining Fellowship characters and the Nagul. It was all a rather predictable, given that there are only two (or possibly three) routes into Mordor. Still, I always really liked the artwork on the cards - the Hobbits and Gollum in particular.

Well, I could go on for quite a while about LotR boardgames, but its probably best that I simply link to my comments on this rather old thread called LotR Risk (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=2&t=001983).

If anyone else shares my interest in LotR boradgames, I would be delighted to join them for a discussion there. smilies/smile.gif

[Ealasaide]

Yes - the SPI wargame - that's the one!

I've got most of mine still in tact -- at least I still have all the major character pieces and cards. I'm pretty sure a few orcs and Rohirrim spearmen, though, have long gone AWOL. smilies/tongue.gif

Hmm.. I'll have to check out your comments in LotR Risk. I really love board games & the like, but I have fallen seriously out of touch with what is happening in terms of Tolkein-based games. I don't know what's out there anymore.

By the way -- I love your title: corpus cacophonous. That's wonderful!

[ September 12, 2003: Message edited by: Ealasaide ]

[Alphaelin]

since I'll be in the States on a visit (North Dakota, Texas, Nebraska, for those who ask)

Darn! I wish you had mentioned you were going to be coming through before you left! I'm in Nebraska, if you check your mail while you're gone. In any case, have a safe and enjoyable trip, Estelyn.

[Linnamalle]

Glee unbounded! Sharon, I was in Borders today (many, many, many miles from home), and amazingly, there I found the two-CD set, Evening in Rivendell and Night in Rivendell by the TOlkien Ensemble. It was the last one. Thank you sooooo much, Sharon, for suggesting I look in Borders! I am *so* delighted, I was dancing in the aisles. Bless you, bless you...

If that weren't enough, the songbook for The Starlit Jewel also arrived in the mail before I left on travel, so that's in my satchel too... Linnamalle is deliriously happy. and feels that she truly has arrived in Rivendell and that the walk was worthwhile! Ah, the singing, the singing! Gee, I should tell the walkers too...

[Orofaniel]

there I found the two-CD set, Evening in Rivendell and Night in Rivendell by the TOlkien Ensemble.

OOO, lucky you. I can't find those things aroud here. Someone gave me a link to a web site where I could buy The Tolkien Ensemble, but I haven't done it yet. I'm a bit sceptic on buying things over the net. Anyway is it so great that I should take the chance? smilies/smile.gif

Anyway, I've heard about LOTR risk....but never played it. Is it just like normal risk with LOTR figures?

[Orofaniel]

Oh.....Right. I misunderstood. Sorry smilies/frown.gif

[Linnamalle]

Orofaniel,

I do enjoy the TOlkien Ensemble's work and I'd recommend the CDs. On all three CDs, I find some songs are great, some fair, and some awful. Like mark12_30, I find Eomer's song a huge disappointment. Neither do I enjoy the Frodo interpretation. But the elvish songs are good-- very Rivendellish! And Strider might have not had such a sophisticated singing voice-- but then again, he did grow up in Rivendell. Maybe he did.

Anyway, yes, I like them. You won't like all of it, but what CDs are there where you do like every song?

Of course, if it was REALLY from Rivendell, every single cut would be deliriously enchanting. Rivers of gold and whispering waves on western strands, and all that... which seems to be the opinion of that out-of-print Starlit Jewel cd... "Sung by Genuine Elves and Hobbits." LOL!

(edit)

Two other points: One, you are wise to be careful about buying over the Net, always make sure it's a secure server, never send a credit card number through regular email. And two: The little hammer icon at the top of each post is for editing, if you click on that you can edit your post.
smilies/wink.gif

[ September 18, 2003: Message edited by: Linnamalle ]

[Child of the 7th Age]

Linamalle,

Glad you found the set?

What's the name of their very latest CD, and where did you manage to find that one?

Child

[Linnamalle]

Oh, I was counting the set as two CD's: Evning, and Night. The third I was counting, was "At Dawn in Rivendell" with Christopher Lee, which many places have in stock, including Borders (plenty of them) and Amazon.

I admit I'm puzzled why the "Dawn" CD is so readily available if Night and Evening aren't; maybe that's why they included Christopher Lee in "Dawn", for some New-Line-copyright-legal-thingy (similar to what sidelined Starlit Jewel?)? Red tape makes my head spin. And my stomach! Lol!

[Linnamalle]

One just never knows. While browsing in rec.music.filk (I think that was the group) on Google, my sister stumbled on a thread about LOTR music, and called me in to look at it. One of the posters mentioned The Startlit Jewel, and another poster wrote that he had "one or two " available. I emailed him, and he still had one. It arrived yeasterday, pristine, in its lovely plastic wrap... brand new. I almost felt guilty taking the wrapper off. Part of me wishes I hadn't, but how do you get the music out and leave the wrapper intact? Lol!

Anyway, it really is lovely. Marion Zimmer Bradley had a real gift. And the music, rather than having the level of classical polish that the Ensemble sets do, is a much more folksy, round-the-campfire sort of sound.

[Arveleg]

Well I read the books in the seventies, so I guess I qualify.

I also remember the SPI game! I had one, and it may still be up in dads attic where he put everything when I abruptly moved out.

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Welcome to our corner of the Barrow Downs, Arveleg! Sounds like you qualify, and glad to have you join us.

[andreadawn]

Forgive me for posting here-I just started reading Tolkien's works about four years ago.*cowering from the tomatoes being hurled at me* However, what I lack in time I make up in enthusiasm (or is obsession a better word?) Also, being that I'm approaching 41 I felt a little elderly at the other "clubs". Thanks for letting me say Hi

[ October 25, 2003: Message edited by: andreadawn ]

[Estelyn Telcontar]

Welcome, andreadawn - we're not *that* particular about the rules here, so you are most welcome. smilies/smile.gif If you like, share your experiences with LotR in your life with us. Are you collecting anything Tolkien-related or reading the book to others?

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Welcome Andreadawn! The more the merrier, you won't be having any tomatoes from me. How did you find out about Middle Earth? Sounds like it was pre movie discovery. smilies/biggrin.gif

[andreadawn]

Thank you Estelyn and Hilde for your welcome. In reply to your questions; I found out about ME over 20 years ago (a friend of mine read The Hobbit and we were both into Led Zep) but I wasn't a "reader" back then. Fast forward to 2000, I have two young daughters who love Harry Potter, we've finished the books and what do we do now? A friend insisted that if we love HP we would love LOTR even more. needless to say, she was right. My husband and I read The Hobbit and the three books of LOTR out loud to the girls within the space of a year. I've since read The Silmarillion to them and on my own the Unfinished Tales, the Lost
Tales (book one) and Tolkien-Author Of The Century. I'm hooked!

[ October 25, 2003: Message edited by: andreadawn ]

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Ah, see you are ahead of me! I started in on Lost Tales, but have decided to reread The Silmarillion first. It had been quite awhile since I first read it.

[Guinevere]

Hi Andreadawn! Mae govannen! smilies/smile.gif

It's nice to meet at least one other BD member who hasn't read LotR already as a teenager.(I feared I was the only one here...) Myself, I only discovered Tolkien at the age of 50 (!) because of my elder boy reading the Hobbit and LotR.(Before that I had been reading Harry Potter with him, like you! smilies/wink.gif )
It didn't take long and I was much more hooked than my son. I've since read the Silmarillion, UT, "Tree and Leaf" , Tolkien's letters, his biography and Shippey's "Tolkien, author of the century" . All this made me appreciate LotR even more on second and more readings. Plus all the fascinating and insightful threads I've read here in the forum. "Quotable quotes" have also become a favourite hobby. smilies/wink.gif

[Ealasaide]

I found out about ME over 20 years ago (a friend of mine read The Hobbit and we were both into Led Zep)

Sounds familiar! smilies/biggrin.gif I was really into Led Zep in the seventies, too! But, seriously, once you've read the books, Robert Plant's lyrics seem kind of silly:

In the darkest depths of Mordor
I met a girl so fair
But, Gollum, the evil one
Crept up & slipped away with her...

What reasonable girl would run away with Gollum? And what was she doing in Mordor to begin with? smilies/wink.gif

[ October 22, 2003: Message edited by: Ealasaide ]

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Sounds like a reference to an RPG to me, Robert Plant obviously deeply involved in fiction at the time! smilies/wink.gif

[mark12_30]

Robert Plant writing RPGs??? Now THAT sounds like a wraithish nightmare straight out of Mordor! With dreams like that I'd sail too just like Frodo did! Brrr! And to think they were once my favorite band.

Although... (blushes)... I still crank it when Kashmir comes on... smilies/eek.gif smilies/rolleyes.gif smilies/tongue.gif

[Bêthberry]

Hello there Ealasaide,

What reasonable girl would run away with Gollum? And what was she doing in Mordor to begin with? <http://forum.barrowdowns.com/cgi-bin/smilies/wink.gif>


Oh, indeed. smilies/biggrin.gif

Bêthberry

[Ealasaide]

Robert Plant writing RPGs??? Now THAT sounds like a wraithish nightmare straight out of Mordor!

Oh, come on! For all we know, he is a close friend of the Barrow Wight and writing alongside of us everyday under some cryptic nick! smilies/tongue.gif smilies/biggrin.gif

[Child of the 7th Age]

I can assure you that a plot like that would be roundly turned down in the Shire. smilies/wink.gif

sharon

[piosenniel]

Sharon -

We could work with it! We just need to see some good character bios!

The Shire's first musical production . . . I can see it now . . .

[ October 23, 2003: Message edited by: piosenniel ]

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Bêthberry did that mean you fancy Gollum or Mordor or just up for a leading role? smilies/biggrin.gif

Oh, come on! For all we know, he is a close friend of the Barrow Wight and writing alongside of us everyday under some cryptic nick!

Like Robert de Palantir?

[ October 24, 2003: Message edited by: Hilde Bracegirdle ]

[Mithadan]

No, actually Mithadan.

Found a queen without a king,
she plays guitar and cries and sings...la la la..

[Ealasaide]

Oops! Sorry, Mithadan. Zep still rules! smilies/biggrin.gif

But, seriously... where were you going with the Girl/Gollum/Mordor scenario?

~ Ride a white mare in the footsteps of doom
Trying to find a woman who's never ever been born~ smilies/wink.gif

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

But, seriously... where were you going with the Girl/Gollum/Mordor scenario?

Who me? I was try trying to understand Bêthberry, the cryptic aura's, rather cryptic comment! It sounds like she's pining for Gollum, the poor dear! smilies/tongue.gif And now she seems to have gone off and left us to sulk in a dark dank part of the Barrow Downs and left me wondering.

Hey, Mr. Mithadan can I have your autograph? Or how about a signature? smilies/wink.gif

[ October 25, 2003: Message edited by: Hilde Bracegirdle ]

[Ealasaide]

Actually, Hilde, since Mithadan was implying that he was Robert Plant, I was trying to find out what on Middle Earth he was thinking when he wrote the Girl/Gollum/Mordor scenario. smilies/biggrin.gif

[ October 25, 2003: Message edited by: Ealasaide ]

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Hail and Hello Ealasaide!

Yes, yes Mr. Mithadan, We're up for a good tale we are! smilies/biggrin.gif

[Bêthberry]

Who me? I was try trying to understand Bêthberry, the cryptic aura's, rather cryptic comment! It sounds like she's pining for Gollum, the poor dear! <http://forum.barrowdowns.com/cgi-bin/smilies/tongue.gif> And now she seems to have gone off and left us to sulk in a dark dank part of the Barrow Downs and left me wondering.


Always leave them wanting more!

Well, I never did buy that story Persephone told her mum about eating the pomegranate seeds. I figured Persephone wanted to be there in the first place. But was never really allowed to own up to that.

[Ealasaide]

I can assure you that a plot like that would be roundly turned down in the Shire.

No, wait! Now that I've mulled it over a bit.. I think the Ramble On RPG could work! As long as we put together a few good bios, as Pio suggested:

Here's the main cast:
Four Noblemen of Gondor (names would have to be changed, of course!):
Robert - big, blond, heroic type with a strong romantic streak
Jimmy - dark, skinny wizard wannabe with a dark side
John Paul - the quiet one
John - Big, brawny, berserker type...

Girl: We'll call her Persephone (thanks, Bethberry)

Gollum

Here's the plot:
It takes place in the years prior to the War of the Ring when Sauron is gathering strength, his mind reaching out for the Ring. Persephone runs off to Mordor in the hopes of getting to Sauron. She's an ambitious girl. He's a single guy... who says he's not looking for a queen? She gets as far as the black gates when she is overtaken and "rescued" by our four intrepid heroes. Thinking her a damsel in distress, our Robert falls in love. Meanwhile, Persephone bides her time, waiting for a chance to escape.

Her escape comes in the form of Gollum! Having just come out of Mordor, he is sneaking around, trying to get away (prior to being captured by Aragorn). Persephone stumbles across him and, lo! He knows how to get into Mordor! She convinces him to help her. They slipped away. Robert is perplexed and heartbroken...

Okay. How do we end this thing? Anybody want to start a Planning Thread? smilies/evil.gif

I know, I know....I have WAY too much time on my hands...

[Bêthberry]

*coughs* Ealasaide, the point is not that such a game cannot be done, but that it cannot be done in The Shire. smilies/wink.gif

No Dark Side stuff in The Shire. The Rangers won't allow it. Pio wouldn't even allow my "Ride to the Dark Side" game in The Shire. I should know. She told me so. smilies/biggrin.gif

It will have to play in Rohan.

[mark12_30]

That puts Mith the King of Angst as Romantic Lead again. Bravo! Hopefully Mho as Page. Where's the drummer coming from?

Burra would make a great Gollum.

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Ah, thanks for the answer to my question Bêthberry, or rather the acknowledgement of it. Have you ever considered a political career? smilies/wink.gif

May I suggest a cameo role for Shelob? It would be so fitting to have her somehow involved in a Stairway to Heaven number. smilies/eek.gif

[andreadawn]

Methinks I hath created a monster with my mention of Led Zeppelin.

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 1:25 PM January 09, 2004: Message edited by: andreadawn ]

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Not a monster Andreadawn, but rather great fun. Thanks!

[Ealasaide]

Yes, Andreadawn... you've created a great deal of fun! smilies/biggrin.gif Thanks! (I'm the monster smilies/tongue.gif )

May I suggest a cameo role for Shelob? It would be so fitting to have her somehow involved in a Stairway to Heaven number.

Perfect! Gollum can take Persephone to the stair!

This is great! Poor unsuspecting Rohan...
Here's the Ramble On RPG Cast (Much to their surprise & chagrin, I'm sure):
Mith - Robert
Mho - Jimmy
Burra - Gollum
Persephone - Bethberry
Shelob - Hilde Bracegirdle (since it was your idea smilies/wink.gif )
We still need:
John Paul - the quiet one
John - big, burly berserker type

But there's no role for me! smilies/eek.gif Who can I be????

[ October 25, 2003: Message edited by: Ealasaide ]

[mark12_30]

How about Samantha, Persephone's loyal handmaiden who vainly tries to talk some sense into her, and who keeps rescuing her from her own stupidity?

Perhaps as a side-plot, MhoPage can fall for Samantha, wooing her with mournful guitar solos that echo throughout the Ephel Duath.

[ October 25, 2003: Message edited by: mark12_30 ]

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

I second that. If I'm to entertain being Shelob, you simply must have a part to play Ealasaide! Oh what tangled webs we weave....

[ October 26, 2003: Message edited by: Hilde Bracegirdle ]

[Estelyn Telcontar]

Oh my, I guess I won't have to look far for parody talents if we ever need more for a third part of the "Entish Bow"! smilies/biggrin.gif

[Ealasaide]

Oh, marvelous! I'll be Samantha, Persephone's loyal handmaiden. Bring on the long, mournful guitar solos! smilies/biggrin.gif

[mark12_30]

And we'll have to have a scene where the whole band raids an orc-party and steals all of their drums, arranges them in a semi-circle. Then the band cranks it up and summons up a wraith. Or a dead balrog. Or Ancalagon the Black's ghost.

After a truly exceptional solo, Samantha, you can nickname him Mhosie.

In Shelob's webs, will band members meet their drugged demise? Or ignore the warning "drink of no stream that flows from the Imlad Morgul" and find their careless drinking on the deadly side?

Poor heartbroken Samantha! Her wails of despair will rival the guitar solos. Who needs an amp in Mordor with all that natural acoustics?

[Ealasaide]

hmmm.... first things first, Mr. Mark. Who will you be playing in our epic drama?

How about Jones, the quiet one? Still waters run deep. He is the conscience and voice of reason for group of heroes. smilies/cool.gif smilies/wink.gif But who shall be our Bonham-Berserker?

As for how to end this...let's see. I think maybe we should go for the "and then there were none" approach. Each character meets a fate suitable to his or her true nature. For example:

Mith-Plant in a fit of melodramatic anguish tosses himself into the cracks of Mt Doom for the love (and loss) of Persephone.

Persephone eludes Shelob and, with the aid of Gollum, finally reaches the Black Tower where Sauron awaits. She takes one look at him and her mind is destroyed. She spends the rest of her days as a vegetable in Sauron's dungeon.

[ October 26, 2003: Message edited by: Ealasaide ]

[mark12_30]

Eh, not entertaining enough for Sauron... she'd be reduced to gibbering, like Gollum was, but not a vegetable. He'd visit her every now and then, and ask her what music she misses most. Perhaps he'd torture a guitar in front of her, or have an orc sing for her. Or have her stand on the highest parapet and gaze at Mount Doom and say "You could have been his, but now MithRobert can't help you anymore."

I'll just play the lone eagle (giant vulture??) that rescues Samantha in the end. smilies/rolleyes.gif Or maybe I'll come rambling through the game as Straggle-haired Strider in search of Gollum, and y'all can lie to me and send me on my endless way.

[Ealasaide]

Yes, that's a much more fitting way for Persephone to go! Veggy-ism would be much too dull for such an ambitious girl. smilies/evil.gif

Okay! You can be the stray eagle who rescues Samantha from Mordor, which is not where she wanted to be in the first place.

As far as
Straggle-haired Strider goes... so you noticed that, too! I was wondering why the movie had him looking so scruffy all the time. You'd think he'd at least comb his hair in Rivendell, eh?

[ October 26, 2003: Message edited by: Ealasaide ]

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

A futher idea to consider:

Perhaps the four men of Gondor could have purchased, at great price, four prototype elven rings of power that enabled them to create wonderfully memorizing music (but having totally disregarded the disclaimers and precautionary statements).

Persephone could have “borrowed” Mith-Plant’s ring, having heard that Sauron had a great and abiding interest in vintage jewelry and wishing to make a great first impression on the dark lord.

I think somehow the band of four would not meet their end at the hand (or 8 legs) of Shelob. Music sooths the savage beast, so they say. Surely, some song could be found for such a purpose.

As for scuffy Movie Striders…he did comb his hair in Rivendell. Didn’t you notice? smilies/evil.gif

[mark12_30]

Perhaps the four men of Gondor could have purchased, at great price, four prototype elven rings of power

Great idea. There were supposed to be plenty of "Lesser Rings" floating around, after all.

that enabled them to create wonderfully memorizing music

Memorizing music: as in absolutely and permanently unforgettable? (Did you mean Mezmerizing?)

(but having totally disregarded the disclaimers and precautionary statements).

The artistic types usually do...

Persephone could have “borrowed” Mith-Plant’s ring, having heard that Sauron had a great and abiding interest in vintage jewelry and wishing to make a great first impression on the dark lord.


Oooo! And MithPlant follows her tenaciously, seeking his Precious, and falls into the cracks of doom after ... biting it off of her finger? Eeew. Better you than me, Mith. Or maybe he tries to retrieve it, but she puts it on and claims it as her own and shoves the pesky MithPlant into the cracks shouting that she prefers Gollum anyway-- OR -- -- perhaps with Sauron by her side??-- commands him by the power of his Precious Ring of Tunes to leap in, and he sings as he falls. (*sniff* *sob*)

[Ealasaide]

As for scuffy Movie Striders…he did comb his hair in Rivendell. Didn’t you notice?

Okay, then...he could have washed it first! smilies/tongue.gif


MithPlant follows her tenaciously, seeking his Precious, and falls into the cracks of doom after ... biting it off of her finger? Eeew. Better you than me, Mith. Or maybe he tries to retrieve it, but she puts it on and claims it as her own and shoves the pesky MithPlant into the cracks shouting that she prefers Gollum anyway-- OR -- -- perhaps with Sauron by her side??-- commands him by the power of his Precious Ring of Tunes to leap in, and he sings as he falls.

OOOOO! That's great, particularly the last bit! smilies/evil.gif But what about the other three?

What ignominious end lies in store for them? Hilde's right... Shelob would be too easy.

[ October 27, 2003: Message edited by: Ealasaide ]

[Estelyn Telcontar]

Sorry, folks, but I'm going to have to step on the brake here. As amusing as this exchange of ideas is, it has taken on proportions that make it off-topic for this thread. If you'd like to keep this discussion going, perhaps one of you has a suggestion for a new location, a personal site or something similar where it can continue. Thanks!

*Estelyn returns to her rocking chair, picking up her trusty old Ballantine's FotR to research for a post...

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Perhaps this rambling does belong in the mirth section!

that enabled them to create wonderfully memorizing music

Ah, Helen you caught me! I did mean mezmerizing. Seems Estelyn has a thread out there for that one too!

So sorry to have strayed Miss Telcontar! smilies/tongue.gif

[mark12_30]

Ealasaide, do you want to move it to Rohan or The Shire, at the respective Inn? This was your idea. I think you ought to run with it and have fun. Who says satire is only allowed in Gondor?

(EDIT) On the other hand, MithPlant could run it in Gondor if he comes on board. Or I could, even though I've got a very minor part. But it sounds like it could be done easily within the Shire guidelines, quick finish-time etc; and if Child and Pio don't like it, you've already got an invitation from Bethberry.

Last I knew, since I can start games in Gondor, I think that means I can start them in Rohan too, if you need somebody? The rules keep changing, I'm not sure. smilies/frown.gif If you decide to run with it and need help, I'll give it my best shot.

[ October 27, 2003: Message edited by: mark12_30 ]

[Ealasaide]

Oops! Sorry, Miss Telcontar! *blushing a deep crimson* I will try to behave in the future!

(Also, sorry Helen for calling you "Mr." Mark. I see now it should have been "Ms." Mark... but Mark seemed like such a masculine name! smilies/wink.gif )

Okay, gang... how do we move this nonsense to Middle Earth Mirth? I think that would be the best place for it until we can decide whether we want to (or will be allowed to) turn this into a real satirical RPG. Seriously... that could be a tremendous hoot!

[Ealasaide]

Getting things back on topic, I hope...
When I was looking through my old LPs in search of Led Zep stuff, I came across a record I had forgotten all about: "Poems and Songs of Middle Earth". The copyright date on it is 1967 and it features Prof. Tolkein reading five stories from the Adventures of Tom Bombadill, as well as "A Elbereth Gilthoniel" in Elvish. It also has five songs from LotR performed by William Elvin and Donald Swann.

I've had it since sometime in the mid-seventies. I was wondering if anyone else has run across it or if it was still in print.

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

That sounds incredibly familar, and I think I may have had a copy, though I do not recall listening to it much. I wish I still had it now, along with a couple of of other Tolkien related items from my younger years, namely some of my books. smilies/wink.gif

[mark12_30]

Actually, the whole thing is widely available online. I enjoy several of the songs, but especially "In the Willow Meads of Tasarinen". So very Entish!

Mmmm, try here. (http://www.geocities.com/filmtolkien/music.htm)

[Ealasaide]

I had a feeling that it might be! I just hadn't gotten around to looking. I'm glad to know that it is still in circulation.

[Theron Bugtussle]

I saw the discussion about Zeppelin screwing up LOTR, how about Styx from Pieces of Eight, and the song Lords Of The Ring:
All hail to the Lords of the Ring
To the magic and mystery it brings
May we someday wear its glory

And now the message is clear
As I became a Lord this year Did these guys actually read the book? I didn't think so.... smilies/rolleyes.gif

[Ealasaide]

Oooh...yikes! I had forgotten about that one. Maybe they read the book. They just didn't understand it! smilies/wink.gif

[ November 25, 2003: Message edited by: Ealasaide ]

[Estelyn Telcontar]

Welcome, Theron! Your signature quote is wonderful for this club!! smilies/biggrin.gif Yes, it sounds like there were people back then with as little understanding of the books as some Leggyboppers today, doesn't it?! It's always amazed me that the ring should seem glamorous to those who've read the story - I would stay as far away even from a replica as possible! smilies/eek.gif (OK, I confess - I did buy a One Ring bookmark, just because it looks so cool to have it dangling from the pages of a book - but I'm not about to wear it as jewelry!)

[ November 25, 2003: Message edited by: Estelyn Telcontar ]

[mark12_30]

I sometimes wear a plain (silver) band on a chain around my neck when there's some bad habit or attitude in my life that I know I have to get rid of. But for me, it's kind of a Lenten thing, and the idea is to get RID of it; March 25 is the goal.

The last time I did that, I really wanted to find someplace to toss it into and melt it down. I never did though. I daydreamed about Mount St Helen's but they don't let you get close enough.

Besides, if I should prove unable to toss the thing, I'd hate to have my finger bitten off. The analogy does break down a little too easily.

[Theron Bugtussle]

Ha, mark12_30, good analogy!

Thanks for the welcome Estelyn, and the invitation. The Lady Telcontar sought me out from among the threads of the Barrow-Downs learned, where I was, shall I say, lost as a halfling in the tall grasses of the Westfold. She bid me come hither to the Coming of Age thread, seeing that my "lack of stature" did not correspond to a lack of memories of the days of youth and first discovery of the Grand Saga.
- - - - -
As to Styx and their understanding of LotR.... That particular tune was sung by James Young, and he usually was the lead singer on songs that he wrote. I suspect that he, and likely they, did not read the book at all.

Probable scenario, according to Theron Bugtussle: The LotR book was popular with some people in their circles, they heard some discussion about it while they were "socializing," and this LAME SONG was the result. Styx was verging into the "theatrical" rock mode by this time, maybe they could even sell a few more albums among the teen-pop-semi-literati by associating themselves with this popular book.

Personal Info Aside: I read LotR originally well before the Pieces of Eight album came out, possibly before I had heard of Styx at all. Well, it may have been around the time that their tune 'Lady' was a big hit, actually. That should date my Jr High years. smilies/biggrin.gif

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Greetings Master Bugtussle!

This morning I was thinking about your mention of Styx and thought perhaps they had asked some more knowledgable soul about the history of the Ring, but didn't quite listen closely enough to the answer. I wonder if they received any letters about it? smilies/biggrin.gif
---------------------------------------
What a wonderful idea Helen! I think that I should try that, but I fear that I would always be found wearing my chain (or fingerless smilies/wink.gif!)

[Ealasaide]

Welcome, Mr. Bugtussle! Pardon my manners for not welcoming you earlier.

As for replicas of The Ring, I agree, I would not have one myself. Although LotR is just fiction (shocked silence, I know!), I still would feel that I was looking for trouble by parading around with one.

Mark 12_30 -- what a great idea about the silver ring! It's a lot less painful than my way of ridding myself of negative habits or thought patterns. I have always put a rubber band on my wrist and popped myself everytime I caught myself indulging in whatever behavior I was trying to eliminate, in order to remind myself of what I was about. At first, it's okay, but after awhile it gets really painful, but, boy, it makes you pay attention. Eventually, I throw away the rubber band...

[ November 25, 2003: Message edited by: Ealasaide ]

[Mithadan]

Another Styx song which always reminded me of LoTR was the melodic intro to Sailing Away. I even recall buying the single, on a funny piece of plastic called a 45.

Welcome Theron!

[mark12_30]

Ealasaide-- whoa. You're drastic! I'll have to remember that next time I'm in a "grim story contest".

I think for many LOTR fans, having a ring on a chain around their neck symbolizes being on a mission or on a journey. It's the folks that put the thing on their finger that I wonder about...

A highly recommended this song: "Fellowship Going South" by Leslie Fish. She is a Filk-singer, (that's not folk misspelled, not quite) very well-known in Filk-circles, but this is a serious ballad, her own composition and tune both. Very good song. It's on the net in mp3 format. A google-search should find it. I found it a while back and only listened to it today for the first time. (Ninnyhammer!)

[ 10:20 AM November 26, 2003: Message edited by: mark12_30 ]

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Hmm...here I was thinking that I would only be wearing a chain, not a ring on it. Good heavens! The only ring of power I wear is a wedding band. That has proved adventurous enough for this hobbit! smilies/wink.gif

I will have to look into Filk, I have never heard of it before, or Leslie Fish.

[Ealasaide]

Yes, I'll have to look into Leslie Fish and Filk, as well. What exactly is Filk?

Getting back to 70's music that makes you think of LotR... Whenever I hear Yes's album Fragile, especially the song "South Side of the Sky", I think of the Fellowship. I think I played the grooves off Fragile when I was reading LotR for the first time.

[mark12_30]

Filk. Eh, I'll try and define it, because there is a lot of Tolkien filk out there. Most of it is humorous/ satire, which isn't quite my cup of tea. But there are a few...

Filk is sometimes described as a cross between "folk" and "Filch" (as in, I filched someone else's tune and wrote my own lyrics to it.) in that sense, one can easily see it's a time-honored tradition. But it has become a subculture. There are conventions, etc.

I'm not sure why Leslie Fish falls into the Filk category; from what I've seen, her tunes are original, her lyrics profound.

You can find an mp3 of Julie Ecklar performing Leslie's "Fellowship Going South" here (http://www.prometheus-music.com/eli/virtual.html). Have a hankie nearby.

Off Topic Edit: and if you are a fan of space shuttles and space travel, don't miss Witnesses' Waltz, listed below, also by Leslie.

[ 10:36 AM November 26, 2003: Message edited by: mark12_30 ]

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Thanks for the link Helen I will have to explore it over the holidays!

And Ealasaide don’t get me started on YES! Jon Anderson’s (older) lyrics aren’t his only works reminiscent of ME, his paintings also have that quality. (But then again I harbor a rather deep suspicion that he is actually a hobbit, raised by elves! smilies/wink.gif Maybe Stoorish... smilies/biggrin.gif )

[Theron Bugtussle]

Thanks to all for the warm welcome!

Mithadan, A coincidence? I listened to Come Sail Away on the way in to work today. It is rather dreamy, and starts off like it could well be a road-trip song, or a seafaring song. Maybe Legolas when he heard the seagulls for the first time, after being warned by Galadriel that he would be done for.

Lemme see if I can remember the first lines... I'm sailing away
Set an open course for the virgin sea
'Cause I've got to be free
Free to face the life that's ahead of me

On board I'm the Captain
So climb aboard
We'll search for tomorrow
On every shore

And I'll try,
Oh, Lord, I'll try
to carry on...

P.S. Woohoo! I have an avatar now! Thanks to one of our illustrious B-D members. smilies/biggrin.gif

Oh, and Estelyn, I just happened on that Gandalf quote in my sig the other day. I think I am reading LotR for the first time in...well, do you know what "a coon's age" is? It's been about that long. smilies/smile.gif

[ 2:17 PM November 26, 2003: Message edited by: Theron Bugtussle ]

[Lyta_Underhill]

I know I'm not quite "of age" but I couldn't help responding to this! (Forgive me! I'm only a few years short! smilies/wink.gif ) I sometimes wear a plain (silver) band on a chain around my neck when there's some bad habit or attitude in my life that I know I have to get rid of. But for me, it's kind of a Lenten thing, and the idea is to get RID of it; March 25 is the goal.
Wow, Helen! That's an interesting idea, and probably a better concept than the way I've been wearing my ring!

Strangely enough, and this may not be the best thing to admit, I have worn my wedding ring on a chain around my neck since Halloween, when I dressed as Frodo for a costume contest. I called it MY One Ring, and I really will defend it from whoever tries to take it from me! I don't really want to wear the replica One Ring, but this Ring is something I'll never throw in a chasm or get rid of, although its meaning is altogether different. It has the effect of making me touch it constantly to make sure it is still there (because it is odd to wear my wedding ring that way and I'm afraid to lose it!). I find myself playing with it when I awaken in the middle of the night, and it makes me wonder if Frodo had trouble sleeping partly because he thought he might accidentally don the Ring in his sleep! I can relate to that fear now! I'm not sure when I'll put it back on my finger, but probably when I reach Rivendell, at least that is what I'm telling myself.

And I must say, Theron Bugtussle, you've really settled in nicely, and I've enjoyed reading your posts on several threads lately! I had not thought of that Styx song in years, since I had not read LOTR at the time I listened to it long ago; the whole allusion was lost on me! But I can see your point about "Come Sail Away" and the sea-longing of Legolas! I can even hear him singing it to Gimli smilies/wink.gif, although I don't think he'd sound much like James Young or Dennis deYoung or any of them, really! (that's probably a good thing!) Oh, and that's a lovely avatar! smilies/biggrin.gif

Cheers,
Lyta

[mark12_30]

New Hobbit Music: Attn music hounds. I had never heard of (argentinian) Andi Grimsditch before, and took a risk on his "Tolkien Song Cycle" on ebay. Am I ever glad and delighted that I did. For starters, a couple of these songs are *SINGABLE* (not all of 'em.) And for another, this guy is a believable Hobbit-voice. It says he's from Argentina but his Scottish accent is delightful, and he has a soft, gentle tenor voice; sounds like the Hobbit Next Door to me.

If the idea of middle-earth music with bass and drums bothers you, well, I was skeptical, but the bass and drums stay in the background. The emphasis is on guitar and strings. They do some non-celtic things with chord changes and odd chords in general, but it doesn't set my teeth on edge (the way it has with some other bands.)

This is Volume 1. I'll be waiting with baited breath for Volume 2. I almost hesitated to post on this-- 'cause I want that first copy when it comes out. But if you want hobbit-music, buy this album. (Or even: buy Vol1 so he puts out Vol2!)

[Child of the 7th Age]

Helen,

I saw this on e-bay and wondered about it. Thanks for the tip. Maybe I'll give it a try.

sharon

[alquadae]

Mae Govannen!
A quiet evening "catching up" on some past threads. If I may be so bold,I would like to share an interpretation.I am refering to 22 Oct,Ealasaide,[Hello]. "Was in the darkest depths of Morder"....... Could this be from Frodo's view,when he claimed the ring ,he had dominion over Galadriel,in that instant he "met a girl so fair" ? The ensuing scuffel may be seen as Gollum and the evil one slipping away with her.
This is the second time I have seen this question on the BD. Any thoughts???

[Ealasaide]

Greetings, Alquadae!
What an interesting interpretation! But taking into account Robert Plant's overall body of work, I would have to say it seems a bit of a stretch. Mr. Plant's lyrics are not generally renowned for their subtlety or depth. Just my opinion, though. smilies/smile.gif

I do like the line of thought, though. I just think you are giving Robert Plant WAY too much credit. smilies/wink.gif

[ 1:05 PM December 01, 2003: Message edited by: Ealasaide ]

[mark12_30]

Music Review. More on the Andi Grimsditch theme: Third listening.

"Earendil was a Mariner" (Bilbo's Hall of Fire song.) Hobbit Andi Grimsditch is the first musician that I know of to attempt it (it's ten minutes long!) and he does it very well. I find "Earendil" more than pleasant, I find it enchanting. Perhaps it's more orchestrated than one would imagine, but I think Bilbo would like it.

Minor complaints: Of the nine songs on this album I enjoy "Frodo at the Pracing Pony" the least; half the song is spoken and half sung, and that always annoys me somewhat. Another thing that annoys me is that one or two of the songs have complicated chord changes and accidentals-- which always strikes me as un-hobbitlike.

Those seem to me to be very minor complaints. I like this fellow's work. He strikes me as "the hobbit next door", unpretentious, merry and easygoing without being sappy.

So: at least Four **** out of five. Maybe four and a half.

Has anybody out there purchased the "Hobbitons" album, and what did you think of it?

[ 9:30 AM December 03, 2003: Message edited by: mark12_30 ]

[mark12_30]

Quickie music review, Giuseppe Festa. (aka Lingalad-- hey, I know him; www.lingalad.com (http://www.lingalad.com) )

The music of Giuseppe Festa is magnificent. There's a twenty-minute instrumental at the end of the album that stops me in my tracks repeatedly. His Tolkien tunes are by and large singable. And he has a very elvish restlessness and longing in his work.

***** out of five.

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 9:40 PM January 05, 2004: Message edited by: mark12_30 ]

[Mithadan]

Has anybody out there purchased the "Hobbitons" album, and what did you think of it?

What is an "album"? smilies/tongue.gif

[mark12_30]

Mithadan, O most respected and eloquent of Mods, surely you need but the most delicate of reminders that "album" means "collection" and thus can apply to any collection of items, such as stamps, or photographs, or a group of songs: *even* if they are (or were) distributed on such an archaic medium as, for instance, vinyl.

But only *really* old people remember vinyl records.

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 11:49 AM January 09, 2004: Message edited by: mark12_30 ]

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

And a few remember glass! smilies/eek.gif

[andreadawn]

Hilde, when you say "glass" are you referring to the old 78rpm records? Now that's going WAY back! btw-Happy New Year All

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

I suppose they probably were 78s. I remember my parents having a couple of them around the house that we would play for kicks. The music was good but the medium was pretty horrendous, not that my vinyl "potato chips" held up any better! smilies/tongue.gif

EDIT: Actually maybe they were shellac?!

[mark12_30]

Hilde, I stand amazed.

...did you see Feanor making the palantirs too?

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

I'm afraid I'm not that old. smilies/biggrin.gif But perhaps from a from a little known family of half hobbit/half elves, (or is it 7/8 hobbit?), who chose the bliss of the Shire to the Undying Lands?! No relation to dear Pio though, that I've heard tell of anyway. smilies/wink.gif

I wonder if old Mr. Baggins had a phonograph tucked away in that hobbit hole of his! Perhaps music was the real treasure squirreled away there, (a gift from a certain member of the Istari perhaps, who no doubt knew had excellent advice on which themes were good and which were bad). And Mr. Bilbo actually went to Rivendell to record the songs of elves for Elrond's vast library before the songs were lost to Middle Earth.... Hmm...I wonder if they are still out there somewhere?

Whew, I had better stop before this tangent gets any worse! smilies/eek.gif

[The Saucepan Man]

The wealth of Moria was not in CD-ROMs and DVDs, the toys of the Dwarves; nor in CDs, their servants. Such things they found here, it is true, especially CDs; but they did not need to delve for them: all things that they desired they could obtain in HMV. For here alone in the world were found Moria-albums, or true albums as some have called them: vinyl is the Elvish name. The Dwarves have a name which they do not tell. Rare labels were worth ten times that of CDs, and now they are beyond price; for little is left in record collections, and even the Orcs dare not shop for them here.

Gandalf to the Fellowship outside the Moria Discount Records Store

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 8:18 PM January 09, 2004: Message edited by: The Saucepan Man ]

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Ah ha! So the theory could be true! smilies/wink.gif That was wonderful by the way Saucepan Man, where ever did you find it? And where is the Moria Discount Records Store? Do I simply turn right when I reach the Misty Mountains? Can't miss it sort of a place with big fancy doors by moonlight...holly trees.... smilies/biggrin.gif

Helen I finally got a chance to listen to Giuseppe Festa. You are right. It is fantastic stuff!

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 9:11 AM January 10, 2004: Message edited by: Hilde Bracegirdle ]

[Roxbury]

Well hello all, do you have room for another old timer? smilies/smile.gif The first time I read Tolkien was about twenty years ago- I can't remember much about that time except I was captivated by the Hobbit and started LotR and never quite finished it. I remember my boyfriend at the time (now my spouse) bought me the leather bound green Hobbit book and the red leather LotR as well as The Tolkien Companion by JEA Tyler. I am back in Middle Earth now thanks to the movies and these discussion forums. These books were meant to be discussed!! My poor spouse is feeling a bit neglected because my elementary school aged boy and I talk endlessly about the story and characters. Reading Tolkien gives me the opportunity to think about matters such as--evil vs. good, immortality/death, courage, etc.... Yeah, I loved philosophy in college smilies/smile.gif Having finished the LotR, I am now working my way through The Sil--I'm taking notes--man that book is packed with information. Looking forward to posting with you all. Oh, BTW I found the BBC recording of The Hobbit at half price books the other day- can't wait to listen to it!! Roxbury

[mark12_30]

Hello and welcome, Roxbury! Glad you found the Clubhouse. Did someone refer you or did you stumble into it? Welcome either way!

Your boyfriend bought you the leather editions of BOTH the Hobbit and LotR? Wow! That's devotion!

I'll be passing thru Seattle in several weeks. It's become a favorite haunt of mine!

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 7:55 PM January 28, 2004: Message edited by: mark12_30 ]

[Alphaelin]

<crawling out of the Great Sea to the long-missed shores of the Barrow Downs> Hello! I don't know if anyone here remembers me; I haven't been to the Downs since last fall. However, I'm very glad to see that the Coming of Age Club is still going strong. Hopefully Real Life has calmed down enough that I can visit regularly again. <sits down to wring sea-water out of clothes>

[Dininziliel]

Oh! Oh! Oh! I do so adore being dead. The company is simply unsurpassable!

I have been exploring other chambers of the Downs lately and for some reason this one only now caught my eye. I've scanned a couple of pages in the old & new threads, and eagerly look forward to a few hours of wonderful reflection in the near future. For now, I want to add my bit as the time is fleeting and my shroud is looking most comfortable.

This very subject has been much on my mind of late. LotR (book and movies) and The Silmarillion have been a refuge and source of renewal for me. Life has recently given me cause to time travel . . .

LIke the previous posting person, I first was made aware of Tolkien by my first real boyfriend when I was 14. He was, an older "man" of 19 and I felt truly enthralled by everything he said and did. smilies/cool.gif Actually, he did bequeath me a great deal of cultural interests that have stood the test of time--Frank Zappa for one. Anyway, he loaned me The Hobbit. I fell in love with the whole thing, and became especially fond of the dwarves. I bought a terrific (I thought) dwarf statuette, named it Balin, and made it my personal icon/totem. After I finished The Hobbit he gave me FotR. (These are all the 1st edition of the Ballentine paperbacks w/Tolkien's endorsement of them on the back cover--ah, the romance of authenticity!). I devoured it and the subsequent books as well. I also spent hours looking for cloth material that matched the Elven cloaks given by Galadriel's folk to the Fellowship and made a swimsuit "cloak." smilies/rolleyes.gif Alas, I had to return the Ballentines. We continued off and on into my freshman year in college. As I write, I am wearing the silver ring engraved with Cirth script he made and gave to me. The only word I can make out is "love." The others are a mystery.

Needless to say, the relationship traveled south to Harad (we stayed fond friends until I lost track of him about eight years ago), but the stories stayed with me.

Around 1969, I bought a poster with a map illustrated by Tolkien and put it up on my wall. A couple of years later it was time to go to college. While I was away, my mother rather ruined the poster by pasting a blue velveteen ribbon around the borders, although she meant well. During one summer while home from university, my parents decided to repaint my room. With great care and regret, I took down the poster, ripping it slightly. Thinking, "Oh, this old thing--it's already half ruined," I tossed it out. I am repenting at leisure.

Between high school and through college, I'd re-read The Hobbit and LotR a couple of times. They began to fade from mind, but one day, I happened to see the very first edition of The Silmarillion in the university bookstore. I felt deeply drawn to ME again and bought it on sight. Ever since I read the account of the creation of the world, I have envisioned its source as the notes sung by the Ainur and orchestrated by Eru. After "Ainulindale," it took me the usual 2-3 attempts to get past the next 60 pages. I now love all of it.

Fast forward a few years and re-readings. I am legally attached to a man who, despite giving me indisputable reason to legally unattach, was a superb gift giver. This was when the leatherette volumes of The Hobbit and LotR appeared--green and red respectively, and tantalizingly embossed with words in runes & of Elvish in shiny gold, red, and green. It is the most treasured among my 4 editions of LotR.

Last year I bought a set of the old Ballentine editions. I just wanted to have them in my hands again. (You can go back again.)

So, from the undertow of adolescence continuing into the crest of expected and unexpected middle age changes, the stories have been with me. They have been a guide through what could have become my own Paths of the Dead. I seem to have gravitated to them during times of darkness and fear, or simply those dread and dangerous doldrums of "dark nights of the soul." They have rewarded me with light and hope and an ever-expanding awareness of the life of the spirit in a world of the all too-fleeting flesh.

Good night, all you wonderful people out there . . . in the dark!

[Estelyn Telcontar]

Welcome, Roxbury and diniziliel, and welcome back Alphaelin! It's always nice to have more of us sharing experiences and getting to know each other! Isn't it interesting to compare who introduced you to Tolkien? In my case, it was a boyfriend too - long gone now, or rather I'm the one who is far away, but the Ballantine's paperbacks he gave me are still going strong, sitting right here next to my computer and full of markings. I wonder how those past boyfriends would react if they knew they still had an impact on our lives?! Well, it's Tolkien's impact, but you never forget the first time, do you?! smilies/wink.gif

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

A hardy hello Roxbury, Dininziliel and Alphaelin!

Alphaelin , how could we forget the finder Clive’s secret diary! You had me on the edge of my seat (pardon the pun) waiting for the next installment! smilies/biggrin.gif

[Alphaelin]

Thank you Estelyn and Hilde for the welcome(s) back! Welcome, Roxbury and Diniziliel.

Regarding Clive, EToF, I am *trying* to get a Live Journal account up and then figure out how to post so I can put the poor twit to rest smilies/biggrin.gif. So far, LJ is not being my friend - or I am really as computer-impaired as my resident Leggy-bopper tells me I am! However, I shall keep trying.

[Alphaelin]

Ah ha! So the theory could be true! That was wonderful by the way Saucepan Man, where ever did you find it? And where is the Moria Discount Records Store? Do I simply turn right when I reach the Misty Mountains? Can't miss it sort of a place with big fancy doors by moonlight...holly trees....

Ah, but remember Hilde, "There are older and fouler things than Orcs in the deep places of the earth." To make your way to the Moria Discount Record Store, you must first pass through the hidden door with reflects only strobe lights and disco balls. Even if you find your way into the deserted Mall of Khazad-Dum, you must pass through the dreaded Mimes of Moria for four days before you come to the East-gate where the ancient record store of Durin is located.

[Dininziliel]

Estelyn Telcontar wrote: I wonder how those past boyfriends would react if they knew they still had an impact on our lives?! Well, it's Tolkien's impact, but you never forget the first time, do you?!

I'll bet they told that to all the girls! They probably had several sets of the books with which they lured us unsuspecting and innocent little bees to our doom! smilies/eek.gif But you know, that's the kinda guy I like--one who's smart enough to let Tolkien do that voodoo that he do so well! smilies/wink.gif

Saucepan Man--I genuinely enjoyed the music store post. Thank you for the LOL.

And, thank you ladies--Estelyn, Hilde, and Alphaelin (sp?) for the welcome. I, too, want to know about Clive. A "Howdy-do?" to Roxbury, too!

It's so sublime to rhyme.
Okay, I'll go away.

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 2:17 AM January 30, 2004: Message edited by: dininziliel ]

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

You are very welcome dininziliel & Alphaelin

"There are older and fouler things than Orcs in the deep places of the earth." To make your way to the Moria Discount Record Store, you must first pass through the hidden door with reflects only strobe lights and disco balls.

E-gads, suddenly I’m seeing the ghastly vision of a Balrog in a white polyester suit, -melted of course- dancing amidst the flames! But one has to brave these dangers if one seeks mithril in Middle Earth. Such decisions!

[Raefindel]

Welcome Back Alphaelin and welcome dininziliel and Roxbury. Check out our pictures Here (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=14&t=001068) thanks to Alkanoonion.

Roxbury, we are neighbors. I live in Port Orchard.

Saucepan Man, Alphaelin, I enjoyed your music store stories. Parodies are one of my favorite forms of humor.

[Sleeping Beauty]

Forgive a young upstart for intruding in the land of the geezers, but it's so much fun to read. :D

The wealth of Moria was not in CD-ROMs and DVDs, the toys of the Dwarves; nor in CDs,
their servants. Such things they found here, it is true, especially CDs; but they did
not need to delve for them: all things that they desired they could obtain in HMV.
For here alone in the world were found Moria-albums, or true albums as some have
called them: vinyl is the Elvish name. The Dwarves have a name which they do not tell.
Rare labels were worth ten times that of CDs, and now they are beyond price; for little
is left in record collections, and even the Orcs dare not shop for them here.

- Saucepan Man

Ah, but remember Hilde, "There are older and fouler things than Orcs in the deep places of the earth." To make your way to the Moria Discount Record Store, you must first pass through the hidden door with reflects only strobe lights and disco balls. Even if you find your way into the deserted Mall of Khazad-Dum, you must pass through the dreaded Mimes of Moria for four days before you come to the East-gate where the ancient record store of Durin is located.

- Alphaelin


E-gads, suddenly I’m seeing the ghastly vision of a Balrog in a white polyester suit, -melted of course- dancing amidst the flames! But one has to brave these dangers if one seeks mithril in Middle Earth. Such decisions!

- Hilde Bracegirdle


Thanks for much for that. That was the best laugh I have had in a while. I never knew the oldies were so creative. I am in awe.
Btw, Alphaelin Mimes of Moria? That's a disconcerting thought. Undead Dwarves walking around in black and white striped shirts and black pants pulling on invisible ropes. Scary. :o

*bows out gracefully before any walking sticks are thrown her way*

[Raefindel]

I've been called a "geezer" !

Take that you young whipper snapper! Let me hit you with my cane... Umm ... that is ... my walking stick!

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

You know what they say, the sense of humor is the last to go!

And Raefindel, better a geezer than a curmudgeon, eh what?

-Hilde (resident old codger :p)

[Ealasaide]

Geezers? Oldies? Codgers? Curmudgeons?

Good heavens, I've been away too long. Let's have a little self-respect around here! Old age and wile will always win out over youth and enthusiasm! :p :D

[piosenniel]

Pio leans on her four-wheeled walker and claps heartily at Ealasaide's words . . . the effort nearly winds her & she seeks the comforts of the old rocker in her room.

shuffle . . .shuffle . . .

Down the sickly green hall of the Barrow-Downs Home for Geezers, Curmudgeons, and old Reprobates she goes, her lovebeads clacking on her chest as she waves to Hilde and Rae . . .

;)

[Mithadan]

Reprobates? I guess that'd be me. Welcome to all you newcomers (and those who have returned for another visit).

[The Saucepan Man]

A wizened old man, covered from head to foot in pots and pans, snoozes happily in a large leather-bound armchair in the corner. However, the strident words of the young interloper, awake him from his slumber and, with a metallic clatter, he sits up suddenly and holds a trumpet to his ear (or, rather, to the side of the saucepan covering his ear).

"Eh? Wha-!" he mutters through well-worn dentures.

But, seeing the enthusastic youngster, he smiles benevolently, recalling the exuberance of his own youth.

"Welcome to the Undying Lands Retirement Home for the morbidly-Tolkien obsessed," he chuckles.

[Child of the 7th Age]

If you folk are in the Valinor rest home, that makes me about ready to keel over in my grave. :(

You've really done it this time. There is a topic I have been thinking about for a while on which I now feel compelled to start a thread. It's time someone stood up and gave a big huzzah for those of us who've reached the grand age of fifty. Tolkien certainly thought it was special!

Please take a look here:

What's so special about '50'? (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10294)

So if you can tear yourself away from cleaning your dentures and tending to your rocker, please give me the benefit of your 'mature' minds in Books!

[Ealasaide]

Good point, Child. :)

I visited your thread and found it very thought provoking, but I did want to say one thing here. I think the reason most of Tolkein's central characters are fifty or above in LotR is that one of his central themes is that of change, the old ways disappearing into the folds of time. Youth is generally not concerned with that sort of thing as a rule. You need older characters with some life experience to draw on in order to carry that theme off successfully and with the right degree of melancholia.

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Welcome to the Undying Lands Retirement Home for the morbidly-Tolkien obsessed

Oh ho! How did I miss that one! Here I was thinking along the lines of the Barrow-Wight's Home for Terminally Dead. But your's is a much more pleasant name!

[Ealasaide]

Hi, gang!
I just wanted to apologize for my earlier post - now deleted. (If you missed it, don't ask!:rolleyes: ) It was really kind of cheesy and inappropriate for this forum. I was just in a rare frame of mind and got a little carried away. As I have said before...
henceforth, I will do my best to behave! :)

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

MUSIC REVIEW: Music Inspired by Middle Earth -featuring David Arkenstone

Well I finally broke down and bought a copy of this instrumental CD, and while it wasn’t what I expected, it has been growing on me considerably. On the first listen it seemed very much like a movie score with a few jarring cliques, some very New Age and Elizabethan sounding stuff and very pretentious…but….

As I said it is growing on me. I have to say that The Riders of Rohan is absolutely wonderful, capturing the mood and spirit of the Rohirm at the end of the Third Age, a lot of layers to it as well. And The Palantir track is downright chilling. The only track I find myself having trouble with is The Field of Cormallen and sometimes Galadriel’s Mirror, which is were I keep hearing things reminiscent of The Exorcist and The Titanic. (Witness is also in there on another track.)

Has anyone else heard this CD?

[The Saucepan Man]

Perhaps he could diversify into Country Music and become the Arkenstone Cowboy. :D

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Ouch! Groan is right! :D

[Bêthberry]

I don't know, Sauce. When I look at your sig, I'm tempted to wonder how anyone who could quote The Darkness would really qualify for the "the Undying Lands Retirement Home for the morbidly-Tolkien obsessed. " ;)

About LOTR music: In an article which I quoted in Movies (what? flog my own thread? moi?) Howard Shore is quoted about what he and PJ were looking for in a score. Both wanted something reminiscent of Wagner and of those epic movie scores of the 40s.

Given that so many fans enjoy more hobbitish music--celtic?--I found this interesting.

Maybe few of us go far enough back to remember any of those 40s movie scores?

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Given that so many fans enjoy more hobbitish music--celtic?--I found this interesting.

"Hobbit music is Celtic?" Hilde questions taking her earphones out of her ears, intreupting her morning long Silly Wizard marathon. "I wonder how we got pegged with Celtic taste and not say music from the Andes?" :D

[Theron Bugtussle]

Hi, Bêthberry, Howard Shore is quoted about what he and PJ were looking for in a score. Both wanted something reminiscent of Wagner and of those epic movie scores of the 40s.

Maybe few of us go far enough back to remember any of those 40s movie scores? These movies used to play on the TV in the early afternoon old movie slots when I came home from school...heh, heh! :D

P.S. We really do need something every now and again to revive this thread with a little interest. Maybe all it takes is a whipper-snapper intrusion!

[Ealasaide]

P.S. We really do need something every now and again to revive this thread with a little interest. Maybe all it takes is a whipper-snapper intrusion!

Hear, hear, Mr. Bugtussle!

As much as I love music, I have to admit all this arcane discussion of music I've never heard sends me straight off into slumberland. I wake up three hours later with the computer screen black and my face in a puddle of drool. (Sorry, Hilde et al!) I suppose I could try to track some of the music down and give it a listen... I might actually like it. Ya think there's any Tolkein-based grunge out there? ;)

[piosenniel]

Grunge, I'm not sure - but here's some power metal from Germany:

Nightfall in Middle-earth from Blind Guardian (http://www.buymetal.net/metal-item_id-B00000HYXB-search_type-AsinSearch-locale-us.html)

Silmarillion based

Tracks:

War of Wrath
Into the Storm
Lammoth
Nightfall
Minstrel
Curse of Feanor
Captured
Blood Tears
Mirror Mirror
Face the Truth
Noldor (Dead Winter Reigns)
Battle of Sudden Flame
Time Stands Still (At the Iron Hill)
Dark Elf
Thorn
Eldar
Nom the Wise
When Sorrow Sang
Out on the Water
Steadfast
Dark Passage
Final Chapter (Thus Ends...)

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Also for Middle Earth prog see Glass Hammer (http://www.glasshammer.com/index2.html). I don't own any of their music, but it does sound promising.

For all you folks like me who hadn't realized it, there is a thread for music reviews out there. So I have subscribed to it and will refrain from too much info here. In the meantime let me by you a cup of coffee Ealasaide! :D

Music Review Thread (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3702)

[Ealasaide]

Cool! Thanks, Pio & Hilde -- I will check them out. Grunge, power metal, alternative, industrial/punk... all works for me!;)

Also, sorry, Hilde! I hope you didn't take any offense at my comments. I seem to be trying to set some kind of record for crassness lately. Don't know what gets into me sometimes....:p

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Not at all Ealasaide, and I do not think that you've been at all crass. (But you may want to stop burning the midnight oil for the RPG's, else you might just drool on your keyboard and short it out! Or at least have a face like a waffle for awhile ;) .) Please do accept my appologies in advance, I'm waxing quite silly and off topic just now! Time to go home I suppose.

[Ealasaide]

In the meantime let me buy you a cup of coffee Ealasaide!

Thanks, Hilde, but I think I had better pass. At 6+ cups a day of black coffee, I'm already a little twitchy, eh? :p Could have something to do with all that RPG midnight oil burning, too. If I had any more coffee I think I'd give up sleeping entirely.

Hey! Why don't you continue with the music reviews after all? It was very helpful in solving my insomnia problems!:D

[Ealasaide]

Not that this has any relevance to anything... I just thought it was kind of fun: I just found out that one of my family names on my father's side is "Greenleaf". Unfortunately, no relation to Legolas!:p

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

...and who but my lady Greenleaves... ;)

[Ealasaide]

Haha! You're too punny!;) :p

[mark12_30]

I have gotten adventurous (reckless??) in buying CDs. I purchased three LOTR-related: Stephen Oliver's BBC adaptations, Bilbo's Great Adventure and The Alan Horvath Rings Project (as yet unopened, she mutters with a blush.) I have yet to review them but I do plan to...

Balanced against those are the three U2 cd's I just bought (also as yet unwrapped.)

Could somebody knowledgable do a thorough review (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3702) of those Glass Hammer albums? ...please?

I've also finished Kocher's biography of Tolkien. I need to write up that review (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1855&highlight=freshman+novice) review too...

Anybody have a poster of the really old map that had the psychedelic emu mural wrapped AROUND the map? I've never seen it online, scanned, mentioned... it was my first ME map, and I'm waxing nostalgic and would like to see it again. "What's become of my old Map, Frodo... the one I gave you?" "I lost it, Uncle...." "...pity..."

[mark12_30]

In Mirkwood Forest there dwelt a sprite
Ealasaide whom they called lady Greenleaves
And ages spent she in moonlight bright
Lingering under leaves of linden trees

No darkness withstood her gaze
Nor could shadow remain where her footsteps passed
Near her birds sang and fawns did graze
And the stag bowed and followed on silvered grass

(cut:)
Once Prince Greenleaf had been all her joy
Although long ago he sailed away
But silvered light fell on Greenwood fair
While yet Ealasaide lingered and tarried there

(replace with:)
Once Prince Greenleaf had been her delight
Deep was their joy while he tarried there
But he sailed long since from haven bright
While yet Ealasaide lingered in Greenwood fair

The seasons swept, and the ages changed
The dominion of men had arrived at last
But deep within the forest grey
Ealasaide lingered long on the silvered grass

She walks there still, so the harpers say
The black butterflies are the lament she sings
And deep within the forest grey
Is the shimmering silver her moonlight brings

Still near her the white stag stays
Though he leaps no more since his age is past
Birds sing and fawns softly graze
While her tears fall like dew on the silvered grass

[Ealasaide]

Ealasaide bends in a deep curtsy, her skirts sweeping the floor.

"That's lovely!" she says when she finally finds her voice. "Thank you, Mark-Helen! You leave me breathless...and quite nearly speechless. I'm deeply honored."

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

That was marvelous Helen! How very nice of you!
:)


Also, I guess I had better send for a Glass Hammer Album to review. Unfortunately, one of the songs on the sampler reminded me quite a bit of Monty Python and the Holy Grail's "Brave Sir Robin" song. Ah well, there is another to try first!

[mark12_30]

Helen waves and smiles. "Glad I am that you found it fair, " she says, "although I am yet tempted to fuss at the third stanza a bit. I lost the rhyming scheme there..."

She wanders off humming Green(s)leaves, and re-thinking

Once Prince Greenleaf had been her delight
But he sailed long since from haven bright
But silvered light fell on Greenwood fair
While yet Ealasaide lingered and tarried there

Frowns. "No, that's AABB, not ABAB. Drat."

Tries again:

Once Prince Greenleaf had been her delight
Deep was their joy while he tarried there
But he sailed long since from haven bright
While yet Ealasaide lingered in Greenwood fair

She nodded, and sighed with satisfaction. "Shall I edit the original post? Yes, I think so..."

[Ealasaide]

Hey! Anybody have some music they want to review? hee-hee...

I seem to have pretty effectively killed the thread when all I was trying to do was poke a little fun. Sorry! :(

In the meantime, until someone joins me again, I guess I shall sit here all alone upon the ground and tell sad tales of the deaths of kings to none but mine own ears... (My apologies to another fine old codger, William Shakespeare. ;) )

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Oh how nice, a story! What age would this king be living, or rather dying in? ;)

[mark12_30]

Ealasaide, do not fret that you have "killed " this thread. It has an undulating, pulsating life of its own, Blossoming, fading, going dormant, and then emerging again... rather like a daffodil on a shorter schedule.

And I did review some music... it's on the music review thread (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=319566&postcount=21), which was more or less birthed out of this thread (and its predecessor...) "The Hobbitons" CD recently arrived, so look for a review on that over the next week or so.

*sits crosslegged, wraps cloak about self, and settles in for story about long-dead king*

[Ealasaide]

Uh... you mean now I actually have to tell a sad story of the deaths of kings? :eek:

Okay...wait... give me a second...

I'll be back. :D

[Ealasaide]

Ealasaide sidles back into the picture, one tiptoe at a time, looking a bit red-faced...

Uh, sorry, haven't got any "sad tales of the deaths of kings." At least nothing to compare with Isildur or Théoden, or even Richard III, for that matter. What I've got plays more like a tragic folk ballad. Or War & Peace, if you take length into consideration. ;) I tend to be a bit long-winded once I get my teeth into a story.

If you're up for it, let me know! :D

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

I tend to be a bit long-winded once I get my teeth into a story.
Spoken like a true old fogey! ;) Let me pull up my rocking chair and you can e-mail me the whole thing. Who we gonna hear about Auntie Ealasaide? And are those your own teeth sunk in the story? :D

[Ealasaide]

And are those your own teeth sunk in the story?

Why, yes, they are! I'd been wondering where they'd gotten off to...

[mark12_30]

Ealasaide, if you have a ballad to sing, why not pop in-character into the Seventh Star and sing it there? (If it'll fit into one post, that is.) Songs are welcome at the Inn!

[Ealasaide]

Ooh! What a good suggestion. Thanks, Mark/Helen! I have a character who needs to put in an appearance in the Star, anyway... a certain Lady Isabel...so I will certainly give it some thought.

Also - my compliments on the White Tree. What a great new addition to the selction of icons!

[mark12_30]

Aside from checking the Downs, what habits do you have that remind you of (or come from) Middle-Earth? They can be seasonal.

For instance, over the past several weeks, I have gone every day to my beech trees to watch "spring unfold the beechen leaf."

"What are you taking pictures (http://members.cox.net/hrwright61/BeechenLeaf.htm) of?" was normally answered by the song (Tolkien Ensemble version).

[Snowdog]

Aside from checking the Downs, what habits do you have that remind you of (or come from) Middle-Earth? They can be seasonal.In the winter when I go out to the car to dig out of the snow before heading to work I think of the Fellowship trying to cross the Misty Mountains, or King Arvedui and his men freezing up in the Forochel area....

[Ealasaide]

Hmmm... the thing I do that reminds me the most of Middle Earth is the long walks I take in the woods with my dog (coyote/border collie mix.) In the park we go to, there are many long, winding trails. The really interesting part is that periodically, we come across the "ruins" of old stone gateways at one bend in the trail or another. I always think of Tolkein when I come across those. Unfortunately, lately, the Park Service has been systematically ripping them all out. :( Soon they will all be gone.

Besides the walks, I also make sterling silver jewelry based on chain mail.

As for pictures, I tend to shoot mostly landscapes and close-ups of flowers and tree roots & the like, but sometimes I will also do interesting windows or doorways. I seldom take pictures of people (unless I get hired to shoot a special event for someone.) When I have film to burn at the end of a roll, I also take a lot of pictures of my dog and cat. :D

[Estelyn Telcontar]

My Middle-earth moments are closely connected with nature; when I walk, I try to be consciously aware of what’s around me, experiencing it with as many senses as possible. It’s easiest to do that in Spring, I think, after the bareness of winter makes everything look “fresh and poignant”, as Lothlórien did to Frodo when he entered that land.

I’m acutely aware of flowers, both wild and in gardens. Sometimes tiny blossoms are so wonderfully detailed that I marvel over them. (Beside one of my favorite paths, I saw some little yellow, star-shaped wildflowers that I dubbed “elanor”.) I stick my nose in every lilac bush and kneel down to sniff the scent of lilies-of-the-valley. And above all, I touch trees, hedges, and bushes. No, I’m not a tree-hugger, but I love feeling the softness of new leaves and fresh evergreen tips! A friend once told me that she could recognize me from a long distance because I always have my arm stretched out when I walk past anything green in the spring.

The feeling of wonder is what I connect with Middle-earth.

[Child of the 7th Age]

My own experiences are somewhat different. I can think of three Middle-earth moments, two of which are not strictly nature related.

The first one is cyclical but on a weekly rather than a seasonal basis. Every Friday evening and Saturday, my family and I live a life far removed from the 21st century. We do without TVs, cars, radios, CD players, and for the most part even computers. (OK, I do "cheat" on that last one occasionally. :D ) We walk to each other's houses (up to about a mile or so) and sit around the table at dinner and lunch, eating heaps of food and talking. It's a rare Saturday that we don't have one or more guests. It's not always so idyllic. Sometimes when we walk, a thunderstorm blows in and everyone gets drenched.

We do this for religious reasons that have nothing to do with Middle-earth, but strangely enough it always reminds me of living in the Shire. Very people centered and relaxing. It's as if time slows down. It's race, race, race all week and then a day to sniff the flowers, read a book, or even take a nap.

My second Middle-earth moment is when I sit with my kids and read to them. (Actually, sometimes I have them read to me, since it beats the prepackaged audio books on CD.) Even though I have a teen and pre-teen, we still do this sometimes, especially in the summer. I always feel like Bilbo telling stories to young Sam or Frodo.

As far as nature goes, Houston is not inspiring. No lovely woods or anything like that. But the ocean is just an hour away in Galveston which is a sleepy city, whose prime is long past. I always think of fading Elves when I go there! But the greatest lure is the beach and to listen to the surf. Shades of Sam Gamgee at the end of the unpublished epilogue, or even the shores of Tol Eressea. The ocean just goes on and on....

[piosenniel]

. . . And as the Captains gazed south to the Land of Mordor, it seemed to them that, black against the pall of cloud, there rose a huge shape of shadow, impenetrable, lightning-crowned, filling all the sky. Enormous it reared above the world, and stretched out towards them a vast threatening hand, terrible but impotent: for even as it leaned over them, a great wind took it, and it was all blown away, and passed; and then a hush fell.

~ RotK; “The Field of Cormallen”

In the wee hours of the night, 2 a.m., after work and looking north, not south from my back yard, while the dog does his business – there is the giant smoke stack of the paper/plywood mill that looms in the near distance above my tall wooden fence. At its top is a blinking light to warn off low flying aircraft, and from its mouth belches a continuous massive pillar of steam and smoke. Ominous and threatening it appears as it emerges; but the top streamer is fragmented in the night breezes.

An army of frogs, inhabitants of our small pond, is loud in the darkness . . . hushing immediately at the arrival of myself and dog.

[mark12_30]

Brrrr, Pio. I am spoiled! I look up in my sky and see oak and beech branches, and stars beyond them...

I just bought three albums from CdBaby by an indie band called Hobbit :
All for the One
Two Feet Tall
Rockin' the Shire.

The review compared them to Yes and Foreigner, if I recall. THe cartoon Bilbo graces the cover of Two Feet Tall. They are still in their shrink-wrap.

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Did someone mention Yes? :D

Seriously, I have been trying to think of some Tolkien moments, but they have been rather far and few between this year, even in my rural surroundings. (Unless working with an orc counts. Then I have intense Tolkien moments all to often! :p Not a very uplifting revelation, is it?)

[mark12_30]

I finally put "All for the ONe" in for a spin. I like it.

Hilda, think of a combination of Yes, Kansas, Journey and Survivor-- sort of-- and you have "Hobbit". They don't quite have the virtuosity of Yes (No Roundabout here) but they aren't shabby. And they do have fun lyrics. A few too many drug references for me... but there it is. Fun album.

Tolkien moments:

Yesterday I spent about fifteen minutes chatting with a whitetail doe. I got within ten feet of her but no closer. She is completely fearless. I wonder if I brought her an apple if she'd take it out of my hand... maybe not, but it's a tempting thought. So-- just call me Radagast for a day. ;)

Fortunately she is a long way from my hostas!

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

Greetings all you coots! I have resisted this thread for too long…

First, my credentials. I have been reading LotR about once a year, every year, for the last 21 years. I took a course at university in which we spent six weeks on LotR; I have published an article about it myself. I have taught a non-credit university level course about LotR. But most importantly, I own the DVDs of the movies. :)

Second, my Middle-Earth moment. I am a new father. One night, not long after the birth of my beautiful boy, I came home from work very late, exhausted and terribly upset by a profound professional set back. As I walked down the street to my home, I saw the lights in the windows, and when I came in, my wife was there, and I sat down and she put my son on my lap and I said – and, as Eru is my witness, I was entirely unconscious of the echo until afterward – “Well, I’m back.”

And you know what – for all the times I’d read that book, and for all the work I’ve done with it, I never really got it until that moment.

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Welcome Mr. Hedgethistle, and what a beautiful Tolkien moment, congratulations! (Now that is uplifting...)

And Helen, I have found samples of Hobbit and have listened. The singer reminds me a bit of Jon Anderson, but I think that I would be hesitant to buy this one. Thanks for the insight.

[Estelyn Telcontar]

How wonderful, Fordim! Wow, what impressive credentials precede that very personal experience! You are very welcome here - with a new baby at home, you'll appreciate our comfortable rocking chairs, I'm sure.

I've enjoyed your contributions on other threads and am glad you've now joined us here!

[Ealasaide]

Welcome, Fordim! My, what impressive credentials, indeed! And that is a beautiful moment as well. Very life affirming. :)

I'm curious what your LotR article was about! My BA is in English Lit/Literary Criticism, so that does interest me. (Never got my Master's as the main Prof I planned to study with died unexpectedly. I kind of lost my inspiration after that.)

Another thing I used to do that made me think of Tolkein is study Kendo, which is the art of samurai swordsmanship. I was doing really well with it until my Sensei had a nervous breakdown and had to go away. After that I wasn't able to find another instructor who was quite as good, then I moved, etc, etc. It is something I would like to take up again someday.

[Raefindel]

My, but how all your Guru's have abandoned you, Ealasaide!

Hullo, Fordim Hedgethistle! It's nice to have you here. Congratulations on your new son. You didn't happen to name him after one of Sam's sons, now, did you?

[Ealasaide]

My, but how all your Guru's have abandoned you, Ealasaide!

Yes, it's really kind of depressing. Fortunately, those are the only two that I lost in such unhappy ways. It's funny that they should both happen to come up in the same post, though! I didn't notice that when I wrote it.

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Yes, I was going to say I noticed a pattern there Ealasaide !

Raefindel! Glad to hear from you!

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

Greetings Ealasaide and all.

Hmmm. . .I'm not sure I want to cite my Tolkien article for you; from the looks of things, people from whom you choose to learn do not fare well. . . :eek:

Sorry, just a feeble attempt at humour.

The real reason I shall not cite my article here is twofold: one, I kind of like my BD Anonymity, and, two, the paper appeared several years ago and then sank into a much deserved oblivion. The only real contribution it made is that it was among the first of the 'new' generation of work on Tolkien (post 1970s) that attempted to deal with the real importance of the female characters in LotR. I got it all wrong, but at least I can say I was there at the beginning of the critical re-evaluation of this aspect of his work :)

[Ealasaide]

Fordim - fair enough! I like my BD anonymity as well, so I can appreciate your stance.

Now...a word in my defense! Contrary to how it may appear, I had nothing to do with the sad ending of aforementioned Gurus. It was purely coincidental. Many of my former teachers are still living and are in at least partial command of their faculties (no pun intended! ;) ).

...although now you guys are starting to make me paranoid...
Maybe the wind I blow around on is an ill one.... yikes! :eek:

[Mithadan]

Now...a word in my defense! Contrary to how it may appear, I had nothing to do with the sad ending of aforementioned Gurus. It was purely coincidental. Many of my former teachers are still living and are in at least partial command of their faculties

Yeah, yeah, right! As they say in my profession, the circumstancial evidence tends to establish...

Welcome Fordim!

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

The only real contribution it made is that it was among the first of the 'new' generation of work on Tolkien (post 1970s) that attempted to deal with the real importance of the female characters in LotR.

There were female character's in LoTR?! :D I had to say that you know. Sorry, you can pelt me with those stones now!

[Ealasaide]

Just call me Ealasaide Stormcrow! :p

Hilde - consider thyself pelted with stones! :D

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

PELT PELT. . .PELT-PELT-PELT

PELT

Harumph!

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Believe me, I have no qualms whatsoever with the way Tolkien wrote LoTR and am quite content with the representatives that are there.

Just being a trouble maker! :p

[Ealasaide]

Speaking of women in LotR...

Since LotR is such a male-bonding sort of adventure, I have always thought it would be interesting to create an RPG or Fan Fic centered around women, almost a mirroring adventure that takes place at the same time as the events chronicled in LotR. I first got the idea from a line out of Isak Dinesen when she talks about how men are are constantly being tested for courage, etc, while women are tested for their abilities to wait & endure. Then I read Carolyn Cassady's "Off The Road", which was the feminine flipside of Jack Kerouac's adventures "On The Road", which really set me to thinking.

In a traditionally male-dominated culture, women are kind of unseen in that most of the time they operate in the background and below the radarscope, so to speak, of men. With this in mind, I have been mentally debating how to develop the notion of a "mirror fellowship" of women for quite a while now, where they are not tested in their ability to wait and endure, but for their abilities to succeed at their given adventure.

On the other hand, it would be interesting to explore the "wait & endure" side of things, too, say from the POV of Rosie in The Shire.

[Mithadan]

Warning: What follows is a VERY politically incorrect parody of Ealasaide's suggested RPG. Apologies in advance, but I couldn't resist.

Rosie Cotton's Secret Diary

September 23, 3018: Sam has gone off with Frodo to set up his household in Buckland. Hope he comes back soon...

October 23, 3018: Still waiting for Sam to return...

October 24, 3018: Still waiting for Sam to return...

October 25, 3018: Still waiting for Sam to return. Darn that Frodo anyway...

November 25, 3018: Knitted Sam new pair of socks as a present. When will he come back...

December 25, 3018: Still waiting...

January 25, 3019: Still waiting...

February 25, 3019: Still waiting for Sam to come back. Ran into Ted Sandyman at the Green Dragon. He said that by now Sam has probably been eaten by some combination of dragons, tree-men, goblins or trolls. Then he asked me out...

February 26, 3019: Hand still bruised where punched Sandyman in the nose. Sam better come back soon.

March 1, 3019: Lotho Pimple now running Shire. Hope he doesn't ask me out. Where is Sam?

March 20, 3019: Lotho Pimple has taken up with Ted Sandyman. Knew there was something strange about those two...

March 30, 3019: Something starnge going on in the Shire. Lotho is bringing in loads of strange men to "Help him run the Shire". Darn pervy Sackville-Baggins...

June 1, 3019: Lobelia arrested. Maybe Lotho not all bad. Where is Sam. Biological clock is ticking..

July 20, 3019: Tick, tick, tick...

September 1, 3019: Finally gave in and went out with Sandyman. He promised me Ring of Power. Told him to stuff it. Can't abide his dirty hands. Very tired of waiting for Sam...

November 1, 3019: Sam finally back! Too busy rousing Shire to spend time with me.

November 2, 3019: Sam still rousing Shire. Tick, tick, tick...

November 3, 3019: Big Boss dealt with. Sam now too busy "setting things straight" to spend time with me...

December 20, 3019: Sam still busy running Shire. Wonder where Sandyman is?

April 6, 3020: Sam crowing about pretty tree in Party Field. If he doesn't spend some time with me soon, I'll whack him with a branch...

May 1, 3020: Married Sam! Yay me!

September 21, 3021: Sam off with Frodo again. Beginning to wonder...

November 7, 3027: Sam elected mayor. I have a bad feeling about this...

December 1, 3042: Have 12 children now. Sam still mayor. Working late tonight running the Shire. Hamfast, Daisy and Primrose have the chicken pox. Bilbo, Ruby and Robin have colds. Elanor out on date. Have to feed and put various and sundry kids to sleep alone again. Should have married rich miller's son, Sandyman...

[Ealasaide]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! <PLONK!>

"Oh, man....! Whoo!" Ealasaide picks her butt up out of the dust where it fell when she laughed it off and reattaches it, still wiping tears of mirth from her eyes. "Okay, Mithadan," she says with a sly grin. "En garde, Sir Wag! I'll get you for this one!"

[Child of the 7th Age]

Priceless!

***********************


Siftings from Child's e-mail 'sent' box......

Mithadan -

What an interesting idea for a games proposal! You will shortly be receiving a games worksheet from Piosenniel with instructions on how to fill out the sheet.

Some of the roles you listed would seem to require a rather 'delicate' hand (perhaps two?). I would recommend that you enlist 'experienced' posters for this purpose who will have their profiles and posts ready when the discussion thread first opens.

We look forward to seeing your revisions and working with you on this game.

Cami Goodchild, Shire Mod

*************************

Pio -

Please see the attached game seed from Mithadan. This one is a real blooper!

I would suggest sending this on to Rohan, but I don't have the heart to do that to Bethberry. Perhaps, we could interest Gondor in this! I think it would fit right in with Reunification of the Entish Bow. :rolleyes:

Cami

******************************


Side note to Esty: This was said with a grin, of course!

******************************

Serious note to Ealasaide:

Actually, this is an interesting idea for either fanfiction or RPG. I was toying with the idea of one of the villages in Gondor or Rohan where all the men had gone off to the war. I had originally suggested something like this last summer, but the young women who ran with the RPG planning thread preferred to focus on court intrigue rather than the nitty gritty. This was the origin of "Corsairs and Corsets".

In terms of that village, I was thinking of a mixture : a combination of "wait and endure" and action. Not necessarily hand-to-hand combat, but perhaps a village being taken over by someone (not Orcs) and women spying to get information from the bad guys, or some such thing.

If you ever decide to do something with this in terms of an RPG, let me know.....

[The Saucepan Man]

Bravo Mith! :D

Actually, there is quite a good precedent for elements of such a story in the Easterlings' invasion of Hithlum following the disaster of the Nirnaeth Arnoediad, which forms the background for the stories of Turin and Tuor. Not being a regular RPG'er, I have no idea whether it would be suitable for an RPG, but it seems to me that it might provide the setting for an interesting story, either RPG or fan-fiction. Elements could include the struggles undergone by Morwen, Aerin's efforts to assist her (and conceal such efforts from her husband and his men) and Rian's sad story.

Anyway, just a suggestion ...

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Oh yeah, that would be a wonderful time and place to set a story in!!! Good idea!

[Estelyn Telcontar]

*Esty chuckles into her crocheting and the chair rocks with every laugh*

You write it, I'll read it!

[Ealasaide]

Child - Yes, I remember getting all excited about the idea of an RPG from the women's POV last summer when the planning thread for "Corsairs" first opened. I had been hoping that it would explore some of the ideas I have been talking about here and was a bit disappointed in the direction it ultimately took. But that's okay! "Corsairs" was a fun little RPG, even if it didn't dig as deeply into women's roles as I would have liked.

BUT...that leaves the door open for me to explore the "nitty-gritty" side of things on my own, doesn't it? I would be very interested in developing an RPG along these lines this summer after my gang in The Shire and I finally wrap up our lingering RPG, "The Lingering Darkness." For the moment, I would like to hold off on my "mirror fellowship" storyline until it has time to gel a bit more, but I would like to follow up on the other one, which I see pretty much exactly as you describe:

a mixture : a combination of "wait and endure" and action. Not necessarily hand-to-hand combat, but perhaps a village being taken over by someone (not Orcs) and women spying to get information from the bad guys, or some such thing.

Let me do a little thinking and planning & I will definitely PM you about it! I see it as an exploration of women's roles in taking care of the homefront while the men are away at war.

Saucepan Man - What an excellent suggestion! That sounds like the perfect framework for what I am talking about. I'll do some reading and see if it actually would work for my purposes. Thanks!

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Oh Ealasaide, I do believe Saucepan Man's idea would apply. In fact I'd love to see that one get started. Plenty of potential.

[Ealasaide]

In my latest foray to the local bookstore, I picked up an interesting cookbook: "Celtic Folklore Cooking" by Joanne Asala. It's a combination of food-related Celtic folklore and recipes. I have not had the chance to try any of the recipes yet, but so far it has been an entertaining read. The writer has an obvious interest in Wicca and New Age-type ritual, but the recipes and folktales are fun and well-researched.

[mark12_30]

Aside from the ritual, that sounds FASCINATING. And I don't normally like to cook.

Actually, I take that back. I enjoy cooking if it's something I think hobbits and elves would cook and eat. Lembas, good. Mushrooms, good. Cabbage and Roots, Good. Mutton and Mushrooms, good. :p

Apple in pocket: even better, no cooking needed!! :D

Anyway, Ealasaide, please keep us posted.

How much was it?

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

OK, I have to ask. . .

I've just been reading through the thread about "early teens on the downs" and discovered that there is a whole swath of 'Downers whom I've been RPing with who are, well, let's say, young. . .much younger than I would have thought based on their posts and intelligence! Which is, of course, the nice thing about this place -- no pre-conceptions based on appearance or social standing/status: everybody is evaluated on the strengths of their posts.

But at any event, my question: don't you somewhat, shall we say, more mature Downers sometime feel a little, well, silly when (if) you are RPing with the younguns?? I know that I do! Heck, sometimes I feel a bit, well, creepy at the idea of RPing with a 15 year old girl: I mean, what if our characters fall in love with one another??

OK, I'm going to slip on my comfortable robe, retire to the rocking chair on the back porch and watch the sunset. That is, if I don't nod off first. . .

EDIT -- just re-read the post and oh my goodness -- agism agism agism. Let me say it for the record: the younguns I have seen around here are absolutely, jaw-droppingly, bestaggeringly amazing to me. I teach, and I could only wish that my students -- most of whom are between the ages of 18 and 20 -- were as mature, thoughtful, intelligent, creative, dependable and interesting as the people I find here!

[Estelyn Telcontar]

Fordim, I quite agree - it's nice to interact with people of varying ages without the barriers real life usually has between generations. I find that the younger forum members are highly differentiated - some have very intellectual interests, some are awesome authors, and some mostly enjoy the fun and interaction. Just like us geezers, actually...

[Ealasaide]

Mark/Helen - no, I don't think any exorcisms would be necessary! On a closer read, I see that what I was taking for rituals was a listing of the Celtic Wheel of the Year at the very beginning of the book: pagan holidays by Judeo-Christian standards, but nothing scary! There are a few other places later on where rituals are referred to, but they are things like "do this to discover who you will eventually marry" and that sort of thing. No spells or hexes.

Fordim - You said:
Heck, sometimes I feel a bit, well, creepy at the idea of RPing with a 15 year old girl: I mean, what if our characters fall in love with one another??
I just separate the writer from the character. When I am writing in an RPG, I don't even think about who the other writer is. If I did start thinking of the writer in combination with the character, I would find it equally creepy writing love affairs with other women, y'know? It's just a pratfall of the medium. You'll get used to it after a while. :) A writer's a writer. We're all here to write and adventure and get away from ourselves for a while!

...at least that's why I'm here! :p :D

[mark12_30]

For a short while in one RPG, I thought we were going to have a guy (written by a girl) falling in love with a girl (written by a guy.) It didn't turn out that way though. In another RPG we had a guy-dwarf (written by a girl) falling (eventually) for a girl-dwarf *disguised* as a guy (written by a girl.)

Luckily we all had a sense of humor.

It is amazing to learn that a writer that you guessed was in his or her thirties... is most emphatically *not*.

[Ealasaide]

For a short while in one RPG, I thought we were going to have a guy (written by a girl) falling in love with a girl (written by a guy.) It didn't turn out that way though. In another RPG we had a guy-dwarf (written by a girl) falling (eventually) for a girl-dwarf *disguised* as a guy (written by a girl.)

Sounds pretty Shakespearean to me! Twelth Night, anyone?

[Snowdog]

I remember getting all excited about the idea of an RPG from the women's POV last summer when the planning thread for "Corsairs" first opened. I had been hoping that it would explore some of the ideas I have been talking about here and was a bit disappointed in the direction it ultimately took. Yes, i remember, and was even a part of this, writing a woman character. I was quickly disenchanted with its direction, and my increasing RL pressures had me basicly hand off my minor character to another. I did enjoy it for a time.

On the issue of RP with older/younger writers. You have to be careful with this. My preference is to write with 18 or older folk so there is no "creepiness" as you say. But I'm all for younger writers RP ing, and some are so literate and make an ebnjoyable story to read.

[Estelyn Telcontar]

It also depends on the nature of the story - I did set a minimum age of 18 for writers on the notorious "Entish Bow" RPG...

[Alda]

Alas it seems I have "Come of Age"

It happened some years ago I am afraid. Time has a way of doing that, slowly and inexorably moving forward into some unforseen future. A future where you turn on the radio and can't even understand what the kids are "singing" about. :eek:

It wasn't too long ago that Bob Seger's "Night Moves" was spinning on the turntable and I was at my desk in my room copying The Tengwar from the Appendix in The Return of the King. Maybe taking a break or two by playing Atari, or getting up to turn the music down because dad didn't like that Led Zepplin guy. :rolleyes:

Ok, perhaps the youngsters are not all that much different than we were. (Just smarter and with better technology) ;)

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

Greetings Alda, and welcome to the Club. There are plenty of rockers and comfortable quilts.

Couldn't help but laugh at your memories of learning Tengwar -- for me, it was Dwarvish runes and The Who. I envy you your Atari, as well, my father would never let me have one as it would ruin my mind. Had to find other ways to ruin it.

[Ealasaide]

Welcome, Alda! Sounds like you'll fit right in...

Plenty of rockers around here, in both senses of the term. Funny... my dad didn't like "that Led Zeppelin guy" either. Unfortunately, he had to endure quite a lot of him. :p :D

[The Squatter of Amon Rûdh]

It also depends on the nature of the story - I did set a minimum age of 18 for writers on the notorious "Entish Bow" RPG...

Why's that? I've never seen a more decorous or family friendly RPG. In fact, it should be required reading in primary schools.

[Mithadan]

There are plenty of rockers and comfortable quilts.

"Idi Amin and the Shah
and al-Fadar is quite bizarre!
Me I do the only thing
that still makes sense to me...
I do the Rock"

[Bêthberry]

I mean, what if our characters fall in love with one another??

It isn't just the youngsters who get mixed up in romance, Fordim. Why, our very own upstanding RPG Administrator, none other than the distinguishedly greying Mithadan, has had the fortune, or misfortune, to have a game of his closed--yes, I say, closed--by a moderator due to improprieties, alleged or otherwise, between his character and an elf of some renown in these here RPG parts as well. Verily doth he say, as he protested above,

but I couldn't resist. .

It is a slippery slope and I for one very much applaud Tolkien for walking wide of this mire and concentrating on high heroics. One can never have too many pedestals. And so, Child, I am much obliged to your kindness in suggesting Gondor for this game. It is just such a thing as Rimbaud, with his vast knowledge of Lord Halfulion, can handle.

Yours chortlingly,
etc etc

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Couldn't help but laugh at your memories of learning Tengwar -- for me, it was Dwarvish runes and The Who.

For me it was Moody Blues and making up something that looked like a cross between Tengwar and Arabic.

Greetings Alda!

[The Saucepan Man]

You are most welcome Alda. :)


It wasn't too long ago that Bob Seger's "Night Moves" was spinning on the turntable and I was at my desk in my room copying The Tengwar from the Appendix in The Return of the King.

For me it was Moody Blues and making up something that looked like a cross between Tengwar and Arabic.I'll go with Adam and the Ants and writing up a Dungeons & Dragons game based on LotR. :rolleyes:


Maybe taking a break or two by playing Atari*Brandishes Playstation 2 controller* What a long way we have come from Atari! :cool:

[Alda]

I want to thank all of you for making me feel so welcome! :)

*Alda sits in the rocking chair and is amazed at how comfortable it is.

I will just close my eyes for a second, no harm in that is there? So much to do you know. There is still plenty of daylight left, I might get that soffit replaced. Oh and the new mulch needs thrown. Weeding, always weeding to be done.

*Chin on chest, and book on floor. zzzzzzzzzzzz

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

I'll go with Adam and the Ants and writing up a Dungeons & Dragons game based on LotR.

Aren't all D&D games based on LoTR? :p Well, except for the gelatinous thing-gummy-bobs (cubes was it?). But I feel confident that Feanor would have come up with them if given a little more time, and a better sense of humor. :D

[tar-ancalime]

It's another year or two before I'm in this club, but I just wanted to say that it's refreshing to find I'm not the only one here on the Downs who remembers LPs and Atari.

[mark12_30]

I would suggest sending this on to Rohan, but I don't have the heart to do that to Bethberry. Perhaps, we could interest Gondor in this! I think it would fit right in with Reunification of the Entish Bow.


"Row, row," bellowed Caspian. "Pull for all our lives! You can say what you like, Reepicheep. There are some things no man can face."


*************

Hilde, Moody Blues ruled.

Hmmm.... maybe I should pick up a CD of "Days of Future Passed"...

Tuesday afternoon...

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

"Row, row," bellowed Caspian. "Pull for all our lives! You can say what you like, Reepicheep. There are some things no man can face."

Yes, I think it would irreparably alter my view of Rosie, let alone Sam!

And I wore the grooves of a ‘best of’ the Moody Blues LP I’d give my eye teeth to have now. Well, maybe not my eyeteeth…. Keep looking to see if I can find it on CD. Maybe I should visit the fabled music stores of Moria, they are bound to have it.

[mark12_30]

*cough* Amazon.

[Ealasaide]

And I wore the grooves of a ‘best of’ the Moody Blues LP I’d give my eye teeth to have now. Well, maybe not my eyeteeth…. Keep looking to see if I can find it on CD. Maybe I should visit the fabled music stores of Moria, they are bound to have it.

I just happen to have that very LP. Hmmm... Eye teeth, eh? :p

**********************

What's all this "row,row, Reepicheep", eh? You've totally lost me there. (Not difficult to do!)

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

The one with the album covers lined up like dominoes? Is it playable? Ah how very precious! Dare I mention birthday presents? :eek: gollum, we wants it we does.

The quote is from The Chronicles of Narnia, though I don't remember if it was from Prince Caspian or Voyage of the Dawn Treader. I think the latter. :)

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

What's all this "row,row, Reepicheep", eh? You've totally lost me there. (Not difficult to do!)

The Voyage of the Dawn Treader, by C.S. Lewis. Read it or you're a Newbie! :D

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Ah, very good we cross posted, or edited. Reepicheep is a rather large and courageous mouse, if memory serves me right. And Prince Caspian is well, Prince Caspian.

[Ealasaide]

AHA! Busted... never read any C.S.Lewis, though I always intended to. Looks like a trip to the library may be in order! :p Lewis Carroll, though, and I'm golden! :D 'Tis always brillig at my house...

Hilde - Yup! That'd be the one. A Double Album: "This is the Moody Blues" I'm sure it's the same album because I heard yours and had to run out and buy one just like it... this was of course many moons ago, in a living room far, far away...

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

And the borogoves are somewhat mimsy, what with that stuffed Bandersnatch over the doorway to the shed!

[Ealasaide]

Ooh.. yes! Bagged that Bandersnatch m'self, I did! My vorple blade went snicker-snack and we had a wonderful Bandersnatch stew for dinner. :D

[mark12_30]

Jubjub birds and wights--

Once upon a tulgy thread there was a frumious discussion about how the slithy downs had changed over the frabjous unfolding years. Can anyone remember the title/ whereabouts/ instigator/ wabe/ SOMETHING FINDABLE of that vorpal thread? I have searched and searched.

I though it was Child, but that was the before&afterTheMovies thread.

[Mithalwen]

I meet the entrance requirements ..... do I have to give the margins .... lol :D

[mark12_30]

Hey, Mithalwen! I was hoping that you'd sign up. If you meet the requirements-- Eighteen years of Tolkien in your life-- then you are in, lady!

Incidentally, there are many who share your admiration for Faramir ( 30 years ago, I would have had to fight it out with my bestTolkien-buddy who had claimed him already, so I settled on Eomer at the time). I am now, however, a Frodo-addict, as are others on this thread. But we try not to swoon, except over Balrogs.

What's your favorite personal Middle-Earth / Tolkien-story?

[Mithalwen]

I like book Frodo and radio frodo but not film frodo........


Well of course I like Faramir and Eowyn..... I like Eomer too, and I wish there was more about the house of Dol Amroth and Elrond and Celebrian......

I like the passion and psychology of Aldarion and Erendis and The Narn i hin Hurin is incredibly powerful.........

Other than that I am the standard elf-fancier ..... :D

[mark12_30]

"Standard elf-fancier"! Most amusing!

But by "favorite personal Middle-Earth / Tolkien-story" I mean what thing has ever happened to you that was Middle-Earth related? It can be funny, sad, profound, whatever.

For instance-- in my teens, I sewed a calf-length green cloak out of cotton (since discarded, unfortunately) and I wore it to school. No-- I mean, I wore it EVERYWHERE every day in school-- to all of my classes. i was the laughingstock of the school. But I was elvish, by golly.

[Mithalwen]

Sorry ..... that gauntlet blow must have dazed me..... no stories as such .. I only wore my cloak in private..... and did try to read LOTR sitting in the only tree in the garden - and elderly apple singularly unlike a Mallorn.....

[mark12_30]

Er.... that thread regarding the evolution of the Downs-- clues anyone?

[Estelyn Telcontar]

Sounds like it should be on the Barrow-Downs forum, Helen, but I don't recall enough about it to know which it could be...

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Greetings, Mithalwen! I take it the reference to a gauntlet has to do with the Chapter-by-Chapter Thread.

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

Greetings, Mithalwen! I take it the reference to a gauntlet has to do with the Chapter-by-Chapter Thread.

Indeed it does. I got us all in trouble with Esty with my silliness, for which I feel truly sorry. But as this thread is devoted to silliness (or senility). . .

Aragorn is way better than Faramir! Sure Faramir might not pick up the Ring if he saw it by the roadside, but I always thought that would be darned irresponsible of him:

"Hey! Look! The One Ring! Best leave that there. I hope somebody comes along and takes care of that thing before Sauron finds it. Gosh, it's getting late. I'd better get home before dad gets all angry with me for not defending the kingdom. I sure wish I were like Boromir -- he'd pick up that Ring, but that's OK cause he's my hero. . ."

What a dweeb.

(Hey -- Mithalwen called Aragorn a prig. My back is up. As is my ire.)

[mark12_30]

(once again, scratches head)

Mithalwen, just in case you want one, I think there's a gauntlet on the floor here somewhere... And I know where I can find a pair of pistols, I think. Where'd Bilbo the pony get off to now?

While you two are settling the details, I'm going to have a glass. Y ...And hasn't ANYbody remembered something parseable about that thread? (rummages around in dusty archives, spilling wine on documents)

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Ah, I see I have some catching up to do on the Strider thread! I just hope that I don’t start talking to my screen as a result!

Helen, that wouldn’t be the Much Has Changed (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?t=10679&highlight=change) thread, would it? About how long ago do you remember seeing the elusive topic?

[Maédhros]

What exactly do you guys in this club?

[mark12_30]

Maedhros-- so far, I haven't seen any rules. We're genteel enough here so that they don't seem needed. To misquote Esty: TCOA has no rules; TCOA needs no rules. If posters get out of line, there's always a handy cane nearby. Now that you know, pull up a rocker. You don't know where the lost thread is, do you?

~~~~

Thanks, Hilde! But that wasn't it.

More data...?

Well, last spied:more than a month, less than a year?
Posters included Maril and Child and many others...
Essence of the thread was that the Downs used to be for scholars-- will we weather the movie/ teenybopper invasion? Will it still be a good place? what will change? What will we lose/ gain? I think it was a pretty old thread, that got resurrected around the release of each movie, more or less.

Now that the furor of RotK has calmed a bit, I wanted to bring it back up-- mostly to note that the new rating system seems to have had quite a positive effect on posting quality, and suchlike comments.

But-- drat if I can find it!

[Maédhros]

Well, last spied:more than a month, less than a year?
Posters included Maril and Child and many others...
Essence of the thread was that the Downs used to be for scholars-- will we weather the movie/ teenybopper invasion? Will it still be a good place? what will change? What will we lose/ gain? I think it was a pretty old thread, that got resurrected around the release of each movie, more or less.

Now that the furor of RotK has calmed a bit, I wanted to bring it back up-- mostly to note that the new rating system seems to have had quite a positive effect on posting quality, and suchlike comments.

But-- drat if I can find it!
Ok thanks for the info. But I'm afraid that I do not meet the requirements to join such club, I was just curious. I just wanted to know if you guys did something special that required to have 18 years or more to be done.
I have always thought that the important thing is what the poster/person had to say rather than how much time they have been reading the books. I think that I can stay my ground with any member of the club. ;)

Again thanks for the info.

[Mithalwen]

What a dweeb.

(Hey -- Mithalwen called Aragorn a prig. My back is up. As is my ire.)


Now I wish I had used my original chioce of vocabulary and not substituted a similar but milder word :p ....... Poltroon! You treat me with contumely.......and you have dissed the object of my affections...... Be afraid, be very afraid......

"But no living man am I! You look upon a woman...... You stand between me and my lord..... Begone, if you be not deathless! For living or dark undead, I will smite you, if you touch him."

[Estelyn Telcontar]

Don't worry, Maédhros - this corner of the Downs is not limited by a secret password or set up for non-"family-friendly" activities! :D (And no, Mithalwen and Fordim, I will not condone duelling on the premises! Go out to the traditional grounds if you must. :p ) It was merely begun to give members of a certain age a place to share their often similar experiences, since many of us have been fans of the LotR books for decades. That does not lessen the knowledge or experience of younger members or those who have come to know and love the book more recently.

[Mithalwen]

The lost thread ...sound like an quest to me ......

Esty ... Fordim made the mistake of assuming (on Eru knows what grounds ...) that I was a gentleman ... I am not and so I guess that means we cannot settle the matter of honour "like gentlemen" (althought I quite like the idea of myself in appropriate costume, hair tied with the traditional black ribbon - eek - just as well HI is too young for this thread lol).

Faramir a dweeb? He has blood in his veins not iced water and he doesn't snivel that he can't make his mind up when things go pear-shaped ... bah ..... and he is man enough to cope with a real woman... :p

After that insult ... I think it may get a bit more low down and sneaky - and that gauntlet may have alternative uses.......

Mithalwen La Rabouilleuse

[mark12_30]

( Glances uneasily at Mithalwen, then whispers: )

Careful, lass. Esty's cane packs quite a wallop, and her reach is long.

*resumes rocking while pouring another glass of wine, then returns to the library to shuffle more documents.*

[Mithalwen]

Ah well, while I am old amongst the "children", I am at the younger end of the spectrum here and maybe sprightlier than most .......and she only forbad duelling on the premises......... and besides, I have one of those innocent faces ...no-one ever believes I could do anything bad......... :D

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

I think that I can stay my ground with any member of the club.

Maédhros , it is comforting to know of a place where one can speak of Tolkien poetry on vinyl (and eggplants and emus, and SPI games), and people actually understand that you are not 'off your rocker'! ;) And neither do they fall asleep you mention such things. At least I don't think they do.... :p

Helen, it seems to me I do remember the thread in question, though I saw it in passing. Did all the threads get transfered over, other than movies?

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

Dweeb...?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

(once again, scratches head)

From the Oxford English Dictionary:

dweeb, n. N. Amer. slang.

A person held in contempt, esp. one ridiculed as studious, puny, or unfashionable; a fool. Cf. NERD n.; FARAMIR n.

[mark12_30]

:eek:

I know your avatar is The Professor, Fordie. But now you are taking on airs.

[Estelyn Telcontar]

Mark/Helen, I like your new avatar! It goes very well with the personal title.

[Mithalwen]

And I doubt the professor would have used slang from the colonies / former colonies.......

[Mithalwen]

And I would deem that she is scratching her head over the application of the word not its meaning.........

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

Oh dear, my pale attempt at humour has gone awry. Allow me to once again post the OED entry, with one thing highlighted for added emphasis:

A person held in contempt, esp. one ridiculed as studious, puny, or unfashionable; a fool. Cf. NERD n.; FARAMIR n.

It was supposed to be utterly hilarious. . .

My apologies to the Professor for my presumption, to Helen for appearing as though I were lecturing, and to all for the putting on of airs (makes me sound like I'm a bald Yorkshireman -- get it? "Putting on 'airs" like in a wig? Like I said, pale attempts at humour).

[mark12_30]

( scratches head again, scanning floor ) ...Where's that dratted gauntlet...?

[Mithalwen]

Psst ....... *hands Helen the gauntlet* ...kept it safe...knew it would be useful......

[Mithalwen]

and if its pistols you want .... I could try to locate a Judas pair......

[mark12_30]

Eh, Fordim? What's that?

...An apology?

....oh.

(Hefts gauntlet, and-- once again-- scratches head. Signs, returns gauntlet to Mithalwen, and bends a leery eye on the man who called Captain Faramir a dweeb.)

[Mithalwen]

*whispers* he didn't actually apologise for calling him that .....

[mark12_30]

Okay. If at first you don't succeed....

Once there was a thread that worried about the changes in the Downs as time went on. Less book-emphasis, more movie-emphasis, too many Legolusters, lowering of overall post-quality, and loss of old scholarly members due to all of the above.

Can somebody remember the thread name, originator, or some searchable text contained within so that I can find the bloody thread?

Please?

[Child of the 7th Age]

Helen,

Was this the thread in the Barrowdowns forum where one of the older members got on and said that he was leaving because of the changes in the site? Then a discussion took place about whether what he was saying was "just"?

That is the only context I can place it in. Perhaps, skimming the thread titles on the BD forum for the last two years would dredge up what you want, as I can't remember anything more than that.

Or are you thinking of something totally different?

[Child of the 7th Age]

Nothing like replying to my own post! :D

Is this it? Click here. (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?t=4701)

[mark12_30]

Magnificent thread, Child!! Not quite the one I had in mind, but-- it may end up as the one I post on. Glad you linked it here so I can find it again!

It seemed to me there was another that both you and maril had posted on. Perhaps I am off my rocker. (Well, I am, it's five hours to the North.) But I seem to remember more discussions about the flood of new members due to the movies, and the skyrocketing of content-free posts, and whether the Downs would ever be as good as it was, and is it better only different... angsty alternated with hopeful depending on the poster. And some newbies had chimed in with I was a Leggybopper once, but that was six WHOLE months ago....

Guess I'll search on Leggybopper. (shudder)

[mark12_30]

Would you believe??? Leggybopper was the key. (fanfare) :

Before and After The Movie (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?t=549) -- a thread started by one Child of the 7th Age

(You may rise and blush now, Child.)

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Congrats! Long searching has paid off. And it was in 'Books' no less!

[mark12_30]

Thanks, Hilde!

I've been pondering for several days now how the downs has changed even recently. Perusing and sorting the membership list, and missing Birdland, and Gandalf_theGrey among others, it struck me that the posters had changed, and the Downs had changed; there are forums I visit daily and forums I visit rarely; but The Downs is still a marvelous place to be. I wanted some longer perspective, and these threads help me find that. I'll ponder for a bit, I think.

But I sure do miss that morphing dolphin. :(

[Child of the 7th Age]

Oh, no.... I am red in the face. I have absolutely no memory of creating that thread or posting on it. You'd think I'd remember something!

It's funny you should say this:

Perusing and sorting the membership list, and missing Birdland, and Gandalf_theGrey among others, it struck me that the posters had changed, and the Downs had changed....

The same thought has crossed my mind. The Downs is settling into a "post-movie" phase, which does not seem to be identical to what went before or what happened during the actual release of the movies. But I guess these are thoughts for the other thread.

[mark12_30]

**rattles clubhouse door & peers thru window**

**gives a quick shove; door opens in a puff of dust to reveal rows of rockers**

Eh... how is everyone?

**wipes several dusty windows with sleeve; lowers self gratefully into rocker with another puff of dust**

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

Eh. . .what? Oy, you there! Close that dang-dern door and settle yerself down, there are some of us are trying to sleep.

Confounded whippersnappers. . .

[mark12_30]

Whippersnapper? Whippersnapper? **brandishes cane**

Say goodbye to yer nap, ye auld codger. Why, when I was yer age--

**erupts into a wheezing fit of dust induced cough. More clouds puff into the air**

You could sweep this place once in a while.

**wheeze**

[Mithalwen]

I've never snapped a whipper in my life - but they do require careful handling because of hteir fragile nature... Personally I would regard my self as far more of a:

flibbertigibbet \FLIB-ur-tee-jib-it\, noun:
A silly, flighty, or scatterbrained person, especially a pert young woman with such qualities. :D

[Ealasaide]

Howdy, howdy! Been away for awhile battling hurricanes and the like.

Welcome, Mithalwen! I don't think we've met. :)

Anything new happening with the codger set besides our usual sneezing, coughing, and cane-bashing? :D

[mark12_30]

**peers into carpetbag**

I might share my Beowulf comic book. Nice artwork. Font's too small, though.

**squints**