WW: LXXXV - The Lost Philosophers of Maiar

[Nogrod]

Melkor looked very pleased. Actually he looked very much excited. And he couldn’t restraint himself from telling the Maiar why he was on such high spirits. He just had to share his fortunes.

“Excuse me for being a bit late, but I have been busy lately. I am the ever watchful, you know. The Firstborn are here! And the Valar have no clue – but I! And they are mortal at least in a way that they can be killed! I’ve tested that… Oh the day!

And you know what? Oromë is looking for them, sure, but he’s looking for them in totally wrong places… and I’ve set lying whispers around that those captured from among the Quendi – as they call themselves – were taken by a Great Rider with a wild horse to devour them… Cunning, eh?

I’ve brought hundreds of them here into the pits of Utumno, breaking them, corrupting and enslaving them with slow arts of cruelty. They will be the backbone of my swarming armies to come! My… dorks! My Quendblins! Hmm… I need to work on their name still.

But ha! Someone of you said earlier that Ilúvatar’s plans outshine mine and that it’s his blueprint that in the end is behind everything. Now I wonder did he plan to create the firstborn only to give me an army of slaves? Think about that…”

Melkor looked triumphant.


“So how about you Loslote? I’m in such a good mood I’d be happy to grant you a quick and only freakingly anguishing death."

Lottie stared back on the mighty Melkor and opened her mouth in a subdued defiance.

"Some things are in our control and others not. Things in our control are our opinions, pursuits, desires, aversions, and, in a word, whatever are our own actions. Things not in our control are body, reputation, command, and, in one word, whatever are not our own actions.

So what others - other prisoners or you - decide is outside my control and thus nothing to me.

We are disturbed, not by things themselves, but by the thoughts which we form concerning them. Death, for instance, is not terrible, else it would have appeared so to Sally as well. But the terror consists in our notion of death that it is terrible. When therefore we are hindered, or disturbed, or grieved, let us never attribute it to others, but to ourselves; that is, to our own principles. An uninstructed person will lay the fault of his own bad condition upon others. Someone just starting instruction will lay the fault on himself. Some who is perfectly instructed will place blame neither on others nor on herself."

"Okay... stop that gibberish." Melkor said quietly. And then he vanished.

Everyone was still, just looking for what would happen.

Nothing happened.

Many had started to feel the insecure relief, when Lottie suddenly started to melt in front of their eyes: first the skin, then the revealed organs, and finally the bones. All that was left of her was a pool of rainbow-coloured liquid on the floor which in turn started slowly turning black and evaporating as it did.

Lottie had been an ordinary innocent.



The living:

Eomer of the Rohirrim - An associate of Ossë, speciality: lochs and ponds, great alliance with frogs
elronds_daughter - A spirit of no-nonsense
Macalaure - Carmótar, the Maia of housework
Shastanis Althreduin - A spirit of water
Kitanna - A spirit of all things unimaginative
wilwarin538 - Belongs to Vána, cares for all the small garden dwelling, winged creatures
Nessa Telrunya - The patron of town criers across the world
Pitchwife - Tender of Oromë's dogs
Inziladun - A vassal of Námo, serving as a warden in Mandos
Rikae - A spirit in charge of silicon & static electricity
Boromir88 - A Maia of Mandos, the interpretter of dreams
A Little Green - A spirit in charge of aliens, hummingbirds and farming
Blind Guardian -A spirit of evil ways
Skip Spence - A follower of Aule with an avid interest in behavioural sciences
Mänwe - A spirit of short acquintances
Valier - A handmaiden of Yavanna, collecting the morning dew from the petals of flowers
Legate of Amon Lanc - A Maia associated with the unfathomed depths of the world's seas but also with the waters surrounding Arda in the outer space...
Thinlómien - A maia who lives in Lórien and paints the dreams of those sleeping there
Aganzir - Aka. Firebeck, a spirit of fire
Caílin - A spirit of secrecy


The dead:

Satansaloser2005 - (Innocent) A spirit of ducks, muffins and cookies; reduced to ashes and dust on D1.
Ozban – (Innocent) Yavanna's underling with inferiority complex. Caretaker of undergrowth and small bushes in general, especially blackberries; ripped to pieces, dried and unintentionally pulverized on N2.
Kath – (Innocent) A spirit of nostalgy; ripped to pieces, dried and unintentionally pulverized on N2.
Loslote - (Innocent) A spirit of sunshine and rainbows; melted down and turned into vapor on D2.


It's Night 3 now.

Hush everyone, except those who have legal errands...

[Nogrod]

The Maiar woke up to realize that the spell was gone. But there was the tumult of war up upon them. Some flashes of lighting even penetrated the vastness of the structures above them and for seconds lighted the hall of the dungeon they had been living for the last decades. More frightening than that though was the shaking of the grounds of the mountain itself which shook the floor and sent huge pieces of rock tumbling down the darkness. They couldn’t see the boulders approaching until the very last moment, but they could hear them. And when they fell the impacts deafened their ears.

“Pull back! Pull back!” Manwë cried.

“Retreat to the corridors!” Aganzir yelled.

“Everyone to safety!” Inzil wailed.

“We’ll be free?” Nessa whispered to herself, standing like hypnotized in the middle of the Hall, until Rikae pulled her back from the hailstorm of boulders raining down on them.

Fire and brimstone indeed.

Suddenly there was a loud and deep crack, filling the air from the lowest pitches none of them could hear to the very highest over their capabilities of perception. Something above them trembled, sending a number of smaller rocks and dust on them… then everything started shaking for real. With a loud boom and then ever thickening screeches something moved on top of them in the darkness… and the voice grew ever louder. The lowest frequencies trembled them bodily from inside.

“Wait! Kitanna!” Legate cried.

“She’s there! In the hall!” Shasta spotted her too.

“Run baby, run!” wilwa begged her.

But Kitanna just stood there. Even in the dim lighting they could see the gleaming tears flowing down her cheeks as she stared at the others – but she didn’t make a move.

There was a loud and low boom somewhere over above them. The walls of the dungeon shook violently throwing the Maiar on their backs.

“I will not use the damned gift of Melkor against you! I’m not ready to kill an innocent!” They heard Kitanna yelling from the distance.

It felt like the end of the world. The roof finally collapsed and came tumbling down. Tons after tons of solid rock fell down and sent a cloud of dust of pulverized stone all over the corridor the prisoners had taken refuge in. The pressure-wave sent them flying tens of meters back in the corridor.

Gathering themselves they could hear some loud crashes and screeches from above, then there was another violent shaking of the whole mountain sending them flying around in the corridor once again. But slowly the bangs died into a deep tremor. And then it was quiet.

It was totally quiet.


~*~


Boro was not sure he was alive or not… but he was conscious. Slowly, to his short-lived relief, he managed to move his hand. I’m not dead, but is that actually better?, he thought to himself. But suddenly, exploring his body with his hand, he came to a parchment in his pocket. He forced himself up and eyed the paper.

“Hey! Everyone! Listen to this! I have the last message from Kitanna in my pocket! She must have slipped it there while I slept…”

He could hear others working their way up in the dim-lit corridor. He read the letter out aloud.

“If a spirit possessed a letter which she knew or believed contained information concerning what she had to consider the blessedness for her being, but the written characters were thin and faded, and the handwriting almost illegible, she would read it and reread it, with anxiety and disquiet certainly, but with passion. At one moment she would get one meaning out of it, the next another. When she was quite sure she had managed to read a word, she would interpret everything in the light of that word. But she would never pass beyond the same uncertainty with which she began. She would stare, more and more anxiously, but the more she stared the less she saw; sometimes her eyes filled with tears, but the more that happened, again the less she saw. In due course the writing would became weaker and less distinct; finally the paper itself would crumble away and she’d have nothing left but eyes blinded with tears.”

That kind of nailed it for everyone.


After a moment’s silence Blind Guardian finally dared to make the obvious question: “Anyone else missing?”

They all looked around. Suddenly Greenie fell on her knees to the floor and started shaking.

“Oh my, Lommy is not here…” Cailín muttered. Legate fell on his knees as well. You traitors kill the two I care about… this is getting personal... he muttered.

“I can’t see Valier either” Boro whispered.

“So their bodies have been buried down under the collapsed mountain?” elrond’s daughter asked looking at the rocky wall that now stood at the end of the corridor, in place of the hall they had retreated from..

“Well, they’re somewhere there…” Aganzir whispered, her voice breaking.

There was a pressing silence.

“So what now?” Mac asked and knew there would be no easy answer to his question.

Greenie stood up and tried to wipe her tears but it was in vain for more poured out uncontrollably. “I’ll sing to my sister” she said her voice trembling, “… and to Valier. You know the Misery song? Anyone? I’ll sing the soprano-solo.”

Eomer, Cailín, Boromir, Macalaure, Rikae, wilwa, Legate and Aganzir arranged themselves around Greenie. And they sang of their misery. They sang from the bottom of their heart’s misery. The narrow corridor echoed with heavenly voices of the Maiar. It seemed that even the dim yellowish light got a little more radiant with the song.

But as the last chord of the song died down in the corridor, it was painfully quiet again.


The living:

Eomer of the Rohirrim - An associate of Ossë, speciality: lochs and ponds, great alliance with frogs
elronds_daughter - A spirit of no-nonsense
Macalaure - Carmótar, the Maia of housework
Shastanis Althreduin - A spirit of water
wilwarin538 - Belongs to Vána, cares for all the small garden dwelling, winged creatures
Nessa Telrunya - The patron of town criers across the world
Pitchwife - Tender of Oromë's dogs
Inziladun - A vassal of Námo, serving as a warden in Mandos
Rikae - A spirit in charge of silicon & static electricity
Boromir88 - A Maia of Mandos, the interpretter of dreams
A Little Green - A spirit in charge of aliens, hummingbirds and farming
Blind Guardian -A spirit of evil ways
Skip Spence - A follower of Aule with an avid interest in behavioural sciences
Mänwe - A spirit of short acquintances
Legate of Amon Lanc - A Maia associated with the unfathomed depths of the world's seas but also with the waters surrounding Arda in the outer space...
Aganzir - Aka. irebeck, a spirit of fire
Caílin - A spirit of secrecy


The dead:

Satansaloser2005 - (Innocent) A spirit of ducks, muffins and cookies; reduced to ashes and dust on D1.
Ozban – (Innocent) Yavanna's underling with inferiority complex. Caretaker of undergrowth and small bushes in general, especially blackberries; ripped to pieces, dried and unintentionally pulverized on N2.
Kath – (Innocent) A spirit of nostalgy; ripped to pieces, dried and unintentionally pulverized on N2.
Loslote - (Innocent) A spirit of sunshine and rainbows; melted down and turned into vapor on D2.
Kitanna - (Hunter) A spirit of all things unimaginative; committed a willful suicide on N3.
Thinlómien - (innocent) A maia who lives in Lórien and paints the dreams of those sleeping there; her destiny was buried with Utumno collapsing over her body on N3.
Valier - (Innocent) A handmaiden of Yavanna, collecting the morning dew from the petals of flowers; her destiny was buried with Utumno collapsing over her body on N3.



Day 3 has begun.

[Aganzir]

Inzil what was your Legate-180 about? I kept refreshing the thread at the deadline and his vote appeared only when my clock already said it was 12:01, so he really waited till the last possible minute. I can't help wondering if both he and Nessa are actually wolves and he decided to buy them one more night with a double kill.

I am not particularly surprised about Lommy's death because almost everybody found her innocent, but Valier is more difficult. She's certainly not a no trace kill but I'm not sure if they thought she was the seer, found her too dangerous to keep alive or just wanted to frame someone.

Okay I need to go now, will be back later.

[Inziladun]

Ach, I'm sorry Lottie. I let myself be swayed at the last second by Nessa. Her defense of you looked genuine. Hats off to her if she's a wolf.

I can understand where the desire to lynch me might be present. If you feel you just can't deal with the uncertainty, or you can't find anyone else who looks worse, go for it. I rather wish you wouldn't, because it won't net you a baddie, and these double kills are fast mounting up.
I'm off work tomorrow, so I'll do my best to be as productive as possible.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

Ach, I'm sorry Lottie. I let myself be swayed at the last second by Nessa. Her defense of you looked genuine. Hats off to her if she's a wolf.

I can understand where the desire to lynch me might be present. If you feel you just can't deal with the uncertainty, or you can't find anyone else who looks worse, go for it. I rather wish you wouldn't, because it won't net you a baddie, and these double kills are fast mounting up.
I'm off work tomorrow, so I'll do my best to be as productive as possible.

Zil, after reading this (especially the underlined part - underlining mine, of course) - I cannot help to ask: Aren't you perchance the Cobbler?

Nonetheless, I really have to wait for your answer (unless it is super-fast) till morning, I really have to go to sleep...

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

Zil, after reading this (especially the underlined part - underlining mine, of course) - I cannot help to ask: Aren't you perchance the Cobbler?

Nonetheless, I really have to wait for your answer (unless it is super-fast) till morning, I really have to go to sleep...

No, I am not the Cobbler.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

No, I am not the Cobbler.

What else could you say, anyway. Okay, will be back in some later hours.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

What else could you say, anyway.

Precisely. I don't think it's likely people are going to simply take my word for it.

[Rikae]

Well, Inzil ought to to a bit better job of explaining than "swayed by Nessa" if he wants to be let off the hook. Clearly the outcome was very important to him, but he wasn't the one being lynched at the end there.

Lommy voted for him, and Valier suspected him. Continued framing attempt? It's pretty extreme, for that. Double bluff? The way the lynch went yesterDay, it would seem at least one of Nessa or Inzil has to be a wolf, or at least at the time I was thinking "there wouldn't be these many waiting until the last minute unless a wolf was on the line". Still, I suppose it's always possible that the wolves are trying to push the predictable lynch of Inzil because they can (rather than because Nessa is a wolf); and, on the other hand, I don't like his passive response at all. It doesn't strike me as innocentish, certainly not framed-innocentish.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Rikae

Well, Inzil ought to to a bit better job of explaining than "swayed by Nessa" if he wants to be let off the hook. Clearly the outcome was very important to him, but he wasn't the one being lynched at the end there.

The outcome was important because I wanted to make the right choice. If Nessa hadn't chimed in when she did I would have gone with her.

Originally Posted by Rikae

Still, I suppose it's always possible that the wolves are trying to push the predictable lynch of Inzil because they can (rather than because Nessa is a wolf); and, on the other hand, I don't like his passive response at all. It doesn't strike me as innocentish, certainly not framed-innocentish.

You know, since I've been suspected by some from the start, and that last vote wasn't exactly a shining example of my innocence, I was feeling fairly confident I'd be a main target toDay. Like I said, I'm not going to merely fade away, but I'm resigned to the fact that this Day could be my last.

[Macalaure]

A look at the votes first.

Nessa -> Rikae (no solid reason - needs to contribute more, or eventually she'll wind up lynched)
BG -> Nessa (didn't contribute much either, but avoided the spotlight so far)
Loslote -> Kitanna
skip -> e_d (not happy with him. One I'd like to look at closer toDay)
Eomer -> Nessa(2) (not too happy with him either, but I recall that I'm always worried about him, so unless he worries me a lot, I'll let him be)
Shasta -> Lottie (I should have a closer look at his case before I pass judgement)
Pitch -> Nessa(3) (confused about him - definitely need a closer look)
Valier -> Skip
Greenie -> Inzil (not sure, not sure)
Rikae -> Lottie(2), then Inzil (3) (I don't see why wolf-Rikae would have done this; Inzil's guilt would clear her)
Lommy -> Inzil(2)
Cailín -> Lottie(2) (she thought she gave Lottie her third vote, not sure what to think of her at this point)
Mac -> Lottie(3) (I was getting worried about all the people thinking I'm innocent - sometimes giving a crucial vote for an innocent pays off )
e_d -> Lottie (4) (don't know what to think at all)
Aganzir -> Nessa (4) (alright)
Legate -> Nessa(5) (alright)
Inzil -> Lottie(5) (Nessa=wolf => Inzil=bad)

Nessa's guilt would more or less clear all her voters. She was an unlikely wolf-on-wolf victim, since a bandwaggon against her was very probable from the beginning on.

Back later with thoughts about the killed and what I said above.

[Rikae]

Ok, so I double posted because of something weird going on with the site - sorry about that. Anyway:

Inzil, how does making the right choice necessitate waiting until the very last second? Also, what is "Legate 180" supposed to mean?

At any rate, it makes perfect sense IF the wolves thought Inzil was seer-dreamed to go after the possible seer(s) and sacrifice him toDay to save the rest. So it may indeed be in our best interests to go with the obvious choice, but I, for one, intend to take a close look at everyone I can.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Rikae

Inzil, how does making the right choice necessitate waiting until the very last second? Also, what is "Legate 180" supposed to mean?

Initially, I was waiting around to see if I would get any more votes, and vote to save myself accordingly. The "Legate 180" referred to my sudden opinion change.

Originally Posted by Rikae

At any rate, it makes perfect sense IF the wolves thought Inzil was seer-dreamed to go after the possible seer(s) and sacrifice him toDay to save the rest. So it may indeed be in our best interests to go with the obvious choice, but I, for one, intend to take a close look at everyone I can.

I think I'd be a likely Seer-dream, but it doesn't concern me.

[Rikae]

Well, Inzil ought to to a bit better job of explaining than "swayed by Nessa" if he wants to be let off the hook. Clearly the outcome was very important to him, but he wasn't the one being lynched at the end there.

Lommy voted for him, and Valier suspected him. Continued framing attempt? It's pretty extreme, for that. Double bluff? The way the lynch went yesterDay, it would seem at least one of Nessa or Inzil has to be a wolf, or at least at the time I was thinking "there wouldn't be these many waiting until the last minute unless a wolf was on the line". Still, I suppose it's always possible that the wolves are trying to push the predictable lynch of Inzil because they can (rather than because Nessa is a wolf); and, on the other hand, I don't like his passive response at all. It doesn't strike me as innocentish, certainly not framed-innocentish.

[Pitchwife]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

Ach, I'm sorry Lottie. I let myself be swayed at the last second by Nessa. Her defense of you looked genuine. Hats off to her if she's a wolf.

Er, pardon? You think Nessa's defense of Lottie was genuine, and this prompts you to vote the one she defended? Does not compute.

Originally Posted by Inziladun

I can understand where the desire to lynch me might be present. If you feel you just can't deal with the uncertainty, or you can't find anyone else who looks worse, go for it. I rather wish you wouldn't, because it won't net you a baddie, and these double kills are fast mounting up.

If you're indeed innocent, I don't think it would be such a terribly bright idea to lynch you just to know for sure, for precisely the reason you mention. Just saying.

In other news, I'm beginning to have second thoughts about Nessa. I mean, it all fits - two innocents lynched to save her two Days in a row, with a Night-kill pointing to her sandwiched between them - but isn't it all a bit obvious? And I've got to admit that her last minute defense of Lottie, at a time when it looked like she'd most likely be lynched, is a point in her favour.

Anyway, I feel I've been concentrating on her a bit too exclusively and need to have a look at some other people - after some hours of sleep. See ya.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

Er, pardon? You think Nessa's defense of Lottie was genuine, and this prompts you to vote the one she defended? Does not compute.

According to the standings at the time, Nessa had five votes, Lottie had four. When Nessa came back at the last second, I acted on a gut feeling and decided to save her by voting Lottie. As I'd said, I didn't really want to vote for Lottie, but if I hadn't Nessa would have been killed. If she turns out to be a wolf, I was fooled, plain and simple.

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

In other news, I'm beginning to have second thoughts about Nessa. I mean, it all fits - two innocents lynched to save her two Days in a row, with a Night-kill pointing to her sandwiched between them - but isn't it all a bit obvious? And I've got to admit that her last minute defense of Lottie, at a time when it looked like she'd most likely be lynched, is a point in her favour.

I'd like Nessa to explain her vote for Rikae a bit more, myself.

Also, I think it's ironic that it's being considered that Nessa and I are packmates, when the first thing people really started suspecting me for was my criticism of her "numbers" post.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Okay, how should I put this: I am not that sad about the two deaths toNight, because it has eliminated two people I have been rather unsure about. Which sort of clears the field.

Nonetheless, I think it is about time for us to get a Wolf. The village is getting smaller, too small for four Wolves AND two kills per Night. Also, the fact that even the Cobbler is still around makes me rather nervous.

So... what about those of my suspects, then, who are still alive. Skip, Boro, Rikae? Nessa, who escaped the gallows yesterDay, and what about again Zil, her gallant savior? And who knows about Pitchwife? Or what about all the quieter folk? Don't we have a team, after all, which is made only out of them? (Something like Greenie-Mänwe-LRH-Cailín/Nessa/BG or something... would actually make a lot of sense, especially in relation to the first Night awkward kills. Maybe if I scratch Greenie from that and make it one of the five, it would make the most sense, as there is a slight chance Greenie would not like to kill Ozban or Kath.)

I guess I will just leave now - I am actually feeling quite tired and sleepy; I would like to look at and consider why Lommy and Val have been targeted. I am not really in the mood right now, though, I will do it in the morning - I am sure meanwhile somebody else will look at it too, but still. In any case, it will be also interesting to read what other people think.

EDIT: x-ed with Agan and Zil

[Mänwe]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

Or what about all the quieter folk? Don't we have a team, after all, which is made only out of them? (Something like Greenie-Mänwe-LRH-Cailín/Nessa/BG or something... would actually make a lot of sense, especially in relation to the first Night awkward kills.

Quieter folk are the easiest to tarnish with the same brush and leave the greater possibility for a judgement error on behalf of their would be jurors. Although I would concede the more quiet the less likely you are to say something that'll give you away. But this reminds me of something Rikae mentioned that irked me a little

Originally Posted by Rikae

...but if we lynch a good quiet one, at least the remaining innocents will be the more helpful ones, alive or wolf-killed

I don't see how some of the most talkative ones can be considered more helpful due to the possibility that every word they say is designed to mislead or indeed because they write so long a post people don't want to read it

Quiet can't be so black or white, for in those names that Legate mentioned there are those who have made the odd post, and those that have popped in to vote; two very different quiet "strategies" if you will...elronds_daughter being case in point with two very wild votes.

Also, Legate

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

Maybe if I scratch Greenie from that and make it one of the five, it would make the most sense, as there is a slight chance Greenie would not like to kill Ozban or Kath.)

May I ask you to clarify this point about Greenie not wanting to vote Oz or Kath?

Maybe more questions ought to be asked of the two extremes, those who just pop into vote and those who do the most talking..

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Mänwe

I don't see how some of the most talkative ones can be considered more helpful due to the possibility that every word they say is designed to mislead or indeed because they write so long a post people don't want to read it

I don't mean "helpful" in the sense of actually actively doing things to help, although, of course, the louder people tend to do more of that as well, but "helpful" because we actually have something to go on. As you said, quiet people leave a greater possibility for judgment error. If I'm going to be left alive as one of three on the last Day (as seems to happen to me a lot, but I mean this in the case of anyone), I don't want to be left with two quiet players to choose between! I want plenty of evidence through which to sift, and we're all better off on any day when we have that.

If' you're going to start "TLDNR"ing, we might as well just quit. It defeats the whole purpose of WW.

Originally Posted by Inzil

Initially, I was waiting around to see if I would get any more votes, and vote to save myself accordingly. The "Legate 180" referred to my sudden opinion change.

Maybe I missed something. Is "Legate 180" a common expression these days?

Originally Posted by Pitch

Er, pardon? You think Nessa's defense of Lottie was genuine, and this prompts you to vote the one she defended? Does not compute.

My first thought on this was "good catch", and my second thought was "wait a minute. Nessa could very well genuinely defend someone and be totally wrong about them."

If I were a Pitchwolf, I'd back off Nessa now, too, if she were innocent.

Edit: X'd with Zil.

[Rikae]

I guess this is the defense of Lottie that rang with such sincerity:

Originally Posted by Nessa

But, Lottie, I don't understand. It just seems like a convenient bandwagon.

*shrug* I don't really see it. It makes sense for a wolf to proclaim the innocence of an ordo about to be lynched. Now, if she was aware that her fate was in Inzil's hands, that would be extremely selfless, weirdly so even for an innocent, but if I recall correctly, there were a few non-voters.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Rikae

Maybe I missed something. Is "Legate 180" a common expression these days?

As a matter of fact, it's in the official glossary.

Originally Posted by Rikae

My first thought on this was "good catch", and my second thought was "wait a minute. Nessa could very well genuinely defend someone and be totally wrong about them."

Which is how I saw it.

Originally Posted by Rikae

I guess this is the defense of Lottie that rang with such sincerity:


*shrug* I don't really see it. It makes sense for a wolf to proclaim the innocence of an ordo about to be lynched. Now, if she was aware that her fate was in Inzil's hands, that would be extremely selfless, weirdly so even for an innocent, but if I recall correctly, there were a few non-voters.

Well, I don't claim that it was a smart move on my part.

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Rikae

Maybe I missed something. Is "Legate 180" a common expression these days?

More or less, yes.

I think I was in the game myself and it had to do something with Legate changing his opinion into the opposite.. and there were some drastic consequences if I recall it right.

Someone else with better memory might be able to fill you up.

But yes, I'd say it means changing your view on some issue to the opposite nowadays...

[Mänwe]

Originally Posted by Rikae

I don't mean "helpful" in the sense of actually actively doing things to help, although, of course, the louder people tend to do more of that as well, but "helpful" because we actually have something to go on...If I'm going to be left alive as one of three on the last Day (as seems to happen to me a lot, but I mean this in the case of anyone), I don't want to be left with two quiet players to choose between! I want plenty of evidence through which to sift, and we're all better off on any day when we have that.

Point noted.

Now, i'm off to sleep before work tomorrow.

[Nessa Telrunya]

Okay, to explain my suspicion of Rikae, I was very weirded out by how convenient it would be for a wolf for so much conversation to come of her post about Pitch. And most of it was about him, as well, taking the blame far away from her innocent-seeming phrasing.

But after a few Days have passed, and more substantial information is appearing...

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

Okay, how should I put this: I am not that sad about the two deaths toNight, because it has eliminated two people I have been rather unsure about. Which sort of clears the field.

This really gives me a strange feeling. That's an odd thing to say after losing the Hunter and two ordos in one go.

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Nessa Telrunya

Okay, to explain my suspicion of Rikae, I was very weirded out by how convenient it would be for a wolf for so much conversation to come of her post about Pitch. And most of it was about him, as well, taking the blame far away from her innocent-seeming phrasing.

I'm a decent player, but I don't actually have the ability to control the whole village. That conversation about/suspicion of Pitch was just what had me placing him in a slightly more innocent category (looked like wolves were after him).

Originally Posted by Nessa

This really gives me a strange feeling. That's an odd thing to say after losing the Hunter and two ordos in one go.

You know, on the one hand, it looks like something no wolf would dare say. And, on the other hand, it looks like something a wolf would say, knowing no wolf would be expected to dare.

[Rikae]

You know what's funny? I suspect everyone else that has posted so far (and where is everyone else? We're three hours in!) except Mac.
Perhaps I should suspect him as well.

Mac, why are you sitting over there looking so suspicious? Oh yeah, the goatee. Explain it!

There, my obligatory wolf on wolf... er, I mean...

[Nessa Telrunya]

Originally Posted by Rikae

You know what's funny? I suspect everyone else that has posted so far (and where is everyone else? We're three hours in!) except Mac.
Perhaps I should suspect him as well.

Mac, why are you sitting over there looking so suspicious? Oh yeah, the goatee. Explain it!

There, my obligatory wolf on wolf... er, I mean...

Perhaps everyone has weekendy things to attend to? I myself am more able to post, precisely because it is the weekend.

Goatees are only incriminating on females, not so sure about Mac.

[Macalaure]

I need to clear my head about him.

Pitchwife

Day 1

#15

Well, the wolves obviously know more than we do, but the cobbler not so much, as of now - so xe will indeed probably want to make xyrself known to the pack in time.

Hint to the cobbler?

Yep, the double Night-Kill sucks for us, and getting rid of it is imperative. I'm not sure if I'd like to risk the Seer for it - as long as the Ranger is still alive, maybe it's worth it.

Very carefully pushing the idea that the seer should reveal after the first dreamt wolf.

#22 - defends Cailín's early vote.

#27 - asks Sally and Rikae regarding their suspicion, understandably.

Early Day1 in general - much role/rule talk, but a few actual points, so that's good - his tone is oddly relaxed though, but maybe that's just him. He looks pretty well for the rest of the day until voting time

He clears his mind in #110, but then the next few posts are just chat, like he's killing time for an opportune moment to cast the vote. (1h time between #110 and his vote in #132, with a few meaningless posts in between.) Usually an innocent would use the time to make up their mind some more.

His vote makes sense considering what he said before (with me and e_d in the running other than Nessa), but why the unproductive waiting period?


Day 2

Starts out using Ozban's death to go after Nessa more (all of #183). This looks like it could have been planned. His second post is about Kath, but he finds nothing of note. Goes after Inzil a bit.

#189 implies that he thinks the Sally-waggon was innocently fueled, which is odd, since it overtook the waggon he himself fueled. It's uncommon to clear an opposing bandwaggon of suspicion, especially without much reasons. Attempt not to ruffle innocent feathers?

#262 - his q&a for me looks innocent.

#275

I still don't think Zil looks particularly wolvish (and I think suspecting him because his first post was made too quickly is rather flimsy)

This might be nitpicky, but I don't like the "still" here. I understand why one might step away from Inzil based on flimsy reasons, but he sounds defensive here, without any reason.

Inzil was the only person other than Nessa he brought forth any reasons against. This fits with the "not ruffling innocent feathers". He predictably votes for Nessa again.


Day 3

#333 today he backs away from Nessa and instead goes after Inzil again. Not much variation.


I can't condemn him - there are too many stretches where he looks rather innocent. However, I think there are some points which paint a dark picture.