T-I-G LVI: Panic at the Prancing Pony

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Rikae

No she wouldn't. Not when she was already making suicidal, obviously evil moves like the one she made yesterDay.

Voting Durelin out of the blue, you mean?

Originally Posted by Rikae

Not to mention Nog's death proves that it was possible for an ordo to be that mistaken, casting the whole bandwagon in a better light.

But no one never assumes a whole bandwagon to be evil. And if such a "better light" kill was to be made, why Nogrod? I think he would have got a bigger share of the spotlight than any of the others...

Originally Posted by Rikae

The most a living Nog would have done is offered a runner-up to Fea in lynchability, and he had a built-in excuse (Lommy's comment about drinking too much wine).

I doubt it would have worked... he would not have used it as an excuse himself, and I can tell you he did not drink that much (at least by the time I went to sleep ).

Originally Posted by Mac

Glad to amuse you, Lommy. I'm sure it will amuse you even more that I'm now more suspicious of her again.

Well now you baffle me.

[Rikae]

A look at the shady-she-penguin:


Post #41:


Looks very calculated, and caught my eye right off the bat. Summery: Setup looks good for the villagers, that's dangerous because we might be careless, so let's stop the banter and get serious, here, “maybe I'll start about that”: banterers are cobblerish, at least make some “useless and obvious “discussion of setting and roles instead.


So easy,calculated and safe.


#81 (I see Lommy also is a victim of the curse of always starting new pages !)


Lots of fluff about typos, horoscopes, “xe”, etc. Iffy suspicions toward Agan (mix of wolfish and innocent self), wishy-washy statement about Fea (“I quite like Fea's tactics...but it does also look like a terribly convenient way of wolfing around”). Niceness to newbies.


Lommy's still playing it very safe. I can't really judge her suspicion toward Agan, since it's based on knowing her really well. I suppose no one can really judge that suspicion, and it's unlikely to attract attention, making it quite a safe one.


Post #88


Calls Agan's question (about what weird stuff she says) “nit-picking dictatorship”. Kind of an odd reaction – has a bit of a wolf-on-wolf feel to it. Claims Ferny is no great threat and we shouldn't worry about him, insinuates Agan is Ferny for suggesting he is. A very sinister paragraph, as I pointed out earlier. Says pointing out Frodo-ish behavior helps the wolves (also misleading). Some defensive looking statements (“this looks suspiciously like a case”). Still, the way she goes after Agan – in two posts, first “weird stuff”, then elaborating, looks somewhat innocentish.


Post 91 – the “this end” phrasing in Mac's post. Honest mistake, I suppose, but could also be an honest-evil-mistake (looking for an easy lynch. She's been very focused on finding wolf-slips in this game).

- several short responses to people, nothing really noteworthy -


Votes for Agan, saying she's probably Bill or Frodo. I, unlike others, don't find this especially suspicious.


Conclusion for Day1: slightly suspicious, but not extremely so.


I'll have to finish this later – I'm holding a hungry baby.

[Meneltarmacil]

Fea seems to hover between being helpful and being mysterious in my book. Day 1 was a strange one for her, as she said she'd look at Sally but then switched to Brinn, whom she strongly suspected but gave no reason for suspecting.

Her role in starting the Durelin bandwagon is also suspicious. That one came out of nowhere, and led to an innocent dying. I'd be wary of Fea, myself.

[A Little Green]

Originally Posted by Mac

I never understood it and still don't: why is it suspicious to make statements of the kind "if I was a wolf"?

Also, I might slip once as a wolf, but not three or four times. Seriously. And if I did, I'd be acting much more nervous by now.

It isn't - I was merely amused by the fact that following the logic of your post the one behind Noggie's death would actually be you. Nevertheless it was not a serious point against you and I hope you didn't take it as such. (Though I admit to some reaction-fishing... Result: I'm none the wiser.)

Originally Posted by Leggy

LG. Post 247: Is it so that there is nobody you actually suspect? Except for Sally, most people are either not alarming, or she has no idea about them.

In a nutshell, yes. (And actually, that "except for Sally" is a bit useless since I have no idea about her either... ) I'm inclined to vote either Lari or Fea toDay. I can't make out how Fea's behaviour would benefit an innocent villager, and as for Lari, apart from her first reply to my suspicion of her she gives me the vibe of a nervous somewhat-new wolf. Dunno.

I'll vote in a minute, I'm afraid - got to go to sleep and let Lommy post and study and all that...


EDIT: x-ed with Mira and Rikae

[Lariren Shadow]

So I just wanted to point out to everyone who thinks that the Seer dreamed of Fea and she was reveled as Ferny, that that isn't possible. The Seer could dream of Ferny all xe wanted, but it would come back as an ordo.

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Lariren Shadow

So I just wanted to point out to everyone who thinks that the Seer dreamed of Fea and she was reveled as Ferny, that that isn't possible. The Seer could dream of Ferny all xe wanted, but it would come back as an ordo.

All I meant to say (maybe I said it wrong) is that if Fea is a wraith, she probably expects that the seer knows and considers herself done for anyway.

But then, you know how she plays as a baddie - you were a wolf with her just one game ago. If you were a wolf this time, you would know better than to defend her... hmm...?

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Lommy: Starts of with sugesting that Nogrod was killed because of possible Ranger suspicions, which I think could be correct. I don’t understand however why my vote was fatalist, what does fatalism (determinism) have to do with it? She mentions being uneasy about Sally.
In 437 she mentions having lynching Fea as a backup plan, which is a very weird suggestion, but not nesisarily a wraith suggestion.

All in all I think Lommy looks very innocent and I will move on to look at Sally, a person I had forgotten all about until I looked through Lommy’s posts.

Sally: I am really torn about Sally. . . She hardly said anything yesterday due to babysitting and such and today she has not been active at all. It is very hard to judge people on day 1 alone and she has not contributed with anything of substance since. Sally is normally a person that you notice, so when you hear hardly anything from her, you get the feeling that she is up to no good.

Mac: Starts the day of with a long post about what happened in the ending of Day 2, although not objective it gives a fairly desent overview of things. Then he makes that ridicules case against me and Fea. It does not make sense that he discards me as seer, because he doubt the seer would be so obvious, but thinks it plausible that I would be so obvious as a wraith. He uses my own words against me, which is always a good tactic, but basicly it seems like an easy case that might catch on. . . Then he makes his post about the reasons to kill Nogrod, he concludes that neither Aganzir nor Fea would kill him. Then he have 2 posts of comments which actually comes of as rather innocent. I am slightly worried about Mac and in lack of other candidates could vote for him, but I see no smoking gun yet.

Aganzir: Starts today of with a rant about Lommy, which makes you wonder. I don’t get why Lommy must not compare her to how she have played in other games, that is often a good way to find wraiths. It could that Aganzir is just general annoyed and innocent, but it can also be frustrating to be a wraith and get accused on (according to your self) “false” reasons. Anyways it is not a really incriminating post, but one that draws attention and maybe put together with other posts can give a good impression of Aganzirs role.
I think Aganzir’s post 474 seem very innocent, I cannot really explain why. . .I guess she just seems genuine and her responses do not seem like they are fabricated.


I might look at a few others like Rikae. . .but I don't know if I have the energy.

[Lariren Shadow]

Originally Posted by Rikae

But then, you know how she plays as a baddie - you were a wolf with her just one game ago. If you were a wolf this time, you would know better than to defend her... hmm...?

Yes I did, and I'm not a baddie in this game.

And I like your new signature.

[Lariren Shadow]

Mac: Why would I be happy to lynch Fea today? Same reason you would be, to not die. There is a high probability it will come down to her and me today and, well, I'd vote her to save myself.

As for my suspcions: you(Mac) are high up on my list. Actually, it's you and Rune. It's not an attack, but you're posts don't read right to me.

As for Rune, well I know my vote was not meant to be part of a bandwagon. At least not intentionally. Rune's, on the other hand, was part of it. I just don't like it.

And Rikae, I hope you're taking a very good look at my posts.

[A Little Green]

I'll vote

++ Fea

because, like I just said, I see no way how what she has done would benefit an innocent villager in any way. First the Dury thing, and then toDay pretty much all the discussion has been revolving around her. If she's innocent, she's acting very weirdly - she hasn't indicated to even trying to turn the discussion elsewhere even though, if innocent, she would know the village is wasting its energy on talking about someone who doesn't need to be talked about. Stinks of cobblery to me.


EDIT: x-ed with Lari

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

IN THE PRESENT TIMES!!!

Fast, so that I don't x-post with too many. I may look more closely at the last few ones once more as soon as I post this, I just more or less skimmed through them.


Reading through the beginning of toDay: I am glad people think the same as I do...

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

Oh, crap it all. I know. I bet the wolves were thinking something like: "Why is Nogrod making such an issue about Dury's ranger impersonation? Maybe because... he's the real ranger!" I think that'd make a lot of sense. More sense than any other explanation I'm coming up with at the moment. (His posts are not seerish, he would not actually make a good no-trace kill etc.)

That's what I thought and still think.

Originally Posted by Rikae

Well, well, well.

YesterDay at deadline, I thought only one of two things could be happening: either I'd found myself (again) in a village consisting mostly of cobblers, or a lot of people were once again IM'ing while werewolfing, doubtless with alcohol involved. On second thought, though, I suppose it's just a matter of one wine-drinking, sleep deprived Noggins, one Mac who didn't wish to die, one cobbler ready to get herself lynched, and a couple of newbies without enough experience to recognize the insanity of it all (except Berry).

And that's also more or less what I thought.

Once again: Fea is a Cobbler. Mac is likely a Wolf. Do not listen to anything Fea says. That would be the best for us all, I am sure.

Beregond voting Mac makes a good impression on me, likewise his first post toDay.

Originally Posted by Nerwen

I agree Fea seems very unlikely to have the village's best interests at heart. How can you be sure she's the cobbler rather than a wraith, though? I'd guess it took more than one baddie to make that lynch happen.

Of course. It took one Macwraith and one Cobbler-Fea.

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

Taking part in a joke discussion several hours later and without even having anything witty to say? If these carrot-potato things are supposed to be taken as hints, I'd be eyeing Rune very carefully...

I hardly think it had anything to do with hints. He simply commented on that because he liked that when he saw that. And, who knows how many bottles of window cleaning liquid had he had prior to that...

Some Mira and Lari could have been voting to "save Fea" because of RL friendship, however silly that is, I think. (That does not mean they are innocent, though.) The two of them have been slipping under my radar a lot (of course. They post far from often or long, and I have never played with them before), but I actually think a Wraith might be hiding there. I need to look at their votes for Dury yesterDay once more.

Originally Posted by Nerwen

If Durelin had turned out to be a wolf... er, wraith, I'd have called that the worst slip ever. As it is, I don't know what she meant.

It's obvious what she meant. She was a Cobbler, not sure who is the Wraith and who not. Maybe she thought she's lynching a Wolf, maybe not. In any case, this is a clear signal.

I like Nerwen's analysis of the voting process, I have to agree with it. (I just hope Nerwen is not a clever wolf who had prepared grounds for that... but I am pretty certain there is at least one Wolf among these Dury-voters, or maybe likely two - Mac and somebody else, either Lari or Mira, most probably.)

I don't like Lari's posting: seeming fishy to me in some way.

Originally Posted by Macalaure

Fea looks a bit like an evil mastermind. She puts the bandwaggon on its rails and does not hesitate about it one second, despite very questionable grounds.
Mirandir and Lari - synchronised werewolfing? They both make a list shortly before things get rolling, and neither suspects Durelin. They both defend Fea, they both change their minds on Durelin, they both make a very similar vote post. It is inconceivable that this was planned, so not both of them are wraiths. A wraith-cobbler combo is possible. Newbieness exonerates Mirandir a little, but Lari gets no such bonus anymore.
Rune's desire to save Fea is out of proportion. Mirandir and Lari are her RL friends, so it's more understandable. I thought that maybe Rune was the seer and dreamt of Fea, but no way would a seer risk himself when his innocent dream is not challenged seriously, which Fea wasn't. Also, if he wanted to save Fea, why go after Durelin? Even if he knew about Fea's innocence, he must've realised that the reasons against Durelin were ridiculous. I remember that he stated something about "experienced players should know better". He is more than experienced enough to know that you lynch the people who act suspicious, not the people who act weird. Stupid lynches like that happen way to often. I suspect that Rune and Fea are companions.
Rikae and especially Brinn take the role of the voice of reason. I believe they are innocent. They could be smart wraiths, but for now, I don't think so.

And what Mac says is just baaad. I mean, he not even mentions the chance of Fea being a Cobbler (that could cause people who suspect her thinking: she's a Wraith, and thus, lynch her - giving the Wraiths one more free day in exchange for this little sacrifice), instead he throws one more possible Cobbler in front of us (to confuse us, likely?), what more, he tries to pair her up with Rune, who looks innocent to me (cf. above). This way, he possibly hopes to widen the losses: they are BOTH baddies, let's get rid of her AND him after that, as well!

Originally Posted by Lariren Shadow

Now if we were to try to lynch Fea toDay, I'd be more for it than anyone else(unless maybe Mac or Rikae because, well, Mac has been sort of saved twice now and some of Rikae's posts are making me wonder).

But we don't want to lynch her: We want to lynch a Wolf. And Fea is most likely a Cobbler. Of course, it's good to get rid of her, but even better is to just stop paying attention to her at all, and find and lynch the Wolves.

I see Mac has again been posting lists and candidates for why Nog was killed, good, nice, but again: offering questions and options does not really help, quite the opposite. It creates confusion in the village, people disperd, which is just what the Wolves need.

Originally Posted by Lariren Shadow

So what I was thinking was this: I have nothing much else to go on. Then I refreshed the page a lot. Right before Fea had poster her vote I had pretty much made up my mind to vote for Durelin. I had no other good suspects. Durelin was the best option at the time for me, I don't know why, maybe my mind at almost 1 AM is not the best thing. Ergo I decided to vote for her. Rune then jumped in while I was refreshing the mad posting so it looked like I was listening to him.

Think I’m suspicious all you want, but I also voted Durelin on Day 1 for the same reasons. I don’t know if that makes me stupid or what.

Lari's vote for Dury is something I like not, and her explanation is something I won't buy easily. She could have wholly made that up. However, the fact that she voted Dury both Days speaks in her favour: that would be quite some luck. Unless... maybe I will re-read the voting again once more.

Originally Posted by Lariren Shadow

Mac: Two options I see: Fea is innocent and set up by the wolves/wraiths to be lynched by us. Possiblity. Second option she is guilty, decided that to throw suspicion away from other wolves/wraiths she should sacrifice herself and be lynched.

And you don't mention the possibility of Fea being the Cobbler. Which is what I think she is.

Originally Posted by Lariren Shadow

So I just wanted to point out to everyone who thinks that the Seer dreamed of Fea and she was reveled as Ferny, that that isn't possible. The Seer could dream of Ferny all xe wanted, but it would come back as an ordo.

Okay, did anybody say they think that (like I say, I just skimmed through the last few posts, so I may have missed that), or if not, why are you saying that?

[Lariren Shadow]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

Okay, did anybody say they think that (like I say, I just skimmed through the last few posts, so I may have missed that), or if not, why are you saying that?

I saw a bunch of people say "seer-dreamed" and "Fea seer-dreamed cobbler/Ferny". It seemed to be a trend. I thought I would point it out.

[Lariren Shadow]

Clearly I need to read more throw posts before just jumping to the end. And not watch and movie and try to read for my history of England class at the same time as WW, therefore:

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

And you don't mention the possibility of Fea being the Cobbler. Which is what I think she is.

I don't mention her being the possible Cobbler because, the way I see this game, there is no Cobbler. Ferny is an Informer. Ferny doesn't get to know the role of the person they tell the wraiths/wolves to lynch. While I don't think xe is on our side, I don't see the connection between a Cobbler, who gets to know what role the person they spy on is plus is clearly on the side of the wolves/wraiths and Ferny, the Informer, who gets to pick one person they think the wolves/wraiths should kill each night, but don't get to know the role of the chosen player. To me at least, they are entirly different roles.

I said it before, Ferny may be on the wolves/wraiths side, but could easily be a thorn in their side.

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Rikae

Says pointing out Frodo-ish behavior helps the wolves (also misleading).

What's misleading about that?

Originally Posted by Legate

The way Beregond reacted to this joke of Rikae's (her saying that she is the seer) - I don't like it. A newbie could ask if it was a joke, yes, why not, but the way he ends up thinking about it seriously... still, he is a newbie.
But what more, Fea was feeding it. She is obviously desperately trying to make the Wolves know she is on their side. Because otherwise, I cannot imagine HER - an experienced player - getting confused by somebody like Beregond (read: a newbie No offense, Beregond) and actually questioning this obvious joke! And I do not even stop to think that Fea could even consider this a serious revelation. Come on.

But I was wondering if I should take Rikae seriously, or not. So I don't think being unsure there is suspicious. Or newbieish.

Originally Posted by Greenie

If she's innocent, she's acting very weirdly - she hasn't indicated to even trying to turn the discussion elsewhere even though, if innocent, she would know the village is wasting its energy on talking about someone who doesn't need to be talked about. Stinks of cobblery to me.

Oh, now that is a good point. Indeed. But I still think I'd rather vote a possible wolf than Fea who is only a probable Ferny. But I won't be terribly disappointed if you others lynch her, especially if she's Ferny and not just a general walking cloud of confusion.

*off to analyse sally*


edit: xed with Rune, Legate and Lari

[Thinlómien]

Her first several posts are just bantering. That doesn't point to anything.

In her first actual post, she does not suspect anyone, just makes a list of people that looks like a list of suspects, but is in fact a list of people she has general or historical reasons not to trust. I don't like that. Most of her reasons not to vote for people are that way too, only two are related to the actual game. It's easier for a wolf to make lists if she can hide behind general arguments and doesn't have to make anything out of the actual game that's going on.

When she wonders who to vote and narrows it down to those who already have votes, she ends up looking really fishy because she ends up saying she could vote almost everyone. Looks like a wolf who doesn't know which chance she's going to seize yet. (And if she's a wolf, I'd be looking at Brinn since this all to wolf-on-wolfy...

Originally Posted by sally

Brinn: Could be. Very well could be. But her suspiciousness (if that's even a word) could just be stress since she says she's been having a rough day or two. Perhaps we should give her the benefit for toDay? We'll see.

That flipflopping and especially that "perhaps we should give her the benefit of doubt" and then "we'll see" to soften it - it looks like she does not want Brinn to get lynched but will vote her to look better if necessary.)

She votes Mac because does not want to vote Brinn or me. That's okay by my standards.

Day2 then? Joking and making the vote tally at first - so nothing of importance, either way.

And then this

Originally Posted by sally

So, without reading toDay in great detail, I was really concerned by yesterDay's voting of Gollum. Now while Mac was trying to save himself, upon looking it over again I think it was more of an innocent Mac trying to save himself while the wraiths took advantage of it.

which has been already pointed out as weird by many.

And then RL took her away... and she only returned to make a baffled comment about the Dury-lynch. And we haven't heard of her toDay yet.

I think she looks quite bad. She deserves a lot more spotlight than has been given, and I'm inclined to vote her toDay.


edit: xed with everybody since my last post