WW: LXXXV - The Lost Philosophers of Maiar

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by skip spence

This is a question to Nogrod. If Kit is "modfired" will she simply disappear from the game of can she still perform her function as a hunter? Maybe just removing her is the best solution in either case?

Anyone who doesn't post & vote in two Days in a row is removed by modfire after the fact. That is the only rule on modfires. (Although there sure is a principle of charity involved if someone fex. posts a lot and is actively in the game but because of force majeure -reasons or unhappy coincidences is unable to vote in two Days in a row)

Another way to exit the game without getting lynched or killed during the Night is to tell the mod one is withdrawing from the game. In that situation the player is removed in the next suitable narration.

Kit told me she would have to withdraw from the game, but I'll try to get a confirmation from her on the issue of which exact way she'd want to go.


ADD: She is in the game toDay anyway.

[skip spence]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

...she is in the game toDay anyway.

Okay. So if we don't lynch her today, and she sticks to her word, she'll get mod-fired and quietly leaves the game two Days from now. And if we lynch her today she'll take one player with her, for good or bad. Like a said before, think I'd prefer the former alternative. More fun if anything else.

Should return soonish with some thought on the voting toDay and yesterDay.

[skip spence]

Actually I've a statement to make:

I am the real hunter.










EDIT: How's that for post 1000?

[Inziladun]

Really, skip? So what does that mean: Kit's trying to get us to waste a lynch on her, instead of getting modfired? I'm not sure that I buy it. How about we lynch you, and you then hunt Kit? That would take care of the question.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by skip spence

Actually I've a statement to make:

I am the real hunter.

Okay, so here goes? Well... actually, it makes a lot more sense now. (Originally, I was tempted to also write into my previous post the quote of you saying that we should just leave Kitanna be, which at that time seemed like undermining the Hunter's work and making sure she does not get a chance to hit...)

But now I can't see you saying that you are the Hunter if you are a Wolf, that would be suicide. And aside from that, after Kit is modfired, if it turns out she was the Hunter, we'll know that we can lynch you. So I trust you now. I think it now makes sense that Kit as a Wolf could no longer play and thus tried to apologize to her mates for leaving them... (although why did she pick to reveal as the Hunter and not the Seer?) Anyway, therefore, here goes my starting suspicion. But good. As for you, skip, well, at least hope you will remain as a nuisance for the WWs. If you are careful about picking your kills, try to keep them somewhat obscure and such, then the WWs will fear to kill you and thus you could stay around as a known innocent (after Kit is gone)...

For that matter, now thinking about that, what to do with Kit, then? Since if she is a Wolf, then if we don't lynch her, the WWs will still have two kills. So in fact, it might be the best to lynch her now. What do ye say?

EDIT: x-ed with the bunch and certain silly person. Skip! One more joke like that and I will seriously lynch you!

[skip spence]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

EDIT: x-ed with the bunch and certain silly person. Skip! One more joke like that and I will seriously lynch you!

Hehe, I'm sorry buddy, but I just couldn't resist (and now with the image of Legate spitting out his tea all over the keyboard in my head I can't regret it ) . Surely the lovely Wilwa will appreciate the joke at least.

But on to serious business...

EDIT: And there she is, again, I'm sorry luv!

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by skip spence

Hehe, I'm sorry buddy, but I just couldn't resist (and now with the image of Legate spitting out his tea all over the keyboard in my head I can't regret it ) . Surely the lovely Wilwa will appreciate the joke at least.

Fortunately, I had no tea at that time, otherwise there'll be more for you to answer to me about! But fortunately, I have cooled down already. Well, a bit. Now in fact I am wondering if that made you lucky, because I would really find it unusual for a Wolf to make deliberately a thing like that a joke. Otherwise, I might have probably voted you. Okay, now in that case, however, there is the question whom should I vote... I need to take a look at people, there are still quite many of us. Shall be back later.

EDIT: x-ed with Agan

[Blind Guardian]

I have to go now so I am going to vote.

Reason: Since yesterday I haven't felt really good with nessa since yesterday, more of a feeling that is hard to explain...
She seems to have to much confidence in herself.


++Nessa

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Back again, few comments on people in order of appearance...

Nessa is at least not very contributive. And the random post about Cobbler (209) was in relation to what exactly?

And there is one person I became worried of when I saw the opening of his post toDay: Skip. And that made me recall that his posts close to the end of yesterDay seemed in some way awkward to me too. All the general talk of the "crowd", basically listing a list of names from whom people could pick to lynch someone, supporting that way general suspicion would be totally Wolvish thing to do. If there is anything that does not fit into the "I will suspect the people whom majority might suspect and go with the flow" scheme, it is funnily enough his suspicion of me.

But just looking at the post overall, from the greeting (which was the first thing that caught my attention) through what I have mentioned above:

Originally Posted by skip spence

Good Day (if you can call it good and day)
(...)
Personally I missed that cobbler-hint thingie yesterDay but reading back I get the impression a few of her voters went for her because of that (Wilwa, Agan, Lommy?). Or with that as a pretext. Obviously it would be interesting to find out if there was a werewolf (or wolves?) among the crowd who was in apparent danger of getting lynched. By the crowd I mean Pitch, Lottie, Nessa and Inzil.

Here I think Nessa looks objectively the worst but I also share Mac's concern about a lupine stitch-up, what with the killing of Oz, who I was also surprised to see killed. A set-up for an easy lynch might might be the explanation. Or that Nessa is a frightened wolf. Or neither.
(...)
Inzil is shrewd and could of course alter his playing style to suit a particular game. If his ww behaviour was that predictable I wouldn't fear him at all. But I do. Nothing very worrying about Inzil at present though.

Today, and spontaneously, I feel good about Pitch, Rikae and Mac. They all make sense and seem helpful. Though I must question the premiss that making sense is a good sign of innocence.

Getting slightly worried about Legate. Not convinced of Nessa's good intentions either. She was a bit twitchy yesterDay. Also worried about wolves hiding in the crowd. This is such a large village one tends to forget completely about those who rarely comment (and lacks name recognition). Wouldn't be surprised to find at least two among the submarines. But it's always hard to vote for a someone you have no info on.

For instance: The words about Inzil are again the "I don't suspect him - NOW - but he IS dangerous, YOU should lynch him".

And the end - the last four sentences about the Wolves hiding in the crowd - sounds so disgustingly alibistic...

Originally Posted by Aganzir

I'm more concerned about Legate. He seemed to pooh-pooh the confusion around me with "if she was evil she would've dropped more obvious hints!" Legate should realise no real hinting could take place yesterday anyway, so I don't get why he thinks I would've been more direct as a baddie. Basically he says I'm innocent because I didn't do something I wouldn't even have been able to do.

"No real hinting"? Why not? "More direct"? Oh yes, you could have been: you could have done the thing you later rebuked Sally for. That's EXACTLY what I had in mind when saying that you did not drop any direct hint. For that matter, I also didn't say I think you are innocent. It did not make me suspect you, and that's a huge difference, as you can surely understand.

Originally Posted by Agan

I can't remember right off who voted for her, but I'm actually inclined not to think so. Would the wolves risk voting for someone who basically said "the cobbler will suggest herself first"?

Good question. You know, your sharp observations in this post about what the Wolves would think about the Cobbler and so on are actually so sharp that I am starting to think that you have been thinking about it a great deal yourself in your quest to find an ally.

And now the last thing, speaking of the Hunter: so it seems that Kit cannot come back after all? Like, not at all?

I hope she could pop up - and basically what I said above would be the best solution... But if not, then perhaps it will be the best to just leave it be and eventually have her modfired. Because it does not make any difference, in that case, whether we lynch her or let her modfired - or even worse, actually, if we don't know whom she hunts, lynching her will be like choosing a totally random kill.

EDIT: x-ed since Nogrod. NOW WHAT THE???? SKIP????

[Aganzir]

Okie dokie here's a list I've been working on for ages.

GUILTY
skip. He just rings false to me (seer shouldn't leave false trails; if we lynch the quiet the wolves can escape the noose by being loud). Then again, I'm starting to think I have a tendency to always suspect him... He voted for sally, but hadn't noticed her cobbler suggestion. And I think his hunter joke was exactly that - a joke - and we can't draw any conclusions about his role from it. I'll be watching him.

ed. I've never played with her before and don't know what to expect, but I don't like her #71. She's throwing in lots of names and agreeing with people (okay mainly Legate), but her attitude seems to be that of "I don't suspect these people (whom others have already suspected) yet but if and when I want to go after one of them, here's to show I already thought about them on day 1!" Today she's mildly worried about us who voted for sally because of lack of adequate reasoning. Pray tell, what do you consider adequate reasoning?

wilwa. The tone of her posts is pretty innocent, but that doesn't tell anything about her role because she just is sweet that way. I'm not convinced she would've voted for sally if a wolf, but I still think her reaction to my posts was somewhat fishy. Not voting for her today though.

Rikae. Yesterday, she said I could be anything. Today, I'm leaning towards the cobbler. The wolves probably know by now it's not me, so it would be very convenient for them to encourage the village to lynch me as the cobbler. Not voting for her either because I haven't gone through her posts properly and because suspecting her has ended badly before, but I'm wary of her.

Green. I found her pretty okay (although too quiet) until she started twisting my words and basically accusing me of lying about why an evil me wouldn't do something that I didn't do. I don't care if she says it was a joke - if she phrases it so that someone might easily jump on it, it looks evil.

INNOCENT
Mac. I don't think a wolf would bring out points against a possible cobbler (me) so early on, even to say "I saw your hint but won't do anything to you, just be nice now ok." Plus he's being reasonable. In spite of this all, I'm deeply amused he tops my innocent list.
Lommy. Has good points and seems generally very innocent.
Caílin. She voted for me yesterday but didn't say anything about me looking like the cobbler. My reason says a wolf wouldn't take the risk. Apart from that, she's being delightfully Cailínish which doesn't unfortunately tell us anything about her role.
Shasta. Comes across as genuine and doesn't look like he was trying to twist anything I say to suit any darker purposes.
Eomer. I can hardly ever read him, but I'm not overly worried about him at the moment.
Lottie. I'm okay with her for now.

EITHER
Legate. I still feel uneasy about him, but I'm not sure he would've chosen Ozban as his first kill. And I think his reaction to skip's hunter joke was pretty innocent. My assumption is that no one would lie about their role if they're dropping out of the game. A double reveal would have meant that either Kit or skip had been lying... and although there's a chance he's a wolf who thought Kit was the cobbler or the other way round, I find it unlikely. That would be some extremely good acting on Legate's part - it took him 14 minutes to write a long-ish post which, I think, isn't enough for a non-native speaker to successfully feign surprise.
Pitch. Wishy-washy reaction to my cobbler play yesterday. He's kind of all over the place in the sense that he talks about everybody and has something to say on everything. He's been getting a lot of attention and I'm simply too lazy to go through him myself at the moment.
Nessa. To be honest, I can't see what makes her so suspicious.
Inzil. There are a couple of things I don't like about him: his "Nessa seems off, why do maths on day 1?" vote, his quickness to draw a connection between himself and the dead, and the half-accusatory tone of "You sally-voters, what were you thinking!?" Apart from that, I'm not very concerned about him though.
Boro. Speaking a lot without saying much brings to mind a Cobblemir I seem to remember. He's up to something, only I'm not sure what. The thing is, I agree with him about role discussion not being a waste of time, but he was doing it really elaborately. I'm wavering on what to think of his "damage control defense" of Pitch. The Boro I know has no problem whatsoever throwing his fellows under the bus, but in this game the wolves have such an advantage while the four of them are still alive that I wouldn't put it past him to defend a fellow.
BG. I don't particularly like her style (pops in, votes and leaves without saying much) but that indicates neither guilt nor innocence.
Mänwe. Never played with him before and don't know what to expect. I know he had a reason to be absent on day 1, but I still find it amusing how he targets on the quiet players and says he'll refrain from commenting on us others for now.
Valier. As enigmatic as ever.

**

My non-Downer friend (who doesn't know my role) is lying on the floor next to my chair and trying to distract me: "Macalaure is a wolf. I know he is. I must be the seer. I hope the wolves don't come and eat me tonight. Do you suspect Macalaure? Let's lynch Macalaure! Don't write that!"

[Aganzir]

Nessa - Rikae
BG - Nessa
Lottie - Kit
skip - ed
Eomer - Nessa 2
Shasta - Lottie
Pitch - Nessa 3

Left: ed, Mac, Kit?, wilwa, Zil, Rikae, Boro, Green, Mänwe, Val, Legate, Lommy, Agan, Cailín

Didn't vote yesterday: Mac, Mänwe, Green (& BG)
I don't think any one of them is under the risk of being modfired, though.

[elronds_daughter]

Some scattered thoughts:

I've tried to read through as thoroughly as I can, but I don't think my brain has come to terms with it all yet.

I agree with (I think it was Shasta's's) point that we should wait on lynching Kit until toMorrow, if we even want to at all. There are pros and cons to consider.

Boro is a little worrisome, but Eomer and Pitch are more so.

Shasta is quieter than I expected him to be, which is a bit unnerving, but that's probably just unreasonable expectations on my part.

Inzil's first post toDay, and everyone's reactions to it, have begun to make me doubt his innocence somewhat.

Rikae could go either way. Having not played with her before, I'm very unsure.

I'll be back in a bit to vote. Hopefully I'll have made more sense of things by then.

[Cailín]

Innocent For Now

Eomer of the Rohirrim - I know him so well that I am sure I'd see through him.

Macalaure - Like I said earlier, he seemed to be thinking more or less along the same lines as yours truly.

Shastanis Althreduin - I think I might cry if he turns out to be guilty.

Kitanna - Obvious

Inziladun - Can anyone fake amateur paranoid wolf that way? I am not convinced.

Legate of Amon Lanc - He seems to respond to events in a very innocentish manner.

Thinlómien - I never suspect Lommy. Who could?

Aganzir - I like her approach and hope she is on the side of good.

Pitchwife - feels genuine.

Rikae - aggressive but interesting.

Guilty For Now

Loslote - as mentioned in my previous post

wilwarin538 - tricksy and difficult to read, but I do not trust her (and normally I always do)

Nessa Telrunya - not committed, quiet.

Boromir88 - makes me uncomfortable.

A Little Green - under the radar and therefore evil

Blind Guardian - under the radar and therefore evil

Skip Spence - bewildering

Mänwe - under the radar and therefore evil

Valier - I remember Valier quite well from the distant past. She does not give me a fuzzy feeling as of yet.