Three Times The Hobbit?

[Snowdog]

Sadly, its what its come down to. The original is swamped in the movie and gaming hype. One can't talk Tolkien books without someone bringing the movies or even that games into it. The movies killed the Tolkien story legacy, and now is only a cult following. As for myself, I'm not even interested in these so-called Hobbit movies. PJ the usurper is using The Hobbit to pad his coffers, an the PJ movie worshippers are loving him for it. Me, I'll likelywatch the movies at some point, but I'm not getting sucked into the hype that got me interested in the Fellowship. I'm with Christopher on this one.

[Lalwendë]

Originally Posted by Snowdog

Sadly, its what its come down to. The original is swamped in the movie and gaming hype. One can't talk Tolkien books without someone bringing the movies or even that games into it. The movies killed the Tolkien story legacy, and now is only a cult following.

I'd like to see stats on how membership of sites like this took off following the films, and I suspect it would have boomed. And I don't know of any members here who first came to Tolkien via the films who disregard Tolkien's writing, quite the opposite! And in the UK, one unexpected bonus has also been the boom in SF literature, TV and film. The films may have made SF 'cool' or it may be that media types realised that the geek market was huge and hungry for more fun, but I strongly suspect that we'd have been without the Doctor Who revival or series like Being Human and Life On Mars without that sea-change.

I think Tolkien's writing is more than strong enough to weather any mere film

[Mithalwen]

I don't know.. maybe the ones who come here are the ones who might have found the books anyway - it is often forgotten that LOTR was the book of the century by popular vote before the films came out by those who seem to think Tolkien owes Jackson (seriously how many wnent to FOTR because they were mad about Heavenly Creatures compared to those because they were Tolkien fans?). The Hobbit is according to an article I kept but never got round to posting one of the handful of books all booksellers have permanently in stock and have had since it's publication.

I have met several people who have told me that they love Lord of the Rings and then said of course they haven't read the books... And everytime they say that an elf dies.....

[Lalwendë]

I doubt anyone would have gone to see FotR on the back of Heavenly Creatures, the audience is very different! I should imagine that many went because they wanted to see whether Jackson had managed to 'film the unfilmable'. But before the films came out there was an acknowledgement that they would have to secure the Tolkien fans' buy in if the films were to be a success.

Fan buy-in is always a known factor with this kind of film. And why these types of films which come on the back of a book with a massive cult following are incredibly hard to make. Look at the various films of Alan Moore's work (he famously refuses to have anything to do with them, he takes the Chris T approach!) - Watchmen secured the fans' approval and was a success, whereas The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen was not, despite being a decent film if you were not already a fan of the comic book.

Then you also get the kinds of fans who will go and see them whether they are keen or not, it's just something they need to appraise for themselves. I'll go and see them even if they are bad films (and I think they will be very enjoyable, so I don't have that worry), just as I lap up Doctor Who even though I'm really not very keen on what Moffat is doing with it - it's just that I prefer RTD's work, much as I prefer the books to the films.

As for people who have only seen the films and think they speak with authority, that's just an ideal chance for me to spread the gospel

[Ninde Lossehelin]

I love the trilogy and can't wait for the Hobbit come december... I hope to read the whole entire trilogy very soon

[Bêthberry]

Originally Posted by Ninde Lossehelin

I love the trilogy and can't wait for the Hobbit come december... I hope to read the whole entire trilogy very soon

I hope you are referring to the "trilogy" of the three books of the Lord of the Rings, as The Hobbit exists in book form as only one book, despite what Peter Jackson may be doing.

But be that as it may, I welcome you to the Downs. If you are seriously in need of Tolkien discussion, this be the place to come! Enjoy being dead.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

I have met several people who have told me that they love Lord of the Rings and then said of course they haven't read the books... And everytime they say that an elf dies.....

I was introduced to a friend of a friend once, like so: "Come and meet ______, he's a LotR fan too!"

So obviously I said "Hey man! Nice to meet you. So, did Balrogs have wings?" *slight chuckle*

"What's a Balrog?"

[Alcidas]

Originally Posted by Lalwendë

I'd like to see stats on how membership of sites like this took off following the films, and I suspect it would have boomed. And I don't know of any members here who first came to Tolkien via the films who disregard Tolkien's writing, quite the opposite! And in the UK, one unexpected bonus has also been the boom in SF literature, TV and film. The films may have made SF 'cool' or it may be that media types realised that the geek market was huge and hungry for more fun, but I strongly suspect that we'd have been without the Doctor Who revival or series like Being Human and Life On Mars without that sea-change.

I think Tolkien's writing is more than strong enough to weather any mere film

Very good point. I have been "into" the fantasy genre from the time I first started collecting Conan the Barbarian comics in the 1970s. In the 1980s and 90s, fantasy was not widely popular, and you did not have the kind of large-scale interest in it that there is nowadays. I think the LOTR trilogy did increase interest in the fantasy genre. Yes, there are problems with the films, but they are certainly of better quality than most other fantasy films out there.

[Kuruharan]

Originally Posted by Alcidas

Yes, there are problems with the films, but they are certainly of better quality than most other fantasy films out there.

In my view, this is more of a sad indictment of the fantasy film genre than anything else.

[Lalwendë]

Originally Posted by Alcidas

Very good point. I have been "into" the fantasy genre from the time I first started collecting Conan the Barbarian comics in the 1970s. In the 1980s and 90s, fantasy was not widely popular, and you did not have the kind of large-scale interest in it that there is nowadays. I think the LOTR trilogy did increase interest in the fantasy genre. Yes, there are problems with the films, but they are certainly of better quality than most other fantasy films out there.

I always think of the period between the end of the 70s and 2000 as the Dark Ages of Fantasy, because it was seen as deeply uncool to the point of ridicule to be a fantasy fan (even though lots of us still were). There's something to be said for being non-mainstream, but it went beyond that during that period. And aside from rare examples, the films that were made during that period were also bad.

I almost feel like an old geek veteran with me war wounds having weathered being a Tolkien fan all through those dark years.

[Mumriken]

Yeah Fantasy in general was popularized with the coming of the internet. It's not geeky to be a fan of fiction. That is just stupid, just like people say it's geeky to be steve jobs or geeky to be an author or geeky to be an artist or a scientist. The geek label has been put on smart people by dumb people...as we all know there are more dumb people than smart people in this world. It's quite likely that some of you reading this reply are above average when it comes to intelligence in your neighborhood.

I think the internet should be a like puttin on a piece of classical music, you start it up and voila you're in the company of sophisticated artists and then one could exchange information and improve the world. However this might actually happen if the people who currently use the internet keep using it as much as they do now into their 70s 80s. I'm very curious what the internet will look like when the people who are young today use it when they're old. Like if I ever get a child there is no way I'd allow him/her to use it freely. I think adults today don't really understand the internet...with time it will probably change.

Sorry off topic.

[Boromir88]

There is off topic and then there is egregiously off topic. Simply saying "Sorry off topic" is not a reason to go on a ramble and make an off topic post. Especially, since there are many religious members who use this site and probably don't like being lumped in with people you believe should not be on the internet.

[skip spence]

Originally Posted by Mumriken

Even if the internet has recognized fiction and people who like fiction to be the greatest and most creative people in our society. Sadly even the stupid people have now gained access to the internet. The internet was predicted to be a place of high culture, but no it's not. I actuall think one should introduce some kind of license for people that want to use the internet. You can be anonymouse but some way to make sure you're not a complete retard. Like for example I'd be very happy if these people could take a break from the internet:

-Pedophiles
-Religious people
-People who dress up and pretend they are animals
-People who dress up as their favorite characters in manga comic books
-People who watch sports
-People who listen to rap, pop, punk all that stuff
-People who are "nerdy" or "geeky" in a stupid way. (Watching manga porn, or posting bad drawings of their imaginary characters etc.
-People who have blogs...

You seem awfully sure you'd pass that retard-filter yourself. To be honest, if we'd come to that there are many who'd call for the inclusion of this category too, I wager:

-People who think they are better than other people without any discernible justification.

Really, are you serious?

[Mumriken]

I don't think I'm better than anyone else, I just recognize high culture while many don't. I'd pass for sure, since I actually enjoy much of what one would put in the "high culture" category. There would be a place for serious discussion on Tolkien that is for sure. But all these fans that dress up as the characters and like pulls Tolkien's work down with all the people who dress up as pokemon and who knows what else. Well the best way to kill off this sillyness is to simply ban it. I'm for some degree of control on the internet.

Just like I'd be for banning all unhealthy food in the supermarkets...however it's in human nature to enjoy unhealthy food...I don't know I just think there has to be some way to simply tame the human condition. You know slap some of your people in the face a bit? The internet is anarchy, we need to introduce some order on here. Start by banning religious people and pedophiles