Unknown beings!?

[Elf_NFB]

Originally Posted by Ulvenok

Yet she trapped Melkor the greatest of the Valar in her nets and made him squeal for his Balrog army, no sense.

Of course it makes sense. Melkor is on a self destructive path where he divests himself of his own power. He becomes lesser and lesser over time. Read Morgoth's Ring in the History of Middle-earth series. It explains a good deal about how the greatest of the Valar is brought low.

Originally Posted by Ulvenok

None can defeat a valar, Melkor was never defeated just thrown out of the world. So no a maia wouldn't be able to defeat a valar.

Melkor was defeated.. not destroyed. Yes.. it is a case of semantics, but an important one. Melkor was defeated first just before the Elves arrived. He was defeated and imprisoned. He was defeated again after the War of Wrath and put forth from the world. Ungoliant had him all but beaten until the Balrogs saved him. Heck, even a Noldor hurt him enough such that "the pain of his wounds could not be healed." SO I would say a Valar can easily be defeated... though not killed/destroyed.

Originally Posted by Ulvenok

I don't think it ever stated that she was corrupted into his service by him. Ungoliant's origins is like Bombadil's unknown. It'd be quite strange if Ungoliant was just another maia that Melkor first corrupted into his service, then she turns on him...

Bombadil IS a complete unknown (and therefore fun to discuss). However, when I put something in quotes, that means the statement is a QUOTATION. The statement about UNgoliant comes straight from the Silmarillion... Chapter 8 "Of The Darkening Of Valinor".... second paragraph... a little more than half way through.

[Ulvenok]

"from the darkness that lies about Arda, when Melkor first looked down in envy upon the Kingdom of Manwe, and that in the beginning she was one of those that he corrupted into his service."

So you're saying she is an maia then, who managed to drain varda's wells dry and suck the sap out of the trees. And confuse the host of the valar that hunted them (Tulkas even), use unlight whatever that is to cloak Melkor and her when travelling through Valinor. And then to top all of that, trap melkor in her net...trap a valar in her net. If she is an maia she has some extraordinaire abilities.

Heck, even a Noldor hurt him enough such that "the pain of his wounds could not be healed." SO I would say a Valar can easily be defeated... though not killed/destroyed.

He chose to duel with Fingolfin, Fingolfin was said to be the strongest, most steadfast, and most valiant of Finwë's sons, and some have named him the greatest warrior of all the Children of Ilúvatar. If he had not chosen to duel with him he would have been able to make short work of him, he eventually also did kill him. I'm sure if he had been able to he would have escaped from Ungoliant himself but he couldn't, that he didn't points towards Ungoliant's above maia status in my opinion.

Not to say an vala would not be able to corrupt another vala like being close to himself in power. Also that quote:

from the darkness that lies about Arda, when Melkor first looked down in envy upon the Kingdom of Manwe, and that in the beginning she was one of those that he corrupted into his service.

I think one has to put it into context since before it it's said something like "but it's said among the eldar" or whatever. It's by no means absolutely true, It'd be nice to have some kind of clear distinction between maia and vala.