Ten Year Anniversary Game: Living Thread

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Before anyone gives me a solid argument why we should go for an imagined "village spokesman" and do what s/he says, or think the dead will follow her/his thoughts / advice / commands / position (aka. that we should interpret what the dead mean based upon whether they give the "spokesperson" the extra-vote or not), I'll be against it and do my best to thwart any actions proposed or interpretations of facts based on such an entity whether living or dead - unless, of course, there is this solid argument why I should think otherwise.

I may be wrong, but my understanding was that by "village spokesperson", people meant the person who states what various dead votes will mean, not the person who gets the dead vote (the empowered person).

Assuming that, I agree with the phantom: the spokesperson is whoever gives a reasonable list when the voting is done. It doesn't matter whether person X or person Y gets the extra vote, when both voted for person Z. It also doesn't matter which meaning we assign to empowering person X or person Y, as long as we're clear on it before DL.

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Rikae

Assuming that, I agree with the phantom: the spokesperson is whoever gives a reasonable list when the voting is done. It doesn't matter whether person X or person Y gets the extra vote, when both voted for person Z. It also doesn't matter which meaning we assign to empowering person X or person Y, as long as we're clear on it before DL.

That sounds like even more far-fetched and flimsy... (Ok I need to check the rules and what was indeed proposed tomorrow - but with my understanding of the suggestion now it sounds ridiculous)

The votes so far.

Nilp -> Nilp
Rune -> Formendacil
Mormegil -> Macalaure
Lalaith -> Legate
Kath -> Formendacil 2
Aganzir -> Lommy
Lommy -> Aganzir


A pause for thought and then a vote.

[Nogrod]

Since Aganzir looks far more suspicious to me than Form (who has two votes already) and no one seems to pick on my "let's send the phantom to be checked by the dead" -idea, I'll go with

++ Aganzir

She felt wrong all Day, too happy to be the one who is on top of everything and her totally unnecessary - and weird - "liking my points" when she did not (and was getting to sleep) looks too suspicious. Like trying to feel good as the point of making such a "point".

But let's make sure we know what tp is sooner than later - or there is a firm chance we regret not doing it.

Good night and see you in one of the threads toMorrow.

[Formendacil]

The votes so far.

Nilp -> Nilp
Rune -> Formendacil
Mormegil -> Macalaure
Lalaith -> Legate
Kath -> Formendacil 2
Aganzir -> Lommy
Lommy -> Aganzir
Legate -> A Little Green
Nogrod -> Aganzir 2



Nine votes. Assuming nothing comes in under the wire, my vote will make ten. That still leaves 14, which is more than enough to tidal wave all that has come before--but we're into the final hour and who knows if all shall vote?

++Formendacil

I still think a tied vote with no lynch is the way to go, so I'm going to put myself up one more. It's either that or not vote at all, and I think not voting would be a worse cop-out than voting for myself. I do think Aganzir could be guilty, but I don't think it strongly enough to put her in the lead. I'd rather trust the village to tie us up--at the very least, maybe this will force the Silent Majority to make a decision between lynching or not.

[Macalaure]

Form, I don't think you can do this. I'm pretty sure Nilp has trademarked senselessly self-voting on Day1.

[Mithalwen]

++ Aganzir

Still feels wrong too tired to look again

[satansaloser2005]

Originally Posted by Formendacil

++Formendacil

That's copyright infringement!


I'm here....ish. Sorry. Replying is a bit of a trick tonight.

[Loslote]

Wow, I forgot how long it takes to read through four pages of Day 1. Anyway, I'm all caught up now (finally!).

I can kind of see where the Agan suspicion is coming from, since she did seem a little defensive at times, but she's not my top choice. Honestly, the person who jumped out at me most was Nog, who seemed to be pretty conciliatory despite being firmly planted on one side of the biggest debate of the Day. I'd prefer to vote for him if at all possible.

[the phantom]

Yeah, I wouldn't mind voting for Nog, but only if we have an actual real chance of leaping him with or ahead of Form and Agan. Otherwise it feels like a waste.

[Firefoot]

I'm here, I'm caught up, and I'm confused.

The Lommy/Agan thing is odd to me but I'm not sure which one seems more suspicious. I don't know Agan at all so I have no idea if this is normal. Lommy seems snappy though.

I don't have time for any kind of thorough analysis so a vote will be a shot in the dark... one thing that has occurred to me is that it seems unlikely to me that a wolf would be expressing much confusion about the rules, having had the whole previous night to hash some of those issues out with their buddies? Nogrod seems a little too bumbling in the beginning to feel wolfish to me, for example (picking on you because your name is currently being discussed, sorry!).

[Loslote]

Originally Posted by the phantom

Yeah, I wouldn't mind voting for Nog, but only if we have an actual real chance of leaping him with or ahead of Form and Agan. Otherwise it feels like a waste.

I'd be willing to vote for Nog if there was a chance of him overtaking Form and Agan. If not, or if there's only the chance that he'll just add to the tie, I would prefer to vote for Agan and ensure that we do take the opportunity to lynch toDay.

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

I have this flippant wish that, when some of you are Dead, you'd get frustrated about having to give crucial information to the village and not knowing a way to do so in a non-misinterpretable fashion, only to realise that if only you'd discussed in more constructive terms how to organise this information conduit while we are all still here there should have been a better way than hoping they get your attempts to move the coin.

Anyway, for this game, I like lists. As I've said previously, I think the biggest targets of NIGHT kills are those who seem to know more about the village's composition than a blind Ordo, and so Wolves would probably hide under a veneer of being clueless or narrow-minded to hide their opinion of the village as a whole.

Here is mine ( Boro):

Koala

• Rikae - probably because we share a lot of ideas and I like people who agree with me
• Boromir88 - ditto. Also, I stole this list heading from him.
• Mithalwen - is my mother and I would never suspect her

Shark-infested waters

• phantom - his ideas got the whole village moving past the banter stage, and I agree with what he's trying to do. Has also posted a list. But he's the phantom, so... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
• mormegil - has made reasonable innocent villager-like arguments
• Shastanis Althreduin - ditto
• Nerwen - disagreed with the vote-tying plan, but argued for some means of communication between the living and the Dead.
• Loslote - same as Nerwen
• Legate of Amon Lanc - has posted a list. Just saddened that he doesn't remember me (I thought I was a, ah, distinctive character. ;_; )
• Macalaure - has rebutted my argument for my suspicion (i.e., I am illiterate, lynch me), as well as made a list

Swarm of killer beers [sic]

• Aganzir
• Thinlómien - The Finnish friends' little spat... well, they are friends, and I generally have a shorter fuse when it comes to my friends. But I echo others' sentiment that it looks Wolf-on-Wolf. (Remember, 'Wolf-on-Wolf' in this village doesn't necessarily mean 'artificially contrived'. Two Packs!) I trust Lommy more because list.
• Nogrod - Oh, man... I initially had him in the previous section (pulling out the Voltaire quote even), but... his vehement argument against some form of clue-giving between the living and the Dead is troubling. Post-Mandos game trauma?

Komodo dragon

• Kath - Where do I put people whom I have no read on? I'll put them here because I haven't seen a Komodo dragon.
• Lalaith
• Sallykins
• McCaber
• Rune Son of Bjarne
• Firefoot - has made a substantial contribution to the discussion of the vote-tying plan, but otherwise I have no read on her.
• A Little Green - disagreed with the vote-tying plan, contributed the Agan-Lommy fight, so a bunch of contradictory signals from her.
• Formendacil - the grump (sorry) of the 'DAY 1 ' movement (whereas I'm the suicidal lunatic of the movement). Self-voting with a purpose is fun. (Also, I forgot the Mythomancer role. ) Because he's a true DAY 1 warrior, I have no read on him toDAY.
• Gwathagor - scared because I'll beat him again in Arda Cup phantasy (has not yet posted)

Godzilla

• Nilpaurion Felagund - lynch him
• Kuruharan

Not that this matters, cos I've already voted.

[Boromir88]

Assuming that, I agree with the phantom: the spokesperson is whoever gives a reasonable list when the voting is done. It doesn't matter whether person X or person Y gets the extra vote, when both voted for person Z. It also doesn't matter which meaning we assign to empowering person X or person Y, as long as we're clear on it before DL. - Rikae

We should be able to set up a fail safe too, just in case relayed information via the Dead vote gets tampered with, or in the event the Dead are innocents who know the identity of a living wolf, or a living gifted, we don't know and thus vote accordingly to lynch/save someone. Some sort of fall back to let the Living know "We the Dead, for whatever reason, did not get the information your spokesperson requested. Abort and disregard our vote."

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

We should be able to set up a fail safe too, just in case relayed information via the Dead vote gets tampered with, or in the event the Dead are innocents who know the identity of a living wolf, or a living gifted, we don't know and thus vote accordingly to lynch/save someone. Some sort of fall back to let the Living know "We the Dead, for whatever reason, did not get the information your spokesperson requested. Abort and disregard our vote."

Yeah, that's what I was getting at with "at least 3 people in the wagon" earlier. So there is a "neutral" way for the dead to join that particular wagon, if they wish, too.
So, we shouldn't be putting the "signals" into bandwagons of less than 3.

Nog, the only way it's flimsy and far-fetched is if someone insists on jumping in and arguing needlessly about what vote should mean what (and anyone who does that looks very, very furry). As long as the dead have enough options, whatever the first person says should be fine.

[Formendacil]

I'm fading fast from this waking world--which is quite unfair since I still have a good five hours or more on the Europeans--and I don't have a firm idea of who to vote for. If we go for actually lynching someone, my gut says to go with the 50% chance of Agan/Lommy over the 25% chance of "Just Anyone," but that's hardly fair to spring at the last minute after they've gone to bed--and grounded to begin with in a tenuous gut feeling that one of them is probably guilty.

Basically, my suspect list looks something like:

Too Little Information to Guess:

-Some of these people have posted more than others, but they're all still close enough to blank slates to me:
Kath
Shasta
Boromir
Mithalwen
Rune
Sally
McCaber
Eomer
Nerwen
Nilp
Loslote
Firefoot
Lalaith
Greenie
Gwath

The Others:
Morm - In general, he seems sensible, but none of his opinions have stood out one way or another. Good camouflage for a wolf?
Nogrod - The brashest personality offering commentary/suggestions today (setting Lommy and Agan aside). That makes me wary of him, but I think that's his style anyway--and I've agreed with enough of what he said.
Lommy - She seems a bit too defensive, but that's not reason enough to lynch her. I incline to think her more innocent that not.
Aganzir - Slightly more innocent than guilty to me--more flippant than defensive is the vibe I'm getting, for whatever little that's worth. She has the votes (as of starting this post) that we get a tie-waggon rolling between me and her, but I don't see that taking off giving the village response thus far.
The Phantom - Oddly enough, I don't think of him as a wolf, so he probably is one--or worse, he's probably the Special Role and he's playing the a Werebear-Mythomancer. But that's not a concrete reason to lynch him on Day 1--and if we'll regret having him alive, we may regret having him take over the Dead Thread from the beginning just as likely...
Mac - I've liked the statistics, but I'm not honestly sure what he's actually said beyond offering them.
Rikae - Ought to be up with the "Insufficient Information" crew, probably, but posted late enough in the day that my attention has been flagged and... I'm not sure: hasn't said anything alarming, but I agree that something feels off about that... but it's nebulous.
Legate - Similar to Morm in that I think he's contributed but in a camouflaged manner. I probably shouldn't trust him, but for now I do...


Vote coming next post or so, most likely...

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by Rikae

Folks, please stop assuming people are trying to dictate to the dead!

Originally Posted by Rikae

the idea is that the dead have a choice. That way the dead can both cast a vote and send an additional message.
And as for me, if/when I end up on the dead thread, I'd prefer to have as much ability to get information to the living as possible. In fact, I would be rather frustrated with (and suspicious of) anyone who muddles that process.

Originally Posted by Rikae

It doesn't matter who decides how the message will be sent. It doesn't require elaborate choosing of spokespeople, just an agreement well before the deadline.

Originally Posted by Rikae

It's interesting how many people are arguing that it either can't be done or is somehow oppressive. And by interesting, I mean suspicious.

Originally Posted by Rikae

the spokesperson is whoever gives a reasonable list when the voting is done. It doesn't matter whether person X or person Y gets the extra vote, when both voted for person Z. It also doesn't matter which meaning we assign to empowering person X or person Y, as long as we're clear on it before DL.

Originally Posted by Rikae

As long as the dead have enough options, whatever the first person says should be fine.

Yes. Yes to everything.

Nog and others- if you are good and Rikae is evil, I do wonder what your excuse is for being so clearly dominated when it comes to exercising common sense. Rikae is just hitting it out of the park.

People seem to be trying to make things more difficult than they have to be. It's like we're trying to hand you a weapon and you don't want to take it.

[the phantom]

Can someone start at the beginning and explain why Agan is suspicious? I just skimmed over the exchange and it looks like she's suspected because she made a joke, and then she is further suspected because she didn't like being suspected for making a joke. Is that accurate or am I missing something?

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by the phantom

Can someone start at the beginning and explain why Agan is suspicious? I just skimmed over the exchange and it looks like she's suspected because she made a joke, and then she is further suspected because she didn't like being suspected for making a joke. Is that accurate or am I missing something?

What I got is she used the word "kill" instead of "lynch," and morm half-jokingly asked her if that was a Freudian slip, because a wolf would likely see the "lynch" from the POV as "killing."

I didn't read Agan's response carefully enough, but Lommy interpreted her reaction to it as even worse than an innocent Freudian slip.