Geography Grilling

[Lostgaeriel]

Over the river and through the woods...
Climb every mountain; ford every stream...
Somewhere over the rainbow...
Take me to the river...

Name, in chronological order, the bodies of water that Frodo crossed in LOTR. (There and back again and beyond.)

Bonus points for modes of transportation! smilies/biggrin.gif

[Telchar]

what a question smilies/smile.gif

The Bywater (bridge)
The Brandywine (ferry)
Hoarwell (bridge)
Loudwater (ford)
The Gate stream of Moria (ford or wading across)
The Silverlode (foot)
The Nimrodel (foot)
The Anduin (boat)
Morgulduin (bridge)
Anduin (boat)
Isen (ford)
Glsnduin (ford)
Loudwater (ford)
Hoarwell (bridge)
Brandywine (bridge)
The Western Ocean (boat)

Probably missed something

[Lostgaeriel]

Nassty, isn't it? Serves me right to post a question I've not finished finding the answer to. smilies/wink.gif

But I know you've missed 2 between the Water and the Brandywine. OK, 1 of those wasn't named, but the other was. And there are 2 more bodies of water (not necessarily rivers/streams) he crossed between the Brandywine and Hoarwell.

While you think of those, I'll check the journey from Rivendell onward. **panicked**

[Telchar]

Would it be the 'Stok-stream' or something like that? Im not sure if they ever crossed the Withywindle but they did cross the midgewater marches

[Lostgaeriel]

Yes, Telchar, Frodo did wade across the Stock-brook. And before that he crossed an unnamed stream where it dived under the road near the fall (probably a tributary of The Water) on the morning of September 24.
And you got the Midgewater Marshes - great!
And you're right - they didn't cross the Withywindle.

And there is another watery crossing before he arrives at The Prancing Pony. Think of a dike/channel/moat.

This is very hard - I'm scanning the whole book - ughh! (I'm avoiding looking up the detailed route maps on the web.) I guess hills and mountain ranges would have been easier!

[ January 14, 2002: Message edited by: Lostgaeriel ]

[Lostgaeriel]

Hey Telchar! Give up? Want me to post my reckoning of Frodo's water-crossings? I finally finished slogging thru the book looking for bodies of water. But it was good to read the descriptions again and fix the images in my mind.

It's a long list. I've got 37 entries - all mentioned or implied in the book and JRRT's original maps in LOTR. I'd like it if you would check it over - I'm sure I've missed or misunderstood something.

I don't think Frodo crossed Morgulduin - he started toward the bridge toward Minas Morgul but Sam and Gollum stopped him.

[Telchar]

just post the list, and well look at it smilies/smile.gif

[Lostgaeriel]

OK. This is what I've got. I'd love to discuss. Thanks! smilies/smile.gif

And, Telchar you get to ask the next question!!! smilies/wink.gif

(Page #s from Unwin/Unicorn One Volume paperback 1983 3rd Ed. - 1985 reprint)

1.The Water – on foot – narrow plank bridge – p 84
2.Across the stream - near their first camp – near the fall - where it dived under the road – p 86
3.The Stock-brook –waded through it – it was a muddy stream just past the elves’ shelter which was in the hills above Woodhall – cutting across their shortcut – p 102-103
4.Brandywine – Bucklebury Ferry – p 113
5.The dike surrounding Bree – the East Road crossed by a causeway – at the Greenway Crossing - the North Road was called the Greenway - on pony – p 166
6.Midgewater Marshes – on foot – p 198-199
7.River Hoarwell aka Mitheithel – Last Bridge – p 216 – on pony Bill
8.Ford of Bruinen – elf-horse, Asfaloth
9.Bruinen south/east fork to Rivendell – implied - see map
10.Bruinen south/east fork from Rivendell – see map – crossed the bridge – p 298 (also – same bridge homeward bound – p1023)
11.At the West gate of Moria - a narrow creek barred their way at the northmost corner of the pool – walked/waded thru it – p319
12.Many streams and wells in Moria – at least one – could hear noise of water churning up as they leapt over a gap – p329
13.The water in the depths of the chasm under the Durin’s Bridge of Khazad-dûm – p 347 & 523
14.Nimrodel - waded across – p 357
15.Celebrant/Silverlode – rope bridge – p 365
16.The fosse (ditch/moat) surrounding Caras Galadhon in Lothlórien – on foot over the white bridge – in-bound – p 373
17.The fosse (ditch/moat) surrounding Caras Galadhon in Lothlórien – on foot over the white bridge – out-bound – p 391
18.Camp on the right/west arm of Anduin on the western shore of Tol Brandir/Tindrock – cross East branch of Anduin as it divides at Tol Brandir/Tind– just south of? OR at south end of lake Nen Hithoel, above falls of Rauros on Anduin – JRRT & CJRT detail maps not clear - by boat – p 427 (descrip pp 393, 388)
19.Dead Marshes – p 656
20.Crossed the stream in Ithilien where they had the rabbbit stew and met Faramir – becomes the river in the narrow gorge that flows over the Window of the Sunset/Henneth Annûn - p 695 (more info pp 699-700)
21.That same stream in Ithilien? – implied? - if Frodo and Sam were taken by Eagle from Mount Doom to Aragorn at The Morannon? If so, no crossing. Or directly to Cormallen to wait for Aragorn? If so, yes they did cross the stream. Ithilien/the Field of Cormallen – near Henneth Annûn. KEY: Did Aragron tend Frodo & Sam on the Battle Plain where he was on March 25? More likely in Ithilien. More wholesome. pp 987, 993
22.Anduin from Cair Andros to Osgiliath by ship – p 993
23.Mering Stream/Boundary Stream in Rohan in the Firien Wood – CJRT’s detail map & in JRRT’s map – Unfinished Tales index - pony
24.Snowbourn River - CJRT’s detail map & in JRRT’s map - see also Unfinished Tales index
25.Isen – at the ford? - p 1015 or p 1018 - pony Strider
26.Glanduin/Swanfleet River ford - p 1021 (– border between Dunland & Hollin – p 1019) - pony Strider
27.Bridge over south branch of Bruinen to Rivendell – p 1023 - pony Strider
28.Bridge over south branch of Bruinen from Rivendell – implied - pony Strider
29.Bruinen – ford – from Rivendell - p 1026 - pony Strider
30.River Hoarwell/Mitheithel – Last Bridge – implied - pony Strider
31.The dike surrounding Bree – the East Road crossed by a causeway - on pony Strider – implied
32.Brandywine Bridge - pony Strider – p 1033, 1035-6
33.The Water – bridge - pony Strider - home Bag End – p 1054
34.The Water – bridge – implied - to Michael Delving – p 1059 – release prisoners from Lockholes
35.The Water – bridge – implied – home again – no other travels noted except to the Grey Havens
36.The Water – bridge – implied – took the Stock Road towards the Woody End to the Green Hills – p 1065
37.The Sea – by ship – p 1068

[Telchar]

smilies/smile.gif MUCHO IMPRESSO smilies/smile.gif

Entry 5. and 31. might be a little far out - a dike is not obviosly a body of water???
but concerning dikes here are some more entrys:


Soon they came into well-tended fields and meadows: there were hedges and gates and dikes for drainage. Everything seemed quiet and peaceful, just an ordinary corner of the Shire.

‘I will!’ said he, and drove out of the gate. There was now no breath of wind stirring; the night was still and quiet, and a chill was in the air. They went without lights and took it slowly. After a mile or two the lane came to an end, crossing a deep dike, and climbing a short slope up on to the high-banked causeway.
Maggot got down and took a good look either way, north and south, but nothing could be seen in the darkness, and there was not a sound in the still air. Thin strands of river-mist were hanging above the dikes, and crawling over the fields.

The dark line they had seen was not a line of trees but a line of bushes growing on the edge of a deep dike with a steep wall on the further side. Tom said that it had once been the boundary of a kingdom, but a very long lime ago. He seemed to remember something sad about it, and would not say much.
They climbed down and out of the dike and through a gap in the wall, and then Tom turned due north,....

On that side, running in more than half a circle from the hill and back to it, there was a deep dike with a thick hedge on the inner side. Over this the Road crossed by a causeway; but where it pierced the hedge it was barred by a great gate.
NO MENTION OF WATER

Along the crest of the ridge the hobbits could see what looked to be the remains of green-grown walls and dikes, and in the clefts there still stood the ruins of old works of stone.

...and the heirs of Valandil removed and dwelt at Fornost on the high North Downs, and that now too is desolate. Men call it Deadmen’s Dike, and they fear to tread there.

...they were amazed at the change that had come over the Ents. It seemed now as sudden as the bursting of a flood that had long been held back by a dike.

‘I see a white stream that comes down from the snows,’ he said. ‘Where it issues from the shadow of the vale a green hill rises upon the east. A dike and mighty wall and thorny fence encircle it. Within there rise the roofs of houses; and in the midst, set upon a green terrace, there stands aloft a great hall of Men.

..and flowed then in a gully through the midst of a wide green gore, sloping gently down from Helm’s Gate to Helm’s Dike. Thence it fell into the Deeping-coomb..

‘Not far ahead now lies Helm’s Dike, an ancient trench and rampart scored across the coomb, two furlongs below Helm’s Gate. There we can turn and give battle.’
‘Nay, we are too few to defend the Dike,’ said Théoden. ‘It is a mile long or more, and the breach in it is wide.’


...winding through the gloom, converging towards the line of the broad road that led from the City-gate to Osgiliath.
‘The enemy,’ men murmured. ‘The dike is down. Here they come pouring through the breaches! And they carry torches, it seems. Where are our own folk?’

Now silently the host of Rohan moved forward into the field of Gondor, pouring in slowly but steadily, like the rising tide through breaches in a dike that men have thought secure.
(I love that sentence)

He turned Shadowfax off the Road, and the great horse leaped the green dike that here ran beside it; and then at a cry from Gandalf he was gone, racing towards the Barrow-downs like a wind from the North.

[Telchar]

Name the beacon of Gondor that lay furthest to the east and furthest to the West.

[Lostgaeriel]

Hi Telchar!

VERY IMPRESSIVE RESEARCH FROM YOU. smilies/smile.gif
(Which I've come to expect.)

I suppose a dike isn't a body of water and neither is a fosse. They are constructions that may or may not contain or hold back water. I misunderstood the meanings. So I checked my dictionary, again, which defines a dike as two things: 1) a long wall or embankment to keep back water and prevent flooding or 2) a ditch for draining water from land. And fosse is defined as a long ditch or a moat or a trench, especially in fortification. I guess I figured if there was a bridge or causeway - a road across low or wet ground - there might be water in the dike or fosse. But if a road goes over wet ground that doesn't count, does it?

So not only is the dike in Bree suspect, so is the fosse surrounding Caras Galadhon in Lothlórien. Numbers 5, 31, 16, 17.

And I'm embarrassed that I missed the ride with Farmer Maggot and Bombadil guiding them back to the Road. I didn't even skim those to check for water or dikes and ditches - I just assumed!!!

Gosh! I hadn't realized how many locations in Middle-Earth have dikes. Thanks for helping me get a better handle on the definitions of these words. Paints a clearer picture of the settings in the story.

[ January 18, 2002: Message edited by: Lostgaeriel ]

[Lostgaeriel]

OK. The beacons of Gondor.

From East to West:
Amon Dîn (furthest East)
Eilenach
Nardol
Erelas
Min-Rimmon
Calenhad
Halifirien (furthest West)

[Telchar]

Yes that is correct.

Comments on the word 'fosse'

A fosse is (as I understand it) a deep trench filled with water, to prevent an enemy to assult a castle, town or fortress.
In the description of the fosse around Caras Caladhon it is said that it has green brinks which indicates that it was indeed filled with water - so I guess that you are correct on that point smilies/smile.gif

Furthermore, the word 'fos' is the Norwegian word for a swift river of wich they indeed have many in Norway.
And in Danish water may 'fosse' out of a hole in a pipe or out of tap, or through a breech in a dike.
Much like 'pour' in english.

Go on please smilies/smile.gif

[Lostgaeriel]

Name and/or describe the geography of 3 places where a hobbit or hobbits fell asleep in the sunshine.

Thanks for the additional info on the word 'fosse'. I'm afraid that in my part of the world we don't have moats, fossae, dikes, etc. so they're a 'foreign' concept to me. And I haven't travelled enough, obviously. smilies/smile.gif

[Curuquendil]

Hope nobody minds if I jump in...

[list=1]
In the Old Forest, against the trunk of Old Man Willow
On the grassy hill in the Barrow Downs
In Ithilien (Sam & Frodo) after eating stewed rabbit
[/list=a]

[Lostgaeriel]

Welcome and well met, Curuquendil! Correct! Glad you joined in. Ask us one.

[Curuquendil]

Thank you! I am enjoying my visits here immensely!

Now for my question:

List the streams, rivers & tributaries which meet up with the River Anduin at one point. (In existence during the Third Age, to avoid any confusion.)

[The Mirrorball Man]

Originally posted by Curuquendil:
List the streams, rivers & tributaries which meet up with the River Anduin at one point. (In existence during the Third Age, to avoid any confusion.)

I will probably forget one or two, but I'll try...

The Langwell
The Greylin
The Rhimdath
The Ninglor
The Celebrant
The Limlight
The Entwash
The Erui
The Sirith
The Poros

Close enough?

[Curuquendil]

VERY CLOSE! There are 10 total & all are correct except for Rhimdath (although I will admit that I don't see Rhimdath anywhere on maps or in the indices) If anyone else can verify that Rhimdath is correct, I'll "stand corrected"!

[Telchar]

River Rhimdath shows on the 'First Map' published in HoME 7 'The Treason of Isengard' I cant recall seeing the name on the later LoTR maps made by CRT. Pretty cool that somebody found it smilies/smile.gif

[Curuquendil]

Thanks for the confirmation Telchar! In that case, I will consider the answer given as correct!

[Watcher in the Water]

The week is up... someone ask as i cant think of one myself just now.

[Telchar]

What was Bamfurlong?

[Mat_Heathertoes]

Bamfurlong was the name of Farmer Maggot's farmstead

[Telchar]

Correct smilies/smile.gif

[Mat_Heathertoes]

What was the 'elvish' name of the "Sun Rising Hill" in the far east of Arda before the Changing Of The World at the end of the Second Age?

[Lindolirian]

Ah Ha! I finally found it! Kalorme is the "sun rising hill".

[ February 18, 2002: Message edited by: Lindolirian ]

[Mat_Heathertoes]

smilies/biggrin.gif Way to go .. your turn ..

[Lindolirian]

Where is the "House of 100 Chimneys"?

[Mat_Heathertoes]

Why that be located in Tol Eressea, in Tavrobel and was the home of Gilfanon, Lord of Tavrobel

[Lindolirian]

Very good Mat-Heathertoes! I thought it would take longer than that, but its your turn now!

[Mat_Heathertoes]

Where was the land of Fragrant Trees ?

[Bruce MacCulloch]

Nísimaldar, the Fragrant Trees was another name for Numenor.

[Mat_Heathertoes]

Indeed it was Bruce, take it away!

[Bruce MacCulloch]

What is the Hill of Anwar called in Lord of the Rings and what was significant about the hill?

[Mat_Heathertoes]

Halifirien 'Holy Mountain' in the tongue of the Rohirrim, was its name and its particular importance was that it once contained the Tomb of Elendil

[Bruce MacCulloch]

The floor is yours, Matt!

[Mat_Heathertoes]

where in Arda,is the dark harbour of the North? and what is its name? .. clue - Mandos spoke his Prophecy of the North there .....

[Lindolirian]

"the northern confines of the Guarded Realm, upon the borders of Araman, which were mountainous and cold." Here the Noldor saw the figure of Mandos and he gave his Prophecy of the North

[Mat_Heathertoes]

Yes, that's right but in one of Christopher Tolkiens associated Histories, it's actual name is given ... curious enough mentioned as the mooring-place of the black ship of Nienna which drew the souls of men onwards to their new home beyond the circles of Arda....

[Lindolirian]

Name the three Mountains of Moria in English, Elvish, and Dwarvish.

[Mat_Heathertoes]

English : - Redhorn, Cloudyhead and Silvertine

Elvish :- Caradhras, Fanuidhol and Celebdil

Khuzdul :- Barazinbar, Bundushathur and Zirakzigil

[Lindolirian]

Very good, as usual, Mr Heathertoes! Your turn.

[Mat_Heathertoes]

Where was the Camp of the Faithful ?

[Bruce MacCulloch]

The refuge of Túrin and his band upon Amon Rhûdh, the home of Mîm the petty dwarf.

[Mat_Heathertoes]

Wouldn't have doubted you for a second Macc smilies/biggrin.gif ..... take it away!

[Bruce MacCulloch]

What is the name of the wild country south of the Andram betweeen Sirion and Gelion?

[Mat_Heathertoes]

Taur-Im-Duinath - The Forest Between Rivers

[Bruce MacCulloch]

Absolutely right!

[Mat_Heathertoes]

what were the Martalmar?

[Lindolirian]

I don't know!! I've toiled over this one at least once every month since Mat posted this. Anyways Geography is great toic, so we'll keep it going.

What two rivers is the Forest of the Hunters in between?

[Joy]

The Taur-im-Duinath was between the Rivers Sirion and Gelion

[Lindolirian]

Nope, I'm asking for the rivers on either side of Taur-en-Faroth, not Taur-im-Duinath.

[Joy]

I wasn't looking at my map good enough. I only saw one forest between two rivers. My bad.

Taur-en-Faroth is above Nargothrond, so that would make the rivers be the Narog and the Ginglith.

[Lindolirian]

Oh... Now you're looking at the Woods of Nuath... smilies/smile.gif

[Joy]

I had the hardest time finding that Lindo!

Okay - hope this is right - Taur en Faroth is South of the Hills of Nargothrond. The River Narog is beside it and I guess you could say that the River Ringil would be the other, as it is North of it - unless you are classifing the River Nenning as the other river.

[Lindolirian]

Yes! Congrats!! smilies/wink.gif

[Lindolirian]

I guess I'll just take it.

By what river are the Overbourne Marshes?

[Beren87]

The Shirebourn?

[Lindolirian]

Eh, the big river...

[TolkienGurl]

So... Is Beren right?

[Lindolirian]

No, I'm looking for the name of the biggest river that the Marshes are near to.

[TolkienGurl]

The Brandywine!

[Lindolirian]

Correct!

[TolkienGurl]

Name 5 places where the Hobbits (together or separate) met someone unexpectedly. Give also the name of who they met.

[Lindolirian]

That actually happened more than 5 times I'm sure, but I'll give ya the more famous ones... the ones you're porbably thinking of.

Tom Bombadil in the Old Forest
Glorfindel on the way to Rivendell
Gollum in Emyn Muil
Faramir in Ithilien
Treebeard in Fangorn

[Legolas]

Durin's Bane in Moria
Gildor in the Shire
Aragorn [Strider] in Bree
Old Man Willow, then Tom Bombadil in the Old Forest

[TolkienGurl]

The ones that you two named which I was thinking about were:

Bombadil in the Old Forest
Strider in Bree
Faramir in Ithilien
Treebeard in Fangorn

The others are correct, but not the ones I'm thinking of:

Gollum... they sort of knew he was following them.

Balrog... registers the surprise of all but the Hobbits. It wasn't their confrontation, but I'm sure they were surprised!

Glorfindel... registers only Aragorn's surprise in the book. He could've counted, too, but I didn't think of him.

Gildor... didn't think of him! Silly me!

See if you can guess the last one! smilies/tongue.gif

[ December 19, 2002: Message edited by: TolkienGurl ]

[Lindolirian]

Sam met Snaga while climbing the Tower of Cirith Ungol.

[TolkienGurl]

Very close... Good try! smilies/smile.gif

[Lindolirian]

Ah, Sheolb... duh. hmm probably wrong too. Of course this is an VERY broad category.

[TolkienGurl]

Yes, it was Shelob. Sorry for the "broadness." I'll try to ask more concise questions if I get any more right! smilies/smile.gif

[Lindolirian]

What city stood at the junction of the Gate Stream and River Glanduin?

[Eruwen]

Was it Moria? I found the river Glanduin, but I just can't seem to find the Gate Stream. And the only city I see around the first river was Moria.

[Lindolirian]

It's an ancient city. Not Moria, but its ruins are still there.

[TolkienGurl]

Hollin? That's the only one I could think of.

[Lindolirian]

No, its a city.

[Aylwen Dreamsong]

Ost-in-Edhil? The 'city of the elves'.

Aylwen

[Lindolirian]

That's it Aylwen!

[Aylwen Dreamsong]

Cool!

Anyway, this is kind of easy, sorry smilies/frown.gif ...

The Orocarni are also known as...?

Aylwen

[Pallando B.C]

The Red Mountains

[Aylwen Dreamsong]

Yes. Go ahead.

[Pallando B.C]

If I travelled 40 miles North of the Hills of Evendim and then 100 or so miles East, Then another 120 miles south, where would I be?

[Thengise Greenleaf of Mirkwood]

Would you be at Fornost in the North Downs?

[Pallando B.C]

Great Job, Thengise Greenleaf of Mirkwood.

Your father would be proud smilies/wink.gif

[Thengise Greenleaf of Mirkwood]

I sure hope he would be!

What's the name of the hill in the Forest of Brethil?....I know I know, it's quite easy but hey I'm a bit new at this.

[Pallando B.C]

Doesn't matter If you're new, I'm #4760 and that I'm sure would be regarded as new.

The Hill in the Forest of Brethil is Amon Obel.

[ December 23, 2002: Message edited by: Pallando B.C ]

[Thengise Greenleaf of Mirkwood]

That is correct! Your turn.

Oh and I'm not new to this site. I've been here since July and have quite a lot of posts around here, except that the RPG room used to be my main place. I mean I'm new to quizing.

Besides I'm better at answering than at giving questions.

[ December 23, 2002: Message edited by: Thengise Greenleaf of Mirkwood ]

[Pallando B.C]

Oh, ok. As you can see I'm new at least!

What river is the seperates the regions of Eregion and Dunland

[TolkienGurl]

The river Glanduin.

[Pallando B.C]

Yes, the floor is yours!

[TolkienGurl]

Thanks! smilies/smile.gif

On which river did the Teleri, being slow and reluctant, camp long in Middle-earth?

[Lindolirian]

Anduin the Great.

[TolkienGurl]

Right! Your turn.

[Lindolirian]

Describe the location of Dor Daidelos.

[Gwaihir the Windlord]

I am not sure if you've got the right spelling, but I believe the area you are referring to was north-west of Ard-Galan/Anfauglith, the hilly land through which one passes to come to Thangorodrim and Angband.

[Lindolirian]

I see what you are thinking. The land you are describing is Dor Daedeloth. I was hoping someone would go for that one.

[Gwaihir the Windlord]

Curse you... then it's anybody's guess. Never heard of that.

[TolkienGurl]

North of the Iron Mountains and the northernmost part of Middle-earth, Dor Daidelos is the Region of Everlasting Cold.

[Lindolirian]

Curse me?? Anyways, yes TolkienGurl, you are correct.

[TolkienGurl]

Umm... how about "Bless you" instead! smilies/biggrin.gif

Name 2 cities in which Numenor's population was concentrated.

I hope it isn't too easy!

[Lindolirian]

Andunë and Armenelos

[TolkienGurl]

Armenelos is correct, but there was another city with a higher population concentration than Andúnië, or so my book source tells me. smilies/smile.gif Which one is it?

[Lindolirian]

It is Romenna then.

[TolkienGurl]

Yup. You're really good at this. Ask away!

[ December 30, 2002: Message edited by: TolkienGurl ]

[Lindolirian]

Between what two rivers does the Silent Land lay?

[Aylwen Dreamsong]

Silent Land is Dor Dinen, so I believe it lies between the River Aros and the River Nivrim. Yet I'm not so sure about Nivrim.

Aylwen

[Lindolirian]

I'm not so sure about Nivrim either, in fact, have at it again. smilies/tongue.gif

[ December 31, 2002: Message edited by: Lindolirian ]

[akhtene]

The second one is River Esgalduin

[Lindolirian]

Of course. Since you were the first to know both, you get it next.

[akhtene]

Which river is the border between Gondor and Harad?

[TolkienGurl]

The river Harnen.

[akhtene]

That's it. Your turn.

[TolkienGurl]

The Men-i-Naugrim passes through Taur-En-Daedelos. Where in Middle-earth are these things, and what are they?

[Lindolirian]

The Forest Road passes through Mirkwood.

[TolkienGurl]

Correct! Your turn.

[Lindolirian]

Ahh, yes.... ye ole Geography. smilies/biggrin.gif

In between what mountain ranges was the Athraid Angren?

[Russandol]

That would be the Hithaeglir and the White Mountains.

[Lindolirian]

Aye, that it is!

[Russandol]

Where was the River Rushdown? Extra kudos goes to the person who can tell me what it's 'elvish' name was.

[Lindolirian]

The Rimdath is a tributary to the Anduin north of the Carrock.

[Russandol]

Correct, as usual smilies/tongue.gif ... you have the baton Lindolirian

[Lindolirian]

What road crosses the Odothui?

[Russandol]

The North-South road, principally at Tharbad.

Now you made me look that up!

[Lindolirian]

I know, I try. smilies/wink.gif Go for it!

[Russandol]

Where was Gar Lossion?

[Lindolirian]

You really made me look that one up! Gar Lossion is on Tol Erresea.

[Lindolirian]

Well, as I said, I looked it up, so, I'm know I'm correct. Gosh I hate sayin that. It sounds so arrogant... Anyways
Where is Brownhay?

[Pallando B.C]

Brownhay, or Rhosgobel is located in the vales of Anduin near the southern borders of Mirkwood. There dwells Radagast.

[Lindolirian]

You should know, Blue Wizard.

[Pallando B.C]

It would be an insult to my order if I didn't know.

North East of Dol Guldur, is which Mirkwood landmark.

[Lindolirian]

The Narrows of the Forest, or the East Bight?

[Russandol]

Maybe the Mountains of Mirkwood ?

[Pallando B.C]

The East Bight was the one I was thinking of.

You may proceed, Lindolirian.

[Lindolirian]

Where is Shathur?

[Pallando B.C]

The sourthern most peak of the three great peaks of Moria, also known as Bundushathûr.

[ January 21, 2003: Message edited by: Pallando B.C ]

[Lindolirian]

That's it!

[Pallando B.C]

What river acts as a southern 'border' of Doraith?

[Beren87]

The River Aros?

[Pallando B.C]

Aros is correct, Beren.

[Beren87]

Thanks Pallando smilies/wink.gif

What was the name of the hills outside of the Grey Havens?

[Pallando B.C]

It is either Ered Luin or the Tower Hills.

[Beren87]

Yep, 'twas the Tower Hills I was looking for.

[Pallando B.C]

What mountain in Beleriand could be called 'The Lonely Mountain'.

Accepting two possible answers.

[ January 30, 2003: Message edited by: Pallando B.C ]

[Lindolirian]

Amon Ereb. Amon being hill and ereb being Lonely as in Erebor- the Lonely Mountain.

[Pallando B.C]

Spot on, Lindolirian. I also would have accepted Amon Rûdh, since it is not near other mountains.

But Amon Ereb was the better answer due to the words you mentioned. Proceed.

[Lindolirian]

Who lives near the Last Hill?

[Pallando B.C]

Saruman, maybe?

[Tar-Palantir]

Treebeard is my guess. smilies/smile.gif

[Lindolirian]

Actually, both. But I was thinking of Saruman. It's Pallando's then.

[Pallando B.C]

What jagged peak forms a northern wall of the Hold of Dunharrow?

[Ultimatejoe]

The only peak I can think of is the haunted mountain Dwimorberg.

[Pallando B.C]

On the right track, but no.

[Ultimatejoe]

The northern "wall" of Dunharrow is the cliff-face; it isn't a peak.

[Lindolirian]

I believe that Dunharrow is at the conjunction of Starkhorn, Dwimorberg, and Irensaga. Not too sure, but I think it is Irensaga that forms the northern wall.

[Pallando B.C]

Right you are, Lindolirian.

[Lindolirian]

In sight of which city was Haramon?

[Pallando B.C]

Minas Tirith, since Haramon is Emyn Arnen.

[Lindolirian]

Correct, Pallando!

[Pallando B.C]

What's the name (in Khuzdul) of the source of the river Silverlode?

[Lindolirian]

Kheledzaram?

[Pallando B.C]

Not on the first go for once!

[Lindolirian]

Well, its in the valley of Azanuilbizar. Is that what you want. The only body of water I see there is Kheled-zaram, and can't quite tell, but it looks like the Silverlode flows out of it.

[Pallando B.C]

Ok, I'll re-phrase it a bit more:

What was the name given to the icy-cold source of the river Silverlode.

Hint: It rises from a natural well in the Vale of Azanulbizar.

[Rochelle]

It was mirrormere, The hallowed lake of Kheled-zâram.

[Tar-Palantir]

"Cold are the springs of Kibil-nâla." smilies/smile.gif

[ February 14, 2003: Message edited by: Tar-Palantir ]

[Lindolirian]

It's been 10 days, but I think Tar-Palantir should take it.

[Tar-Palantir]

What most populous city of it's realm is surrounded by five 'stars'? And what are the names of those 'stars'?

[elven maiden Earwen]

The most popular city is Armenelos, and the five stars are Andustar, Forostar, Orrostar, Hyarrostar, and Hyarnustar in the relm of Numenore.

[Tar-Palantir]

That was fast, your gonna force me to be hard on you next time! Fire away Earwen. smilies/smile.gif

[elven maiden Earwen]

ok im sick so my brain isnt letting me think of any good questions so this is going to be easy.
What is the name of the lake in Mordor?

[Rochelle]

That would be the sea of Nurnen

Nothing wrong with easy questions!

[elven maiden Earwen]

Yay! your right.

[Rochelle]

Alrighty...

What was the name of the ford on the upper reaches of the River Aros?

[Tar-Palantir]

Arosslach?

[Rochelle]

Correct you are smilies/smile.gif You're up!

[Pallando B.C]

My apologies for earlier. I didn't realise someone had answered the question. Tar-Palantir was correct anyways.

[Tar-Palantir]

OK. thanks.

Which island is surrounded by water?

[Rochelle]

*lol* Aren't all islands surrounded by water?

[Tar-Palantir]

Sorry, my attempt at a little humor... I did say I was goin to give a tough one though! smilies/biggrin.gif

Ok, how about a little riddle thrown in?

I have been stepped on in the past
but truly conquered never
Tis not my protectors
far hearing and far sight
That keep the intrepid yonder
The roaring voice around me keeps most from the test
And men of the past do all of the rest

Where/What am I? smilies/smile.gif

[ February 25, 2003: Message edited by: Tar-Palantir ]

[Lindolirian]

Rauros.

[Tar-Palantir]

Soooooo close, Lindolirian. I can see my minor flaw, but have changed the wording so as not confuse - try again!

And for fun, can you name all the elements?

[ February 25, 2003: Message edited by: Tar-Palantir ]

[Rochelle]

I was heavily considering submitting Rauros myself! Hmm...perhaps its Emyn Muil?

I have been stepped on in the past
{It has been a pathway...}
but truly conquered never
{No true paths have been made...}
Tis not my protectors
far hearing and far sight
That keep the intrepid yonder
The roaring voice around me keeps most from the test
{Rauros...}
And men of the past do all of the rest
{The dead marshes...}

[ February 25, 2003: Message edited by: Rochelle ]

[Lindolirian]

I have never been stepped on in the past
(No one has ever set foot on Tol Brandir)
but truly conquered never
Tis not my protectors
far hearing and far sight
(Amon Hen and Lhaw)
That keep the intrepid yonder
The roaring voice around me keeps most from the test
Rauros)
And men of the past do all of the rest
(Dead Marshes)


I'm guessing Tol Brandir because no one has set foot upon it, and the roaring voice of Rauros is around it, and Amon Hen and Amon Lhaw are on either side. It also has a good view of the Dead Marshes.

It was that "My roaring voice" that made me think Rauros last time, but now the change makes me certain its Tol Brandir.

[ February 25, 2003: Message edited by: Lindolirian ]

[Tar-Palantir]

Very good Lindolirian! Your turn.

But you missed two clues:

I have been stepped on in the past
but truly conquered never
- men have walked on Tol Brandir, but the summit has never been reached, too steep

And men of the past do all of the rest
- the Argonath

smilies/smile.gif

[Lindolirian]

Into which bay does the Nunduinë flow?

[Rochelle]

Was it the Bay of Eldanna?

[Lindolirian]

That it was. Proceed.

[Rochelle]

Alrighty here goes...

Unique I am in shape and in size,
The envy I am in anothers eyes.
All around me I see nothing but green,
the tall lonely oak is not all to be seen.
Thankful I am, I was nobody's bane,
yet after they left, the enviers came!

I think it's fairly simple *lol*

[Tar-Palantir]

#3 Bagshot Row
West Farthing, Hobbiton
The Shire

[Lindolirian]

The envy I am in another's eyes.

This makes me think of the Sackville-Bagginses and their uncanny desire for Bag-End.

yet after they left, the enviers came!


After Frodo left, Lobelia got the hole.
I say it's Bag-End.

[Rochelle]

Bag-End it is! smilies/biggrin.gif

[Tar-Palantir]

By the hands of the hired
Was I wrought from the rock
A great wealth was payed
But much more was sought
Sorrow was the result
Of the hairy ones greed
The desire of a prize
Caused many to bleed
Of all that had lived
In this place once held dear
The greatest of all
Was a beast mortals feared

yikes! Guess this will be a speed round! smilies/smile.gif

[Annunfuiniel]

Khazad-dûm, I presume. smilies/wink.gif

[Tar-Palantir]

WRONG! WRONG! WRONG!

Where is the dunce cap? smilies/wink.gif Sorry, I just got excited for a second there - it won't happen again, scout's honor...

[Turambar]

Nargothrond?

[Tar-Palantir]

Yes, oh Master of Doom, you are correct. You should know, you are the one who slew the filthy beast! smilies/wink.gif Pity about your sister though... smilies/frown.gif

proceed.

[ March 01, 2003: Message edited by: Tar-Palantir ]

[Turambar]

River that flows from the home of "the oldest living thing that still walks beneath the Sun", past the scene of a famous battle.

[Annunfuiniel]

River Limlight/Limlaith, it flowed from Fangorn forest where the ents still dwelled and passed the Field of Celebrant.

[Turambar]

Correct, Annunfuiniel.

P.s. I like your avatar.

[Annunfuiniel]

Yey! Ok, here's your new puzzle:

I'm all alone, aloof
my companions long gone
my name stands as proof
that changes have been done.

Oh, and thank you Turambar for your compliment! smilies/smile.gif Yours is great too, somehow authentic...

[Estanesse]

I'm not sure, but is it Lothlorien

I'm all alone, aloof
my companions long gone- in the fourth age the galadrim no longer life in Lothlorien

my name stands as proof
that changes have been done. - The first name of the golden wood was Laurelindorenan
In later days the elves make the name shorter, calling it Lothlorien
smilies/rolleyes.gif

[Annunfuiniel]

Well, that seems to fit! But sorry, it ain't the answer I'm looking for. Keep on trying pals! smilies/smile.gif

[Pallando B.C]

Mirkwood?

[Tar-Palantir]

The Old Forest.

Why are we all guessing of the woods? smilies/biggrin.gif

[Annunfuiniel]

Yep, stop guessing woods 'cause it ain't one! smilies/smile.gif

[Rochelle]

Hmmm...perhaps Isengard?

[Lord Elessar]

well if you have a look at the name i would think it must be Lonely Mountains

[Tar-Palantir]

Tol Eressëa

The Last Homely House

New Row (Bag-End)

Amon Rûdh

Amon Sûl

[ March 06, 2003: Message edited by: Tar-Palantir ]

[Aylwen Dreamsong]

Meneltarma?

[Annunfuiniel]

All wrong! Hmm, maybe I have been too vague...
But Aylwen, getting close!! smilies/smile.gif

[Tar-Palantir]

The Sundering Seas.

[Rochelle]

Minas Morgal/Ithil?

[Annunfuiniel]

No and no.
Hint: this place is surrounded by Ulmo's element.
No trick here, I just want this thing to move on. smilies/smile.gif

[Estanesse]

It is a hard one Annunfuiniel!
Is it Númenor? I can’t fit it with your verse, but it’s close to Meneltarma smilies/biggrin.gif

[ October 12, 2003: Message edited by: Estanesse ]

[Rochelle]

Hmm..perhaps an island? Númenor ?

[Tar-Palantir]

Tol Sirion - because that is where the old Minas Tirith was built?

[Annunfuiniel]

You are half way there! Yes, it's an island but no it's not Númenor.
Last hint: the place isn't what it used to be but something else has changed too...

[Rochelle]

This is definatly a tricky riddle *lol*

I'm going to go with Almaren.

[Annunfuiniel]

smilies/biggrin.gif You really don't have to go that far back in time! And it's something that still exists, look at the maps and you'll find it. smilies/smile.gif

[Tar-Palantir]

Himling, used to be Himring - which means changes have been done

[Annunfuiniel]

Well hooray, we have the winner! smilies/smile.gif Makes sense now does it? Himling stands quite alone surrounded by the sea, those "companions" that are gone are the other hills and mountains that were lost in the sea and T-P got the name and change part right.
So the stage is all yours, Tar Palantir! smilies/smile.gif

[Tar-Palantir]

Okely, dokely... I chopped up the Lizard King to make this one interesting for you, helps to sing it. smilies/smile.gif

House upon the hill

Evil lying still

Shadows of the peaks

Witnessing the wild breeze

C'mon baby hide with me

Let's hide



The mansion is warm, at the top of the hill

Rich are the rooms and the beauty there

Strong are the arms and the family fair

And you won't know a thing till you get inside

[Salix]

Strange, makes me think of Moria.

[elven maiden Earwen]

Edoras

[Pallando B.C]

Ilmarin maybe?

[Annunfuiniel]

Or Gondolin?

[Narya]

I would say Gondolin, too.

"evil lying still" - could refere to Maeglin

"and you won´t know a thing till you get inside"
- this one fits very good into the context of Gondolin

[ March 12, 2003: Message edited by: Narya ]

[Tar-Palantir]

Or Gondolin?

Yes Annunfuiniel! Tis indeed Gondolin, I had one more verse that was perfect, but I didn't want to make it *too* easy.

[Annunfuiniel]

Oh gosh, that means it's my turn again! Yeah, it's smilies/cool.gif but still smilies/rolleyes.gif , if you know what I mean. smilies/biggrin.gif
Yep, here we go:

A land that once was
but isn't any more
and once it bore, alas
the ones that live in lore
and in legends as well
for their fates changed
and so these two could dwell
this land 'til things arranged
and they bid world farewell

There, have fun!
smilies/smile.gif
Edit: whoops, double negation...no-one noticed my flaw, right? smilies/wink.gif

[ March 16, 2003: Message edited by: Annunfuiniel ]

[Turambar]

Well Numenor is the obvious guess.

[Annunfuiniel]

Haha, maybe so but it's not the right answer! smilies/tongue.gif smilies/smile.gif

[Tar-Palantir]

Beleriand

[Annunfuiniel]

No right answer yet. Hmm, think on a bit smaller scale...

[elven maiden Earwen]

i dont no Rivendell or Lothlorien

[Annunfuiniel]

No, though they fit too quite nicely - exept for the last line, Valinor is still in the world, isn't it? smilies/smile.gif

[Tar-Palantir]

I am now feeling silly even saying it smilies/tongue.gif - but I will, is it Aman?

[Annunfuiniel]

No, it's not Aman either, but no need to feel silly. smilies/wink.gif
I altered one line slightly to make it more specific. Hope that helps! smilies/smile.gif

[Estanesse]

Are those two Beren and Luthien
If so my answer would be Tol Galen

[Annunfuiniel]

You found it, Estanesse, well done! (Dor Firn-i-Guinar was the name of Tol Galen while Beren and Luthien dwelled there.) Your turn. smilies/smile.gif

[Estanesse]

Ok,thank you. smilies/smile.gif
Here comes my little riddle

I am were it is cold
Taller then tree
Misty all around
The ones I harbour
Are filled with hate

[ March 16, 2003: Message edited by: Estanesse ]

[Eruanna]

The Misty Mountains?
Or maybe Caradhras?

[Annunfuiniel]

Or Thangorodrim?

[Estanesse]

No and no smilies/biggrin.gif

[elven maiden Earwen]

i was thinking of the barrow downs but they arnt taller than trees right?

[Estanesse]

No don't think they are taller the threes
smilies/biggrin.gif

[Eruanna]

Orthanc?
Barad-dur? I'm thinking tall smilies/biggrin.gif

[Estanesse]

you think tall, but not tall enough smilies/biggrin.gif

[Tar-Palantir]

Carn Dûm - high, cold, filled with hate, "Misty".

[ March 16, 2003: Message edited by: Tar-Palantir ]

[Estanesse]

Nope but you’re getting warmer