The Greatest Warrior... - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Legate of Amon Lanc · 07-27-2007, 03:40 PM

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Originally Posted by Hammerhand

I suppose Glaurung would be one of them.. seeing as he isn't Maiar or Valar.

Well, I won't classify Glaurung... you see, the means by which he fights are completely different... not "conventional"... the same as with Treebeard... say, I would limit the choice to just Men, Elves, Dwarves, Dúnedain and Hobbits. Otherwise you could say even Mumak... but the title reads "the greatest WARRIOR" and I won't label Glaurung as "Warrior", nor Treebeard... Warrior is someone who wields a sword or some other weapon, or at least wrestles... Glaurung bites and... Treebeard does something strange with his arms, but he surely does not wrestle...

Bêthberry · 07-27-2007, 03:58 PM

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If it's "the most capable of destroying their opponent"

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Warrior is someone who wields a sword or some other weapon,

EOWYN

Hammerhand · 07-27-2007, 04:02 PM

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Originally Posted by Bêthberry

EOWYN

NO! lol!

Legate of Amon Lanc · 07-27-2007, 04:04 PM

Well, I of course assumed, that the words

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the most capable of destroying their opponent

do not mean one particular opponent, but any opponent. You cannot say Farmer Maggot was the greatest warrior just because he was the most capable of destroying his opponent, who was a cockroach, whom he totally crushed under his foot and almost nothing remained of him. Not even Fingolfin managed to crush Morgoth into such little pieces. But generally, Farmer Maggot, nor Éowyn I believe, would be able to face, let's say, Morgoth.

Though, when we speak of it, Éowyn is a good choice. I believe she could be able to stand maybe even up to Glaurung, or Sauron (though in both cases with some difficulties, no doubt). But I don't believe she would (in contrary to my nominated champion Fingolfin) even scratch Morgoth.

Raynor · 07-27-2007, 04:14 PM

I am surprised to see that no one mentioned Feanor. I wonder if this is due to the fact that he doesn't come out as a favorite character for everyone, to be polite. However, he is described as the "mightiest of the Noldor", or, more generally, "mightiest in all parts of body and mind, in valour, in endurance, in beauty, in understanding, in skill, in strength and in subtlety alike, of all the Children of Iluvatar". True enough, we ought to take into consideration that he is not the brightest commander ever.

Legate of Amon Lanc · 07-27-2007, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raynor

I am surprised to see that no one mentioned Feanor. I wonder if this is due to the fact that he doesn't come out as a favorite character for everyone, to be polite. However, he is described as the "mightiest of the Noldor", or, more generally, "mightiest in all parts of body and mind, in valour, in endurance, in beauty, in understanding, in skill, in strength and in subtlety alike, of all the Children of Iluvatar". True enough, we ought to take into consideration that he is not the brightest commander ever.

Maybe the reason you mentioned played its part somewhere there as well

However, I would imagine Fëanor also sort of a... well, not exactly a warrior. Yes, a warrior... but not that it would be his main... how to explain it... you see, Fëanor is simply "Multiclass"

Fingolfin is mainly a warrior, as well as Túrin and Húrin and rest of the folk... though as you mention the quotation, I wonder if it's not after all the one I was speaking about in my first post here... but that does not mean he would need to be the greatest warrior... od does it? Body... endurance... valour...strength?

Estelyn Telcontar · 07-27-2007, 04:29 PM

As an opinion topic, this has been moved to the Novices and Newcomers forum, where similar threads are located. Please continue to read and write there - thanks!

Raynor · 07-27-2007, 04:43 PM

Well, Fingolfin is described as the "strongest, the most steadfast, and the most valiant". These two statements seem to go head to head, unless Tolkien was referring to Feanor's fire, when talking about his strength - and thus considering a spiritual potence, which might or might not translate into physical/combative aptitude, depending on how hot-headed he was at the moment. So, it may be that the answer is Feanor, if he keeps his cool, otherwise it's Fingolfin.

Hammerhand · 07-27-2007, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

Well, I won't classify Glaurung... you see, the means by which he fights are completely different... not "conventional"... the same as with Treebeard... say, I would limit the choice to just Men, Elves, Dwarves, Dúnedain and Hobbits. Otherwise you could say even Mumak... but the title reads "the greatest WARRIOR" and I won't label Glaurung as "Warrior", nor Treebeard... Warrior is someone who wields a sword or some other weapon, or at least wrestles... Glaurung bites and... Treebeard does something strange with his arms, but he surely does not wrestle...

Are you being treeist

or naturist rather

lol. I can see your angle, warrior being a title to those who fight conventionally. But Ents and Dragons are mortal too - i think for the purpose of the thread i agree, that "conventional" warriors are probably the limitation to the choice

Raynor · 07-27-2007, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

Warrior is someone who wields a sword or some other weapon, or at least wrestles... Glaurung bites and

Hm, why would you disregard his fire-throwing abilities? It is a most formidable weapon by itself

07-27-2007, 04:14 PM	#5
Raynor Eagle of the Star Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Sarmisegethuza Posts: 1,058	I am surprised to see that no one mentioned Feanor. I wonder if this is due to the fact that he doesn't come out as a favorite character for everyone, to be polite. However, he is described as the "mightiest of the Noldor", or, more generally, "mightiest in all parts of body and mind, in valour, in endurance, in beauty, in understanding, in skill, in strength and in subtlety alike, of all the Children of Iluvatar". True enough, we ought to take into consideration that he is not the brightest commander ever. __________________ "May the wicked become good. May the good obtain peace. May the peaceful be freed from bonds. May the freed set others free."

07-27-2007, 04:29 PM	#7
Estelyn Telcontar Princess of Skwerlz Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: where the Sea is eastwards (WtR: 6060 miles) Posts: 7,500	As an opinion topic, this has been moved to the Novices and Newcomers forum, where similar threads are located. Please continue to read and write there - thanks! __________________ 'Mercy!' cried Gandalf. 'If the giving of information is to be the cure of your inquisitiveness, I shall spend all the rest of my days in answering you. What more do you want to know?' 'The whole history of Middle-earth...'

07-27-2007, 04:43 PM	#8
Raynor Eagle of the Star Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Sarmisegethuza Posts: 1,058	Well, Fingolfin is described as the "strongest, the most steadfast, and the most valiant". These two statements seem to go head to head, unless Tolkien was referring to Feanor's fire, when talking about his strength - and thus considering a spiritual potence, which might or might not translate into physical/combative aptitude, depending on how hot-headed he was at the moment. So, it may be that the answer is Feanor, if he keeps his cool, otherwise it's Fingolfin. __________________ "May the wicked become good. May the good obtain peace. May the peaceful be freed from bonds. May the freed set others free."