Tol-in-Gaurhoth LXVIII: A Full Moon Over Innsmouth

[Roa_Aoife]

So now we have two seers and a ranger? Oh man...

Morsul, if you're the dreamer, who did you dream?

Hakon, that was totally unnecessary. You were in no danger whatsoever, and if the wolves had tried to kill pitchwife toNight, they wouldn't have made a kill and we'd be up an advantage.

I'm pretty sure Morsul is the Agent. As such we should ignore him. (He counts as an innocent in the numbers.) I did the very same thing to seer-Rikae when I was the cobbler. Pitch wasn't in lead in the votes, and would certainly not have handed over a fellow wolf on Day 1, especially one as powerful as SPM.

Edit: Crossed with a bunch. And what did your dreams reveal about me and Inzil?

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Roa_Aoife

I'm pretty sure Morsul is the Agent. As such we should ignore him. (He counts as an innocent in the numbers.) I did the very same thing to seer-Rikae when I was the cobbler. Pitch wasn't in lead in the votes, and would certainly not have handed over a fellow wolf on Day 1, especially one as powerful as SPM.

Agreed with this all. And now, let me go to sleep at least.

"Other stars anon shall rise/To the axis of the skies
Stars that soothe and stars that bless/With a sweet forgetfulness:
Only when my turn is o'er/Shall the past disturb thy door"

I am amazed by how much I remember.

Good night. Will be back.

[Roa_Aoife]

I can already tell this day is going to be wasted. *throws hands up and stalks off to do analysis*

Edit: Crossed with Legate

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Roa_Aoife

I can already tell this day is going to be wasted. *throws hands up and stalks off to do analysis*

Edit: Crossed with Legate

Good luck with that.

[Brinniel]

Well I just spent the last half hour doing dishes instead (they were really piling up), so there goes that time. While I haven't had time to look back at yesterDay, I did skim through toDay again. This is what I have so far:

Legate's reactions and frustrations towards all the reveals looks genuine to me, and I'm inclined to find him more innocent than not. However, he's managed to fool an entire village before, so I'll remain wary.

Roa is one who always worries me. I want to trust her, I really do. Because she's making a whole lot of sense as we try to sort through this chaos, and I do agree with a lot that she has to say. Yet she can be so deceptive, and I always fear that she is completely fooling me.

I found Loslote's behaviour a bit suspicious yesterDay, but with Spm's vote for her, I find her more innocent toDay. Considering that who'd be lynched was a complete toss-up when he voted yesterDay, I really doubt Spm would've made a wolf-on-wolf vote.

While I don't particularly suspect Inzil just yet, I'm getting the feeling that I should keep a close eye on him. And perhaps when I get the chance I'll reread his posts more thoroughly.

Kitanna hasn't posted enough for me to form an opinion of her yet, but she's also one I always watch closely because she can be sneaky and I believe she's had a history of surviving as a lone wolf to the end...so she can most definitely fool an entire village.

I can't think of much else now, and I'm too tired to. I don't know how much participation I can give in the morning, but considering I don't have any suspect as of now, I hope to make some progress before I make my vote.

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Brinniel

I don't know if I would see his claim as a joke, though perhaps I can see where she's coming from on the idea that maybe he's an ordo who made a severely wrong move. Considering his behaviour so far, I wouldn't be surprised if that turned out so.

I would. Even a very confused ordo should have realised that he would only be getting the (presumed) real Dreamer killed if he succeeded. I mean, along with repeatedly denouncing "the impostor" Pitchwife, he also urged the Ranger not to protect him (#166). Does that sound like a misguided ordo trying to draw fire from the real Seer to you? Really?

Originally Posted by Brinniel

Though when I think about it, when I was a newbie I had difficulty understanding immediately what the role of cobbler exactly was. Is it at all possible Morsul is confused on what the agent does which is why he's going along with it?

Or possibly he really does think he's allowed to switch sides.

But of course, if he's just an ordo, then the false Priest– whichever it is– might be the real Agent. In which case if the real Priest were to die toNight, there'd be no call for us to lynch the impostor next Day...

You see why I'm getting worried about Nienna and her "if one of them's a wolf" business?

EDIT:spelling.

[Lariren Shadow]

*reads thread...screams**is also fully aware we are to be talking about not the revels*

Ok, so at the moment we have two reveals for what are pretty much the most crucial roles of the game at the moment(not saying the Changed isn't important but...well at the moment these are the two best defense we've got).

The Dreamer revels...well if I sort of had any doubts about Pitch my doubts about Morsul have increased ten fold. However, I am leaning towards what others are saying about him maybe being the Agent. Mostly because he is new to the game and possibly a new confused Agent would think of a bold and risky move to either get the wolves attention or to save the pack. Though I'm not sure who he is trying to save, but time(hopefully) will tell.

The Priest revels...klsdfskfj...Ok now that that is out. I have no idea what to think. On one hand Hakon's boasty "haha! I has fooled the wolves by not protecting Pitch but I shall toNight! And oh yes! Let me add that I know SPM was a wolf!" sounds very much like him. But at the same time it sounds enough like him to make me doubt it. He did some weird game logic stuff before and for all we know this is the same thing.

And then Wilwa revels. And claims that no really she totally did protect Pitch last Night. And even admits saying that was who she protected was bad(after being caught by Roa(?). Her revel seems...more I don't want to say genuine, because in his own way Hakon sounds very genuine. Her's seems less gloating. And she mentioned that there were clues, which can obviously be faked and planted everywhere, but some people do rely on them to work and for when they revel having tangible evidence to prove their role.

However, this could be a bold move by two wolves trying to survive. Or this is what my sleepy brain thinks could be a possibility.

Originally Posted by Nienna

Just saw this... it worries me... I've seen more than one wolf jokingly say they are a wolf to have it brushed off (which it was).

I have no idea what to believe anymore in this game.

I really wish I could think better. I also hope that I can wake myself up for deadline because at the moment my definatly partially dehydrated worked a full shift mind is not coming to anything anymore right now. I'm going to set my alarm for an hour and a half before deadline and hopefully will wake up and participate. If its only to vote very sorry.

Speaking of votes, because I needed to keep track:
Hakon --> Wilwa
Morsul --> Hakon
Crayon --> Morsul

[Pitchwife]

I'm back, and I notice there's been a lot of action in my absence.
Morsul certainly has been entertaining, but the show has collapsed by now. Probably Agent, so let's just ignore him for now.
Between Hakon and wilwa, it's hard to tell. Hakon's reveal certainly seems premature (now look who's talking!), but I think him quite capable of pulling off a gamble last Night; he might even be an ordo trying to confuse the wolves. On the other hand, wilwa blurting out that she's already protected me last Night would be strange if she's genuine - it's basically telling the wolves to come and get me. Right now I'm leaning slightly towards believing Hakon, but I'd advocate against lynching either of them toDay (sheer egoism: with two Priests around, my chances of survival are dramatically increased). Things may sort themselves out in the Morning.
So yes, we need to look at everybody else. Unfortunately I can't stick around much longer (must be off to work soon and won't be back before DL) and don't really have enough time for any deep analysis - so I'll do a hurried survey and then a hasty early vote *horror*.
Oh yes, and an urgent plea to our Changed: please stay quiet, there's enough confusion already!

(x-ed w/ Lari)

[Pitchwife]

Argh. This mess sucks. I'm afraid every vote I could make at the moment would be rushed and bordering on randomness, so I'll rather not vote at all toDay. If I survive, I'll make up for it toMorrow, promise - if not, good luck! Cthulhu bless you!

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Lariren Shadow

However, I am leaning towards what others are saying about him maybe being the Agent. Mostly because he is new to the game and possibly a new confused Agent would think of a bold and risky move to either get the wolves attention or to save the pack. Though I'm not sure who he is trying to save, but time(hopefully) will tell.

Nobody– I think he was hoping to get Pitchwife lynched, or at least left unprotected.

Originally Posted by Lariren Shadow

However, this could be a bold move by two wolves trying to survive. Or this is what my sleepy brain thinks could be a possibility.

In which case the wolves are in the interesting situation of having to keep the real Ranger (whoever that may be) alive, since his death would expose both of them. With only two wolves left, that seems suicidal.

What gets me is that both of them sound genuine! While at the same time each has done something about equally foolish/suspicious.

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

Oh yes, and an urgent plea to our Changed: please stay quiet, there's enough confusion already!

Good thinking. I was just about to reveal, but– darn it! Now look what you made me do <=Now that is a joke reveal.

EDIT:X'd with Pitchwife.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Okay, first, let me sum up the Gifted nonsenses so that I may get this over with from my part.

Morsul I would believe is indeed an agent, Pitch is still most likely a real Dreamer, and as for the Priest, hard to say. I guess we should indeed let this sort out by itself, like Roa said.

1. No reason to lynch Morsul, as I'd think he's an Agent, and there is no reason whatsoever to lynch the Agent. (However, I sympathise with Crayon's vote, as I can see the point. Though not that I encourage such behavior in general.)

2. With the Rangers, we do more harm with lynching one than with letting them be, as if one of them is a real one and one a Wolf, then most likely it's the problem for the WWs, and they will kill the real Ranger one Night. It's really nonsense for the WWs to keep the real Ranger alive, at least by the end, when there are some six people remaining, if such a pair of them was still alive, then it'll be really easy to catch a Wolf then. Aside from that, Ranger can wreak havoc upon the WWs by protecting people, the longer he survives, the bigger his chances are. So I really say we leave these two be as well. (As for whom of them I believe more, I have some reasons for each, in short as for Hakon, I mostly said my feelings before when he revealed, only to note also I wonder that he used the word "ranger" and not "priest" to label himself, though whatever. Wilwa, in some ways it would make more sense, I could imagine her reacting like that if she was true Ranger, on the other hand... well, actually honestly, her revelation does not make much sense for me, even if she was a Ranger and even if she was a Wolf, but it could be pretty irrational, especially if she is true Ranger and sees Hakon's claim. But like I said, let's leave it be for now.)

That means, let's focus on others. I do not, alas, have much time to do anything now, but first, a few random remarks of what I noted while reading the thread. Later I hope to post something more yet.

Originally Posted by Inziladun

Theoretically, Pitch could be a wolf, and his giving up SPM a plot to ensure his being thought innocent the rest of the game.
However, if Pitch survives beyond Day 3 or so, I would have to assume he was a wolf and go for him. Everyone knows that a revealed Seer is a dead Seer. It's only a matter of time. If he wasn't killed by the wolves after the oportunities for the Priest to protect him ran out, we'd have his number.
I do appreciate your giving me the all-clear though, as I am indeed innocent.

Okay, this is making me slightly uneasy, especially considering that Morsul indeed must be a fake. It looks like jumping on whatever train rides by, and maybe trying if there is a chance to get rid of the real Seer. On the other hand, perhaps it'd be slightly too uncautious from a wolf.

Originally Posted by Roa_Aoife

As for the seers, well the wolves would be really foolish to leave the real seer alive to continue dreaming. Which means that every day Morsul and Pitch are still alive, the should post their dreams. If either finds a wolf, we lynch the "wolf." If it's a real wolf, hooray, we killed a real wolf. If not we know who the liar is. If it's an innocent, well, when the real seer dies we will have a list of known innocents.

Logically, one of the seers is the Agent and one of the rangers is a wolf.

Everyone else, I highly doubt there is more than one wolf in the mix. Definitely the agent, a wolf, and two gifteds. Which mean that there is still a wolf out there. Let's let this mess sort it out, because it will, and move on to finding the other wolf hiding in all of this chaos.

Roa looks good to me, and I agree with the elaboration of hers above which I quote.

By the way, and this was asked before, maybe we should ask McCabber Himself, how many WWs are around, then? There is nothing on the Admin thread about it, and the first narration says something about "four paws", though that is by no means anything official.

Originally Posted by Morsul the Dark

Wow my memory is that bad huh? I'm so caught up in Pitchwife's claim I'm forgetting who's innocent... Well I hope a slip of memory doesn't make everyone make the wrong choice about the real seer

(I marked this post to quote while I was still reading the thread... well, hilarious, obviously )

Originally Posted by Roa_Aoife

Please, people. If you are wrong about the person you think is a wolf, then you are killing a gifted, which plays right into the wolves hands. There is only a 1/4 chance of getting the right person, and 1/2 chance of killing a gifted. Are you really going to risk killing a gifted on odds like that? We need the ranger alive and we need the seer alive.

That mess will definitely sort itself out. Just leave it be for now and don't risk our gifted on something you can't be sure of.

Agreed, and just repeating it to prove the point.

Originally Posted by Loslote

I agree that we should leave them be. If Wilwa is the seer, then the wolves can kill Pitchie. But then we know that Hakon's a wolf, and we can lynch him. If Hakon's the seer, then they can't kill Pitchie toNight. But if Pitchie doesn't die, it doesn't prove that Hakon's the ranger, it just gives a bit more legitimacy to his claim. Therefore, we only know for sure who's the ranger if Pitchie dies toNight. I'm definitely not happy with that, but what can you do?

By the way, this is actually a pretty good point too. So we WILL basically know the true Ranger by the next morning, even if the WWs don't kill the real one.

Brinn looks good to me, too, and sensible, by her posting.

I did not, this far, pay much attention to Nogrod, as I'd really need to go through his posts and focus on him in particular. Anyway, he's not around today, I may do that as long as there are not too many posts, let's see. I also want to check Nerwen. Somebody said that Kitanna may be good in fooling the village, it's true she seems genuine to me, but who knows. I am probably going to check these people as soon as I can. But now, I will probably leave and not sure how long before DL I'll come back (I have also other RL things to do). I will drop by, if nothing more, though.

[Morsul the Dark]

Don't you see how cunningly he's pulling this off?

I think the early reveal was pretty bold, of course when I expose him I come under scrutiny, Seriously guys come on as I understand the track record you lost a seer on day1 the past few times don't let it happen again... We're off to a great start

Pitch and Brinn are My forerunners

Nerwen although not as strongly suspect

Legate voted for SPM but tried to make it look like he did so logically but then basically said "Fine SPM"

[Inziladun]

Here's why I have a tough time with this, Morsul.

Theoretically, Pitch could be a wolf, and his giving up SPM a plot to ensure his being thought innocent the rest of the game.
However, if Pitch survives beyond Day 3 or so, I would have to assume he was a wolf and go for him. Everyone knows that a revealed Seer is a dead Seer. It's only a matter of time. If he wasn't killed by the wolves after the oportunities for the Priest to protect him ran out, we'd have his number.
I do appreciate your giving me the all-clear though, as I am indeed innocent.

[wilwarin538]

Originally Posted by Morsul the Dark

Wow I missed a lot Especially Pitch Revealing himself as the seer, Here's why that's suspicious to me, because I'm the dreamer I'm thinking Pitch revealed either to save himself from lynching or more likely to get in our good graces by giving up one of his fellow wolfs... If that's the case then Brinn is highly suspect too. Look how quickly she accepted his deception.

Although Nerwen is still fairly suspect very bandwagondish, though maybe not wolfish. By the way he drew a lot of interest yesterday so I checked out Inzil he's clear.

Although I won't vote in my first post this time I'd like to point out Pitch fooled us once let's be weary of any suggestions he has. I mean Come on he "dreamed" about the person was kill conveniently unhelpful isn't it?

Edit: Crossed with Legate

Both Pitch and Morsul are making me uneasy. I really don't know which is really being truthful. I am tempted to believe Morsul though. I mean think about it, if he was faking it wouldn't he have said that he too had dreamt of SPM?? Just to make it more believable? I don't know it's tough.....

Oh my Hakon. So I was right to vote you yesterDay. You're really going to make me do this aren't you??

I'm the Priest! I've never been the ranger before so I was panicked last Night and protected Pitch, I was too scared to bluff the wolves. I have no idea what I'll do toNight. Oh, and I`ve been using the ring as my symbol on all my posts, to represent the rings that Priests wear when they make their vows.

Therefore Hakon must either be a wolf or the Agent (leaning towards Agent, too bold for a wolf I think). This game has gotten ridiculous.

Sorry to just drop this on you guys, but I really have to get some studying done, just didn`t want Hakon to get away with this.

[Roa_Aoife]

Originally Posted by wilwarin538

Both Pitch and Morsul are making me uneasy. I really don't know which is really being truthful. I am tempted to believe Morsul though. I mean think about it, if he was faking it wouldn't he have said that he too had dreamt of SPM?? Just to make it more believable? I don't know it's tough.....

Oh my Hakon. So I was right to vote you yesterDay. You're really going to make me do this aren't you??

I'm the Priest! I've never been the ranger before so I was panicked last Night and protected Pitch, I was too scared to bluff the wolves. I have no idea what I'll do toNight. Oh, and I`ve been using the ring as my symbol on all my posts, to represent the rings that Priests wear when they make their vows.

Therefore Hakon must either be a wolf or the Agent (leaning towards Agent, too bold for a wolf I think). This game has gotten ridiculous.

Sorry to just drop this on you guys, but I really have to get some studying done, just didn`t want Hakon to get away with this.

Ok, had to calm down. Firstly, if Hakon is evil then you just played right into his hands. Secondly, why would you say you protected Pitch last night? You could have bluffed and said you didn't and we could have had the seer one more night.

All these reveals are driving me insane. Gifteds are supposed to be unknown. This is rediculous. I hope the hunter has the common sense to stay quiet.

[Morsul the Dark]

Sorry Roa I wanted to stay quiet but I couldn't let Pitch get away with this I mean we'd be crazy to protect him like that.

[Roa_Aoife]

Morsul, Pitch would have been killed had he survived much longer than a revealed seer should. If you're really the seer then all you've done is reveal yourself to the wolves.

Pitch also handed us a wolf. You handed us two innocents which are the easiest thing for a trickster to reveal. Because if you're a wolf then you know who's innocent. If you say a gifted is innocent, they'd assume you were just trying to hide their real role as an act of protection. An Agent can't fail, because no way is a wolf declared innocent gonna say that they're not. As for handing over a wolf?

Pitch is either a bumbling Agent, a bold wolf who's plan cannot possibly succeed, or the real dreamer. The odds are with a dreamer, because I have never seen a baddie pretending to be a seer claim that they know a wolf.

[Roa_Aoife]

Also, to the village as a whole:

The real ranger and seer will be killed by the wolves. I tried leaving a revealed ranger alive in a game to freak people out, and it bit me in the... well you know what I mean. It's tactic that's overly bold, even for me. So I say we leave Hakon and Wilwa alone. The real ranger can continue in their duties and the fake one can attempt their shenanigans and the real one will be killed. So, Hakon, if you are the ranger, protect Pitch. Wilwa, if you are the ranger, protect Morsul.

As for the seers, well the wolves would be really foolish to leave the real seer alive to continue dreaming. Which means that every day Morsul and Pitch are still alive, the should post their dreams. If either finds a wolf, we lynch the "wolf." If it's a real wolf, hooray, we killed a real wolf. If not we know who the liar is. If it's an innocent, well, when the real seer dies we will have a list of known innocents.

Logically, one of the seers is the Agent and one of the rangers is a wolf.

Everyone else, I highly doubt there is more than one wolf in the mix. Definitely the agent, a wolf, and two gifteds. Which mean that there is still a wolf out there. Let's let this mess sort it out, because it will, and move on to finding the other wolf hiding in all of this chaos.

Edit: Edit crossed and bolding. Wilwa, if you doubt Pitch then you think Morsul is the seer so don't protect yourself. If you're really the ranger and you die, then we can catch Hakon. Don't protect yourself- it only helps you and not the rest of us.

[wilwarin538]

Originally Posted by Roa_Aoife

Ok, had to calm down. Firstly, if Hakon is evil then you just played right into his hands. Secondly, why would you say you protected Pitch last night? You could have bluffed and said you didn't and we could have had the seer one more night.

I know I know . I posted that then got off the computer to study for a bit, and I realised afterwards I should have never said who I protected, so I came back on. Besides, I'm not even positive Pitch is the dreamer, it could be Morsul. But it's so obvious to me that Hakon is evil, I just wanted it to be out there so we can definitely get a baddie today. I could always protect myself toNight and then get another protection (that only I know about) the following Night, or something. Like I said, I've never played this role before, so I'm not used to it.