TIG XCIV– WHere the Stars Are Strange (Game thread)

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by Pomegranate

not that sure what that says to everyone about me, but when for once someone says something else than "she seems sharp", I remember it :P

You might not be able to fully experience a Downsian WW game until you've had a good, passionate row with me, but honestly, you need to start looking 20 times more suspicious for that to happen. Until then, you're going to be on my "Smart. Sharp player. Her, I like." list. It's probably a terribly boring list to be on, but you'll be on it until I actually see "Not only is she all that, but she's evil too. Her, I like, but keep a closer eye on!"

Originally Posted by Inzil

I don't know about Boro. He feels less "natural" for him toDay than he did yesterDay. I'm used to an innocent Boro being a cunning, bold wolf-hunter and I really haven't seen that.

Maybe if I actually had some gift in this game, I would see your point about not being myself. But really, I know nothing more than any other non-spy or seer. All I can do here is if I see it, call bs on someone and hopefully not do something disastrous like lynching the seer. If I can manage that, I think I've done the best I can, you lot...expect too much from me.

But I do realize I've been rubbish as far as giving my clear thoughts about today/lynching Nog/Ranger killed. It's nothing you're missing though, when it's essentially "I would not in the least bit have a problem with lynching Legate and/or* Shasta today."

*Yes, and/or, because I think there's been enough concentration on the two of them, for me...I've had enough Legate/Shasta in one sitting. I would propose orchestrating double-lynch, if not for the very fact that all of you are flippin' mad today and it's making me mental. So, attempting to put together a double-lynch would drive me more bonkers than what it would actually be worth.

I'm well aware there are more spies than just Legate a/o Shasta, but I am perhaps the worst multi-tasker you'll ever know. Give me one thing to do. I'll execute it and then move on to the next thing. Asking me to jumble all these ideas of a Legate-Shasta-Pitch, Shasta-Lommy-Greenie, Legate-sally-Lommy spy combinations is a processing overload for me. So unless you want my brain to explode, let me go about my business one step at a time. Starting with either Legate or Shasta today. Comprende?

Edit: crossed with everyone since Pom's that I quoted

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Eönwë

-The fact that Zil is innocent is the reason I was looking at Boro. I mean, the hint seems to pretty explicitly say that Inzil was the hunting target, and the fact that Nog tried to shift it to Boro seems quite bad.

Interesting. It would, but does the hint really explicitely say that it is Inzil? I am still not getting the whole hint business...

Originally Posted by Inziladun

I thought so. You'd suspected me pretty strongly on Day 1. Then on Day 2, you dismissed me as a threat. When you revealed, it made sense. That's the reason I was so quick to trust you.

And I owe you apologies for the really strong suspicion, and for calling you weird, although... well, there was something weird about your behavior. But well, happens.

Originally Posted by Boromir88

*Yes, and/or, because I think there's been enough concentration on the two of them, for me...I've had enough Legate/Shasta in one sitting. I would propose orchestrating double-lynch, if not for the very fact that all of you are flippin' mad today and it's making me mental. So, attempting to put together a double-lynch would drive me more bonkers than what it would actually be worth.

No, please, NO. Okay, if Shasta is a Wolf, it would be better, but... hmm. Now I am thinking (since most people don't trust me much and I might be lynched anyway) whether not to try it and in case Shasta turns out innocent, totally lynch Boro for orchestrating such a massacre of innocents. I am only not sure if it is worth it. Two deaths are really a lot (if it turned out we both were innocent). I mean, if I knew for sure that Shasta was a Wolf, I'd be willing to even go and sacrifice myself along with him (for the sake of more clarity in the village). But despite all my suspicion of him, I can't be sure, of course. And I really hate double-lynches.

Also, anyway, if we really did it, it doesn't mean letting Boro off the hook. Quite the opposite. I mean, such a lynch, even if Shasta was a Wolf, would serve the Wolves just as well as us, number-wise. (If not even better. Somebody with better math skills should calculate that.)

I wonder what people think about it.

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

No, please, NO. Okay, if Shasta is a Wolf, it would be better, but... hmm. Now I am thinking (since most people don't trust me much and I might be lynched anyway) whether not to try it and in case Shasta turns out innocent, totally lynch Boro for orchestrating such a massacre of innocents. I am only not sure if it is worth it. Two deaths are really a lot (if it turned out we both were innocent). I mean, if I knew for sure that Shasta was a Wolf, I'd be willing to even go and sacrifice myself along with him (for the sake of more clarity in the village). But despite all my suspicion of him, I can't be sure, of course. And I really hate double-lynches.

And relax. I wasn't being serious with that double lynch, but expressing my annoyance at both of you, and overall annoyance at this "Legate-Lottie-Shasta" "Lommy-sally-Shasta" spy-trifecta chatter today. Annoyed to the point where, at this time I couldn't care less if either you or Shasta were lynched, therefor you could both go. Give a few hours to have some hot chocolate, watch some guilty pleasure/trash and I'll be significantly less annoyed.

[Loslote]

I've got to vote early, so I'll go ahead and

++Legate

For the reasons stated in my earlier post, especially his reaction to Steve's reveal. Good lynching, everyone!

[Inziladun]

Smilies removed. This is not a comprehensive "everything he said" list, just some things that stood out.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

so I think it's a bit strange that Legate continues going after Inzil with a point that he specifically mentioned wasn't a point against Inzil.

Casts a little suspicion onto Legate.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Nogrod's #23 is a long, well-written post that doesn't really say much. For one, it's another "hate on random votes" post, and for another, it's his thoughts on the Acolyte. All well and good, but it seems he's replying to something Legate was using against Inzil at the time, which doesn't really fit.

A small point against Nog.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

And in a bit of a turnaround, Inzil's #24 is another answer to Legate that's basically been the same as his previous answers. Could be a case of "talking too much yet saying nothing", but I still tend to think Legate is the fishier of the two.

Ok, so in the Acolyte debate of Legate and I he finds Legate "fishier" there.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

In #29, Inzil mentions that Rikae agrees with him and then doesn't like the emptiness of his posts, which looks like an opportunistic kind of "hey, look, that's suspicious" move - except in the post he quotes, Rikae says she agrees with Legate, not Inzil. Interesting.

Says I was "opportunistic" when I pointed out what I thought was a contradiction on Rikae's part.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

...What? You just got through basically reprimanding Inzil for discussion that doesn't accomplish anything, and now you're giving him a license to continue? That's.... awkward, Steve, very awkward indeed.

Scolds Eönwë for further questioning about the Acolyte business.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Pitch is now the second person to basically say 'Yeah, Legate had a good point on Inzil' (Greenie was the first.) And that bothers me, since Legate specifically said that what he was saying was "nothing against Zil". It's also worth noting that though Pitch apparently agrees with Legate's point, he hangs back a bit with "whenever I've suspected him because of it I've been wrong" - almost in a way that leaves him an out in case an Inzil lynch happens.

Brings some suspicion on Pitch. That's all from the same post.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

If you're talking about when she blew up at Rikae, I tend to disagree here (what? Shasta disagrees with Nogrod?) And I tend to disagree with Boro, too, when he mentioned that "that's typical G55." I'm almost certain I've never seen G55 explode like that, and the post she made after to clarify what she was saying (indeed, that she felt like she had to clarify at all) looks suspicious to me.

Also, the fact that it's Nogrod, of all people, defending what seems to be an emotional outburst is an immediate red flag.

Attacks Nog for defending G55.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Okay... Lottie's post was pretty obviously a joke to me, given that it's Lottie (and given the wink smiley.) So you're thinking it's Lottie, not Inzil who looks weird there? But I thought you were just thinking it was Inzil (see above)? If that's the case, then you look like you're scrambling to make the same evidence fit a different theory now that your first one's been debunked, if that makes sense. Right now, that looks bad.

This was against Lommy.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

In Legate's #68 (and, apparently, in his list from earlier, as I think that's where Eonwe got his quote), he apparently legitimately suspects Inzil? Which, then, looks a bit like a Legatewolf going "Hey, people bought that? Okay, let's go with it!"

More suspicion on Legate.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

...You're kidding. Who are you and what have you done with Nogrod?! That's so unlike what you'd normally say that I'm almost forced to look for a reason why you'd be protecting G55.

And more suspicion on Nog.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Well... in Inzil's post here -

- he pretty well answers that, in my opinion. So why mention it yet again? Legate, you do realize you've been doing basically the same thing as what you say Inzil's been doing, right?

Takes Legate to task about suspecting me for supposedly not answering him about the Acolyte deal.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Also, Inzil at #96 - all the talk about you apparently not just posting "empty posts" and you post something like this? Man...

This was the post he was talking about. I thought he was really reaching in calling that "empty".

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

He's explained himself twice. I find it interesting that you missed both instances, and I find it even more interesting that you're finding Inzil this suspicious right after A) he starts getting votes (Rikae's in particular) and B) he votes for you.

Doesn't like Eönwë's suspicions of me.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Leaning Very Innocent:
Shasta - Duh.

Leaning Innocent:
Boro - Two major reasons: one, I agree with him regarding G55; two, he's getting what seems to be a rather large amount of suspicion from people I'm currently suspicious of.

Rikae - I debated with myself for a bit before putting her here, instead of "No read", because she has been posting. It may be that her posts stick out less in my mind because they aren't gigantic walls of text; everything she's said thus far looks fairly ship-shape. I don't know that I agree with her vote, but she hasn't said anything that's made me think her overtly suspicious.

Pitch - Nothing Pitch has done today has really set off any alarm bells for me. Even though he's said a fair bit today, he almost went under the radar for me because I just remember him saying a fair bit without actually remembering much of the content - except when he argued a bit with Nogrod. I remember concentrating on that part especially.

Lottie - Like Boro, has been taking some heat from other people I find more suspicious. She's also said quite a bit that I happen to agree with. I don't find her suspicious at the moment.

Leaning Worse than Innocent, Better than Guilty:
Steve - Was tending to think him more innocent than not until his most recent post against Inzil. A lot about that post looks odd, especially the timing of it.

Greenie - Not a lot here to go on, but more than anyone in the "Not Leaning at All" category. I don't really agree with her vote.

Inzil - I'm not certain that he's an innocent. That said, there are some indicators that he was the target of a witchhunt today, for good or ill (I'm leaning ill, myself.)

Leaning Guilty:
G55 - I was fine with her until she exploded earlier. After that, I felt like her clarification of said explosion was basically used to make people more confident of her innocence ("A wolf wouldn't act like that," etc).

Lommy - I was on the same page with her regarding the Lottie/Inzil Case of the Ambiguous Posts until Inzil mentioned that he was talking about something completely different. I thought that was the end of it until Lommy began talking about ways that that made Lottie look bad in a way that almost looked like she was looking for support.

Nogrod - I admit, most of the reason he's in this category is his apparent connection to G55, whom I also find suspicious. His reaction to and subsequent defense of her was so incredibly counter to normal Nogrod that I just can't see that being his real thoughts on the matter.

Legate - The apparent leader of what has looked to me like a witchhunt on Inzil. Apparently missed it the first time Inzil explained himself, and hasn't posted since he explained it the second time. Still, the fact that he mentioned in the beginning that what he was saying wasn't a point against Inzil, and didn't change his mind until a fair number of people seemed to share his ideas, looks bad to me.

Not Leaning at All:
Sally
Pomegranate
Eruhen
Bom


I will likely end up voting someone in the "Guilty" category today.

Ok, so he has me in the middle category with Steve, and both Nog and Legate in the worst section.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

I'll comment on the rest momentarily, but I want to get this thought out there as quickly as possible to give everyone time to consider - I would, personally, be not at all averse to lynching Bom. Think about it for a second - why, even beyond Legate's thought (which is currently the prevailing mood, sad as it is to say), I can nearly guarantee that later, down the road, someone will say "man I wish we could lynch Bom, but we can't now, it's too late in the game." Because, as I recall, Bom does this quite a bit, and people say exactly what has been said thus far - that is, chastising him for it but not really doing anything about it. Because the general opinion is either "oh that's just Bom" or "a wolf wouldn't do that, oh well."

So if people want to lynch Bom, I'm all for it. It's about time our threat of "participate or face a lynch" actually had some bite to it.

Out of nowhere decides lynching Bom is a good option. As I think I said before, I can see an innocent Shasta doing this, but it was a bad idea, and good cover for a baddie.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

It looks odd that it's only after you start getting suspected and voted that you suddenly suspect Inzil as much as you did in that post. If you just woke up to find that, it's less odd (I honestly have no idea what timezone you're in, haha.)


That's precisely the point!


That's fair. But I'm not sure you realize that Lottie does that all the time. Again, that's getting into playstyle differences. But it's a point regardless.


That line has since been explained. See Lommy and Zil's conversation.

And another point I was trying to make. Why should this kind of behavior be acceptable from anyone, no matter who? And you can "strongly discourage" all you like - it's not going to change anything. It never has.


No, I understood that. I was just wondering if you saw that every time Inzil answered with the same answer, you responded again with the same question.


Uh-huh, and that leads back to the "witchhunt" I was mentioning earlier. Just what explanation would have satisfied you? Because it looks to me like you were prepared to be dissatisfied by anything Inzil said.

He defends me from Legate and Eönwë. Thinks I'm the would-be victim of a "witch hunt".

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

No, it'd be a wake-up call. No one should be allowed to slip through without participating and voting. People can say "oh, well, they didn't deserve to win" all they like when someone who just floats through the game ends up living to the end (because if they're wolves no one wants to lynch them because of lack of evidence and if they're innocent the wolves won't kill them because they're not doing anything) - it doesn't change the facts that they won, and we let them by allowing them to do so.

Defends his wanting to lynch Bom.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Well, with Lommy looking a little better now that I know where she was coming from re: Lottie, I'm going to put my money (or in this case, vote) where my mouth is.

++Bom

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

You're right, Lommy, it is a little harsh. However, I, personally, feel like it's something that has to happen at least once, or nothing will ever change.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

It's mean regardless of what I am. I know that. And I'm sure I'll change my tune once Bom proves that he's capable of actually participating in a game he signs up for. That doesn't really change anything.

Has no apparent regrets about voting for Bom. This seems fairly in character for an innocent Shasta.

Hmm. I don't know. He certainly wasn't shy about pointing accusations at people. then again, restraint really isn't Shasta's style.

Just on the basis on Day 1, I'd be inclined to think him innocent, or at least not a Spy.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Note - for this game it's likely I'll only be active during the latter half of the Day, as Sally said - the DL is 6 am my time, so yeah.

In any case, I'll comment on the most recent happenings real fast before I go back and do a post-by-post commentary.

Eonwe - Seer
Nog - Wolf
Inzil - Acolyte

Seriously? Guys. Look at the Eruhen kill. It's pretty clear at this point that the Acolyte, if not a traditional werebear, at least has the power to kill by himself (I say him because Nog being a wolf doesn't mean his points about Inzil being the Acolyte aren't valid - I've thought so myself since yesterday, as did Rikae apparently).

Nog is a wolf. Fine. Lynch him tomorrow. Lynching one wolf out of four isn't going to have any short-term effects - if we lynch Inzil (who clearly, at this point, doesn't have the best interests of the village in mind), we drop the number of kills per night to one.

++Inzil

After Steve's reveal, Shasta votes for me, saying he thought I was the Acolyte since the previous Day. He's willing to vote for me over a probable Spy Day 2, yet Day 1 he had me in his "middle" category of suspicion and voted for Bom. He said I might be the target of a witch hunt then. I have a serious problem with this inconsistency. It looks like a possible attempt by a ShastaSpy to save a mate.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

We know it kills people. I think that's quite enough.

Again, we don't know what the Acolyte does.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

However, I didn't even consider a double-lynch idea. That would solve the conundrum quite nicely. Who's left to vote? Can we pull it off?

Thinks now about a double lynch of me and Nog. What really made me suspicious about Shasta wanting to get me was that he had no certainty I was the Acolyte, or whether the Acolyte was definitely evil.

It doesn't make sense to me still how an innocent could consider the Acolyte more worthy of killing than a wolf, even if it were certain who the Acolyte was.

This makes Shasta look evil.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

I thought the narration was pretty clear on that fact, myself. Unless a "shadowy figure" isn't supposed to be suspicious.


1. Inzil was hinting at something during Day 1. If you'll remember, Rikae mentioned it quite blatantly.

2. Nog's points about it. The fact that he was a wolf doesn't really matter - the Acolyte doesn't count for the innocents or the wolves; plus, every indication was that the Acolyte was some type of Werebear, with the Eruhen kill. Wolves have an interest in getting rid of the Werebear - besides that the Werebear could kill them at night, something they aren't usually worried about, the Wolves and Werebear traditionally cannot win together. I don't think Nog's points about Inzil being the Acolyte should be discounted just because he was a wolf.

3. (and really the best point) - He hasn't denied it. Every time the subject has gotten a little too close to someone asking him directly, Inzil has either avoided the question or changed the subject.

So Shasta's willing to listen to a known Spy, who really was the one who started the ball rolling that I must be the Acolyte. And his third "point", that I hadn't denied it, is utter rubbish. Pitch mentioned that too, I think. What would it really have gained me? It's like telling someone they must be a wolf, then when they don't come right out and say they're innocent, saying "See? A real innocent would have proclaimed they were good!"

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Now then, what was so scary about wanting to double lynch Nog (a Seer-dreamt wolf) and Inzil (who I'm convinced is the Acolyte, and want to lynch)? Let's look at the votes from yesterday -

When I voted Inzil, Nog had 5 votes. Therefore, even if every person after me had voted Inzil, Nog would still have been lynched along with him.

Which, coincidentally, renders this point by Legate -

- utter bollocks, if you'll pardon the saying. Sure, the other three wolves could have voted Eonwe. That would just have required manipulation of the space-time continuum (at the point Legate said this, it was just him and Pitch left to vote), and would have put Eonwe at 5 and Nog at 6. Brilliant!

Again: There was no way to know I was the Acolyte. He was willing to gamble on killing me rather than lynch Nog.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Conclusions from above - I think Inzil is the Acolyte, I would ideally like to get rid of him before he can kill again, and some things Legate have said have been so far off the mark and unlike how I know Legate to act that it's basically Nog vol. II to my eyes at the moment.

So he wants to kill me, but thinks Legate suspicious too.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Subtle? I thought I was being quite blatant. I don't trust the Acolyte, and I don't think anyone else should. Good try, Boro.

And another thing. Your post that was basically 'you just look so suspicious Nog' was way more over-the-top than anything I've said thus far. The similarity between that and how I remember Glirdan being was too uncanny for me not to mention it. You're really reaching incredibly far here.

Some suspicion on Boro.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Well, it wasn't a modkill (Nerwen would have said so) and it wasn't a wolf kill (that was Rikae in the narration), so...? I think that's pretty clear.

He was incorrect on this, as pointed out by Steve.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Cool. I don't believe you, but cool. Then what were you really doing Day 1?

This in response to my exasperatingly saying point-blank I wasn't the Acolyte. I'm sure he would have believed had I said that Day 1.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

"Don't like" it all you wish. I'm going to keep doing it. Someone has to, because apparently no one's worried that's it's not just wolves killing us but me. Therefore, while I'm still going to be looking for wolves, I'm likely going to continue pushing an Inzil lynch.

Says right out that he wants me lynched over wolves. Despite the fact that we don't know what the Acolyte really does, and we do know what the Spies do.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Now I'm really getting annoyed. Apparently everything I say or do is going to be suspicious to someone. Also, Pitch, this is crap. Eonwe wasn't that suspected, there was no reason for an Eonwe-wolf to self-destruct by fake-revealing on D2. Therefore, he was legit, his dream on Nog was legit, and at the time it was very likely (to me, apparently, but not to anyone else) that there was going to, again, be a second kill on N2, which I wanted to prevent. This bit about "wolves concocting an emergency strategy" is rubbish, as evidenced by the nine votes on Nog yesterday.

I keep coming back to the point that he had no concrete evidence that I was the Acolyte.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

While going back and looking at Legate, I found this -


- in regards to whether Eonwe should reveal his ordo. Now, my overall reaction to Legate is still that he seems extremely fishy, but this is actually an interesting point, and one that looks fairly innocent, actually.

The main reason it caught my eye, actually, is how Legate can post well-thought-out points like this and at the same time be as wildly off-kilter as he has been? My overall conclusion on this is while the point makes him look slightly better, the dichotomy makes him look worse.

This looks like trying to keep the door open on Legate for a potential lynch, while leaving other options as well.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Boro, your post is based entirely around the fact that you think I was saying Nog was being reasonable (thus implying that I was defending him.) If you look back, you'll see that I fully believed Eonwe that Nog was a wolf - I simply thought I would try and prevent someone I thought had killing powers from killing again. What's better, two kills per night or one? You're going far, far out of your way to misrepresent me here and I don't like it one bit.

And I'm not "fixated" on the Acolyte. There's no "rampage". I keep bringing up the subject because NO ONE ELSE WILL. Seriously, everyone but me thus far has basically said "oh well we don't know the Acolyte isn't playing for the good team" and has basically left it there and I think that's wrong. The Acolyte doesn't count for innocents or wolves in the tally - how likely is it the Acolyte can only win by himself? Answer: pretty likely.

But fine. If the only response I'm going to get is "Shasta's suspicious for talking about the Acolyte" then I'll drop the subject completely. I won't even say "told you so" when the Acolyte wins by themselves.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

The narrative for N1 appears to support that Eruhen was killed by someone, not modkilled.

Oh, right. My bad. Shutting up.

This apparent frustration looks genuine on the surface, but it really doesn't look like something that should have merited such a reaction.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

I'm aware of that. Which is why I'm still looking for spies/wolves. But I still think the Acolyte is a greater threat than people are making him out to be. I suppose it's a bit like the cobbler debate - do you lynch a known cobbler, or do you keep hunting for wolves?

And once again, he didn't know anything about who the Acolyte was. You know, this whole debate would be different if, say, a Seer had outed the Acolyte.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

I already pointed out how much rubbish this point is. In fact, since I voted Inzil, I'd be very interested to hear how I supposedly threatened Eonwe yesterday.

I don't want to think I'm basically OMGUSing Legate here - I might be, certainly, but he's seemed completely (not a bit, not some, pretty much completely) off to me since the beginning.

What does OMGUS mean again?

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Wrong. I never said I wanted to lynch Eonwe, in fact I never mentioned him in the slightest. Why would I want to lynch the Seer, in any case? Yes, I mentioned that a double lynch of Inzil and Nog might be a good idea, after someone mentioned it (I'd originally forgotten about double lynches at all), but how would that have "left uncertainty"? Nog would have been just as dead. Your other point is still not very good - I already gave you the numbers to prove that even if it had been possible for the wolves to double-lynch Eonwe, they all would have been revealed after that and the game would be over! See, Legate, you keep trying to make this into a reason that I'm suspicious and it's just not working. That's what I mean about how completely off you are. I didn't mean to insult you or anything, if that's what you thought (as your last comment leads me to believe.)

He's got a point here in that Legate was misrepresenting him.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

I sense the beginnings of a witchhunt, but fine, I'll answer.

I had originally forgotten about the fact that we could double lynch - I wanted Zil gone over Nog because I felt both were bad for the innocents, but killing Inzil would have dropped the nightkills from two to one (I still thought the Acolyte was going to kill the next night.) Then, after I voted, the idea of a double lynch was mentioned, which I thought was a fine idea - kill both with one lynch.

Sidenote, Legate - it was not going to be very easy to make a double-lynch all by my lonesome, as you're implying. I knew Nog had four or five votes by then and I knew no one else had voted Inzil, but I figured it was worth a shot, and if I didn't manage it then Nog would be lynched anyway and that'd be one baddie down.

Had it been possible, yes. Once Lommy voted right after me, though, I didn't really think it was possible. Still, since there wasn't a vote tally up and I wasn't sure how many more votes were coming in, I felt like there was still a chance and I urged people to consider it.

Seriously? We'd be getting rid of a wolf and the Acolyte, who I thought (and still think) was dangerous.

If you're asking me this, then you're implying there wasn't a way to achieve that, which means your point about me endangering Eonwe, is, like I said, pretty leaky. That said, I'll answer - it would have required the cooperation of the people after me to vote; like I said, once Lommy voted I figured the chances were slim, but there was no harm in trying.

What about it? In my view, either way we were getting rid of someone who was a danger to the village. If Nog was lynched, fine - we'd gotten rid of a wolf. If Zil went instead, that was fine too - that'd be the end of the Acolyte and we could lynch Nog the next day; if Eonwe had managed to find another wolf with his dream, we could just double-lynch them, so we weren't even losing any time.

Who do I suspect? You, currently. Boro, because I think he was bussing Nog. Inzil I still suspect of Acolyte-ism, but I don't think he's a wolf, unless his "lynch me instead of Eonwe" yesterday was just a very clever wolf-front. I still have some suspicions of Lommy as well.

All that was in response to Legate. I'm inclined to think Shasta looks a bit better for it.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Nogrod on Lommy

Day 1, Nogrod barely mentions Lommy at all. He mentions her in passing in a post on Pitch and another on Lottie, then near the end of the day he says this -

and then in #122 he defends her.

What he's defending her against here is the votes she got from Eruhen (he calls it "bandwagoning in major scale" and G55 ("possible bandwagon".) It's interesting to note that most of what this post is about, seemingly, is less defense of Lommy and more a changing of his attitudes toward G55, who he started the Day very trusting of. The two (defense of Lommy and early defense of G55) actually look rather similar.

And that's all Nogrod says about Lommy on Day 1.

Day 2, Nog's #168:

Again, more a justification of his suspicion of G55 than anything about Lommy. The only thing a little bit interesting here is that last comment, which is basically a tacit endorsement of what Lommy said earlier. I suppose it could be a way to subtly reinforce good vibes about Lommy, but it's such a small thing that I doubt it.

Here he's answering Pitch about the Bom lynch, and mentions that he had no reason to vote for Lommy as he had nothing against her. And he hasn't, so that's okay.

Nog's #201 is in answer to a post of Lommy's from earlier, and he's very neutral about it, just basically responding to something she said rather than attacking her or defending her at all.

A short quote from #228:

Again in response to G55. Mentions again that Lommy was going to be bandwagoned.


This is what Nog had to say about Lommy from his list post, #234, right after Eonwe's reveal. Again, very neutral, nothing for or against.

And then he doesn't mention her again after that.

So, conclusions - well, there aren't really very many to be drawn here, to be honest. Nog barely mentioned Lommy, and when he did he was either kinda defensive or completely neutral. I suppose it could be a giant case of distancing, but there's not really anything to support that.

Looks for links between Lommy and Nog. Apparently doesn't see any.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

"Defensive." "Jumpy." "Making stuff up." What did I tell you? Witchhunt. All me answering your questions did was give you more fodder for your witchhunt against me, because all you've mentioned are opinions that are designed to look like hard suspicions. Look at this -

(in regards to this-)

Now, you say this sounds fabricated. Obviously there's nothing I can say to that, since it's not fabricated. But it gives you an easy way to continue to suspect me, doesn't it?

I'm going to skip over all the bit about the Acolyte because it's clear that, whether you're innocent or evil, we just flat are not going to agree where he's concerned.


This is just the same point, restated in order to make it look like you have a bigger argument against me than you already do. Also, I said basically the same thing earlier in the day when I replied to Pom, so there's further proof I didn't make it all up just now.

All that was also in response to Legate.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

*throws hands up*

I'm done talking for now. I'm making myself far too easy for the wolves to lynch, at this point.

Now seems convinced he's going to be bandwaggoned.

Conclusions? Well...I don't trust him in the slightest, but I don't know if I find him or Legate (who I don't have time to analyze) more worthy of a vote. I feel fairly good about one of the twain being evil, and at any rate I haven't really looked closely at anyone else.

I'll have to vote very soon. Maybe I can make up my mind as I brush my teeth.

[Loslote]

I was feeling so good about Pom...but I'm beginning to wonder. She's been playing with a bit of a cautious hand, not getting into much drama, and basically staying in the shadows while seeming to be sharp and helpful. Also...

Originally Posted by Boromir88

You might not be able to fully experience a Downsian WW game until you've had a good, passionate row with me, but honestly, you need to start looking 20 times more suspicious for that to happen. Until then, you're going to be on my "Smart. Sharp player. Her, I like." list. It's probably a terribly boring list to be on, but you'll be on it until I actually see "Not only is she all that, but she's evil too. Her, I like, but keep a closer eye on!"

This post of Boro's makes me think that not only would Pom and Nog, as Lommy said, be likely packmates, but so would Pom and Boro. In that post, Boro's basically writing Pom off as innocent, and implying that an evil Pom would happen in the future - that is, not this game.

EDIT: xed with Shasta

[Pitchwife]

Originally Posted by Loslote

In that post, Boro's basically writing Pom off as innocent, and implying that an evil Pom would happen in the future - that is, not this game.

I don't see why "in the future" has to mean "not in this game", unless you decide to read it so; this is a constructed argument.

I must admit I had more or less forgotten about Lottie for the last two Days (sorry dear), but I don't like this.