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Old 08-04-2012, 10:18 PM   #1
Mumriken
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Where, simply put, it's very difficult for one evil to be loyal to another evil. I mean would one argue that Orcs had a strong sense of loyalty to Morgoth, or Sauron?
Lol why can't I give this up xD xD

The reason Sam rejected the ring was because he loved Frodo. This loyalty exists in all beings that are dependent on another being. It's actually a form of love the orcs have for Sauron. Because he gives them what they want, just like Frodo gives Sam what he wants. Sauron was loyal to Morgoth because morgoth gave him what he wanted, power and control. By not turning his back to morgoth even after he was thrown out of the world. Sauron has shown his loyalty to Morgoth. Even if Morgoth is not there to give him power he still honors Morgoth by trying to follow in his footsteps even though he is unable to do so because of not being as powerful as him. Everything he did in the second and third age to some degree served morgoth's purpose. Probably the reason he did not fully destroy the children as Morgoth tried to do was because he simply wasn't powerful enough to do so.

That beings who are "evil" have a hard time being loyal is just a biased view from the people who consider themself to be good.

-Mumriken

xD xD xD
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Old 08-04-2012, 10:38 PM   #2
Zigūr
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Originally Posted by Mumriken View Post
This loyalty exists in all beings that are dependent on another being. It's actually a form of love the orcs have for Sauron.
The Orcs served Sauron out of fear, not love. They fear him (and the Nazgūl) more than they feared their enemies.
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Even if Morgoth is not there to give him power he still honors Morgoth by trying to follow in his footsteps even though he is unable to do so because of not being as powerful as him.
If it was written somewhere that Sauron thought he was doing this deliberately to honour Morgoth I would agree with you. I guess I just don't believe that you can be "accidentally loyal". Loyalty in my opinion involves some element of deliberate decision-making.
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Probably the reason he did not fully destroy the children as Morgoth tried to do was because he simply wasn't powerful enough to do so.
I'm afraid Professor Tolkien covered Sauron's lack of destructive intent:
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the only real good in, or rational motive for, all this ordering and planning and organization was the good of all the inhabitants of Arda (even admitting Sauron’s right to be their supreme lord)
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Sauron had never reached this stage of nihilistic madness. He did not object to the existence of the world, so long as he could do what he liked with it. ~Morgoth's Ring.
Sauron wanted to rule Middle-earth and its inhabitants. Whether or not he had the power to destroy it/them isn't especially relevant: even if he could, he didn't want to.
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Old 08-04-2012, 10:58 PM   #3
Eäralda Halatiriva
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Originally Posted by Zigūr View Post
The Orcs served Sauron out of fear, not love.
"when one sows Vice, one reaps Orcs" - Elvish proverb
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