Werewolf CXIII: Death at Deadmen's Dike - GAME THREAD

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

Who calls themselves Moon Moon anyway? Someone who is obsessed with terrible rhyming, probably. Therefor it's probably Nerwen.

Definitely Nerwen. Isn't Moon Moon the town where she lives?

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

I said he was Moon Moon, I didn't say he was Aleister Crowley.

Zing!

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

"Just this once, everybody lives"? Please, not that again. A Day 2 with no lynch, no votes to analyse and draw conclusions from, how would that be different from your vanilla Day 1, and then? Rinse and repeat? I shouldn't even have to explain this, as I know you know that's how it works, so why are you even suggesting this? So you don't have to commit to anything?

Yet again, sense. Back on the merry-go-round. Day 1 is pretty much always a crapshoot, barring some amazing, spectacular See-action, but not voting has always seemed to me more of a help to the baddies. It's scary that I agree with Pitch so much so early.

Originally Posted by Huinesoron

A vote for someone who seemed to be using goofiness as a way to avoid discussion wouldn't be random. But see below.

Again, a little touchy, this.

Originally Posted by Huinesoron

Post 30 is a huge addition to the Boromiric Canon, but I have no idea what it indicates. I think he's dedicating himself to the role of The Goofiest Player, at least for Day One; this actually makes me think he's less likely to be a wolf, because that's a bold stance for an early-game member of a 2-person team. (He may still be MoonMoonIsh, though.)

I thought Goofiest Player was my job! Or maybe that was creepiest...

x/d with Huey and Rune

[Pitchwife]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

It's scary that I agree with Pitch so much so early.

It definitely is--to be agreed with so much, I mean.

Huey's suspicion of Rune seems fair enough if a little thin, based on just one post. I'd need a little more reasons to get behind that.

I've got an eye on Huey himself--could be an eager innocent a little nervous in a new environment, could be an eager but somewhat touchy wolf cub. Anyway I'm giving him a newbie's pass toDay.

Zil agreeing with me so much is indeed eyebrow-raising, and the fact that he points it out himself could be a self-conscious attempt to deflect suspicion after Huey commented on it earlier.

I'm flip-flopping about Boro (which is kind of hilarious). Something isn't right with him, and I'd like to find out what it is. I said above that he shouldn't be our concern toDay, but I remember a Borowolf who acted cobblerish and got away with it (one of Nog's games, I was the real cobbler). Could imagine voting for him.

[Pitchwife]

Hmm, Rune's swerve from Huey to Zil was a bit sudden. I can't fault his reasoning, but then I tend to suspect Zil a lot early in the game -- creepiest player is his job, whatever he is, and he gets lynched early a lot because of it.

It scares me a bit how we few are getting ready to vote each other while half the village are still more or less no-shows (Morsul? Shasta?).

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

It scares me a bit how we few are getting ready to vote each other while half the village are still more or less no-shows (Morsul? Shasta?).

As much as I'm going to be grinding my teeth here, I'm going to have to force myself to vote today, because if I were one of the murderers I would pick off Morsul or Shasta next, and leave us with nothing again tomorrow.

So be it...

++Nerwen

No particular reason other than I don't want one of the active people today. Nerwen did post once and, if a wolf, best to take a shot at getting rid of her now, or we're all dead.

[Pitchwife]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

Nerwen did post once and, if a wolf, best to take a shot at getting rid of her now, or we're all dead.

'Let's lynch her now because if she's a wolf she'll be oh so dangerous." That's plain truth, but if she's not she'll be oh so dangerous to the wolves, so why should we lynch her without any evidence? Since when do we lynch people just in case?

[Pitchwife]

OK, I just realized I've been up for close to 20 hours, and nocturnal creature though I am, this undead vampire bat has a lot of sunlight damage to recover from.

Nerevar guide me!
++Boro

Good night!

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

OK, I just realized I've been up for close to 20 hours, and nocturnal creature though I am, this undead vampire bat has a lot of sunlight damage to recover from.

Nerevar guide me!
++Boro

Good night!

So... was there a reason for this, or...?

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Huinesoron

I'm a little more nervous about Zil now - post 37 feels like a retread of post 29 rather than anything particularly new - but equally, there's nothing new there to spark new suspicions. And Rune... well, Rune's post is bulked out by a big paragraph about voting, after which the content comes down to:

-Zil only posted once.
-Boro is having fun.
-Pitch is productive.



The first three points have all been previously made in the thread; the last is an expansion of other people's suspicions (as was his original comment on Boro), and is pointed at the person who's several times named him as number 1 voting candidate.

There's nothing here to make me reduce my suspicions, so in the absence of other candidates, and on the principle that a voting record is helpful to the village:

++Rune

hS, roosting upside-down in a tree and hoping for the best

Huey sort of suspects me, but decides Rune is a bit worse, so votes for him.

His suspicion of Rune seems a bit forced, but is it Day 1/New Player uncertainties, coupled with "I gotta vote for someone?"

Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne

Okay, this is not an easy decision, but I have to make one very soon.

If nothing else happens thee next ten minutes my vote will go to Inzil.

The contributions have mostly been good natured banter, and comments on Huey being a bit jumpy. Perhaps more will follow, but as things stand this behavior seems to needlessly shy away from confrontation (in my opinion). What does it mean that Huey is a bit jumpy (Inzil has pointed it out twice), is this wolfish behavior or not? Furthermore the posts interact with a fair few of the villagers, but without leaving any real traces. Of all the active players, this is the behavior that seems the most wolfish to me. A relatively low key day 1, staying out of focus, but with a degree of interaction.

Now this seems forced as well, though it is me saying so. What kind of 'confrontation' d'ya expect on Day 1?

Originally Posted by Boromir88

As much as I'm going to be grinding my teeth here, I'm going to have to force myself to vote today, because if I were one of the murderers I would pick off Morsul or Shasta next, and leave us with nothing again tomorrow.

So be it...

++Nerwen

No particular reason other than I don't want one of the active people today. Nerwen did post once and, if a wolf, best to take a shot at getting rid of her now, or we're all dead.

I can sympathize to a point, because Nerwen always worries me. I strongly disagree with the 'just because' vote though.

x/d with Pitch

[Lalaith]

Curse these transatlantic voting deadlines, cried the fell voice. It makes for very sleepy decisions.
Also, where are Shasta and Morsul? And I also seem to remember a Sally in "oh my ears and whiskers I just need to rush off and do something and then rush in again" mode being a Very Bad Sally.
Well as we all know first days suck and often the most active participants get unfairly picked on. I will spread the vote and go for a quiet one... although not an absent one as that could be too risky
++Sally

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

Hmm, Rune's swerve from Huey to Zil was a bit sudden. I can't fault his reasoning, but then I tend to suspect Zil a lot early in the game -- creepiest player is his job, whatever he is, and he gets lynched early a lot because of it.

It scares me a bit how we few are getting ready to vote each other while half the village are still more or less no-shows (Morsul? Shasta?).

This post makes me wonder a bit, after this:

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

Huey's suspicion of Rune seems fair enough if a little thin, based on just one post. I'd need a little more reasons to get behind that.

Especially after Rune died a wolf.

[Inziladun]

Congrats to the Forces of Evil!

Pitch was masterful as a solo wolf, and I envy Boro for having had what I consider the most fun role in WW.

It was a little gratifying that my intuition did lead me to say this early on:

Originally Posted by me

It's scary that I agree with Pitch so much so early.

but I also enjoyed actually not having my innocent self lynched, which is a rarity.

Thanks G55 for the game!

[Morsul the Dark]

I dreamt innocent Zil night one and thank IRL work schedule plus meetings the day 1 slipped my mind. The days run together sometimes.

Dreamt innocent Sally

Then died after dreaming MoonMoon Boro.

I legitimately have no idea why Boro got a free pass for clearly voting just to vote.

Pitch didn’t enter my mind at all as a wolf.

[Huinesoron]

A post-mortem of Huinesoron.

Originally Posted by Coroner's report

The remains of subject GORCROW were found scattered across a wide area. The primary evidence of its death were a large number of feathers; the meat they were once attached to was--

No, that's not quite what I mean.

Day One

Day One I got lucky. I do think Rune overreached with his tag-along accusation of Boro, but I was also lucky that so few people showed up! Only half of the players were active before I had to leave, which meant it was much easier to focus on each of them. Pretty much perfect for a first game Day One. That said, the case against Rune was always weak, and could easily have been the work of an innocent.

Day Two

Day Two exposed the downsides of my first day. I was now firmly in the mindset (that I didn't get out of until Day Four) that wolves would be caught by their spurious logic. That got me caught up on the fact that most people looked okay, and then on the Sally&Morsul case against me. I still don't get how 'wolf-on-wolf is possible' turned into 'wolf-on-wolf must have happened'; Morsul, what was it about me that made you convinced enough to run the risk of people falsely assuming a Seer read?

I also stayed hung up on the BoroMoon theory - ironically correct, and even more ironically proposed by PitchWolf! - which led me down a twisty side-path regarding Sally. I tunnelled on this for a while, managing to miss the fact that it didn't make much sense.

Morsul's reveal threw me for a loop. It took both Sally and himself off the table, and they were the people I'd focussed on all day. You can see me scrambling around to find anything against anyone else, and eventually picking Nerwen. Um, yeah, that didn't end well.

Day Three

Day Three exposed a big problem, and that's the way my playstyle interacted with the time of the deadline. It turns out that I'm very bad at considering people who aren't there; BoroMoon slipped entirely under my radar by the simple act of barely posting on Days 2 and 3. I also never really went back and looked at Shasta's accusations against Pitch - because Shasta wasn't there to pursue them. Sally and company discussed this after I was gone.

The timing also meant that Pitch had a lot of opportunity to reinforce my lack of suspicion in him without too many other people around. But... honestly, I think I would have voted Lalaith even if Pitch had been entirely absent. She said too much that came across as logical errors, misinterpretations, and just plain wrong statements, and had a hard time naming suspects. I know Lalaith is the reading I was most confident in.

Day Four

Look! I finally figured it out!

Except I only got PitchWolf pinned down because of BoroMoon's vote, not because of any reading on Pitch. So I still didn't really get there (and in consequence, I got et). In fact... I've looked back at Shasta's posts against Pitch, and I still don't see it. I think the idea is that Pitch was pushing too hard on Boro as a wolf after initially pegging him as Moon Moon - but I'm having a very hard time seeing his actions as more suspect than (say) Lalaith's.

Conclusions & Lessons Learned

-Never use the word 'see' in Werewolf. (Haha, I've already used it three times in this post... I just can't help it!)

-Look at other people's accusations in detail, bearing in mind the suspect's arguments, behaviour, and voting record.

-Don't trust innocents' judgement just because they're innocent. I ignored BoroMoon partly because of Sally's confidence in him, and was guided into the Lalaith lynch partly by Pitch (who I thought was innocent at the time...!).

-Don't be too defensive. I'm thinking that only actual accusations need to be replied to, not random comments that could lead to them.

-Don't get up at 3am to try and get the drop on the wolves; it doesn't help.

Well, I had fun, and I survived to the final Day as a newbie; I'll take that. Congratulations and well played to Team Werewolf, and thank you to everyone - especially Galadriel55 for setting it all up and bringing me in!

hS

[Morsul the Dark]

You acted suspicious to me. I only acted on those suspicions. Also don’t really appreciate being called a liar.(unrelated but that comment irked me.)

[Morsul the Dark]

I would have dreamt you instead of Boro had he not so obviously been evil after his vote Day 2.

[Huinesoron]

Originally Posted by Morsul the Dark

You acted suspicious to me. I only acted on those suspicions. Also don’t really appreciate being called a liar.(unrelated but that comment irked me.)

... oh, right. That. I'm sorry for calling you a liar. I was trying to stress that we should trust the Seer rather than claiming he'd done things he hadn't. The idea that you'd dreamed Night One, then got mixed up, and then that the person you'd dreamed was dead and not worth mentioning, didn't even come close to occuring to me. I'm sorry.

For potential future games - can you be more specific on what you think was suspicious? Having the Seer focus near-exclusively on you when you're innocent is pretty unnerving...!

[Pitchwife]

Originally Posted by Huinesoron

I do think Rune overreached with his tag-along accusation of Boro

I swear I cursed at the screen when I saw this, and you were totally right to point the finger at it; it was such an easy standard textbook suspicion. Good wolf-spotting!

(Rune, don't get me wrong, I enjoyed wolfing with you and was sorry to see you go. I wish we could have shared the Night kills! You left no ties to me, that helped.)

Originally Posted by Huinesoron

honestly, I think I would have voted Lalaith even if Pitch had been entirely absent. She said too much that came across as logical errors, misinterpretations, and just plain wrong statements, and had a hard time naming suspects.

Boro addressed this: innocents, because they're flying blind, can make mistakes, slip up, misread things just as well as wolves; wolves on the other hand, knowing who is on their side and who isn't, can be mercilessly logical and coherent. Also, appearing to be helpful by answering questions and clarifying things is great cover for a wolf!

Originally Posted by Huinesoron

I've looked back at Shasta's posts against Pitch, and I still don't see it. I think the idea is that Pitch was pushing too hard on Boro as a wolf after initially pegging him as Moon Moon

This - I even said myself that the cobbler isn't our main concern, but Boro just made too convenient a target to let go. Also note that I commented on a few suspicious things that Rune had done but never followed up on it. "Hmm, yes, his sudden suspicion of Zil is fishy -- Oh, look, a butterfly!"

[Galadriel55]

Originally Posted by Pitch

I honestly think the Rule of First is a daft rule though -- the last in a tie should be considered the village's best-informed choice; that's just an observation though, no criticism of*G55's modding.

Interesting, and fair enough. I will consider this for the future. Personally, I kind of hate the rule of lasts - at least in my experience it often ends in people waiting for the :00 on the deadline to post their vote to make sure it comes in, in later Days. It's a backwards race of who comes in last. Maybe I just don't like it cause once my side lost through such voting cause our vote came a bit too late, at DL:01. Maybe doing a dice roll or no lynch are better alternatives. No lynch has also been misused though - but maybe that's also part of the game.

[Morsul the Dark]

I’m just still curious why Boro got a pass?

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Pitch was a wolf because of his Day 1 attempt at saving Rune, his subsequent shading of me when I pointed it out, and his "oh, sure, yeah, you're right" attitude towards my suspicion of him (there's a reason his nickname is Mr. Agreeable). My own reasoning didn't have a ton to do with Boro, to be honest.