TIG: LXV - Our fate lies with...them?

[autume98]

Also look at sally's post #880 (http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=607730&postcount=880).

[satansaloser2005]

Also look at sally's post #880 (http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=607730&postcount=880).

Did you mean to link to my post on Brinn? Asking just in case.

[Formendacil]

Morm has simply not appeared suspicious to me - I could be wrong, I don't read him that well, but I simply don't see what is fueling the wagon.

Okay, that's fair enough, though my question was more whom you thought his death would implicate/exonerate than about whether you'd vote for him--though that question was tied in.

I agree with tum's reasoning to an extent--assuming that my version of how that reasoning goes is accurate. Basically, it runs thus: "Here are Morm's posts, here's what he says in a nutshell... and then out of the blue he has a serious suspicion of Formendacil, denounces him as the Bear, and votes thusly."

Insofar as I know I'm not the Bear, this puts me on edge, but the more objective case against him is in the out-of-the-blueness with which Morm's suspicion of me appears. As far as that goes, it looks quite odd indeed.

[Rikae]

You joined over a year after me, and have almost as many posts? Inconceivable!

[satansaloser2005]

You joined over a year after me, and have almost as many posts? Inconceivable!

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

[autume98]

Did you mean to link to my post on Brinn? Asking just in case.

Yes I did. You had some items in there regarding morm in reply to what Brinn had done.

[mormegil]

I am only to 973 but I feel the need to retract the Form vote, sorry mate but it had to be done. I do suspect you and you haven't thrown me off, I do suspect some people more. I was glad to see Lommy jump on so quickly. I haven't fully read her yet, which is odd; actually it's odd I haven't suspected her, because like Rikae I tend to suspect her when innocent. With that said my case against you was fairly weak but knowing I could retract I wanted to throw it out there.

Again I don't trust you but there are those higher on the list. Alona for example especially with the no vote. I think it was Macthat pointed out she looks like a scared new wolf. I agree. I am beginning to think Sally is a good cobbler candidate, but honestly Lommy may fill that role though I'm more inclined to believe her the wolf.

I will not vote yet but I will retract

--Formendacil

[Formendacil]

You joined over a year after me, and have almost as many posts? Inconceivable!

Well as far as that goes, you joined a year and a half after me, and you're within about 100 posts...:rolleyes:

Silly Sally talks too much?

X-ed with all since the quoted Post.

[autume98]

...and then out of the blue he has a serious suspicion of Formendacil, denounces him as the Bear, and votes thusly."

Insofar as I know I'm not the Bear, this puts me on edge, but the more objective case against him is in the out-of-the-blueness with which Morm's suspicion of me appears. As far as that goes, it looks quite odd indeed.

This is kinda looking familiar. Isn't this kinda what Shasta did on Day 1?

Edit: x-ed with morm and Form wow...it rhymes! I am easily entertained.

[satansaloser2005]

Yes I did. You had some items in there regarding morm in reply to what Brinn had done.

Ahhhh....okay, just checking.

Also, check out where I analyzed Shasta. Because he was at one point in quite a bit of suspicion and then just disappeared from conversation. (Of course I'd still rather wait until he's around, but if he's the bear or something it's best to kill him now.)

[Macalaure]

Alona - best suspect I have, but I feel foggy about her, if you know what I mean.
Autume - I don't know, but my feeling tends to more innocent than suspicious.
Durelin - good vibes from her.
Form - I'm not convinced by the evidence presented against him. I'm not convinced of his innocence either.
Lommy - really don't know what to think of her.
Mira - I used to think she's innocent, but now she has escaped my attention.
morm - probably innocent, but you never know.
Nerwen - creepy.
Nessa - creepy.
Nienna - not creepy.
Rikae - feels pretty innocent
Sally - a lot of evidence against her, but my gut feeling just won't agree with it.
Shasta - isn't anywhere close to my radar.

I'm not going to vote for Durelin, morm, Nienna, or Rikae toDay, and probably not for Autume, Form, or Mira (unless something unexpected happens, of course). I will choose among the rest on a whim, I think.

And I apologise for my lack of participation. I just don't feel like I'm really "in" the game and getting what's going on. :(

[satansaloser2005]

Well as far as that goes, you joined a year and a half after me, and you're within about 100 posts...:rolleyes:

Silly Sally talks too much?

Amen! Erm, I mean....

Which is weird, because I sometimes get accused of being too quiet. Then again, it depends on the game (e.g. timing and stuff, not my role). Sometimes I'm a loudmouth, sometimes I like to play in Rudolph's pen. Never know with me. :D


EDIT: x'd with Mac

[autume98]

Ahhhh....okay, just checking.

Also, check out where I analyzed Shasta. Because he was at one point in quite a bit of suspicion and then just disappeared from conversation. (Of course I'd still rather wait until he's around, but if he's the bear or something it's best to kill him now.)

I saw that. I haven't heard enough from him at this point to kill him. He is on my radar though.

[autume98]

Amen! Erm, I mean....

Which is weird, because I sometimes get accused of being too quiet. Then again, it depends on the game (e.g. timing and stuff, not my role). Sometimes I'm a loudmouth, sometimes I like to play in Rudolph's pen. Never know with me. :D




Too quiet! Ha! That'll be the day. :p ;)

[satansaloser2005]

I saw that. I haven't heard enough from him at this point to kill him. He is on my radar though.

Heh. That bit was for everyone, lovely. ;)

Too quiet! Ha! That'll be the day.

OI!

ETA: I'll get you for that tomorrow, you know. Just wait, woman, just you wait....

[Formendacil]

I am only to 973 but I feel the need to retract the Form vote, sorry mate but it had to be done. I do suspect you and you haven't thrown me off, I do suspect some people more. I was glad to see Lommy jump on so quickly. I haven't fully read her yet, which is odd; actually it's odd I haven't suspected her, because like Rikae I tend to suspect her when innocent. With that said my case against you was fairly weak but knowing I could retract I wanted to throw it out there.

Again I don't trust you but there are those higher on the list. Alona for example especially with the no vote. I think it was Macthat pointed out she looks like a scared new wolf. I agree. I am beginning to think Sally is a good cobbler candidate, but honestly Lommy may fill that role though I'm more inclined to believe her the wolf.

I will not vote yet but I will retract

--Formendacil

Well, my irkédness is mollified, anyway. :p

And, really... I think we suspect each other most of the time anyway, Morm. Something a bit stronger than not trusting me would make a better basis. I mean... is there anyone you do trust in this game? Because there's no one I trust (well, unless it's within a specific game context and we're lovers or shirriffs or something), and it would seem very odd if you did.

Lommy as the wolf... I can't see--partly, perhaps, because of a conflated mental image wherein she wasn't around for the first bit of the game, and thus couldn't have been killing people (yes, I know... she has a team if she's a wolf). Cobbler... now there's a possibility. Day 1 was crazy enough the wolves wouldn't've needed a Cobbler.

Probably going to vote Alona at this point, though I'm willing to contribute to a Sally-waggon if we want the second-most votes (in case of tying or last-minute flurries) to belong to someone else suspicious seeming. If the Alona-defence returns last minute again, I'd be willing to settle for a Sally kill.

[satansaloser2005]

If the Alona-defence returns last minute again, I'd be willing to settle for a Sally kill.

Heck, if anything I'll be switching to Alona. Morm's just at the top of my list.

[Nienna]

I'm getting bear vibes off of Morm. He has discussed the bear at great length and he has done some weird voting things... mostly voting early and then the locking in of Hakon on Day One. He is just exuding bear to me at the moment.

[mormegil]

Lommy as the wolf... I can't see--partly, perhaps, because of a conflated mental image wherein she wasn't around for the first bit of the game, and thus couldn't have been killing people (yes, I know... she has a team if she's a wolf). Cobbler... now there's a possibility. Day 1 was crazy enough the wolves wouldn't've needed a Cobbler.


Yes but something is with Lommy. She is not being her usual self who goes after people with purpose, putting herself out in the open. She is not being bold at all and that concerns me greatly.

[Formendacil]

Heck, if anything I'll be switching to Alona. Morm's just at the top of my list.

Well, insofar as Alona is my FIRST choice, that's quite alright with me. I'm hardly expecting you to vote yourself to save Alona.:p

Although... now that I think of it... if you're the Cobbler, then I guess you would.

[autume98]

Heh. That bit was for everyone, lovely. ;)


Oh right. Makes sense. :cool:

ETA: I'll get you for that tomorrow, you know. Just wait, woman, just you wait....

Ummm...about that...

[satansaloser2005]

Well, insofar as Alona is my FIRST choice, that's quite alright with me. I'm hardly expecting you to vote yourself to save Alona.:p

Although... now that I think of it... if you're the Cobbler, then I guess you would.

Pfffft. Even if I was the cobbler, this is too fun. :p



EDIT: x'd with Tum. That's what I thought. :smokin:

[mormegil]

I'm getting bear vibes off of Morm. He has discussed the bear at great length and he has done some weird voting things... mostly voting early and then the locking in of Hakon on Day One. He is just exuding bear to me at the moment.

Nienna, if I need to explain this I will as it has bugged many people, but particularly you it would seem. Nothing was happening on Day 1 Hakon needed to be voted for. I got things moving a bit if nothing else. The retraction and revote was a bit of an annoyance factor from Hakon. I was a bit bugged that he asked for a retraction, I found him suspicious and so to be comical and again to get people talking I did what I did and don't regret it.

[autume98]

I'm putting in my vote for morm. I still find him the most suspicious.

++morm

Edit: x-ed with morm

[Rikae]

Here goes:

--Sally

++Alona

[Nienna]

Nienna, if I need to explain this I will as it has bugged many people, but particularly you it would seem. Nothing was happening on Day 1 Hakon needed to be voted for. I got things moving a bit if nothing else. The retraction and revote was a bit of an annoyance factor from Hakon. I was a bit bugged that he asked for a retraction, I found him suspicious and so to be comical and again to get people talking I did what I did and don't regret it.

Thank you. I think I understand now. It doesn't make you any less suspicious in my eyes, though. Just so you know.

[Formendacil]

Yes but something is with Lommy. She is not being her usual self who goes after people with purpose, putting herself out in the open. She is not being bold at all and that concerns me greatly.

This is true... but it occurs to me that this might just be case of not being properly immersed in the game--she missed all of Day 1 and its 14 pages, and so might not have acclimatised properly.

On the other hand, I'm nowhere near enough convinced of Lommy's innocence to protest it on her behalf beyond that.

[satansaloser2005]

Oh, and for the record, I didn't find Morm's retract and revote Day One suspicious. The vote itself, yeah, but I thought the retract was hysterical. :p

[Mirandir]

I'm getting bear vibes off of Morm. He has discussed the bear at great length and he has done some weird voting things... mostly voting early and then the locking in of Hakon on Day One. He is just exuding bear to me at the moment.

Really? I think Form talked more about the bear than morm, but I could be mistaken.

So it took a ridiculously long amount of time for me to get caught up (blame Boro for that :p) and I have little idea who I suspect enough to vote for than I did when I left for work this morning. There are a few candidates (who I'm not going to mention now in case I change my mind) but I'm going to take a closer look at a few people and see what happens.

[Formendacil]

I'm getting bear vibes off of Morm.

Not that it matters... but I keep reading this as "I'm getting beer vibes off of Morm.":p

(Sally, I think that's your cue...;))

[mormegil]

Thank you. I think I understand now. It doesn't make you any less suspicious in my eyes, though. Just so you know.

I wouldn't have it any other way. It helps me stay alive at nights.

[satansaloser2005]

Not that it matters... but I keep reading this as "I'm getting beer vibes off of Morm.":p

(Sally, I think that's your cue...;))


I just laughed so hard at that I need a nap. Lol. Back in ten.

[autume98]

I thought the retract was hysterical. :p

That's because it was! :D:p

[mormegil]

Not that it matters... but I keep reading this as "I'm getting beer vibes off of Morm.":p


Comical, especially as I don't drink ;):D

[Nienna]

Rikae--> Sally
Morm--> Form
Lommy--> Form
Alona--> No Vote
Nessa--> No Vote
Sally--> Morm
--Morm--Form
Autume--> Morm
--Rikae--Sally
Rikae --> Alona
Form--> Alona



Alona, Morm, and No Vote 2, Form 1

[Boromir88]

Maybe I should add No vote to the player list? :rolleyes:

[mormegil]

Rikae, are you around? Who are you considering voting for?

Mac, same question?

I am going to cast my vote for Alona or Sally.

[satansaloser2005]

Maybe I should add No vote to the player list? :rolleyes:

Don't bother. They'll be dead by toNight anyway.

[Formendacil]

Well, I'm not at all willing to go gentle into the dark Night 4, and I'm right up there with Morm and the dastardly No-Vote, so I'm not quite willing to risk this.

So let's make it a round 4-way tie, and see what happens. :p

++Alonariel

[autume98]

Rikae, are you around? Who are you considering voting for?

Mac, same question?

I am going to cast my vote for Alona or Sally.

I believe Rikae retracted her vote and voted for alona.

[Macalaure]

I definitely prefer Alona to Form or morm, so let's add some fuel to that waggon.

++alonariel

Retraction possible.

edit: crossed with everything since Nienna's count.

[Boromir88]

I didn't know wagons had fuel...unless you are referring to the total creepy stalker car, the station wagon?

[Rikae]

Morm - well, I guess I'd have to say I'm considering voting for "No vote", since I've already voted twice toDay! :p

By the way, where is this idea coming from that the bear would talk a lot about the bear? What for? To tip us off, so we can lynch xem? What are you people thinking?

Mind you, the people spreading this idea around are ones I already didn't trust - but no one was pointing out the absurdity of that bit of reasoning, so I thought I'd better do it.

[satansaloser2005]

I didn't know wagons had fuel...unless you are referring to the total creepy stalker car, the station wagon?

Hey, I knew someone who had one of those once.

....

....

Never mind, you've got a point.



Oh, and can we call the no vote Norm? Please?!:Merisu:

[satansaloser2005]

Morm - well, I guess I'd have to say I'm considering voting for "No vote", since I've already voted twice toDay! :p

By the way, where is this idea coming from that the bear would talk a lot about the bear? What for? To tip us off, so we can lynch xem? What are you people thinking?

Mind you, the people spreading this idea around are ones I already didn't trust - but no one was pointing out the absurdity of that bit of reasoning, so I thought I'd better do it.


Heh.


And to the bolded part. I was going to point it out but was too lazy right now.

[Nerwen]

By the way, where is this idea coming from that the bear would talk a lot about the bear? What for? To tip us off, so we can lynch xem? What are you people thinking?

Well, it's psychology, you know... guilty conscience... trying not to think of (white) bears... that sort of thing.

I suppose.

[Nerwen]

Oh, and can we call the no vote Norm? Please?!:Merisu:

No. We already have Morm and Form.

[mormegil]

I have no idea where Nienna got the idea I've spoken a lot about the bear. I don't think I have *shrugs*

[Macalaure]

I didn't know wagons had fuel...unless you are referring to the total creepy stalker car, the station wagon?

Does a carrot on a stick count as fuel? ;)

[Nerwen]

You know what? I have no idea who to vote for.

EDIT:X'd since my last post.

[satansaloser2005]

No. We already have Morm and Form.

Exactly.


(.sdrawkcawkcab setirw taht lrig eht morf sihT)

[Nienna]

I think it is like a lot of other roles which people feel the need to talk about when the hold them. They could be testing the waters and see what people think about the role and they want to feel important. That is what I think anyway.

[Rikae]

Oh, and can we call the no vote Norm? Please?!:Merisu:

Norm? I could warm to that idea. Or we'll create a whole swarm of them, and they can live together in a dorm...

[Formendacil]

I have no idea where Nienna got the idea I've spoken a lot about the bear. I don't think I have *shrugs*

Well certainly not compared with Hakon and the phantom on Day 1.:rolleyes:

[Nerwen]

(.sdrawkcawkcab setirw taht lrig eht morf sihT)

Well, maybe there'd be less confusion if we called them mroF, morM and norM.

Or maybe not.

EIT:X'd since Sally.

[Durelin]

but no one was pointing out the absurdity of that bit of reasoning, so I thought I'd better do it.

Well, I did, just not quite as directly I s'pose.

So, I wonder why a wolf would not use their vote power, but then I think, especially in the case of alona, that perhaps it would be a decent way to go if you feared being lynched. Doesn't leave a vote your fellows have to worry about following or not. If that makes sense.

Personal thought - Wouldn't it be fun if morm, Rikae, and Mac were the wolves?

I think Mira needs to post more so I can renew my suspicion of her. Really I wanted to hear from her before I voted...and I sorta have but...am not satisfied...eh, I have 45 minutes.

[Rikae]

I think it is like a lot of other roles which people feel the need to talk about when the hold them. They could be testing the waters and see what people think about the role and they want to feel important. That is what I think anyway.
It would be a pretty pathetic bear that could not refrain from obsessing publicly about the bear, I daresay. The only way that would happen would be as a double bluff.

[Boromir88]

Does a carrot on a stick count as fuel? ;)

haha :p

erm...returns to observing so not to distract as the DL approaches

[satansaloser2005]

Norm? I could warm to that idea. Or we'll create a whole swarm of them, and they can live together in a dorm...

Sounds lovely. We could go there and eat corn and play the french horn. As long as it doesn't storm.

Well, maybe there'd be less confusion if we called them mroF, morM and norM.

Or maybe not.

EIT:X'd since Sally.

Heh. Heh, heh, heh. Ow. :p

[Durelin]

I could see people talking about their role as if they didn't understand it in order to supposedly throw people off, but talking strategy is a whole 'nother thing.

[satansaloser2005]

Nienna, I think you're fired.:p

Rikae--> Sally
Morm--> Form
Lommy--> Form
Alona--> No Vote
Nessa--> No Vote
Sally--> Morm
--Morm--Form
Autume--> Morm
--Rikae--Sally
Rikae --> Alona
Form--> Alona
Mac-->Alona


Alona 3, Morm 2, (Norm aka novote 2), Form 1

[Macalaure]

Sally is too happy, she should get more votes. :p

[satansaloser2005]

Sally is too happy, she should get more votes. :p

Heh. Sally is happy she can see the screen properly again. I can take off my glasses if you want. ;)

[autume98]

Sally is too happy, she should get more votes. :p

++Sally :p

[Rikae]

Sally is too happy, she should get more votes. :p

I agree. She looks like a wolf that just got off the hook.

Let's lynch her toMorrow. If I'm dead toMorrow, lynch her extra good for me.

[Nerwen]

++Sally :p

autume, is this vote meant to count? You didn't highlight it.

[autume98]

autume, is this vote meant to count? You didn't highlight it.

Nope. It was a joke.

Oooh one more post and I'm at 100. :cool:

[Nerwen]

Anyone got a vote count?

[Formendacil]

I agree. She looks like a wolf that just got off the hook.

Let's lynch her toMorrow. If I'm dead toMorrow, lynch her extra good for me.

Heh. I said I'm just as happy with Sally as Alona, and I can still retract--don't make me do it, Sally,you young whippersnapper.

:smokin: <--Closest thing to a curmudgeonly smiley.

[Nienna]

Rikae--> Sally
Morm--> Form
Lommy--> Form
Alona--> No Vote
Nessa--> No Vote
Sally--> Morm
--Morm--Form
Autume--> Morm
--Rikae--Sally
Rikae --> Alona
Form--> Alona
Mac--> Alona



Alona 3, Morm and No Vote (Norm) 2, Form 1

[Boromir88]

Nienna, I think you're fired.:p

Mac-->Alone


You're fired for saying Mac is alone! what a unforgivable mistake in the vote tallying. :p

[satansaloser2005]

++Sally :p

Hehe.


I agree. She looks like a wolf that just got off the hook.

Let's lynch her toMorrow. If I'm dead toMorrow, lynch her extra good for me.

But....but I'm cute and cuddly.

(Really, I don't care, as long as my headache doesn't come back like it did toDay.)

Oh, and I forgot.


Haven't voted:
Durie
Nerwen
Mira
Nienna
Shasta

[satansaloser2005]

You're fired for saying Mac is alone! what a unforgivable mistake in the vote tallying. :p

Yeah, I noticed that but was doing another post. Editing it now, sir. *hangs head in shame and keeps Mac and the wereduckling company while Rikae is off doing evil*

[Formendacil]

You're fired for saying Mac is alone! what a unforgivable mistake in the vote tallying. :p

Wait...

Has Nienna just been mod-fired?:p

EDIT: Or Sally... or whomever you meant...

[satansaloser2005]

Wait...

Has Nienna just been mod-fired?:p

Nope, that'd be me. Alas, poor Sally, you lynched her well. ;)

[Nerwen]

Rikae--> Sally
Morm--> Form
Lommy--> Form
Alona--> No Vote
Nessa--> No Vote
Sally--> Morm
--Morm--Form
Autume--> Morm
--Rikae--Sally
Rikae --> Alona
Form--> Alona
Mac--> Alona



Alona 3, Morm and No Vote (Norm) 2, Form 1

We-ell... I'm sort of leaning towards Form... something about him has felt wrong to me... but that's looking like a throwaway at the moment.

Perhaps I'll have to vote for Norm. Or Morm.

[satansaloser2005]

Okay, I have a silly and yet fair question. If the majority of us vote for "Norm" would that mean no one was lynched? Obviously I'm mostly joking but it's interesting to bring up. Heck, I'm bored.:p

[Nerwen]

You're fired for saying Mac is alone! what a unforgivable mistake in the vote tallying. :p

Boro, I think power's gone to your head.

*is modfired for insubordination*

[autume98]

I forgot to mention I like your avatar sally. :D

And yay for 100 posts! :p

[Boromir88]

Boro, I think power's gone to your head.

*is modfired for insubordination*

Well the power would really go to my head if I could mod-fire myself. That is power. :p

[Nienna]

++Morm

He is the most suspicious to me right now.

[Rikae]

We-ell... I'm sort of leaning towards Form... something about him has felt wrong to me... but that's looking like a throwaway at the moment.

Perhaps I'll have to vote for Norm. Or Morm.

Norm's too gormless to be a wolf.

[Nienna]

Vote count:

Rikae--> Sally
Morm--> Form
Lommy--> Form
Alona--> No Vote
Nessa--> No Vote
Sally--> Morm
--Morm--Form
Autume--> Morm
--Rikae--Sally
Rikae --> Alona
Form--> Alona
Mac--> Alona
Nienna--> Morm



Alona and Morm 3, No Vote 2, Form 1

[satansaloser2005]

Norm's too gormless to be a wolf.

*snickers*


And thanks, Tum. Made it myself. :)

[Mirandir]

Oh shoot. I get distracted by photography contests and ramen and suddenly it's 20 minutes to deadline and I still don't know who to vote for. :eek:

[mormegil]

++Alona

Has anybody actually given any reason to expect me?

[Nerwen]

Norm's too gormless to be a wolf.

Awww, don't be so mean to the n00b, Rikae. It's Norm's first game!

[Nienna]

Rikae--> Sally
Morm--> Form
Lommy--> Form
Alona--> No Vote
Nessa--> No Vote
Sally--> Morm
--Morm--Form
Autume--> Morm
--Rikae--Sally
Rikae --> Alona
Form--> Alona
Mac--> Alona
Nienna--> Morm
Morm--> Alona



Alona 4, Morm 3, No Vote 2, Form 1

[satansaloser2005]

++Alona

Has anybody actually given any reason to expect me?

Expect you, no. Suspect you, yes.:p

[Rikae]

No one expects the Mormish inquisition!

Norm is also a dankish tickle-brained varlet, and a gleeking crook-pated vassal. He is an unmuzzled doghearted whey-face - but I mean it in purely an in-game, not at all personal way.

In a purely in-game way, I wish that Norm would be modfired, deported and flung to the far reaches of the galaxy. Nothing personal, of course.

EDIT: "Norm is also..." refers to my previous post about Norm, not to Morm.

[Boromir88]

I think it's hilarious that Norm has even been given a name...erm well the no-vote thanks sally! :p

[mormegil]

Expect you, no. Suspect you, yes.:p

Yes yes, I saw that too after the fact, but I was in haste.

[satansaloser2005]

Yes yes, I saw that too after the fact, but I was in haste.

I know. I just had to tease you about it.

[wilwarin538]

10 minutes

[Durelin]

Meh...

++Alona

unless a bandwagon starts against Lommy or Mira or Nienna or....in the next 7ish minutes...

I think I'm going to be looking at Sally and Nienna over the Night.

[Boromir88]

Highlight Durelin.

I know you're not used to doing it :D

Edit: nevermind

[Nienna]

Rikae--> Sally
Morm--> Form
Lommy--> Form
Alona--> No Vote
Nessa--> No Vote
Sally--> Morm
--Morm--Form
Autume--> Morm
--Rikae--Sally
Rikae --> Alona
Form--> Alona
Mac--> Alona
Nienna--> Morm
Morm--> Alona
Dury--> Alona



Alona 5, Morm 3, No Vote 2, Form 1

[Nerwen]

++Mormegil

Somehow he seems more suspicious than Alona.

I can't claim that I really know what I'm doing here, though...

EDIT:X'd since The Dark Monarch.

[Mirandir]

Crap.

++Mormegil

Unfortunately I was going to say the same thing Nerwen did. Voting for someone else who I find suspicious at this point would be a throw-away.

[Macalaure]

I can't claim that I really know what I'm doing here., though...

You have my sympathy. :)

[wilwarin538]

5 minutes

[mormegil]

Somehow he seems more suspicious than Alona.

I can't claim that I really know what I'm doing here., though...

If I die please remember this remark.

[Nienna]

Vote count:

Rikae--> Sally
Morm--> Form
Lommy--> Form
Alona--> No Vote
Nessa--> No Vote
Sally--> Morm
--Morm--Form
Autume--> Morm
--Rikae--Sally
Rikae --> Alona
Form--> Alona
Mac--> Alona
Nienna--> Morm
Morm--> Alona
Dury--> Alona
Nerwen--> Morm
Mira--> Morm



Alona and Morm 5, No Vote 2, Form 1

[wilwarin538]

Norm? ahahahahahahaha

[satansaloser2005]

Oh dear. We have another tie, don't we?


EDIT: x'd with Nienna, who confirmed my fear, and Wilwa, who is a silly girl. :p

[Macalaure]

Aw, come on. Not morm. :rolleyes:

[satansaloser2005]

I'm quite tempted to do something silly. Meh, why not?


--Morm


Wait for it, wait for it....

[wilwarin538]

2 minutes

You're sillier Sally, you're the one that came up with Norm, I'm just approving :p

[mormegil]

If I die please look closely at Alona, Nerwen, Lommy, Sally, and Formendacil.

Shasta has vanished, I wonder why.

[Nienna]

Rikae--> Sally
Morm--> Form
Lommy--> Form
Alona--> No Vote
Nessa--> No Vote
Sally--> Morm
--Morm--Form
Autume--> Morm
--Rikae--Sally
Rikae --> Alona
Form--> Alona
Mac--> Alona
Nienna--> Morm
Morm--> Alona
Dury--> Alona
Nerwen--> Morm
--Sally-- Morm



Alona 5, Morm 4, No Vote 2, Form 1

[satansaloser2005]

++/Norm



Does it look like an M? 'Cause it's supposed to be.


Anyway, to make it clear


++Morm


So there's no surprises from me.


EDIT: x'd with Nienna. Dang it, I told you to wait for it~!

[Nerwen]

I'm quite tempted to do something silly. Meh, why not?


--Morm


Wait for it, wait for it....

You're not going to vote... Norm, surely...?

Poor hapless newbie that he is...

EDIT:X'd with Sally.

[Nienna]

Rikae--> Sally
Morm--> Form
Lommy--> Form
Alona--> No Vote
Nessa--> No Vote
Sally--> Morm
--Morm--Form
Autume--> Morm
--Rikae--Sally
Rikae --> Alona
Form--> Alona
Mac--> Alona
Nienna--> Morm
Morm--> Alona
Dury--> Alona
Nerwen--> Morm
--Sally-- Morm
Sally--> Morm


Alona and Morm 5, No Vote 2, Form 1

[Boromir88]

DL. Silence.

Last I checked it will be a coin flip but not sure.

Alona will be assigned heads. Morm tails. Result in a bit

Heads. Alona is lynched. I was debating whether I wanted to keep you all in suspense while I do the narration and you axiously await. But I won't. (and for anyone who doubts the veracity of the results I will seriously hold a grudge against you for a while)

You have lynched....











Firefly. 2 villains and a bear remain. Night 4 has begun

[Boromir88]

The D-league vs. The Dark Monarch
Volume 1, Episode 11: Wild-eye craves hashbrowns so this will be a quickie

"Form!" voted Lommy.

.newreN dias "!mrom oN"

"Concur" declared sally. "Morm!"

Nessa shouted out "Norm!"

Morm, Form, Norm, too many orms, too few oppurtunities available.

"Alona!" said Form.

"Yes, lets lynch her!" said Rikae

"...erm wait...not Morm...eh um...morm!" sally added at the last second.

Tie! said the disembodied voice of the Decider. And it shall be...Alona!

The heroes circled around Alona.

"Wait a second. All of you...just listen. We can figure this out. Let's not be hasty."

"You heard the decider" said morm "He's drunk with power...literally...and he has decided you."

Alona cackled and turned into a beautiful, yet scary, winged beast. "Behold Firefly! The decider may have picked me, but I'm taking you with me!" Alona clutched a lighter and shot a ball of flame towards morm.

"Nooooooo!" shouted an unknown voice none of the heroes had heard before.

"It's Norm!" squealed sally..."Naming him must have allowed him to come to life."

"He's kind of cute." smiled Nienna. All the ladies agreed.

Norm burst through the crowd and caught alona's fireball, absorbing the full blast and launched it back towards her. She was hit and instantly burst into ashes. Norm collapsed, everyone gathered around. He had just made an incredible sacrifice no one had ever seen before, but he was dead.

"I guess that means no more Norm." said Mac.

Which means no more ++No Votes. Mwahahahaha. laughed the disembodied voice.

"He really is drunk with power, either that just mad." All the heroes agreed.
Living

wilwa (the Dark Monarch)

autume- Lady Tum, The Fish Whisperer, can converse with fish
Durelin- Felis Grey, under the impression her domestic cats obey her
Formendacil- Celibateman, saving girls everywhere from awkward 1st dates
Lommy- Prin-Guin, claimed princess of the penguins, wears a penguin suit and crown
Macalaure- The Incredible Sulk, when angry he turns green and pouts
Mira- Narcolepsy girl, falls asleep at the most inoppurtune moment
morm- Athletes Foot Man, grows edible green fungus in feet
Nerwen- The Reverser, can read and write backwards
Nessa- Laughing Lass, can make others laugh uncontrollably
Nienna- Word Cloud Girl, analyzes people based on the frequency of the words they use
Rikae- Doktor Von und Zum Quatsch
sally- Movie quotes girl, quotes/recognizes quotes out of movies and TV
Shasta- Mr. E., always cast in shadows

Dead

Boro- Wild-eye (Night 1)
Fea- Doctor Girlfriend, died from sheer awesomeness (Day 1) - ordo
Pitch- Studebaker Hawk, fell to his death (Day 1) - seer
Hakon- Leaf Man, made into firewood (Night 2) - ordo
Lari- Hover Girl, broken neck (Night 2) - ordo
Inziladun- Dr. Electron, used as filament (Day 2) - ordo
the phantom- Candor Man, taken by special request of the Monarch (Night 3) - ordo
Brinniel- Butterfingers, caught herself on fire (Night 3) - ordo
alonariel- Charms girl, killed by Norm (Day 3) - Firefly
Norm- sacrificed himself to kill alona (Day 3) - No votes

*NIGHT 4. Do what you have to do.

[Boromir88]

The D-league vs. The Dark Monarch Volume 2, Episode 1: Glimmer of Hope

A hero, sat in his room, and he was in deep thought. There are two people I'd like to protect, but I may only choose one. Dratted Wild-eye and his vial of scent. Yes, yes, must use every last drop. Maybe if I go for a walk I can come to a clearer decision.

The man left his room and immediately it hit him. I've got it! He went racing down the hall and found the hero's room. He began to pour the vial of Wild-eye's scent around the room when two dark figures approached.

"What do we have here, partner?" said Pain.

"Looks like the Ranger thinks he can foil our plans tonight." said Gust.

"Get away you demons!" shouted the Ranger. "You can not kill tonight!"

"No need to call us demons." said Pain "We really aren't that evil, we just follow orders, ya know."

"Tonight you have been stopped by me, the Ranger! The finest Ranger you will ever lay eyes on. Begone! Return back to your extremely grotesque beast of a master!"

Gust lunged as if about to rip out the man's throat, but Pain held Gust back. For they were not strong enough to overcome Wild-eye's powerful scent. "You may have won the coin toss, but the House always wins!"

The two figures departed, and the Ranger breathed a sigh of relief. I thought that Wild-eye was crazy. He really knew what he was doing then, didn't he? The man walked back towards his room, feeling triumphant for the victory he just gave the heroes. Now he knew who they wanted to kill, and that the Dark Monarch had failed this night. It will only be a few hours before everyone knew of the glorious master Shasta!

*growling* "Saw your little scene with the villains. Suppose you think pretty highly of yourself right now?" *growling*

"Away with ye, and trouble me no more!" Shasta's confident voice against the villains began to waver. "If you are seeking to complete what the villains failed, I will not allow it!"

"Silly Ranger. I'm not after who they picked. I found my choice and he's standing right in front of me." The shape-shifter smiled, knowing it was about to claim its next kill.

~~

The heroes gathered in the common room downstairs and were pleasantly surprised to find only one of their team missing. It was Shasta, who no one at first was surprised, for no one could remember if he was with them yesterday. However, they all decided it would be best if they just checked on him.

The heroes found Shasta wrapped in the dark blue sheets, and on top rested a phial, that smelled like Irish Spring body wash. The Ranger was dead, but there was another note.

I have killed your ranger. However, I thought it only proper to tell you his tale since he is unable to tell you himself. He is the reason there is only one kill tonight. In fact, I was quite moved by how he forcefully told the Villains that they could not kill tonight. Yes, very moving. Don't get me wrong, I still had to kill, even if he tried to send me away, but his bravery should be rewarded. Too long has he been in the shadows, I suggest you let him see the sun again. It is not often I get the pleasure of killing someone so worthy.

With deepest sympathy,
Your neighbouring Bear

The heroes looked at eachother at first, contemplating whether they should actually listen to the Shape-shifter, but they had to admit the bear did have a point. They wished Shasta had lived so he could reveal who he protected, but that secret would die with him. Shasta had been in the shadows too long, and he was the reason last night there was only one kill. He had given the heroes another day. With how bleak the battle against the Dark Monarch had begun, there was now a glimmer of hope.

Living

wilwa (the Dark Monarch)

autume- Lady Tum, The Fish Whisperer, can converse with fish
Durelin- Felis Grey, under the impression her domestic cats obey her
Formendacil- Celibateman, saving girls everywhere from awkward 1st dates
Lommy- Prin-Guin, claimed princess of the penguins, wears a penguin suit and crown
Macalaure- The Incredible Sulk, when angry he turns green and pouts
Mira- Narcolepsy girl, falls asleep at the most inoppurtune moment
morm- Athletes Foot Man, grows edible green fungus in feet
Nerwen- The Reverser, can read and write backwards
Nessa- Laughing Lass, can make others laugh uncontrollably
Nienna- Word Cloud Girl, analyzes people based on the frequency of the words they use
Rikae- Doktor Von und Zum Quatsch
sally- Movie quotes girl, quotes/recognizes quotes out of movies and TV

Dead

Boro- Wild-eye (Night 1)
Fea- Doctor Girlfriend, died from sheer awesomeness (Day 1) - ordo
Pitch- Studebaker Hawk, fell to his death (Day 1) - seer
Hakon- Leaf Man, made into firewood (Night 2) - ordo
Lari- Hover Girl, broken neck (Night 2) - ordo
Inziladun- Dr. Electron, used as filament (Day 2) - ordo
the phantom- Candor Man, taken by special request of the Monarch (Night 3) - ordo
Brinniel- Butterfingers, caught herself on fire (Night 3) - ordo
alonariel- Charms girl, killed by Norm (Day 3) - Firefly
Norm- sacrificed himself to kill alona (Day 3) - No votes
Shasta- Mr. E., No longer with the shadows (Night 4) - Ranger

It is Day 4. Begin. :D

(I finished a few minutes early today. With this extra time, I expect 10 more posts that would not have been posted had the day started at 11) :p

[wilwarin538]

"grotesque beast"???

come now, must you be so cruel to me?

:Merisu: :p

[Boromir88]

"grotesque beast"???

come now, must you be so cruel to me?


I'm sorry :(...I am really mean to you aren't I? I've changed it for you. I heart you. :D

[Rikae]

Nice work, Shasta, if you can hear me where you are!

Ok, one thing I've got to ask off the bat:

Rikae--> Sally
Morm--> Form
Lommy--> Form
Alona--> No Vote
Nessa--> No Vote
Sally--> Morm
--Morm--Form
Autume--> Morm
--Rikae--Sally
Rikae --> Alona
Form--> Alona
Mac--> Alona
Nienna--> Morm
Morm--> Alona
Dury--> Alona
Nerwen--> Morm
--Sally-- Morm
Sally--> Morm


Alona and Morm 5, No Vote 2, Form 1

Me, Form, Mac, Morm and Dury for Alona... that's 5. But only Sally, Autume, Nienna and Nerwen for Morm...? Did Nienna leave somebody's vote off, or was it really not a tie at all?

At any rate, if that Morm-wagon wasn't at least in part a wolf-driven Alona rescue attempt, I'll eat my keyboard. All the votes will need a careful look, but I'm too tired to do it now, sorry.

[Mirandir]

Me, Form, Mac, Morm and Dury for Alona... that's 5. But only Sally, Autume, Nienna and Nerwen for Morm...? Did Nienna leave somebody's vote off, or was it really not a tie at all?


I voted for morm as well. Apparently Nienna doesn't love me enough to include me. :p

[autume98]

It is a sad day for us villagers. :( Shasta did a great deed by saving someone in the village. I just wish that he weren't dead.

[Nienna]

Eek. * Apologizes* Sorry Mira! The end of day was a little confusing and I was trying my best to keep up... but I am no Lari. There is an earlier count that was correct but then I some how managed to mess it up and with Sally retracting and then locking in it got a bit confusing. :(

[Durelin]

Shasta was a popular man it seems. :D Nice job, mate.

[Nienna]

It is sad that Shasta, our valiant Ranger is now dead, but I'm happy we have finally nabbed a wolf and the wolves lost out on a kill. This is good news.

[satansaloser2005]

Gonna analyze Nessa because, well, I want to. Back in a sec.

[mormegil]

Well I must thank two people, the ranger, as I am almost certain I was the wolf's target last night and the head of Boro's coin.

According to Nienna's count here is the votes from yesterday

Rikae--> Sally
Morm--> Form
Lommy--> Form
Alona--> No Vote
Nessa--> No Vote
Sally--> Morm
--Morm--Form
Autume--> Morm
--Rikae--Sally
Rikae --> Alona
Form--> Alona
Mac--> Alona
Nienna--> Morm
Morm--> Alona
Dury--> Alona
Nerwen--> Morm
--Sally-- Morm
Sally--> Morm

Alona voters: Durelin, Morm, Mac, Form, Rikae
Morm voters: Sally, Nerwen, Nienna, Autume, Mira (somehow not included on this list but was on an earlier list)
No votes were Alona and Nessa

Very interesting the way it played out. I am very much inclined to believe Durelin, Mac and Rikae innocent with Form a possible bear suspect.

Somehow my suspicion of Sally was not lessened at all :rolleyes:. Alona no voted which is odd too but would another wolf go along with that? I doubt it, too obvious for me I would think and I'm not sure Nessa is that bold. I am thinking her a bit more innocent.

Did Lommy vote?

I would be content to focus most all the attention on the Morm voters from yesterday and keep an eye on Form.

Here is somewhat of a wild plan that may work. We have 12 remaining villagers, 3 gifteds, a cobbler, bear, two wolves and 5 ordos including me. If the 3 gifted came forward, but no revealing their role, this is for two reasons. 1. With the hunter still at large the wolves and bear will have to second guess which one to kill. 2. The cobbler may decide to join the ranks of the proclaimed gifteds. However, if this were to happen we would need to decide if we want to believe the claim at all before the gifteds reveal their true role. I think the cobbler would be very obvious if she tries to reveal herself (I'm thinking Sally first then Nerwen as likely candidates). Anyway that would give 3 solid innocents of 12, if I am assumed innocent because of Shasta's protection last night, I had hoped he would have survived to verify the claim. Anyway, I think it reasonable to assume the worst case for me would be that I am the bear, with this plan in place we could fairly quickly eliminate the wolves and bear. There would be 4 to 5 known innocents, depending upon who you are. For the 4 other ordos they will know that they are innocent, ergo 5.

What say ye? Too soon for this? It would be that 1/3 of the village would be known innocents and then I think it would be fairly easy to ferret out the guilty based on voting patterns etc...

EDIT: Crossed with everybody since Boro's last post.

[mormegil]

Oh, and on my plan I am primarily interested in hearing from those whom I believe innocent.

[Durelin]

...how do you know Shasta protected you and how are we supposed to know?

[Boromir88]

What say ye? Too soon for this? It would be that 1/3 of the village would be known innocents and then I think it would be fairly easy to ferret out the guilty based on voting patterns etc...


I say the shirriffs can't be known innocents at the same time. *points to rules* ;)

[Formendacil]

Oh, and on my plan I am primarily interested in hearing from those whom I believe innocent.

That's excellent.

It means I don't have to talk right now.

:p

Actually, I'm only posting now to let it be known that, as with yesterDay, I'll be offline from now until about 4-5 hours before the Deadline. I assume I won't get distracted and start purchasing any expensive Tolkien books, but that would also have been my assumption yesterday, so...

Anyway, yeah... online in 18-19 hours.

Meanwhile, my only comment is that, had there been more of them, the No Voters would bear more watching, but it was only Alona and Nessa. Should probably look at Nessa just in case, though...

Okay, going to bed--unless something catches my eye on the way out.

[mormegil]

...how do you know Shasta protected you and how are we supposed to know?

You can't be certain Durelin, but assume for a moment I am not a wolf, would I be a likely wolf target?

[mormegil]

I say the shirriffs can't be known innocents at the same time. *points to rules* ;)

Confounded man, you and your blasted rules, a pox on them! I failed to see that rule, it might be safe to assume I am not a BFF.

[satansaloser2005]

You can't be certain Durelin, but assume for a moment I am not a wolf, would I be a likely wolf target?

Why would the wolves kill someone who's been the topic of so much conversation (and lynching interest) recently? I'm not saying it's impossible, I'm just saying that I'm not believing you're innocent just because you say you were attacked. For all I know they tried to kill me (although it'd be the same idea, and thus unlikely).


Finding all the Nessa posts now, and hopefully I'll get it out before I head for home.

[mormegil]

Why would the wolves kill someone who's been the topic of so much conversation (and lynching interest) recently? I'm not saying it's impossible, I'm just saying that I'm not believing you're innocent just because you say you were attacked. For all I know they tried to kill me (although it'd be the same idea, and thus unlikely).


Finding all the Nessa posts now, and hopefully I'll get it out before I head for home.

So then, two wolves were on the chopping block last night Sally? Highly unlikely. To the wolves it would be obvious that I would be either a fairly well known innocent or the bear, either way they would want to eliminate me.

[Durelin]

I would think any of the alona voters were likely targets last night, with considerations for targeting the ranger or the shirrifs and possibly avoiding the hunter.

But maybe the wolves really are convinced you're the bear.

Sally...cobbler?

Nienna and Lommy wolves?

Nerwen and Mira also bother me a lot.

But I'm ready to vote Morm for his gifted-reveal plan.

[satansaloser2005]

So then, two wolves were on the chopping block last night Sally? Highly unlikely. To the wolves it would be obvious that I would be either a fairly well known innocent or the bear, either way they would want to eliminate me.

I still fan you for the bear. I'm not saying, I'm right, I'm just saying that's what I'm still feeling.

In a way I'm glad I retracted and 'changed' the outcome of the vote, because Alona's dead and we're down a wolf. On the other hand, I really want to know what Morm is. Grrrr....going to work on something else and then keep looking at Nessa.

(By the way, not 'grrrr' I'm mad, but 'grrrr' I'm torn. I still find Morm suspicious, but if he is innocent I don't want to spend all my time on him.)



EDIT: x'd with Durie. And I agree with her, in case I didn't already say. The plan sounds like the best way to get the gifteds killed.

[mormegil]

Sally and Durelin, what purpose can the gifted serve right now, especially the remaining ones other than to be known innocents, obviously that can't happen because of Boro-jerk! :D (love ya Boro).

It is times like these that I miss phantom. He would understand where I am going with this and agree.

[Durelin]

Do not patronize, morm.

[Rikae]

Morm, I think we have plenty of leads toDay without the gifteds revealing.

[mormegil]

Morm, I think we have plenty of leads toDay without the gifteds revealing.

Fair enough, when the plan came to me it was much better because I figured the ranger would be alive and the the BFF's could reveal and at the time I assumed I would be attacked and protected...

Now why would the bear go for Shasta? It seems that he stays on the fringes and I think he got lucky with the ranger kill and didn't peg Shasta as gifted.

[Rikae]

Morm, using the gifteds as known innocents would make a lot more sense if/when the village is smaller and we have no clue who the remaining baddie/s are. Having them reveal toDay would be a total waste.

EDIT: X'd with morm (and my previous post x'd with several people, too).

[satansaloser2005]

Well the hunter is still useful (unless they're revealed, because then the wolves/bear will avoid them like the plague) but the BFFs? If one reveals they're dead toNight. The other reveals toMorrow and they're gone too. Sad but true.

[Macalaure]

Just a quick post now, since it's bedtime for me soon and I'll be gone for much of toMorrow.

It is entirely possible that the wolves considered Alona to be a goner (she's been under suspicion from almost the beginning on) and voted for her. It is also possible that morm is evil. However, let's not think about those possibilities now and instead ask the questions which of the morm-voters, plus Lommy and Nessa, looks most evil.

Nessa no-voted almost at the same time Alona did. I somehow doubt that two wolves would have tried the same trick at once. Of course, this does not rule out cobblery, and especially not bear-y.

As I said yesterDay, Sally was too happy. I don't think a wolf-Sally would have been so cheerful while a companion went down the plank. Of course, what holds for Nessa, holds for Sally, too (bear, cobbler).

I get more and more cobblerish vibes from Nerwen.

I used to trust Nienna, Autume, and Mira, but I might have to make up my mind.

I don't have any extra comment about Lommy, except that she's suspicious, but that isn't new.


I don't know how morm's so sure he has been protected. If so, the wolves probably think he's the bear and we should really give his voters the bad-cop treatment (since they probably tried to get him lynched), but there are other scenarios (as has been said, any Alona-voter made a good pick), not to mention the possibility that Shasta could have been just lucky (or the wolves unlucky). I don't see how we should benefit from the assumption anyway, considering that we have a cobbler and especially a bear. Shasta might have protected an evil one.

I also don't see the benefit of morm's plan. Only one of the BFFs can reveal, and he's probably the one we can be most certain of, since he has probably left a clue as to who the other one is. If the gifteds don't reveal their roles, this advantage isn't there, and we will have three claimed gifteds, one of which is the cobbler. If they reveal their roles, since we lack a ranger now, the two BFFs are probably dead within one night, two at most, and then bear and wolves may wonder which is the cobbler and which the hunter (or even decide to leave them alive). I do see the benefit of known innocents, but if we use them now, we'll waste them.


Another question, why did the bear kill Shasta? Did he do anything yesterDay that pointed toward giftedness? I'd need to check, but I don't think so. Hakon, Brinn, and Shasta... does anybody see a pattern?


And seriously, when I started writing this, I was sure it would only be a short, quick post. :D

[mormegil]

Please pay attention everybody...

When I proposed my plan I thought the BFF's could reveal together, they can't I was wrong. Being that my plan was based on that assumption it makes less sense once that is removed. My plan is flawed I admit, it sounded better in my head and when I thought the BFF's could reveal.

The great part of all of this, is if you leave me alive today, which I would advise, the wolves are still going to consider me the bear, or a likely candidate and kill me tonight only to find out I'm an ordo but they won't believe me even as I tell them I'm a wasted kill. If you want the bear kill Formendacil.

[Durelin]

Hah. I completely forgot about autum...

[Boromir88]

Memo to self: Next time morm is involved in a tie...keep flipping the coin until it lands on the side that kills him. :rolleyes::p

[satansaloser2005]

Memo to self: Next time morm is involved in a tie...keep flipping the coin until it lands on the side that kills him. :rolleyes::p

Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition....

[Durelin]

When I proposed my plan I thought the BFF's could reveal together, they can't I was wrong.

That is not the only flaw in your proposed plan, morm.

If you want the bear kill Formendacil.

Then why did you retract your vote for him yesterDay, after you received support against him from Lommy?

[mormegil]

That is not the only flaw in your proposed plan, morm.

Never said it was, in fact I admitted a flaw when I proposed it as well.



Then why did you retract your vote for him yesterDay, after you received support against him from Lommy?

Two reasons, I'm still not certain of his guilt, my case was fairly weak, but he fits the bill for the profile I've formed and most importantly, self-preservation and the vote was for somebody I suspected.

You seem awfully ready to attack the plan Durelin, why? Just because I propose for the gifteds to possibly reveal themselves doesn't mean it's going to happen, it's to give the idea and see what happens.

[Durelin]

You seem awfully ready to attack the plan Durelin, why?

Because I find you suspicious for your suggestion of it, and would like to see you defend it in order to get a better feel for you.

And why am I attacking you rather vehemently? Because you suggested that the only reason anyone here disagrees with you is because we're not as intelligent as the phantom.

Shocked?

[Nerwen]

...seoreh nellaf owT .esruoc fo ,mroN dnA ?atsahS tuoba das ti t'nsI !egalliv ,olleH

You can't be certain Durelin, but assume for a moment I am not a wolf, would I be a likely wolf target?

Yes, but only one of several.

You seem awfully ready to attack the plan Durelin, why? Just because I propose for the gifteds to possibly reveal themselves doesn't mean it's going to happen, it's to give the idea and see what happens.

Why are you still arguing this point, Morm? They can't reveal at the same time, remember? It doesn't matter whether your plan is good, bad, or indifferent– we can't do it.

[mormegil]

Because I find you suspicious for your suggestion of it, and would like to see you defend it in order to get a better feel for you.

And why am I attacking you rather vehemently? Because you suggested that the only reason anyone here disagrees with you is because we're not as intelligent as the phantom.

Shocked?

So that's the real issue then? You felt I insulted your intelligence. I can assure you it was not meant as such. I meant more that this scheme would be to his liking and tactics. Not that he's more intelligent and therefore would understand it.

Nerwen, they can't both revel themselves? Huh, that's odd because I think I've mentioned that I realize that now. *sigh*

This is the problem with proposing any plan, somebody puts himself out there and tries to help out and it backfires nearly every time. Everybody jumps up and down pointing a finger..."Hey he said we should do something that I don't agree with he must be evil....KILL HIM!!!" Good mob mentality at work and all the while the real baddies are slipping through cracks and I'm forced to defend and redefend my position.

[mormegil]

Yes, but only one of several.


Think of it this way Nerwen, out of the few most likely wolf targets, who is also most likely to have been protected? I am 90% certain it was me but because I open my yapper and give a plan all attention is diverted to the plan. For that reason (all the attention to the plan and not on finding baddies) I regret presenting it.

[Durelin]

So that's the real issue then?

No, that's the reason for some bitterness behind my attacking you.

I'm the only one who has so far suggested you are evil, other than Sally (but what's new there)...don't act so victimized already. :p

[Durelin]

Well, okay...Nerwen did vote for you yesterDay...

Sally and Nerwen don't count.

[mormegil]

In looking over the voting it is important to note that Durelin was the last to vote for Alona, my gut tells me these wolves aren't overly brazen and wouldn't go for that approach. I continue to think Durelin innocent of being a wolf.

Nerwen, Nienna, Mira and Sally (less on Sally) really poured on the votes for me at the end...disclaimer, I can't remember when Mira voted I think it was before Nienna and Nerwen. Anyway those are two suspects who seem to have wanted to save their compatriot. However, as I've brought up and others too Nerwen fits the bill for the cobbler.

I cannot remember Nienna voicing any major suspicion of me yesterday. Perhaps I'll go back and check but not now as it is bed time. If Nienna is innocent and how no strong suspicions of me why would she vote for me to possibly save Alona? The only reason is she felt Alona was very innocent, which is hard to believe. Otherwise a guilty Nienna could very easily have wanted to save her pack mate and saw that I was the most likely target other than Alona and went for me.

Again, I hope to review and see if she had any major suspicion of me but if any of you Europeans have time to do it while I sleep it would be great.

[Nerwen]

In a way I'm glad I retracted and 'changed' the outcome of the vote, because Alona's dead and we're down a wolf.

What the-? Didn't you retract and then vote Morm again?

No, that's the reason for some bitterness behind my attacking you.

I'm the only one who has so far suggested you are evil, other than Sally (but what's new there)...don't act so victimized already. :p

The only one? Morm nearly got the chop yesterDay– I reckon he's got something to feel victimised about. On the other hand, that edginess was there all yesterDay too– it's mainly why I voted him.

It now seems unlikely he's a wolf, though.

[Thinlómien]

I still don't get why morm is so confident he was attacked last Night. You can't know stuff like that, and if I had to start naming probable wolf kills, morm wouldn't even be in my top five. And even if he was protected last NIght, it doesn't make him innocent - he could still be the bear. So I don't see why anybody should believe any part of morm's claim.

I'm sorry to see Shasta go. Not only because he didn't get to play much, but obviously also because he was the ranger. With both the seer and the ranger gone, our future looks quite gloomy. We really had better keep lynching baddies.

Speaking of which, I'm glad you ended up lynching Alona. (If Form is the bear, that would've been better but good anyway. :Merisu: ) I think I'll go through Alona's posts and possibly even what people have said about her - if I have time - it could be useful.

Did Lommy vote?Yes, it is even in the vote table you posted. ;) I voted Form.

Now I'm to comment what happened yesterDay after I went to sleep and then I will have at least some sort of look at Alona.


xed with Nerwen

[Thinlómien]

I was under the impression Form always explains himself, among other things, a lot. Explaining is a favorite past-time of many people I know, and I am at least under the impression that he is one of them.Well yes, he tends to explain a lot and I was silly not to think of that, but I still think he's sort of trying to excuse himself too much in this game to look completely honest.

All anyone seems to have to offer is that a bear likes to talk about his/herself, which I don't buy.I never said that - I said Form's manner of speaking about the bear is suspicious, not the fact that he speaks about the bear (a lot).

And now I know why Shasta seemed so suspiciously edgy... it crossed my mind at some point he might be gifted but I decided he looks far more like a wolf... Well, I'm glad I/we didn't manage to get him lynched.

Rikae can you clarify creepy for me... I'd like to respond but yet find I don't know how to respond as I don't know what creepy means...I'm not to sure what to make of this comment, because normally people just ignore such vague yet clearly enough phrased suspicions and let them be. Nienna, however, wanted an explanation to be able to defend herself and half of me says that's a sign of guilt, and the other half that it's a sign of innocence... go figure.

A baddie-Sally doesn't tend to overly state that she is innocent. She tends to imply her innocence without saying it out-right. I may be wrong with this but it is what I have noticed. So I trust her for the moment.I had forgotten that, but now I remember - that's true. I recall one game where a wolf-Sally made a fake seer-reveal without directly saying she's the seer. So if she indeed has claimed innocence loudly (haven't noticed that, though) I'd be more inclined to believe her innocent than guilty.

We're playing Werewolf, of all things, and you think I'm being too analytical? I'm not saying I couldn't be the bear speculating out loud about my own strategies as the bear to misdirect people... but, at the same time, in a game that basically thrives on analysis and reading-into... you're going to convict me on that? Haven't you ever played with Nogrod? (*is being rhetorical... I know the answer)There's nothing bad in being analytical per se, but as an experienced werewolf player you should probably know that many wolves have been caught because they have explained the Night kills so smartly and effortlessly (straight from their Nightly PMs) or have managed to give the impression they think (a lot) from the wolves' prespective. I'm not saying going inside a baddie's mind and speculating stuff is bad - on the contrary - but sometimes it looks so authentical it gives off bad vibes, often for a reason. And that's why I suspect you.

Really, anyone who appears suspicious during the Day is more likely to be a Wolf, because they're covering for other people that cripples how they can play. A Bear, on the other hand, has goals like a Wolf, but can play more like an Ordo.You're right, and that's why I wouldn't advise going just bear-hunting. But if I see someone who looks like a bear I rather vote him than someone who looks like a wolf.

Well, I have no idea where my vote should go. It would be Alona, but I'll be sleeping at deadline, and I am loathe to vote someone who has no chance to defend themselves. Sooo.....
++no vote This is really worth looking at now that we know Alona was a wolf. It seems very very suspicious. But it's rather puzzling too - why didn't she vote Form whom she said she suspected earlier (she was wondering whether to vote him or Alona)? Is it possible we're dealing with a Nessa-Form-Alona trio?

Although I'm guessing he probably wouldn't suspect Rikae if they were both wolves in the same game.Why not? (Not that they seem like mates, but that argument looks rather questionable.)

I think Rikae's case againt me makes her look more innocent, because when I was reading it I was thinking "hey, what? that woman makes everything I do look darn suspicious, aha, she plans to attack me based on this" and then was really surprised to see her conclusion as "60% innocent". If she was a wolf, she'd probably just exaggerate the case a bit (more) and say I must be guilty. She could still be the bear, anyway...

Thinks the bear may have killed Hakon because xe thought he was the cobbler
(I'm not sure why the bear would be after the cobbler...?)Maybe because the cobbler helps the wolves, who are the bear's enemies, and the bear doesn't profit anything from having a cobbler around (unlike from having wolves around).

Mac has a double standard
(presumably for calling Mira on her slip? What else should he do - let a wolvish slip go, and a wolf go free?I don't think it was very wolvish after all.

Will vote for me if Sally/autume/Alona all innocent (! Why would that make sense from an innocent Lommie's perspective?)Why wouldn't it? As a wolf, you'd be very crafty to make a random group of three innocent people and say "there must be one wolf here" because then you can basically get them all lynched (if you're good and lucky" by insiting "the first one wasn't so it must be some of the others" and "oh, the second one wasn't either, let's lynch the third one, ok?" and then apologise humbly when you turn out to be wrong.

I was glad to see Lommy jump on so quickly.Jump on it? I have been suspecting Form of bear-ery since early Day2 and I was considering voting him all along! And "so quickly"? Maybe, but it was something around 1am and I needed to vote before going to sleep.

Yes but something is with Lommy. She is not being her usual self who goes after people with purpose, putting herself out in the open. She is not being bold at all and that concerns me greatly.Not bold at all? What was saving another player at the last minute with no knowledge on their role? I didn't suspect Inziladun much more than Alona, but decided to act on it anyway. I think that's pretty bold, given that it didn't matter to me personally which one of them died and could just as well been accidentally saving a baddie (like it turned out to be).

This is true... but it occurs to me that this might just be case of not being properly immersed in the game--she missed all of Day 1 and its 14 pages, and so might not have acclimatised properly.If you want to, you can excuse my Day2 behaviour by that, but not stuff from yesterDay or toDay.

No one expects the Mormish inquisition!This totally made me crack up. :D

[Thinlómien]

I'm not doing the Alona analysis yet - no one seems to be around and it's lovely weather outside. I'll go to swim in the sea and maybe sit on the beach, I'll be back either in an hour or two, or then in the evening after work, but in any case I'm going to have a look at Alona at some point today.

[Thinlómien]

I'm back (didn't swim, both the weather and the water were rather cold but I had fun) and I'm off to do the Alona-analysis. I have an hour to do it now so I doubt I will manage it before I go to work. I will finish it later then. I'm keeping an eye on thsi thread, so if anyone is around and feels like a chat, I'm here.

[wilwarin538]

I'm sorry :(...I am really mean to you aren't I? I've changed it for you. I heart you.

Extremely?!?!?!

Way to show me who's the boss. :p;)

[Thinlómien]

Okay, I started my analysis and managed to do Day1. I have to go to work now, but I'll be back to finish my analysis - you can expect to see it in 6-7 hours. (Free feel to make your own analyses if that's not soon enough. ;)) Until then!

[mormegil]

Nienna:

Post 280 she is in favor of lynching Fea. Her reasoning is—“This way we can make sure we aren't lynching a gifted or even an ordo. It will give us another day to work out who the baddies are.”

Post 405 defends previous post and Hakon doesn’t look guilty those who locked in vote for him look suspicious. She doesn’t come out and say my name here but implies it.

Post 421 mildly defends Alona saying that Mac’s vote for her seems fine but Pitchwife’s doesn’t. She wonders how Pitch narrowed it down to Alona and Autume.

Post 449 votes Pitchwife our seer with this reasoning—“Pitchwife is being the most suspicious to me after his weird voting thing. Of everyone he seems the most baddie-like”

End of Day 1. She votes our seer on tenuous reasoning at best, however this cannot be held too strongly against her as ordos obviously did the same. There were a fair amount of posts I did not include because they were fluff, such as vote counts and a word cloud or something like that.

Post 498 asks me why I think the bear would only try and kill wolves…she twisted my words here as I never said that I did say that it would make a lot of sense for the bear to go for the wolves.

Post 590 does a vote summary from the previous day. My Hakon lock in feels unsettling to her.

Post 606 does a fair analysis of Hakon voters from previous day. It is important to note that Alona was among that lot…I will quote the whole post here.
“Hakon Voters:

-Morm – weird vote and retract and vote again just because Hakon commented on something Morm said pre-game

-Alona – voted early because she said she might not be around… always the possibility to retract later… thought that Hakon bringing up surveys just felt weird and agreed with what Morm says about Hakon earlier

-Sally – gave no reasoning for her vote in her vote post but in a previous post she said that she didn’t like Hakon trying to stir things up and being laid back at the same time. She said it looked squirmy (218).

-Autume (later retracted) – Didn’t give any reason for voting Hakon… not even a little. Then switched to Pitchwife (one minute before deadline to push Pitchwife over the edge) also without reason. She says she can expand on it toDay. I think it is time for that explanation.”

Post 608 does an analysis of Pitchwife voters. Wants to hear more from Shasta and Autume who retracted from Hakon and voted for Pitchwife.

Post 610 apologizes to Autume for not seeing her explanation of vote for Pitchwife, it can be found in post 494 and doesn’t help turn my suspicions of Autume one bit.

Post 658 non Hakon/Pitchwife voters…not a lot of substance here.

Post 722 votes for Shasta as he has been the most suspicious today but she recognizes that he hasn’t been around. Nienna, you seem to have a knack for voting to lynch gifted. Her substance is very weak for her vote here.

Day 2 ends. Again a lot of posts but little substance. She does more vote counts and word clouds than useful posts.

Post 858 does a post by post analysis of Sally with the conclusion that she’s not overly suspicious but does end up ¾ the way on her list

Post 921 Sally no longer looks suspicious but Shasta still does primarily because of his voting record…Hey Nienna, your voting record isn’t squeaky clean either :P

Post 937 wants clarification from Rikae as to what creepy means so she can respond to it. Defends Sally here. This has been a sudden shift from suspecting to defending her.

Post 973 defends her previous votes

Post 981 replies to Rikae with this—“I apologize for being quiet and concise. I'm sorry that it makes me seem 'creepy' but I don't think that posting more often or at greater length is a strength of mine. I am just trying to figure out who the baddies are and lynch them so that we can have a village victory.”

Post 996 Answers Rikae again with this—“I'm merely trying to figure out how to defend myself to you.”

Post 1018 says this about me—”I'm getting bear vibes off of Morm. He has discussed the bear at great length and he has done some weird voting things... mostly voting early and then the locking in of Hakon on Day One. He is just exuding bear to me at the moment.” It was later pointed out that I did not speak of the bear much. This was odd to me and seemed forced.

Post 1026 I have responded to her specifically on my vote for Hakon, which I had done previously too but she said she understands but is still suspicious of me.

Post 1052 People in certain roles will talk about their roles quite often to test the waters.

Post 1081 votes for me as I’m the most suspicious to her, what happened to Shasta here? She hasn’t at this point really considered anybody seriously and hasn’t stuck out her neck and been risky in other words she is playing it very safe.

End of Day 3 a lot more vote counts and some other fluff

Post 1124 these posts always raise red flags to me “It is sad that Shasta, our valiant Ranger is now dead, but I'm happy we have finally nabbed a wolf and the wolves lost out on a kill. This is good news.” Our valiant ranger, she is trying so hard to show us how sad she is and then has to express how good it is we bagged a wolf. This feels forced and contrived.

That is all I have on her. I feel no better about her. To highlight:

• Terrible voting record
• Lots of fluff and meaningless posts though vote counts are helpful in a sense they don’t commit to anything
• Is playing it safe and not sticking her neck out on anything
• Defends Alona at one point rather mildly yes but would a pack mate be overt in their defense.
• Has really been trying to fly under the radar but do so with a lot of the fluff posts I pointed to earlier.
• Jumped from suspecting Sally to not suspecting rather quickly and went from Shasta to me rather quickly for reasons that aren’t really valid such as me talking about the bear a lot, now I have a bit more today but prior to this I had not and my Day 1 vote for Hakon.

Overall, I don’t trust her. I think her a very likely candidate for a wolf.

[Nienna]

I'm covering for Fea at work today so I'm not going to be around until like 8pm EST just so you know.

Morm I think you are grasping with the analysis of me. I think you are worried because I've been calling you out as the Bear. I've made a few mistakes with voting but I voted based on my assumptions at the time and won't apologize for any of it. Feel free to keep analyzing me and such while I'm gone. And if you think I'm the most guilty vote for me. I'd hate to die when we could be lynching a wolf/bear but do whatever you feel necessary.

[mormegil]

By way of information here is my current read on everybody

autume-Looking fairly guilty to me
Durelin-Innocent
Formendacil-Likely Bear
Lommy-Something is not right cobbler or bear feel
Macalaure-Innocent
Mira-uncertain but could be guilty
Nerwen-possible cobbler
Nessa-Leaning guilty
Nienna-Feels guilty
Rikae-Innocent
sally-Leaning guilty

There are three I trust right now--Rikae, Mac and Durelin.
Cobbler--Nerwen is most likely followed by Lommy and Sally
Wolf- Autume, Nienna are the leading followed by Nessa, Mira and Sally
Bear--Formendacil followed by Lommy

[Boromir88]

Extremely?!?!?!

Way to show me who's the boss. :p;)

Don't forget it either. I see your mind, you use your right wing as means to charm me and get me off guard, but with your left you seek to supplant me. Supplanter! :p

[Durelin]

The only one? Morm nearly got the chop yesterDay

I know, I know. I was talking about accusations based on his *plan*...I think.

I can't remember when Mira voted I think it was before Nienna and Nerwen

Actually she voted you after both of them, tying you with Alona.

I copy morm...

Cobbler
Sally? Nerwen?

Wolf
Nienna, Mira, Lommy, Nessa, Sally, autum....

Bear
morm...Lommy...

What's interesting is once again Sally did a bizarre retraction, and is convinced she did something she didn't do. Ties are ties in this game, it is not the first to a certain number of votes, it is a coin flip. I'm thinking she's our cobbler cause of this, but maybe she is a wolf playing that...boldly.

I mean, I must admit I'm a little partial to keeping her around because she's fun.

edit: by "a certain number of votes" I mean the highest number of votes...duh.....

[Mirandir]

So Shasta. Why? I'm going to try to start an analysis before I have to leave for work, but it'll be done by deadline, even if I have to finish it when I get home. Hopefully I can find a connection between the three bear kills. To analyzing!

[mormegil]

It has become too quiet for my taste and I smell something foul in the air. I wish the group I think innocent would talk more. I fear that the wolves got scared because of yesterday and now they are laying low letting the tides go where they may hoping to avoid detection.

Durelin is the lone exception to the current trend, in fact she's said more today than all other days combined, or so it seems.

[satansaloser2005]

What's interesting is once again Sally did a bizarre retraction, and is convinced she did something she didn't do. Ties are ties in this game, it is not the first to a certain number of votes, it is a coin flip. I'm thinking she's our cobbler cause of this, but maybe she is a wolf playing that...boldly.

Heh. You know I was mostly kidding about that, right? :)

[Thinlómien]

Morm starts to seem slightly foul to me.

Could someone explain why half of the village suspects Nerwen of cobblering? It confuses me because I get no such vibes.

Now I'm off to first have dinner and then finish the Alonalysis.

[Durelin]

Durelin is the lone exception to the current trend, in fact she's said more today than all other days combined, or so it seems.

No, morm. You just started to notice me because I talked about you. ;)

Heh. You know I was mostly kidding about that, right?

Well no. I went back and looked, and I really can't see anything that tells me that.

And what does "mostly kidding" mean anyway?

So Shasta. Why? I'm going to try to start an analysis before I have to leave for work, but it'll be done by deadline, even if I have to finish it when I get home. Hopefully I can find a connection between the three bear kills. To analyzing!

What about the wolveses that are still out there?

[mormegil]

And what does "mostly kidding" mean anyway?


Ask Miracle Max, he know what 'Mostly Dead' means so he certainly should know what 'Mostly Kidding' means.

I agree with Durelin here. I don't see any jest. I see Sally doing what Rikae demonstrated she did yesterday. Keeps trying to explain things and continues to dig a bigger and bigger hole.

[Macalaure]

Commenting on the comments first, then off to analyse a bit.

What I find very awkward about morm's insistence that he has been protected is that he only (flawfully, imo) argues why the ranger would protect him, not why Shasta-ranger would protect him. (note to self: have look at Shasta if time permits.)

On the other hand, that edginess was there all yesterDay too– it's mainly why I voted him.

I can't remember that I've ever seen morm non-edgy.

I'm not to sure what to make of this comment, because normally people just ignore such vague yet clearly enough phrased suspicions and let them be. Nienna, however, wanted an explanation to be able to defend herself and half of me says that's a sign of guilt, and the other half that it's a sign of innocence... go figure.

Sign of innocence (though I still have to take a closer look at her and make up my mind). Not only the suspected person usually ignores such petty accusations, but the average other person, too. Why risk it that the suspector elaborates on the "creepiness" and actually convinces someone of it.

"One half says it's guilty and one half says it's innocent" is a horribly vague and wolvish statement, Lommy. The people who suspect Nienna already take it as support of their view, while the non-suspicious people aren't rubbed the wrong way.

There's nothing bad in being analytical per se, but as an experienced werewolf player you should probably know that many wolves have been caught because they have explained the Night kills so smartly and effortlessly (straight from their Nightly PMs) or have managed to give the impression they think (a lot) from the wolves' prespective. I'm not saying going inside a baddie's mind and speculating stuff is bad - on the contrary - but sometimes it looks so authentical it gives off bad vibes, often for a reason. And that's why I suspect you.

This bit sounds very, very dodgy.

There are three I trust right now--Rikae, Mac and Durelin.

*approves*

[satansaloser2005]

Well no. I went back and looked, and I really can't see anything that tells me that.

And what does "mostly kidding" mean anyway?

First of all, Morm gets points for the reference. :)


It doesn't really matter, I just found it funny. I really didn't change the lynch, and of course I know that, but it's funny if you realize that if I hadn't been messing around yesterDay (aka the 'vote change') Morm would have been the other side of the coin and he'd have been dead. It made me giggle, that's all.

[satansaloser2005]

Okay, off to do my Nienna (I mean Nessa....dang it, I keep doing that!) analysis now. Then I need to do Nienna as well so I can remember which of them has done what so I can figure out which I suspect more. (Yes, I know, Morm did one a bit ago if I remember correctly but I'd rather look at her posts myself than just see Morm's summations of her words.)

[Durelin]

Ah. Now I get what you meant, Sally, about the coin toss.

[Rikae]

In a way I'm glad I retracted and 'changed' the outcome of the vote, because Alona's dead and we're down a wolf.

Um... ... ...

you didn't.

You retracted and locked your vote in.

Just so that's clear to everyone.

EDIT: Oh jeez, said that without reading everything, I see it's already being discussed. *is dumb*

[satansaloser2005]

Um... ... ...

you didn't.

You retracted and locked your vote in.

Just so that's clear to everyone.

EDIT: Oh jeez, said that without reading everything, I see it's already being discussed. *is dumb*

Meh, is all right. My fault for not putting a :p or something behind it as well as the ""s around changed in the first place.

[Rikae]

I thought this might be useful, at least to me:

The Alona and Morm wagons and the interaction between the two:

(Going back to Day 2 for a moment, Durelin put Alona ahead of Inzil, Sally says she thought she was
breaking a tie between them but actually re-tied Inzil with Alona, and Lommy voted Inzil at the same time,
saying Alona should be grateful - so there's a point in favor of Durie and against Sally and Lommy off the bat).

Day 3:

11:28 pm:
-Rikae calls Sally and Autume's (meaning Sally and Lommy's) retractions to save Alona suspicious (for them and
for Alona).

11:29pm:
-Morm says Alona looks suspicious based on her voting record, wonders if Rikae and Alona are wolves together.

-Sally begins defending vote retraction with "I x'd with Alona, and if you'll notice I felt dumb afterward because I didn't realize she'd retracted. And as I had said before, I was planning to break the tie if necessary."

11:30

- Morm agrees with Rikae's post about Alona and her rescuers.

11:31

- Morm asks Sally why she felt the need to "do that", presumably, save Alona.

11:32

- Sally says Rikae is too eager to suspect her (Sally).

- Alona says she had no idea anyone was going to try and save her, doesn't understand Lommy's "grateful" comment.

11:33

- Sally follows Rikae's mistake in thinking Autume, not Lommy, was the other to try and save Alona. Worth noting, less likely Sally/Lommy or Sally/Autume are last two wolves (could always be cobbler/wolf).
Tells Morm she already suspects him, "don't make it worse" - presumably he's making it worse by questioning the vote-retractors.

11:36

- Sally elaborates on the above with "Saying that I am suspicious for trying to break a tie (albeit in the wrong way, and I still hate myself for it) when I said I was going to do it ages before is horribly suspicious. I completely understand."

11:39

- Sally says she suspects Morm for grasping at straws.

11:43

- Sally: "I just think that coming out and saying "Hey, such and such is suspicious because they did exactly what they said they were going to do" is a bit silly. And really, you'll notice that I wanted to kill Morm, so I would think he wouldn't be complaining. Just sayin'. (Although when I finish with Brinn I intend to analyze Alona because I think she looks darn suspicious right now. YesterDay I didn't have a chance to look at her much and by the time I did it was too late."
(I find the implication that Morm should stay quiet about suspicions of Sally our of gratitude very weird).

11:46

- Rikae notes her mix up of Autume and Lommy.

11:50

- Form logs in and says this about Alona (among other, non-Alona talk): I was more expecting, though, to wake up and find someone like Alona gone--someone making more noise, and generally more suspicious.

Speaking of Alona, her Day-End antics yesterDay definitely bear some investigation, and she definitely seemed jumpy, but it was quite weird--I was around until 10 minutes before the deadline yesterday, and although she'd accrued a lot of suspicion, I was rather surprised with I got on after and caught myself to find that she'd jumped into the tie-line and been saved by a couple bells. The whole Day-End situation is rather tangled and might well include some furry creatures.

11:51

- Alona tries to cast some suspicion on Durelin, or at least questions Durelin, for her vote post.

11:59

- Autume says: "if sally were really trying to help alona why didn't she vote for Inzil instead?" - So, Autume defending Sally on erroneous grounds.
Also says: "With that said, I think that we also need to be taking a look at alona. Obviously her vote to try and save herself makes sense. What doesn't make sense is the vote by Lommy to save her. I can't say that I've gotten any bad vibes from her at this point. I'll have to take a closer look at her toDay and see if I see anything."

12:10 am:

- Form says "Alona seems less jumpy--coached overnight by packmates?" and "Morm has come back very aggressive. Good old Morm."

12:41:

- Mac says Alona's suspicious, but not probably a wolf with Sally and Lommy. (I'm not quite sure where he gets this conclusion).

1:02:

- Alona explains to Mac why she waited until the last minute (newbie nerves, she says). Says she is wary of autume and can't read Form.

7:38:

- Nessa makes the following statement, not really Alona or Morm-related, but I find it really weird and disturbing so I include it here:
Ah, what a mess. I really hope we manage to net a baddie today. Seems like there are quite a few scapegoats coming under suspicion at the moment, not good. We are getting so divided, I won't be surprised if we finish the wolves' job for them.

And the nickname conversation was...unexpected, to say the least. But then again, my nick is one of the easiest.
Not sure what to make of it, want to see if anyone does... it has a very detached look I don't like.

8:33:

- Autume says: "As for the last minute voting yesterDay. It really makes sense for alona to save herself." and "morm has raised some of my flags. At some point in time today I'm going to have to go back and analyze morm."
(Where did she get the idea Alona was considered suspicious for saving herself?)

9:00:

- Lommy explains her vote (Alona was neutral in her book, Inzil slightly suspicious) and says she finds Alona's smiley use suspicious.

10:01:

- Alona answers Lommy, saying she'll stop using so many smilies if it bothers her.

10:33:

- Rikae further questions Alona about Sally and Lommy saving her, and says: "I think the trio of Sally/autume/Alona just has to contain at least one wolf - I have a feeling knowing one of their roles would help sort out the others."

11:18:

- Morm says: "I agree that at least one of those 3 (Sally/autume/Alona) are wolves, if not 2 or 3 of them."

12:45:

- Rikae posts list with Alona, Sally and Autume most suspicious, Morm as "leaning innocent".

1:45 pm:

- Durelin says: "Sally, Nessa, Nienna, Mira, Lommy, alona, autume...so many to lynch, so little time...I guess I need to pick a few favorites."

1:59:

- Alona says: "So why all the scrutiny on me for the last-minute retractions? It wouldn't have made a difference whether or not it was me or Dun (is that the nickname we decided on?) who was lynched, the village would still be down an ordo toDay." (Somehow this reaction makes me all the more suspicious Lommy or Sally is eeeevil...).

2:14:

- I didn't notice this before - Durelin says to Nessa: "If you're the cobbler you should be louder and less worried about lynching a wolf." ... um, why do you say that, Durie?
Also says: "alona and autume - Jumpy, defensive, while agreeable, and highlighting new-ness. Let's see some backbone! They're probably lowest on my list if only maybe because I have no background with them." and "Rikae and Morm - I've been agreeing with them quite a bit, and am starting to feel uneasy about it."

(leaving out my long debate with Sally over her retraction-post, my Sally vote)

2:25:

- Sally analyzes Brinn, finds things she thinks could point to Morm-bear killing Brinn, but concludes "Brinn didn't say much, and her (granted mostly random) votes were both for Morm. I think Morm's not that transparent, but it could either be a setup from the bear or Morm could assume that we'd think that highly of him and use it against us."

2:41:

- Lommy tells Alona her smilies aren't annoying, just suspicious. Will think I'm innocent if one of Sally/Alona/Autume guilty, want to lynch me if they're not.

2:52:

- Lommy: "As for Sally's speculation - I can honestly see morm as a bear and doing that. But I'm still more inclined to consider Form a bear."

3:45:
- Lommy lists Morm as "leaning innocent" and Alona as "slightly suspicious"

3:46:
- Autume says "I really feel like alona and sally are innocent. alona's retraction makes sense. She thought she had to save herself. I think sally made a mistake. I can see why you might suspect her, but she's not acting like wolf-sally.

I haven't had time to analyze morm yet. However with what sally said earlier I suspect him even more."

5:41:

- Mac says: "Alona's defense in 838 doesn't convince me much.

Both Alona and morm think my Nerwen-comment is interesting, but neither contributed anything to it, so I'm taking their agreemen with suspicion."

6:00:

Alona's list:
Durelin - what I posted earlier still stands - why did she vote based only on the three way tie?
morm - I had a hunch about him yesterDay, but was surprised to see that other people voted for him, too. I think I stated it was just a hunch. I'm less certain of his being evil after re-reading through Day 2, however.
autume - People think she's being chummy, I think it's just being nice. We're turning out to have a similar style so far. Still keeping an eye out, as she could be a newbie wolf, but that's less than a hunch right now.
Sally - I honestly believe it was just a mistake, though her attempt to explain it all out has created quite some confusion and, consequently, some suspicion from me.
Nerwen - unsure, but keeping an eye on her
Lommy - Grateful comment still bugs me, but other than that, I don't have a whole lot of suspicion for her at this point

7:13:

- Alona says: "This Form suspicion has seemed to come not from nowhere, but definitely almost as a sidetrack from me and Sally. It's confusing and is inadvertently adding to my suspicion of Sally. I think I'm gonna go back and do another read-through of Day 2..."

7:16:

- Sally analyzes Shasta, concludes:
So really, there's not a lot here either. He suspects (or at least did yesterDay) Mira and thinks Form's shifty as well. He also hasn't left any sort of trace regarding other people; it's almost like he's trying to avoid commenting on the big issues that have been discussed in the game. It might be because he's busy, so I don't really want to lynch him toDay, but I'll be keeping an eye on him.

7:18:

- Nienna defends Sally, asks me to define creepy (actually, I find the question itself... creepy).

7:26:

- Alona no-votes.

7:33:

- Autume thanks Sally for Shasta analysis. "Thanks for the Shasta analysis sally. Definitely someone I want to keep an eye on, but I don't see anything to lynch him today. Like you said there's not a lot to go on."
Weirdish, wolf-to-cobbler-thanks-for-pointing-out-rangerish? Have to take another look.

7:43:

- Nessa makes a list, which includes:
"Alona-I just get this... Feeling from her. Like sort of a wolfish feel."
(what a thing for a wolf to say about a companion in danger - doesn't add fuel to the case, but (she probably hopes) will make her look innocent if the other dies...

"Morm-I am very impressed with. Puts himself out there, but kind of gray, rather than black or white, in terms of role."

8:11:

- Nessa no-votes, saying: "Well, I have no idea where my vote should go. It would be Alona, but I'll be sleeping at deadline, and I am loathe to vote someone who has no chance to defend themselves. Sooo....."

8:31:

- Form says: "Nessa's No-Vote is less damning than Alona's"

8:34:

- Sally votes Morm, saying he's more suspicious than the other people she's looked at toDay (Shasta and Form). Which reminds me, she basically ignored Alona, except to defend her own Alona-saving-vote-switching. That is, until:

8:35:

- Sally: "Oh, and my mind/vote is able to be changed. I'm looking at Nienna in a bit, and Alona if I feel like it."

8:37:

- Autume analyzes Morm, or rather summerizes, offering almost no opinions of her own until the end where she concludes Morm is "still suspicious".

8:42:

- Rikae analyzes Lommy, concludes: "60% innocent. Will look considerably more guilty if Alona or Morm turns out to be a wolf."

8:48:

- Rikae says: "Hmm, considering switching my vote to alona, if there is support for it... perhaps still more suspicious than Sally, and her role might shed light on some others."

8:51:

- Sally replies: "I still think Morm's a good choice for toDay, though I see your point about gleaning more from Alona's death. *shrugs* Can we kill them both?"

- Form says: "I've got Morm pushing my buttons and Alona ringing alarm bells"

8:57:

- Form replies to me:
Heh... well the last time I tried voting in the same direction as you, I botched it completely and went in the opposite direction. I'm also not sure I trust you, though you've been off my radar almost completely toDay. That being said, I'm amenable to voting Alona.

I'm not sure, though, that Alona's death would she more light than Sally's. Obviously, if one is a wolf and the other isn't, then the one who is a wolf is a much better catch, but if we can't tell that now--and I think we can't--then on the chance they could equally be wolves, each death would give us an entirely different set of possible related suspects.

So... if you're more suspicious of Alona, then go for her, but if you're equally suspicious, I'm not sure what the point would be. (And yes, I do see that in the quoted text you say you're "perhaps still more suspicious of [ Alona ]," but that's pretty weak preference. Can you talk yourself into a flat-out preference?)

8:57:

- Sally: "I'm worried about Nienna recently because I think the no-vote was a bit of a cop out. Sure, her main suspect has left but there's gotta be someone else she feels suspicious of by now."
Another case of mistaken identity, this time Nienna and Nessa. Would Sally fake this sort of thing? She's tricksy enough, but I don't think that's what's happening here.

9:06:

- Rikae: "As I see it, Alona's death will shed light on Sally, Autume and Lommy, while Sally's would really only reflect on Alona. Plus, the Alona-saving issue was the main source of my Sally-suspicion, anyway."

9:07:

- Sally claims to suspect both Morm and Alona (along with Nessa).

9:08:

- In response to Alona's "This Form suspicion has seemed to come not from nowhere, but definitely almost as a sidetrack from me and Sally.", Nerwen says "Right, so... we'll get back to lynching you and Sally then... if that makes you happy?"

9:12:

- Form asks me what I think a Morm-wagon would reveal.

9:16:

- I tell Form I don't suspect Morm.

9:18:

- Sally tells me to look at Autume's analysis for reasons behind Morm-wagon.

9:21:

- I tell Sally I don't see anything suspicious there.

9:28:

- Form says: "I agree with tum's reasoning to an extent--assuming that my version of how that reasoning goes is accurate. Basically, it runs thus: "Here are Morm's posts, here's what he says in a nutshell... and then out of the blue he has a serious suspicion of Formendacil, denounces him as the Bear, and votes thusly."

Insofar as I know I'm not the Bear, this puts me on edge, but the more objective case against him is in the out-of-the-blueness with which Morm's suspicion of me appears. As far as that goes, it looks quite odd indeed."

9:31:

- Morm retracts vote for Form, suspects others (including Alona) more. (Didn't notice before, but Morm retracts his Form-vote when suspected).

9:35:

- Mac makes a list: "best suspect I have, but I feel foggy about her, if you know what I mean." and "morm - probably innocent, but you never know."

9:41:

- Probably going to vote Alona at this point, though I'm willing to contribute to a Sally-waggon if we want the second-most votes (in case of tying or last-minute flurries) to belong to someone else suspicious seeming. If the Alona-defence returns last minute again, I'd be willing to settle for a Sally kill.

9:43:

-Heck, if anything I'll be switching to Alona. Morm's just at the top of my list.
Sally's talk about switching to Alona isn't very convincing, I'd say.

- Nienna "getting bear vibes" off Morm, for discussing bear and for locking Hakon vote.
Weak reasons, looks suspicious.

9:50:

- Autume votes for Morm.

9:52:

- Rikae switches from Sally to Alona.

9:54:

- Mira says Form talked about the bear more than Morm.

10:03:

- Form votes Alona.

- Mac votes Alona.

10:35:

- Nienna votes for Morm ("he is the most suspicious to me right now")

10:42:

- Morm votes Alona, asks why people expect him. (That still amuses me, sorry Morm!)

10:52:

- Durelin votes for Alona.

10:54:

- Nerwen votes for Morm. "
I can't claim that I really know what I'm doing here, though..."

10:55:

- Mira votes for Morm.
"Unfortunately I was going to say the same thing Nerwen did. Voting for someone else who I find suspicious at this point would be a throw-away."


Conclusions:

So, Morm and Rikae, and to some extent, Mac, get the Alona-wagon rolling, and Form climbs into it along the way. Durelin voted Alona on day 2 as well, and was breaking tie then - ties Alona with Morm yesterDay.
Sally and Autume really responsible for getting Mormwagon rolling. Nienna makes one post about "bear vibes" late in day, then joins in. Mira and Nerwen jump in at the last minute.

Durelin looks very unwolfish. Lommy looks unwolfish for the natural, sort of uneven way her suspicions develop over the course of the day, but something about her is perhaps... bearish?
If wolfishness were candy, Sally would be an atomic fireball. Even if she's just a cobbler, we don't need a cobbler cobbling around in the endgame and self-voting or something. Autume looks
evil, but seems less likely to be a wolf along with Sally (wolf and cobbler combo, I think). Nessa and Nienna are lurkish and non-committal and both good bets for the third wolf - especially Nessa. Mira might
just be too busy - although still a possible wolf.
I disagree with those who say two wolves wouldn't no-vote together. Why shouldn't they? Newbie wolves might not know better, and experienced or more careful wolves would realize that everyone would
decide "two wolves wouldn't do that" anyway.
Nienna could be more ursine than canine, actually. Her Morm-voting reasons, though, are quite weak - and would a bear forego a chance to lynch a wolf in favor of a trumped-up case on an ordo (assuming Nienna
also thought Alona was wolfish)? Maybe. Looking too innocent would make her a likely wolf-kill, after all.

Right now I'm most likely to vote for Autume or Sally.

[Nessa Telrunya]

I really don't see why people find my giving a valid reason for votes(or no-votes) suspicious. Voting while someone is unable to defend themselves has already lost us more innocents than baddies.

[Macalaure]

Of and about Alona
(I'm leaving out the interaction with Rikae, morm, and Durelin because I'm already convinced enough they're innocent)


Day1

Alona is one who criticises Nerwen for writing backwards most (could be staged). (+1 baddie-point)

I agree that Mac's vote for Alona seems fine while Pitchwife's seems a little desperate to join a bandwagon. I'm still trying to find out how he narrowed it down to Tum and Alona... but that worries me a bit.Not sure what to make of this. This comment made Pitch change his vote, although that was largely due to an overreaction of his. (+1 baddie-point)

Form thinks back and forth about Alona and Nessa, and his choice for Nessa can be interpreted suspiciously. (+1 baddie-point)


Day2

A lot of buddiness with Mira in the beginning. (+1 baddie-point)

Lommy says she keeps on mixing Nessa, autume, and Alona up. I've seen fellows do similar things to make people think they're not in it together. She later repeats it (only for Alona, not for the other two, check #671) (total of +2 baddie-points)

-Alona – voted early because she said she might not be around… always the possibility to retract later… thought that Hakon bringing up surveys just felt weird and agreed with what Morm says about Hakon earlierSuspiciously neutral statement (+2 baddie-points)

alonariel Very little substance as yet. She has at least the face value of making an effort to be useful, but fairly little to go by. In her favour, this could be the result of lack of time--and yesterday, Day 1, I'm hardly one to fault.Keeping her safely in the middle (+1 baddie-point)

A lot more buddiness with Autume (+1 baddie-point)

#630/632 could be staged, but otherwise makes Sally look innocent, since a wolf usually knows what her fellows voted like (+1 baddie-point, +2 goodie-points)

Form follows up after Rikae mentions Alona and Autume's buddiness and defends both in a suspicious "it is eerie, but"-way (+2 baddie-points)

Nessa votes Alona, putting her into completely unnecessary danger considering the voting (+3 goodie-points)

Alona is more or less completely under my radar.Since this is used as an excuse for not voting for her: (+1 baddie-point)

Sally retracts to save Alona at the last minute (+2 baddie-points)

Lommy retracts to save Alona at the last minute (+2 baddie-points), however, her "grateful" comment doesn't look like something a wolf would dare to do (+2 goodie-points)


Day3

Sally digs herself a nice deep hole while trying to defend her retraction and vote for Inzil (+2 baddie-points, but +1 goodie-point because a wolf would have carefully rehearsed a credible story)

Form thought the bear might kill Alona (+1 baddie-point) The last paragraph of #810 is strange (+1 baddie-point)

#814: Autume says we need to look at Alona, but twists it so that Lommy and Sally look more watchworthy in the end. She later thinks Sally is innocent and doesn't know what to do with Lommy (+1 baddie-point)

#824 Form makes a remark concerning Alona being coached (+1 goodie-point)

#838 Alona suspects neither Sally nor Lommy (+1 baddie-point each) She's wary of autume (+1 goodie point) and can't read Form (+1 baddie-point). Picks up my point about Nerwen being the bear (+1 goodie-point)

Lommy gives a believable explanation for her retraction (+1 goodie-point) "Alona's use of smileys is kind of disturbing." Eh? Anyway, Alona is surprisingly offended by that comment. (+1 goodie-point)

Autume mixed up the voting (+1 goodie-point, again, because a wolf would know such things)

Lommy declares Alona slightly suspicious (+1 goodie-point, but +1 baddie-point for keeping her in the middle), also (+1 baddie-point) for repeatedly throwing Alona and Autume into one box.

Autume says Alona is innocent (+1 baddie-point)

Other options? Voting Alona or Autume based on a general feeling without knowing their styles? Voting Form because of a mere fix idée? Voting Sally or Rikae?Fishy (+1 baddie-point)

#918: Alona narrows the list down to Durelin and morm, and Autume, Sally, Nerwen, and Lommy. The suspicion for each is rather vague. She defends the chumminess with Autume, defends Sally more than she suspects her, is very generic about Nerwen. She keeps Lommy's "grateful" comment around, but says she doesn't have anything else. (+1 baddie-point for all but Nerwen)

Alona attacks Lommy for bringing up Form (+2 baddie-points for Form) (+2 goodie-points for Lommy)

Nessa is suspicious of Alona but doesn't vote. If she doesn't intend to vote for her, why carry her around as your prime suspect? (+1 baddie-point, +1 goodie-point)

#966 Form starts out finding Alona suspicious and then.. makes us pity her? Later re-states that Alona rings his alarm-bells (+1 baddie-point, +2 goodie-points)

So... if you're more suspicious of Alona, then go for her, but if you're equally suspicious, I'm not sure what the point would be.
...
Can you talk yourself into a flat-out preference?(+2 baddie-points)

Sally is suspicious of Alona, too, but more of morm. (+1 goodie-point)

#994 (+2 baddie-points) for Form, again.

Then later again, he says he's probably going to vote for her and that she's his first choice. (+1 goodie-point)

And votes for her at a crucial point, but combined with his talk before, I see this as a possible wolf-on-wolf vote. It was obvious at this point that Alona was a goner sooner or later anyway (+3 goodie-points, +1 baddie-point)

#1069 He still wants to retract (+1 baddie-point)

#1098 Nerwen "somehow" chooses morm (+1 baddie-point) - not more than that because trying to save her at this point is risky

I will also add (+1 baddie point) for the morm-votes of Sally, (+3) for the ones of Autume, Nienna, and Mira.


And that makes:

Form 16:7 (+9 to evilness)
Nienna 6:0 (+6 to evilness)
Autume 7:2 (+5 to evilness)
Mira 4:0 (+4 to evilness)
Sally 8:4 (+4 to evilness)
Lommy 10:7 (+3 to evilness)
Nerwen 3:0 (+3 to evilness)
Nessa 1:4 (+3 to goodness)

[Durelin]

Lommy's vote on Day 2 is the most...confusing. If she is a wolf, would she have been that obvious and that concerned with saving her companion? Everyone's saying she seems like a bear, but what reason would she have for saving alona (and morm as she said she wanted to)? Unless she really wanted Inziladun dead for some reason, and instead voted him under the pretenses of wanting to save people.

Sally in general is confusing.

Durelin says to Nessa: "If you're the cobbler you should be louder and less worried about lynching a wolf." ... um, why do you say that, Durie?

She's another who has a cobbler-ish feel to her in that she rather un-commited and unwilling to really suspect someone (as if she's afraid to), but is just not having enough effect on the game if you know what I mean. I feel that if you're a cobbler, you shouldn't be a wallflower.

Interesting point - Mira votes morm after pseudo-defending him by saying that Form talked more about the bear than morm did.

autume-Sally is a definite connection...I have agreed with a lot of people on thinking Sally seems cobblerish, but what doesn't make sense to me is autume being and wolf and Sally being a cobbler. Why would autume-wolf bother to defend Sally-cobbler as much as she did, rather than go after Sally to distract from alona?

If autume and Sally are indeed evil, it makes the most sense if they are both wolves.

I don't think Sally is a wolf with Nienna. She could be a wolf with Nessa.

Random thoughts...hopefully more later...

[Rikae]

What about Nessa's defensiveness? Not equal, though, to Nienna's.

I'm not so sure about some of your earlier Form reasoning there, Mac... nor why alona's genericness doesn't give Nerwen a baddie point... and Sally's "suspicions" of alona look like very half-hearted attempts to cover her tracks to me, and should merit a baddie, not a goodie, point. Not sure about the statistics, but it's an interesting analysis anyway. I'll have to give it more thought after I get some actual work done around here...

(Did Boro give instructions to people with similar names to play similarly in this game? Nienna and Nessa playing it safe and sleeping under the reindeer, Alona and Autume both acting wolfishly newbieish, Morm and Form under fire as possible bears...? :D)

EDIT: X'd with Durelin

[mormegil]

Sally follows Rikae's mistake in thinking Autume, not Lommy, was the other to try and save Alona. Worth noting, less likely Sally/Lommy or Sally/Autume are last two wolves (could always be cobbler/wolf).

This has some Merit and probably valid but Sally is at the heart of both of these questions.

Nessa makes the following statement, not really Alona or Morm-related, but I find it really weird and disturbing so I include it here:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nessa
Ah, what a mess. I really hope we manage to net a baddie today. Seems like there are quite a few scapegoats coming under suspicion at the moment, not good. We are getting so divided, I won't be surprised if we finish the wolves' job for them.

And the nickname conversation was...unexpected, to say the least. But then again, my nick is one of the easiest.
Not sure what to make of it, want to see if anyone does... it has a very detached look I don't like.

I agree and it is similar to what I said earlier and Nienna. It’s overly dramatic maybe and an attempt to show how concerned they are, when they really aren’t.


- Form asks me what I think a Morm-wagon would reveal.
Talk about testing the water in a non-committal way. I now remember this and thought it strange at the time, but it got pushed to the back of my mind.

Overall Rikae a good analysis. The conclusion forgoes any mention of Formendacil. I think you have come to the same conclusion I have and that is Sally needs to go. She is either a wolf or the cobbler. Just too many things add up to it.

Sorry I started to read Rikae’s novel and then got busy at work with interviews and what not so if there are posts after I have not read them at this point.

[Rikae]

Durelin - What I don't understand is why you're giving the cobbler advice (or does it just look that way, and actually you're just saying what looks cobblerish and what doesn't?)

Something that just occurred to me - the wolves may feel more safe defending each other/not suspecting each other than they usually would because of the presence of the BFFs.

[Rikae]

Morm, good point about Form. I'm ignoring him a bit because people I suspect seem happy to go after him, but after what you and Mac said, maybe he deserves a closer look. If he doesn't seem like a likely wolf, though, I probably won't vote for him - there are simply too many people who could be bears, trying to get the bear would seem like a shot in the dark at this point.

[Boromir88]

Mira wanted me to tell you all, she won't be very active for the rest of the day, between work and other duties. She should be back to post before the DL, but not much more.

[Rikae]

Just to clarify - there were some arguments in favor of Form being a wolf, but there are stronger links from Alona to Sally/Autume/Nienna, so I'm more likely to vote in that direction.

[mormegil]

Morm, good point about Form. I'm ignoring him a bit because people I suspect seem happy to go after him, but after what you and Mac said, maybe he deserves a closer look. If he doesn't seem like a likely wolf, though, I probably won't vote for him - there are simply too many people who could be bears, trying to get the bear would seem like a shot in the dark at this point.

Agreed that it is a shot in the dark but if we were to bagged a bear it would eliminate one kill a night and make it a lot easier to last, plus their skin can make a nice rug for my floor. However, it is a risk reward scenario. There is a lot of risk and the reward is high, but with that said we do need a fair amount of certainty as to who the bear is, I am leaning Form right now with Lommy behind.

[mormegil]

Just to clarify - there were some arguments in favor of Form being a wolf, but there are stronger links from Alona to Sally/Autume/Nienna, so I'm more likely to vote in that direction.

No I don't think Form is a wolf. I think those three you point out are the most likely as well.

I am glad to see Mac, Rikae and Durelin posting a lot as I trust them currently. Everybody else has gone MIA.

[satansaloser2005]

Blah. I was working on my Nessa *checks to make sure she's got the right N girl* analysis and I completely lost my train of thought. Then I forgot about it. *headdesks* Think I need a bit of a nap then I'll catch up and tell you what I think. Sound shiny? :)

Oh, and so you've got something for now.

Suspicious
Morm
Nessa/Nienna
Formie (?)


Meh (aka no read or confusing read)
Mira
Durie
Tum
Lommie
Mac


Innocent
Nerwen:eek:
Rikae:eek:
Sally

[Thinlómien]

Alona about others

Nerwen - Day1: complains about her sdrawkcab gnitirw twice, Day2: greets Nerwen with annoyance (because of sdrawkcab gnitirw), replies to her speculation about Hakon the Bearkill, clarifies a question she didn't understand, Day3: says she's under her radar, says she reminds her of an innocent Nerwen from the previous game, is unsure about her and keeping an eye on her

morm - Day1: relies on his reasoning when voting Hakon, Day2: votes him for hiding behind a vote, is wondering whether to switch the vote or not and decides not to until he returns, Day3: has a wolf-hunch that is fading after rereading

Mac - Day1: jokingly replies to his suspicion, asks if his vote for her is payback from the previous game, Day2: seeks to allay his fears by telling she's been considering retracting, Day3: replies to his points (a few times)

Rikae - Day1: thanks her for defending her, Day2: say she might be framed by the bear and wonder which players would profit from getting rid of her, says she's not ready to vote her just yet, replies to her suspicions, keeps back and forthing with her about stuff (a lot), says Rikae's right when pointing out her weird willigness to retract, questions the joke part of her vote for her, says her vote makes her unhappy, Day3: replies to her teachings and later to her questioning her defense of Sally and Lommy

Nienna - Day1: ♥s her for making a vote tally

Mira - Day2: defends her sense of humour to Form, replies to her bear-speculation about Rikae, praises her contributions, again replies to bear speculation by saying the bear is probably a newbie, says her Rikae-bear speculation was a bit tongue-in-cheek

Autume - Day2: replies to a comment of hers, speculates with her about morm, Day3: wary of her 'cos she agrees with people so much, suspects her "less than a hunch"

Sally - Day2: replies to her queries about Hakon's death, questions her voting similarily to her, talks about Lari's schedules and Serenity with her, Day3: praises Sally's songs, defends her to Rikae by saying they cross-posted, does not suspect her, says baddie Sally is different from this Sally, thinks her long explanations confusing and slightly suspicious, jokes with her about tp

Lommy - Day2: admires her willingness to stay awake late and her sig, Day3: defends her to Rikae by saying they cross-posted but echoes Rikae's suspicion over the grateful-remark, does not suspect her, talks with her about smileys and says she can stop using them if they're annoying, suspects for grateful-comment but nothing else

Form - Day3: can't get a read on him

Durelin - Day3: suspects her for only voting based on the tie, replies to her comments

Nessa - nothing


Others about Alona

Nerwen - Day1: promises her not to sdrawkcab etirw (I just discovered how it's easy to do that and now I know why Nerwen got so hooked, btw :D), Day2: doesn't understand Alona's question about arranging deaths, disagrees with her newbie-bear speculation, Day3: suggests making her happy by lynching her and Sally, says morm is more suspicious than her and votes him

Rikae - Day1: asks if anyone has opinions on the newer players including Alona, doesn't suspect her and doesn't want to vote her because she won't be around, Day2: says she hasn't left an impression, summarises her actions and concludes she's a bit suspicious (could be a cobbler or a poor newbie, though), says her vote explanation was weird, replies to her defenses, says she and autume are oddly buddy-buddy and says Alona's constant bringing up angry-bear theory looks schemed, doesn't think she and Autume are BBF's, wonders why she and Sally are both suddenly thinking of switching votes once tp questions it, votes her and clarifies it's not a joke vote, apologises for making her unhappy by voting her, Day3: suspects those who voted to save her, lectures to her about life and werewolf (sorry couldn't resist that phrasing :p), says her defense of Sally and Lommy doesn't make sense, suspects her and says she's using newness as a shield, thinsk there's a wolf among Sally/autume/Alona and it's be useful to know which one, replies to Lommy's suspicions by saying that if the above trio is innocent Lommy should be looked at, considers to switch her vote to her, speculates about the light her death would shed, reatracts her vote from Sally to Alona

Mac - Day1: doesn't like her vote, votes her based on the vote and being vague and fueling the Hakon-wagon, explains her the vote for her and is troubled by her reaction to it, retracts from Alona to Zil because the vote has no support, Day2: is doubtful about her, wonders about bandwagons (including Alonawagon), Day3: wonders about people wanting to save her and why she took so long to save herself, is not convinced by her defense, she's his best suspect, votes her because prefers her to the -orms and says he may switch

Nienna - Day1: says Mac vote for her makes sense but Pitch's doesn't, thanks her for ♥ing her, Day2: analyses her vote

Sally - Day1: talks with her about Pitch's retraction, Day2: replies to her question about voting similarily to her by saying it's coincidence, talks about Lari's schedules and Serenity with her, retracts to save her because doesn't find her too suspicious, Day3: highlights xing with her vote and says she felt dumb because of that and that she was just planning to break the tie, Day3: wants to analyse her cos she looks suspicious, explains saving her at length while interrogated by Rikae, explains her last game's behaviour to her, jokes with her about tp and sorta disapproves of her no vote, suspects her and wants to take another look at her, says she's ready to switch her vote to her, retracts from morm to morm and ties morm and Alona

Form - Day1: says he confuses Nessa and Alona and decides to vote the first rather than the latter, Day2: says she has produced little substance and classifies her under "Hasn't Said Enough to Have a Trustworthy Feeling", speculates about he and autume being wolves together without reaching a conclusion, Day3: says her late Day2 behaviour is jumpy and suspicious, wonders if her new calmness is due to packmate-coaching, says she looks like a jumpy newbiewolf who's more interested about saving herself than catching wolves, speculates about the light her death would shed, says he'll probably vote her, votes her

Mira - Day2: thanks for her praising her sense of humour and talks with her about Rikae, replies Alona's "ununderstandable" question and thanks her for praising her, follows Nerwen's example of voting morm instead of Alona because of suspecting him more

Autume - Day2: agrees with her that it's difficult to guess people's roles, doesn't suspect her, questions morm based on her reasoning, says she's buddy-buddy with her because they're both new, says she understands her (possibly because they're both new), Day3: speculates about her and Sally being in cahoots in a confused manner, says it made sense that she saved herself, feels she's innocent

Lommy - Day2: says she has a cute avvie and keeps mixing her up with others, agrees with her about the village being in a tight spot, says Alona is completely under her radar, says she'd vote Inzil to save morm or Alona, retracts to save her and says she should be grateful, Day3: says saved her because she was neutral while Inzil was slightly suspicious and grateful-remark was there because it was about morm earlier, is disturbed by her use of smileys and says it's suspicious, says "the a-ladies" are rather jumpy and that if all of alona/autume/Sally are innocent Rikae should be lynched, lists her under "slightly suspicious" for being jumpy and eager to please

Nessa - Day2: votes her for being double-sided, Day3: gets a wolvish feel from her, would like to vote her but won't 'cos she can't be around to defend herself

Durelin - Day2: notes Alona's placeholder vote, votes her because she's more suspicious than morm or Inzil, Day3: would like to lynch her (alongside with half of the village), says she and autume are "jumpy, defensive, while agreeable, and highlighting new-ness", says attention away from her and Sally is not necessarily bad, explains her vote to her, disapproves of her vote for Norm, names her as a part of the ball of wolvishness, hopes she and Nessa are wolves, wonders if she's innocent because a wolf wouldn't waste vote power, votes her

morm - Day3: says she looks mighty suspicious based on her Day2 voting, doesn't trust her based on the no-vote, says he'll vote her or Sally, votes her, says that if he dies she (and some others) should be looked at


Next up: conclusions
then: reading and commenting all the posts I probably xed with

[Durelin]

Durelin - What I don't understand is why you're giving the cobbler advice (or does it just look that way, and actually you're just saying what looks cobblerish and what doesn't?)

I guess I was giving 'advice'. But with sarcasm. Kinda like...if you're the cobbler, be more interesting! I dunno. Truthfully, I like the cobbler role and like seeing it utilized, in-game allegiance aside.

Something that just occurred to me - the wolves may feel more safe defending each other/not suspecting each other than they usually would because of the presence of the BFFs.

I've been thinking from the beginning that I don't really like the BFF role. I can't remember the last game I played with shirrifs in it...

[Thinlómien]

probable-ish mates
Nerwen - there seems to be some sort of friendliness between the two (arguing about backwards-stuff), Alona keeps flip-flopping about Nerwen, Nerwen votes morm when he and Alona are running for the execution block (although, I'm not sure she'd do that if she was a fellow wolf - I can also see the possibility that Nerwen is a cobbler and that was suggested in the wolves' Nightly chats, or then Nerwen's just innocent)
morm - Alona might have been looking for cover by her fellow on Day1 and then when accused of it starts accusing morm of similar behaviour, morm ignores Alona until she's widely suspected and then he too suspects her
Mira - the two ignore each other quite nicely but Mira votes to tie morm with Alona (again the question of obviousity vs cobblerism vs innocence arises, though)

possible mates
Nienna - hardly any interaction
Sally - Alona flip-flops about Sally a lot, Sally attempts to save Alona twice and they seem very friendly with each other - the problem is that they look even too friendly to be fellow wolves (is Sally a cobbler, was Alona just buddying her up?)
Autume - they're quite nice to each other even though Alona suspects Autume a bit, but they seem somehow too obvious a pair to be fellows
Form - she avoids mentioning him but he suspects her... hmm
Nessa - I don't like Nessa not voting Alona because she can't be around and thus no-voting, but if they were fellows, why not give the vote to Form whom she also suspected?

unlikely mates
Mac - I don't think Mac would be as nasty as to accuse and vote a newbie fellow on Day1
Rikae - too much interaction and too much constant suspicion from Rikae's part
Durelin - picked Alona for lynching even though had two other (and several more others) options


edit: xed with Dureley

[Boromir88]

Reading all this analysis makes my brain hurt...how do you all do it? :rolleyes: :p

[Thinlómien]

It is very enlightening to read Mac's analysis because he seems to have spotted stuff I totally missed and also missed some stuff I noticed and our conclusions were partly the same, partly different.

Off to make a list of sorts...

[Formendacil]

I'm going to assume it's not the deaths of Alona and Shasta that have provoked this strangely quieter day--I had under two pages to catch up on since last night!

My immediate first impressions have to do with Morm, who has set himself up rather nicely as a presumed Known Innocent--which is fair enough on his end, since we all do it, but it's rather disconcerting how everyone else has jumped on it. He hasn't, in any case, been subjected to much heavy scrutiny today.

Perhaps this bugs me because he's so certain I'm the Bear, and I know I'm not.

Relatedly, I'm really bothered by Morm's certainty that he was the probable Wolf-kill last night. While the argument is possible that he was on the Wolves' menu, how he comes to this conclusively I've no idea--unless people are talking out of turn on MSN or something, but as I assume that's not the case, I'm more inclined to read an over-bold assumption on the part of Morm here--a capitalisation, perhaps, on the fact that the Ranger is dead and the Wolves obviously aren't telling.

Which is not the say that Morm couldn't have been the Wolves' attempted Kill last night, but given his abysmal lack of accuracy where my alleged ursinity is concerned, I'm definitely not going to take his logic on faith.

Let's try and reason it out then ourselves...

Regarding the case that Morm was the Wolf-kill, I think the following two points need to be considered:

1) Why would the wolves have gone after someone attracting so much suspicion? If he's not one of their own number, they would surely be glad to have him around today, to keep the focus off themselves.

2.) The Wolves want the Bear dead too. They can't win if s/he's still alive. Unless they think Morm is the bear or a Gifted, it doesn't stand to reason that they would kill him off when he might have the potential to lead the village to finding and killing the Bear for them.

Morm has not adequately addressed these questions, in my opinions, and they are grounds enough alone for not assuming he was the Night's pick.

[Thinlómien]

(in no particular order)

Bears
Form
morm
Durelin
... Mac or Rikae...? :eek:

Wolves
Form
morm
Nerwen
Mira
Sally

Cobblers
Nerwen
Mira
Sally

(Currently not under suspicion: Nessa, Autume, Nienna. Fair enough - they're under the radar. :rolleyes: I don't get the current trend of suspecting Nienna, though, because if I had to bet I'd say she's innocent. And also - currently only under passive speculative suspicion: Mac, Rikae and Durelin.)

Means I'm going to vote Form, morm, Nerwen, Sally or Mira. Probably either Form or morm because a) they both could be either wolves or bears aka killing machines and b) I feel their deaths would reveal more than Nerwen's or Mira's or probably even Sally's. (Or then I'm a sexist like Durelin. :p)


edit: xed and added a )

[Nessa Telrunya]

Hmm, Morm, you seem to bangwagon quite a bit, I've noticed after reading some. Quite suspicious if I may say so.

[Formendacil]

What's interesting is once again Sally did a bizarre retraction, and is convinced she did something she didn't do. Ties are ties in this game, it is not the first to a certain number of votes, it is a coin flip. I'm thinking she's our cobbler cause of this, but maybe she is a wolf playing that...boldly.

This makes sense to me. However, while Sally's eminently capable of playing a wolf playing at a Cobbler, I incline to think she isn't, and this begs the question then: do we assume Sally's Cobblery, but let her live, so as to catch an actually dangerous baddie? Or do we go for a more certain baddie, and take out the Cobbler in lieu of consensus on a baddie?

The bet-hedger in me likes the latter, but the village in general (despite not agreeing on who is furry), seems to think we've a good chance of catching a wolf or bear today, and with two deaths looming tonight and the Cobbler being more of a nuisance than a danger, I'm inclined to strike more boldly than my nature would prefer.

[Formendacil]

(in no particular order)

Bears
Form
morm
Durelin
... Mac or Rikae...?

Wolves
Form
morm
Nerwen
Mira
Sally

.....

Means I'm going to vote Form, morm, Nerwen, Sally or Mira. Probably either Form or morm because a) they both could be either wolves or bears aka killing machines and b) I feel their deaths would reveal more than Nerwen's or Mira's or probably even Sally's. (Or then I'm a sexist like Durelin.

A couple questions, here Lommy--which actually might be applicable to the entire village:

What difference, if any, makes you assume someone might be a Wolf or might be a Bear? Because a lot of the gut-feeling suspicion going around might, in fact, be accurate about Good or Evil, but I scarcely see how it can distinguish between Union and Free-Lancer.

Secondly--okay it's more of a comment than a question--I'm rather amused that, since he's the other people who started the whole anti-me waggon, that Morm is apparently coëval with me in your suspicions.:p

[Nessa Telrunya]

I'm sorry about my early-vote again. I always have trouble with deadlines being in the middle of the night. :rolleyes:

++Morm

[satansaloser2005]

Popping to the grocery store but I wanted to mention/ask something.

Lommie, the people you say you will vote are the people who are on your wolf list. Doesn't it make more sense to go after your bear candidates first and decrease the number of Night kills? I don't know if it's just me or if that's weird. Of course she's not around but I look forward to seeing her response when she gets back.

[Thinlómien]

What difference, if any, makes you assume someone might be a Wolf or might be a Bear? Because a lot of the gut-feeling suspicion going around might, in fact, be accurate about Good or Evil, but I scarcely see how it can distinguish between Union and Free-Lancer.Well, although half of the village discredits this reasoning, I think the way people talk about the bear may point at them being the bear themselves. As for wolvishness, it's about being mate-looking with known or suspected wolves. And partly it's just gut-feeling. Like, Rikae, Mac and Durelin all creep me out a bit and they do not look like Alona's mates, so I keep the option of one of them being the bear.

I'm thinking of voting Morm because he's been avoiding the noose for too long :p and his role would undoubtedly reveal stuff.

But then again, I'm not sure if a wolf would insist so strongly on being the Night-kill and I want to lynch him exactly because he could be either a wolf or the bear.

Should I vote Form then? He seems a lot more innocent now that he has come back.

Mira? Sally? Nerwen?

Argh... I'll go brush my teeth and think about my vote meanwhile.


edit: xed with Sally

[Thinlómien]

Lommie, the people you say you will vote are the people who are on your wolf list. Doesn't it make more sense to go after your bear candidates first and decrease the number of Night kills? I don't know if it's just me or if that's weird. Of course she's not around but I look forward to seeing her response when she gets back.I'm around yet because I'm slow... (and once I go I won't be back)

I said rather clearly that I want to vote Form or morm because they could be either bears or wolves.

And if I end up voting you, Nerwen or Mira - and not Durelin, Rikae and Mac - it's just because I prefer voting a likely-ish wolf to a possible bear. After all, we're here to eliminate all the baddies, not shoot wildly at possible bears until we run out of people who turn out to be innocent.

[Formendacil]

I'm sorry about my early-vote again. I always have trouble with deadlines being in the middle of the night. :rolleyes:

++Morm

Heh.

I'm really not sure I trust this vote, given Nessa's overall quietness in the game, but I definitely like it. And I'm irked enough with Morm I'm inclined to go much the same way myself. Nice to see I wouldn't be alone.

[Formendacil]

But then again, I'm not sure if a wolf would insist so strongly on being the Night-kill and I want to lynch him exactly because he could be either a wolf or the bear.

Well, far be it from me to discourage you in voting Morm, but in the interests of fair play, I feel I should say that I hardly see how being a wolf or a bear would necessarily make a difference in claiming to be the Night kill. Indeed, it almost makes more sense for Morm to claim to be the Night kill if he's one of the Wolves, because he (and his partner) would be the only ones who would know it's not true. A bear-Morm, on the other hand, would have to be wary that any future Wolf-deaths did not end up killing on the Wolves who would leave a clear trail back to himself as the Bear.

Or, well, I guess I should say "clear trail insofar as anything in this game is clear"--but I'm sure you all assumed that anyway.:rolleyes:

[Nerwen]

What difference, if any, makes you assume someone might be a Wolf or might be a Bear? Because a lot of the gut-feeling suspicion going around might, in fact, be accurate about Good or Evil, but I scarcely see how it can distinguish between Union and Free-Lancer.

But does it matter?

Should I vote Form then? He seems a lot more innocent now that he has come back.

He does, actually.

EDIT:X'd with Form.

[satansaloser2005]

I'm around yet because I'm slow... (and once I go I won't be back)

I said rather clearly that I want to vote Form or morm because they could be either bears or wolves.

And if I end up voting you, Nerwen or Mira - and not Durelin, Rikae and Mac - it's just because I prefer voting a likely-ish wolf to a possible bear. After all, we're here to eliminate all the baddies, not shoot wildly at possible bears until we run out of people who turn out to be innocent.

K, fair enough. I just wasn't sure I understood you so I wanted you to explain before I completely crucified you for something you didn't do. Thanks for clearing it up! :D

[autume98]

No I don't think Form is a wolf. I think those three you point out are the most likely as well.

I am glad to see Mac, Rikae and Durelin posting a lot as I trust them currently. Everybody else has gone MIA.

I have gotten to this point in reading so far. I know I haven't been around, but it definitely wasn't by choice. I've been feeling a little under the weather today.

So far with what I've read, I'm beginning to have second opinions about Lommy. The biggest thing that comes to my mind at this point is they way she saved Alona on Day 2. There have also been some comments and an overall vibe coming from her.

I still think morm is suspicious. At this point it looks like my vote will either be for Lommy or morm. However I have only read up to this point, so it could still change.

[Nerwen]

All right. Preliminary vote here, will change if needed, blah, blah blah.

++Morm

1. Because he's too darn edgy by half, even for him, and I'm getting an increasingly strong "killing machine" vibe off him.

2. Because I agree with Lommy that his death will tell us more than most people's (especially mine).

3. Because his name just looks so much better in red. I never thought green was his colour!

EDIT:X'd since myself.

[Formendacil]

But does it matter?

I think it does. If you can distinguish between a Wolf and a Bear--and you've got equal reason for thinking both--it should make a difference, insofar as it seems likely to me that you'd rather rid the village of the Bear, rather than the Wolf. At least, that's what I would think, since I'd prefer one kill per night rather than two, though I suppose it's possible you'd prefer to weaken the team players, on the hope the remaining wolf will eat the bear, or vice versa.

My point, basically, is that it would affect your vote, if you could be sure of the distinction. More likely, I suppose, it's unlikely that you'd get the "all other things being equal" end of it, and either the potential bear or the potential wolf would be a more powerful argument on its own--but not necessarily.

[Thinlómien]

Well, Autume, it is the ultimate question again, would a wolf try to save a fellow or sacrifice her to look better? I think I've done both in the past, there are no clear answers. I wouldn't probably done that to save Alona, had I been her fellow wolf, but I cannot say for sure, and you can't of course take my word for it (especially as I'm unsure myself).

++Formendacil

More innocent right now or not, he's suspicious enough to get my vote. I actually suspect morm a bit more than him, but this village looks a bit like turning into a huge mormwagon (I know, only one vote so far but quite a lot of people are very suspicious of him), so I think a vote for Form should provide an option.

If we lynch Form and he's innocent and later turns out morm was guilty, I'll probably bang my head against the wall.


edit: xed with Nerwen (what did I say ;)) and Form

[mormegil]

2. Because I agree with Lommy that his death will tell us more than most people's (especially mine).



I was going to ask this of Lommy but I will ask it of both of you now, what pray-tell would my death tell you when I turn out to be an ordo?

[autume98]

Regarding the case that Morm was the Wolf-kill, I think the following two points need to be considered:

1) Why would the wolves have gone after someone attracting so much suspicion? If he's not one of their own number, they would surely be glad to have him around today, to keep the focus off themselves.

2.) The Wolves want the Bear dead too. They can't win if s/he's still alive. Unless they think Morm is the bear or a Gifted, it doesn't stand to reason that they would kill him off when he might have the potential to lead the village to finding and killing the Bear for them.

Morm has not adequately addressed these questions, in my opinions, and they are grounds enough alone for not assuming he was the Night's pick.

I was wondering about these points as well. Just another reason morm looks even more suspicious to me.

Well, Autume, it is the ultimate question again, would a wolf try to save a fellow or sacrifice her to look better? I think I've done both in the past, there are no clear answers. I wouldn't probably done that to save Alona, had I been her fellow wolf, but I cannot say for sure, and you can't of course take my word for it (especially as I'm unsure myself).


Well even so right now morm looks way more suspicious than you. At this point in time I have no desire to start a Lommy wagon. ;)

Edit: x-ed with morm

[Rikae]

What am I missing here? Morm was tied with a known wolf twice, and now he's the first to get two votes? It looks like Alona's wolfishness means nothing at all to anyone, since no one seems to be willing to reevaluate yesterDay's suspicions in light of it.

Nessa, Nerwen, do you really think the wolves would have allowed two of their pack to end up tied for the lynch yesterDay? If you think Morm is the bear, do you honestly think it's better to shoot for one of one bear than one of two wolves? Please answer. Neither of you has explained much of anything in this game, and it's high time you did.

Also, I just thought I'd throw this out there:
I think Lommy is the bear.

[satansaloser2005]

Also, I just thought I'd throw this out there:
I think Lommy is the bear.

Interesting thought. For some reason toDay (more recently) I've been getting baddie vibes from her, but I was thinking wolf. What gives you the bear idea?

[mormegil]

Hmm, Morm, you seem to bangwagon quite a bit, I've noticed after reading some. Quite suspicious if I may say so.

No you're right of course, I mean I started Day 1 by voting for Hakon, clearly a bandwagon. On Day 2 I voted for Rikae, I might have been number 2, again clearly a bandwagon and it is to be remembered that I had to vote early and leave for the rest of the day to travel across country. On Day 3 I voted for Alona a wolf which also saved myself...very suspicious band-wagonning going on here.

[Rikae]

I also don't like the way the group of autume, Mira, Nienna, Nerwen, Nessa, and to some extent, Sally hang together in their votes, do not bother to explain anything, and refuse to absorb new information as it becomes available. This is half the village, and obviously they can't all be evil, but some of them seem to have dubbed themselves unofficial cobblers. None of the morm-voters seem to have made any effort to analyze each other (beyond saying they would) and none seem to even acknowledge that, had a coin flipped differently, they would have let a wolf get away.

Of these, autume seems perhaps honestly misguided, Mira may just be busy, and Nessa is a newbie who might not know what's expected of her (although she ought to, by now), and Sally seems at least more independent, though I'm tempted to call her the ringleader. Nerwen and Nienna, however, know better. They're hiding in a pack, and I know they're capable of more... I can't believe they do so out of concern for the village's best interests.

[mormegil]

Well, although half of the village discredits this reasoning, I think the way people talk about the bear may point at them being the bear themselves.


HEY EVERYBODY!!!! She talked about the bear so she must be the bear herself

*waves arms frantically* Everybody run and hide...

Seriously though Lommy, I understand what you are saying but you keep insisting that because somebody talks about the bear and how they might behave or what not they are likely bear candidates, what about those who talk about those who are likely bear candidates because they talk about the bear?

Seriously are you the bear Lommy, just tell me you know you want to scream it out.

[satansaloser2005]

Of these, autume seems perhaps honestly misguided, Mira may just be busy, and Nessa is a newbie who might not know what's expected of her (although she ought to, by now), and Sally seems at least more independent, though I'm tempted to call her the ringleader. Nerwen and Nienna, however, know better. They're hiding in a pack, and I know they're capable of more... I can't believe they do so out of concern for the village's best interests.

Erm, should I thank you or demand an apology? I'm really not sure.


EDIT: x'd with Morm. Lol.

[mormegil]

I also don't like the way the group of autume, Mira, Nienna, Nerwen, Nessa, and to some extent, Sally hang together in their votes, do not bother to explain anything, and refuse to absorb new information as it becomes available. This is half the village, and obviously they can't all be evil, but some of them seem to have dubbed themselves unofficial cobblers. None of the morm-voters seem to have made any effort to analyze each other (beyond saying they would) and none seem to even acknowledge that, had a coin flipped differently, they would have let a wolf get away.

Of these, autume seems perhaps honestly misguided, Mira may just be busy, and Nessa is a newbie who might not know what's expected of her (although she ought to, by now), and Sally seems at least more independent, though I'm tempted to call her the ringleader. Nerwen and Nienna, however, know better. They're hiding in a pack, and I know they're capable of more... I can't believe they do so out of concern for the village's best interests.

Rikae you put words to my thoughts exactly. Thank you.

I wonder Rikae are you considering voting for Sally? Sally, Nienna, Form or Lommy are my most likely candidates, it may be necessary to change to save my life again, but it might be nice to get some consensus now if we can. Mac and Durelin what are you two thinking?

Autume is seeming more innocently misguided today especially the more recent posts.

[Rikae]

Interesting thought. For some reason toDay (more recently) I've been getting baddie vibes from her, but I was thinking wolf. What gives you the bear idea?

More gut feeling than anything, but also that her arguments seem contrived, she seems less reasonable than I know her to be, and yet she doesn't really seem tied to anyone in particular.
I'm not really planning on hunting the bear toDAY, though. That's best left for later, I think.

[wilwarin538]

*waves arms frantically* Everybody run and hide...


Had to say this really made me giggle, hehe.

[satansaloser2005]

Crap. I have to go in ten minutes. I'll be back around an hour before DL, but I've not finished my thing on Nessa. *headdesks herself for messing around so much this afternoon* I'll post the bits from Day One and see if I can finish Day Two before I leave, savvy?

[Rikae]

Erm, should I thank you or demand an apology? I'm really not sure.


EDIT: x'd with Morm. Lol.

Nerwen and Nienna should know better than to follow your evil ringleading. :p

[satansaloser2005]

NESSA DAY ONE


Stealing Mac's plus and minus thing, because....well, it's awesome.

Oh wow! I wake up in the morning and we're on PAGE FOUR?

All I can say is that I would've helped, but little girls like me are supposed to be asleep in the early a.m's.

Even worse, in all FOUR (three?) pages, no one has said anything for me to blame them. And to think I was hoping for such a miracle. ToT

But tp's plan seems sound enough to me. The only problem is that it unnervingly reminds me of a similar scenario in TiG III involving Fordim Hedgthistle. Except there, it was used as a basis for Day one votes. (Yeah, I like to read through the older games-helps a doof like me figure things out)

I won't be surprised if someone uses peoples reactions to that plan to decide on their vote. It seems to happen a lot.

edit: crossed with morm

Banter, banter, fluff, reference to an old game, supports lynching an already dying Fea, says that the discussion will probably help people make up their minds about each other. +0

Well, I just go to older threads in Mirth. Makes for good reading, and it's fun to guess who is who while you read. :p

Banter. +0

That may be what he had in mind, just to try and make this game that much more interesting. But couldn't the wolves exploit that reasoning by saying they distrust each other?

Makes a good point, and while she didn't say much she brings up....erm, actually an obvious point. One that needed to be brought up, but obvious. But she was trying, so yay for that. +1

Maybe, if that is how Boro chose roles. We would have to tally up everyone's answers though, if we were to do that.

I myself would rather have more concrete evidence, based on someone slipping up. It's too easy to be tricked in any strategy, however, if that's all we have to go on...

I say, Day one is the hardest vote of all, merely because there's nothing to go on.

Says the surveys are worth looking at but that it's too much effort and she'd rather use (as I put it) real werewolfing skills to figure out the baddies. And Day Ones suck. (+1 liking points, +0 suspicion points)

I sense a little tension here. >_>

Yeah, well.... +0

Well, at least now the conversation is boiling down to the problem at hand, rather than other oddities that only serve to up the page count.

I think the most likely strategy, that everyone will most likely fall into anyways, is to blindly vote Day one as they always have, and then look back at who voted who, and who was Night killed for motives.

But the problem lies in this: when all we can do toDay is vote blindly, how will our votes mean anything? There's no point in giving a well-thought reason when there's nothing to go on for us villagers(and gifteds). If we just tell the truth about why we're voting instead of trying to sound smart(guilty here) then it will be easier to distinguish who is who. Only the wolves are sure of who they need to kill: everyone. And that means that they will be glad with whatever lynch they can get on the first day, provided none of them die.

Erm....states the obvious. This post looks so helpful, and yet....nothing. She's saying what we all know is true. -1, because it looks....weird.

I would love to be able to form solid opinions of everyone like Rikae, but, as has been noticed multiple times, there has been nothing to go on. The funny thing is, there is more substance in her one post than has been in the last few pages. And I hate lynching people who have nothing against them. That contradicts the idea that you're supposed to use your head in this game.


There may be a list forthcoming(oh no!), but I regret that you must wait for it.

Says that she has trouble getting a hold on people and that Rikae is being more helpful than most. Ties to Rikae, in a way. Doesn't want to lynch someone who....I'm getting the impression of who can't talk a lot, but she could also mean people who haven't been suspected much. Promises a list. Again, this is a good post and I understand where she's coming from, but....could she be buttering up to Rikae by saying she's being helpful, for whatever reason? -1

No, I think it's excellent when someone has a sensible reason, only it's easy for one to vote based on banter rather than substance. That's what I'm trying to say. But I'd rather hear an obvious statement out of the speaker's desire to help the village than a genius plot from a wolf and their respective trickery.

edit: crossed since Inzil

Ahhhh, gotcha. Anyway, says it's too easy to hide behind stupid vote reasons. Also states that she'd rather....wait, she said she'd rather hear from an ordo than a wolf. Well of course. Pretty speech, but words whispered, etc. -1

The thing about innocents, is that their only concern should be to figure out who the baddies are. The wolves and gifteds are the ones who need to play tricks, and for either self preservation or some other motive.

I know I didn't say it (for the record, Rikae did) but the ordos occasionally need to play tricks too, and often do for the good of the village. Phantom and his insanity, for instance (not in this game necessarily but in others). I agree that we (the ordos) should try to catch the baddies of course, but this seems off to me. (-1 liking points, +0 suspicion points)

Oh, wow, so many posts. @_@ Seems I have garnered a vote. I really must remember to congratulate myself. Late deadlines are always difficult for me, since I hit the hay pretty early, and must vote early, if I am to vote at all. ++Rikae If only for my dislike of how you seem to jump down everyone's throats. Night :)

This seems like a personal vote but I know it's not. Some wolves are very aggressive (no offense meant to Rikae of course) and Nessa could assume that's what Rikae was doing. At the same time, however, she had previously said she liked what Rikae was doing. Ties to Rikae. Weird for her to flip like that. Oh, and I've done the 'oh look I got a vote yay' thing too but this seems weird to me. -1


For those of you at home, the total so far....

Liking points (her posts, not Nessa herself of course): 0
Suspicion points: -3

[mormegil]

Really though village we are on the edge of disaster if we don't do it right today. We have 12 total if we kill an innocent today and assuming the wolves don't kill the bear that is 9 tomorrow with 3 being evil, one more day like that and it's basically over.

Rikae, I am beginning to wonder if we should hunt the bear in more earnest today. If we do get him/her today than we are really well positioned for the coming days to win.

[satansaloser2005]

Nerwen and Nienna should know better than to follow your evil ringleading. :p



Ahhhh. Lol if I was evil I'd say thank you then. As it is I won't demand an apology either. And really, Nerwen's my biggest fan, so you never know. :p

[autume98]

What am I missing here? Morm was tied with a known wolf twice, and now he's the first to get two votes? It looks like Alona's wolfishness means nothing at all to anyone, since no one seems to be willing to reevaluate yesterDay's suspicions in light of it.

Nessa, Nerwen, do you really think the wolves would have allowed two of their pack to end up tied for the lynch yesterDay? If you think Morm is the bear, do you honestly think it's better to shoot for one of one bear than one of two wolves? Please answer. Neither of you has explained much of anything in this game, and it's high time you did.

Also, I just thought I'd throw this out there:
I think Lommy is the bear.

First: That's a good point about morm. I will have to take that into consideration.

Second: Nessa is raising some flags. I'm not comfortable with her No Vote yesterday. She has been awfully quiet throughout the game. However that may mean nothing.

Third: I'm glad I'm not the only one feeling bad vibes coming from Lommy.

Edit: x-ed with #1220 to here

[Boromir88]

Nienna will also be hampered late due to work.

End Note.

[satansaloser2005]

Have to go, sadly. I'll finish Nessa (that's what she said) when I return. :)

[Formendacil]

What am I missing here? Morm was tied with a known wolf twice, and now he's the first to get two votes? It looks like Alona's wolfishness means nothing at all to anyone, since no one seems to be willing to reevaluate yesterDay's suspicions in light of it.

Okay, I guess here's where a distinction between Bear and Wolf makes a lot of sense to draw.

If Morm is the Bear, then relations to a Known Wolf means precious little or nothing. Any association to be drawn would be as spurious as between an Ordo and a Known Wolf--and just as impossible to tell apart from non-spurious relationships.

Secondly, it has happened before that two wolves have been on the block at the same time--an antsy situation for the Wolves, certainly, but not, simply on the basis of that, a reason to discount shared lupinity.

All the same, I think you're right about this mostly removing Morm from the list of likely wolves. But that doesn't mean he's not still suspicious; it just mean that as suspiciou-Morm he's more liable to be the Bear.

Liable to be the Bear, I note, on the grounds that he's suspicious and seemingly not connected to our Known (dead) Wolf--not the more spurious grounds of "he talks about bears so he is one."

[autume98]

I also don't like the way the group of autume, Mira, Nienna, Nerwen, Nessa, and to some extent, Sally hang together in their votes, do not bother to explain anything, and refuse to absorb new information as it becomes available. This is half the village, and obviously they can't all be evil, but some of them seem to have dubbed themselves unofficial cobblers. None of the morm-voters seem to have made any effort to analyze each other (beyond saying they would) and none seem to even acknowledge that, had a coin flipped differently, they would have let a wolf get away.


You have made a good point Rikae. I do believe there is a wolf in there somewhere. I'm leaning towards Mira, Nienna, Nerwen, or Nessa.

I have believed that one of these are a wolf for a while now. I don't remember if I put anything about some of the people that have been quiet. I might not have after my vote on Day 1. I do think that one of these possibly two of these are a wolf. They just haven't posted a lot for me to get a feel for them.

Edit: x-ed with Form

[Rikae]

You have made a good point Rikae. I do believe there is a wolf in there somewhere. I'm leaning towards Mira, Nienna, Nerwen, or Nessa.
In other words, anyone but you? :p
What do you think about each in particular? They can't all be wolves, of course.

[Macalaure]

Those morm suspicions are hard to get rid of, indeed. If I would understand why people think he's the bear, I might get it, but would still think that we have better things to do toDay than chase after the faint hints that the bear might have left. Since I don't understand those suspicions, all I can do is shake my head. I'm particularly worried about Nerwen, who has been casting strange votes for several days now.

I'm at a complete loss as to why Lommy concluded morm was suspicious. I'm also surprised how quickly she adopted my suspicion of Form. I'm quite confident of my case, but I'm surprised nevertheless.

I also don't think that the pursuit of Sally is the greatest idea. She's a cobbler at best, in my opinion.

Since it has been requested, my preferences:
Good idea: Form, Nerwen, Nienna
Bad idea: Autume, Lommy, Mira, Nessa, Sally
Very bad idea: Durelin, morm, Rikae

On second thought, let's lynch Sally for plagiarism! :mad: :p

[Durelin]

I definitely feel there is something wrong with Lommy and have felt so from the time she first started posting.

Now the question to me is - go for a simply evil-looking Lommy...wolf or bear, I am not at all sure...OR go with evil-looking with more wolf-y connections. Of course, she did save alona!

While I am uneasy about morm (in a bearish sense), I think it is compeltely bizarre that Nessa, Nerwen, and Form have completely passed over the fact that we lynched a wolf yesterDay! To a certain extent they all seem to be on a different planet from the rest of the game. I get the same sense from Lommy...at least she did an alona-related analysis, though one of her probable-mates was morm...

Anyway, since I know it's a concern... My bear-suspicion of morm began only toDay, I will tell you that. And I do not feel at all confident enough to vote for him.

[Formendacil]

While I am uneasy about morm (in a bearish sense), I think it is compeltely bizarre that Nessa, Nerwen, and Form have completely passed over the fact that we lynched a wolf yesterDay! To a certain extent they all seem to be on a different planet from the rest of the game. I get the same sense from Lommy...at least she did an alona-related analysis, though one of her probable-mates was morm...

What's to say? I've only got on in the last couple hours, and Day's well under way. Better to address where we're at, especially if you are a chronic non-analyser of pages and pages of posts.

But... really. Alona was lost in the mess Day 1, looked suspicious on Day 2 and even more suspicious when other people mysteriously appeared to save her (though now that I mention it, why aren't they more suspicious?), and was clearly in danger all day yesterday, died, and here we are.

Well, that's my reasoning anyway...

[Mirandir]

You have made a good point Rikae. I do believe there is a wolf in there somewhere. I'm leaning towards Mira, Nienna, Nerwen, or Nessa.

I have believed that one of these are a wolf for a while now. I don't remember if I put anything about some of the people that have been quiet. I might not have after my vote on Day 1. I do think that one of these possibly two of these are a wolf. They just haven't posted a lot for me to get a feel for them.

Edit: x-ed with Form

So you agree completely with what Rikae says. That's not suspicious at all. Actually, I don't find it that suspicious because I doubt that even a newbie wolf would be quite that obvious.

That being said, I am back only to do my promised analysis of Shasta's posts and then I'm gone for the rest of the night.

[Durelin]

Well, if Form's a wolf I'm going to be more convinced Lommy's the bear...

Form seems too hung up on morm but he was the second vote for alona yesterDay, hoping to avoid lynching himself, when he just as easily could have voted for morm, which would have brought him up to 3 already.

Wolf who voted his fellow or bear...I just have no sense of Form, gut-feeling wise or vibes or whatever.

[Durelin]

And knowing a wolf leaves use nothing to go on, Form? Nothing at all, except that well, now morm's more likely the bear?

[Rikae]

I'd be quite happy to vote either Nerwen or Nienna, and before anyone jumps on me for not distinguishing between them, let's see them make more effort to distinguish themselves in this game. I have not seen anything original from them, only a lot of helping-a-now-known-wolf and trying-to-hide-in-the-shadows. They probably aren't both wolves, so it's kind of a 50/50 chance, but we certainly can't afford to keep them around, assuming they'll continue as they have - they'll just create confusion and harm the village.

I'd rather vote the people higher on the list than those lower (although I might change this list a bit):

Nienna
Nerwen
Sally
Nessa
Lommy
Autume
Mira
Form
Durelin
Morm
Mac
Rikae

Another thing - although it's far from Day 1, we still have an awful lot of quiet people who are not giving us anything to go on. If they are wolves, and we let them win, it will be a dishonorable win for them... but also, shame on us for allowing them to lurk their way to victory. If they are innocent, they're not helping the village much at all (in fact, they've been voting like cobblers) and having them around in the endgame could be disastrous. I'm not suggesting we vote quiet people instead of suspected baddies, but all else being equal, it might be a good idea to go for the quieter suspect - even if we're wrong, it will make for a livelier and easier-to-read village in days to come than if we lynched a louder innocent.

[autume98]

In other words, anyone but you? :p
What do you think about each in particular? They can't all be wolves, of course.

Of course anyone but me. ;):p

On a more serious note I'm leaning towards Nessa, Nerwen, or Nienna.

Nienna does look suspicious. She has been playing it pretty safe thus far. I don't know if this is how she normally plays or not. I'm also not comfortable with the reasoning she gives for morm. All she mentions is that he talked about the bear a lot. The thing that I was looking at morm for was more along the lines of the kills of the bear along with the voting. Sally points it out in her analysis of morm yesterday. I wouldn't have voted for morm on just speaking about the bear.

Nerwen - I'm not sure what to think about her. She seems to be playing it pretty safe too. I know people have mentioned cobblery, which it could be. I don't know what a Nerwen-wolf looks like. So I'm not sure what she would do.
++Mormegil

Somehow he seems more suspicious than Alona.

I can't claim that I really know what I'm doing here, though...
Looks like she is just jumping on a band-wagon. Could be possibly trying to save Alona.

Interestingly enough Mira posts right after Nerwen:
Crap.

++Mormegil

Unfortunately I was going to say the same thing Nerwen did. Voting for someone else who I find suspicious at this point would be a throw-away.
I don't like either of these votes. There is no reason for their votes. At this point Alona has 5 votes and morm had 3. Both of their votes at this time make it a tie.

So with that both Mira and Nerwen look suspicious.

Edit: x-ed with lots

[autume98]

So you agree completely with what Rikae says. That's not suspicious at all. Actually, I don't find it that suspicious because I doubt that even a newbie wolf would be quite that obvious.

That being said, I am back only to do my promised analysis of Shasta's posts and then I'm gone for the rest of the night.

Never said I agree completely, just that she made a good point. It has also been a feeling of mine for a while now that one of you four are the wolf?

Now I'm wondering why you voted for morm yesterday. Care to share?

[Mirandir]

#84
Says to lay of Nerwen for the backwards writing thing, banters with phantom.

#86
banter

#392
Votes Pitchwife for his first post.

#402-403
banter

#428
"Can I just say that I hate the "voting to keep around someone more useful" reason for voting? It's the main reason I got into it with Nogrod two games ago - it's basically a slap in the face to someone who may not have been able to participate, etc.

Also, Pitchwife backs off his alona vote when pressed? Interesting. My vote stands, for now."

#434
Vote count
"Noteworthy: Pitchwife seemed to freak a bit after suspicion turned to him and jumped on Mac's vote for alona, but why didn't he vote for Hakon if he were evil?"

#454
"Form, you've never liked me in any games you've played with me, I get that, but I've never seen you blatantly lie about me before. I haven't suspected Rikae at all, and I'd like to know just where you got that particular assumption."

#535
Confuses morm with Mira.

#578
Votes Mira for pointing out gifteds

~~~~~

That is seriously all he posted. Based on this meager amount, I personally don't see any ranger hints. Furthermore, I certainly don't see any reason why the bear would kill him. He doesn't mention the bear at all (unless I missed something), and thus doesn't leave any clues as to who he thinks it might be. Why bother killing someone who doesn't post a lot and thereby is probably going to be an easy lynch target for his lack of participation. I don't get it.

[Formendacil]

And knowing a wolf leaves use nothing to go on, Form? Nothing at all, except that well, now morm's more likely the bear?

Well, no, it does leave more to go on than that. If that's the impression I'm giving, it's wrong of me.

It is, however, fair to see that it's all I've managed to glean from it, so it's really all that I can post about it. Partly this is my own fault--a predilection for analysing rather than researching, and I would categorise looking back at Alona and relations to and from her as research. It's also partly circumstance. I've come back into the Day at a point where yesterDay is long gone and a reasonable substance of new argument has come up--including, throughout the course of itself, plenty of commentary already about Alona. My feelings, at this point, take into account what people have argued today. Morm, especially, didn't look particularly suspicious to me yesterDay (as I think someone more Research-inclined would agree if they took a look), but in the wake of his certitude that he was last Night's dream, he looks very suspicious.

[Mirandir]

Never said I agree completely, just that she made a good point. It has also been a feeling of mine for a while now that one of you four are the wolf?

Now I'm wondering why you voted for morm yesterday. Care to share?

Sure. I wanted to keep Alona alive a while longer in order to look at the prospect that she and you were BFFs like phantom suggested you might be. Nothing more vicious than that.

[Formendacil]

That is seriously all he posted. Based on this meager amount, I personally don't see any ranger hints. Furthermore, I certainly don't see any reason why the bear would kill him. He doesn't mention the bear at all (unless I missed something), and thus doesn't leave any clues as to who he thinks it might be. Why bother killing someone who doesn't post a lot and thereby is probably going to be an easy lynch target for his lack of participation. I don't get it.

Granted, I'm going to look my answer is too right and fits too perfectly... but that seems perfectly obvious to me--Shasta was quiet and left no trail, and therefore the Bear would kill him--to leave no trail. I've mentioned this a couple times already, and I think it's fair to bring it up again, but the Bear should be a lot harder to find than Wolves or a Seer, because s/he has no knowledge of anyone's roles--same as an Ordo. Theories that Bears can't help giving themselves away aside (because while they have some credence, they're not really relevant to the night kills), it would be in the Bear's best interest to kill the quiet ones at night, because this keeps them as anonymous as their daytime knowledge might.

Brinn's death also fits that pattern. Hakon's? Well... Hakon's death doesn't fit it as obviously, but it does fit. At least, it seems to me anyway, that there's pretty much no way on the basis of Day 1 that Hakon's demise would implicate anyone, and I would interpret that in the same way: the Bear is sniping people leaving no trail, and that's the whole point.